sjastro said:

You just don't get it, all the issues have been addressed ad nauseum and this latest serving can be described by an analogy.

I ask you what the time is, you respond by giving me the history of the downfall of the Roman Empire. I repeat what is the time and you give the same answer and so on.
You are adamant I didn't ask you what the time was but it was about the Roman Empire.

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Because your questions are red herrings. You claimed the researchers did not measure these vases in 3D and they did. You are finding faults that are not there.

I told you you need to put your complains to the researchers and you keep blaming me. I am only relaying their work. They state in plain english that these tests are in 3D and the results show high precision on par with modern machings.

Do you deny that this was not their conclusion. Then you make ad hominems against them which no formal review would do. Give me a break. If you really want to get my attention then put your complaints in writing to the researchers and not me. I cannot take some social media complaint seriously. Especially over the researchers who at least have done the hard work and formerly published it.

sjastro said:

So the question becomes whether your responses are by accident or design.
If by accident you are clearly not the sharpest tool in the shed, by design you are a lying troll.

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More name calling and fallacies. This time and either/or that is reduced to posionous name calling and considers no other option. Let me just say that it is not just my position but that of many. It is the position of the culture themselves. So your tarring a lot of people who are expressing a disagreement with you.

sjastro said:

Either way it doesn't involve personal attacks, it is based on your behaviour in these threads.

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No its personal attacks. No matter what you think of others who hold different beliefs or opinions to you personally attacking their credibility and character is wrong fullstop. I have not stooped to this even though I disagree with your opinion.

You have to consider my position. I have two different groups making claims. I am not an expert though have logic and commonsense and can understand the clear words that are said in videos and articles. They clearly state that the methods are good and the data is properly gathered. They clearly state that some of these vases including those with good providance are in the precise class on par with modern maching.

Heck they even show me live tests with the numbers popping up on the screens before my eyes. They even show me images of what looks like modern machine marks inside the vase. Which alone shows me it was a pretty sophisticated lathe.

On the other side I have someone who says they know what they are talking about on a social media platform. They may very well know. But they are name calling and deriding the researchers. They have not done tests or any formal analysis and published the findings or supported the objections.

Who am I to believe has more credibility. At the very least I have several experts who are saying the same thing and independently repeated the findings in a number of ways. On the other a lone person who is complaining about all this. Would any rational person take the word of one over many who have actually at least done some work.

Your more or less saying they are all conspiring to lie and present falsehoods and you are telling the truth without offering any formal evidence.

Citanul said:

I obviously can't speak for other men, but I don't do speed dating because having to speak to a new person every few minutes just doesn't work for me. It takes me time to warm up and be comfortable with someone, by which time you have to move onto the next person.

If events were structured with fewer people and the opportunities for longer conversations then I might consider it, and my introversion would definitely handle that better than short conversations with lots of people. But the typical speed dating set up isn't for me.

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I understand that some folks are uncomfortable talking to strangers. But remember,every friend that you now have,was a one time........a stranger.

This happened a month ago. The man had been deported seven times, and sneaks back in again. Not seeing where he was given sanctuary.

The one killed were farmworkers.

• 39-year-old Aaron Ruiz Ruiz
• 32-year-old Beymar Reynosa Rodriguez
• 39-year-old Demetrio Celerino Francisco
• 57-year-old Pedro Lopez Gomez
• 42-year-old Loreto Ricardo Hernandez
• 34-year-old Fernando Silverio

It was a terrible accident. This time they should keep in jail for many years and not just deport him. They should keep him till he dies. imo. I suspect the families of those killed want him permanently jailed.

I don't see where Newsom "released him". The DHS is putting a propaganda spin on all this.

Hentenza said:

Awww look the ad populum fallacy. The reformation happened to correct the doctrinal error and corruption of the RCC. It still continues today.

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Nah, ad populum probably applies better to Protestantism today than it ever did to Catholcism. Either way, popularity doesn't make right-or wrong-whereas history and experience means something-and the Reformers threw both pretty much out the door while speculating with Scriptual guess-work some 15 centuries after the fact, and then often disagreed on it's the meaning anyway. And that beat continues on even louder today. Either way they got the basics wrong. The truth of the faith as recorded in history, not just as it regards Catholicism but all of the early church east and west, is against you.

A New Dawn said:

FYI, the Doctrines of Grace are what you call Calvinism. TULIP = the Doctrines of Grace. All TULIP does is acknowledge and elucidate how God uses grace for salvation.

Also, another FYI, Augustine was the first to fully grasp the same concepts of salvation through grace that TULIP teaches. So, seeing your hatred for Calvinism and salvation by grace, I have no interest in your supposed “help”. But when you come to understand that Augustine and Calvin were on the same side of the discussion of salvation by grace, come and get me and I will help you out.

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Yes, I know of TULIP, of course, and I'm aware that Calvinism virtually adopted Augustine as their own due mainly to his work and emphasis on grace in battling Pelgianism. And the Catholic Church, BTW, calls him the Doctor of Grace-and the CC has the correct understanding and application of that work, as well, which is where you need help.

Mejia had been convicted on four separate occasions for traffic offenses, including driving without a license and driving on a suspended license three times.
Under the previous administration, an immigration judge terminated Mejia’s removal proceedings on July 25, 2023, after he was marked as a non-enforcement priority. This allowed him to indefinitely remain in the U.S. illegally. He entered the country illegally at an unknown data and location.

When will it end?

Guojing said:

So are you saying you are Israel?

That was what I was actually asking.

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No...not that it matters here

Good on her. I liked her music when I was a young Christian. She can now sing in her grand daddy's church.

jonojim1337 said:

Ok so what’s this

View attachment 371406

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I'll bite, what is it?

dms1972 said:

As regards the woman, she should have walked away, nothing required her to keep listening.

As regards your friend, was he really evangelising, or was he engaging in eristics?

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He was arguing that we are more than just an evolutionary process. This means he was arguing for the existence of a creator.
Sometimes, we need to show a person that God exists to start off with. Then, once they think that there is a God, we need to tell them the Gospel.
So, he was still evangelising. He may not have been telling the Gospel, but he was getting the person to come to the conclusion of the first point, that we are not an evolutionary process and that there is a creator.

essentialsaltes said:

Did it? Who were they? What were their names? What are they charged with? It's been a week and I haven't seen any information about it.

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Officials told TPM the apartment building in Chicago's South Shore was a "location known to be frequented by Tren de Aragua members and their associates." The crimes that have been committed by all those arrested include, but were not "limited to aggravated battery, discharge of a firearm, retail theft, possession charges and possession of a controlled substance."


Are you entitled to their names? How soon do you personally need information. Maybe you ought to contact DHS and demand to know everything. I mean since you have a right to know.

Oompa Loompa said:

So Jesus knew how hurtful his words would be for the woman, but told her that she had to change her sinful lifestyle anyway. No different than if I told a gay couple that their relationship is sinful and they need to end it.

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You really think Jesus had hurtful intent behind his words to the woman caught in adultery? I find that concept bizarre and sub-Christian.

The rest is just a bad analogy, but I think it flows from the fundamental misunderstanding of the context in which Jesus addresses the woman caught in adultery.

bèlla said:

Are you hoping that’s the case? I think their position is largely influenced by their overseers. The invisible hands behind the monolith. I’ve never believed politicians were running the show. Including the president.

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Ok so you have identified that there is some power or motivating factor that can force the State to adhere to certain ideologies or agendas. So the State is never neutral and can either be beholden to certain ideaologies from individuals and groups they side with. Or just their basic ideology as a party is antagonistic to opposing beliefs as we have seen in the culture wars.

They may descriminate against certain groups and deny funding merely because of a disagreement of ideological beliefs. Not facts or science or the truth about whats best. But merely because they don't like the other groups beliefs.

bèlla said:

I know what you’d like me to say but I can’t. The bible provides enough examples about christian’s place in the world and our hardships. Why we exacerbate the latter is beyond me.

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Are you saying that Christians or Christian organisations who may be descriminated against should accept that descrimination as part of the hardships they must endure. Say nothing.

I understand that we must not get into culture wars and make Christianity political. Like some sort of theocracy on earth through political or worldlly power. That is more or less becoming the world.

But where is the line. To what extent can a Christian organisation exist in the world without being the world. Maybe thats why I think Christians should be offering help for free. No strings attached and no obligations to anyone but God. But then they will still have to abide by the worlds ideologies.

Peter and Paul say Christians should be subject to the authroities even if they are unjust. Be Christlike and submit even if its unfair as the good example will turn people to God.

bèlla said:

Someone suggested that was the case in a previous post.

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I am not sure. If this is the case then it must be that people are assigned certain areas or health carers that are in their area. Like schools. So maybe that is the only hospital in her area. But then how can the hospital refuse to treat her if its suppose to be her care facility. \

Its also weird that a person would want to go to a hospital that could have actually caused her death. I would be staying well away lol. She would have to be at some other hospital now as she needs to be treated. I don't know.

bèlla said:

There was a time when I contemplated running a charity. But I decided against it for many reasons including the above.

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I mean setting up your home kitchen to cook meals for the needy is one one. But even then you have to be careful as it gets to a point where you have to start worrying about registrations, workplace health and safety ect.

But people still do it. They cannot help but start grassroots movements in helping others. They try and keep it quiet and do it in the background. I know of many who are driving round at night with meals and blankets helping those on the streets.

bèlla said:

Nothing in the world is free. Including charity. Someone must earn the means or create the resources you dispense. It doesn’t fall from the sky.

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Yes and thats those more able. A big cost is labor but as Christians doing it for no return helps a lot. This is how social welfare began with organisations like the Salvos. What you notice is that its infectous and then others come out and donate and want to help. It can be done for little money.

bèlla said:

Given the level of litigation in our society and the malpractice insurance rates they pay. I’d assume there‘s profit involved even if it appears otherwise. It’s a risky business.

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Obviously if your going to work with others you have to have some minimal costs like insurance and any State fees. But musch can be done with volunteers. I mean are not Christians suppose to help others like the Good Samaritan. Pool all their resources and help the poor. Even going without themselves.

Otherwise Christianity becomes just another version of corporate society in the world.

bèlla said:

How do you intend to do that? Or what have you done? I’ve noticed a pattern on the site concerning this subject. You only quote the bible and say what should occur. But I rarely hear personal tales. It’s kind of odd.

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First forget about what anyone has done. Either the bible is correct or its not. Christ and the disciples are clear. We are to help the poor even if that means sacrificing our own place in the world as far as riches and comforts. So it doesn't matter what others do as its a truth teachings.

MOst people agree Christians have become too comfortable with one foot in each world. Unlike the early church which proves its possible. We just forgot and the world has overtaken.

But ultimately the worlds suppose to hate Christ and Christians. So it doesn't matter as a true Christian will be called to stand up and suffer anyway. As for myself I try to help as much as I can. I am disabled so I cannot do a lot. But any work I have done has been to help others and now I volunteer as one of those free workers that helps run a organisation that helps the disadvantaged. I could do more.

bèlla said:

@Carl Emerson posed a question along these lines and I responded to the thread. My answer was based on something I drafted for myself concerning patronage and the direction I want us to take in our household. When the desire to give is deeply felt you do things like that. You don’t speak in platitudes or wag your finger. You put things in place and act.

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I think principly Christianity is not something that is always felt. Like the person has to feel in the mood for giving or helping. I think its a duty and even when we don't feel like it. Its something we have to make a priority even over our choices of work and personal investments ect that will create some nest egg and empire in this world.

Now I know this is incredibly hard especially in a consumer, modern tech and material world. But that is the aim. It will depend of course on family commitments as the bible says we have to first look after our family. How can we help others if we cannot look after our own family. But as a family that can make us stronger as a group to help others as well.

But its hard and ultimately its up to each individual and what they believe is right for them in their situation. But definitely I think we are to give up the world as much as we can and trust God.

Otherwise I think there will come a time where just being a Christian in this world will be too hard for many because by nature this world hates Christians and one way or another whether they voluntarily sacrifice themselves or not. They will suffer if they are truely standing with Christ.

bèlla said:

I’m not suggesting you‘ve done so with your post but it’s something I’ve noticed. And I‘ve been in circles where philanthropy is the norm and joined an organization known for its generosity in my twenties. I wasn’t walking with the Lord at the time but my commitment to patronage was great.

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It is natural for people to help others. But Christians are suppose to do it in secret. NOt tell others. As then it becomes about self rather than God. Theres a new phenomena called PC and social marketing which is all about the organisations social imprint and how this itself is now a marketable aspect of business in scoring brownie points in the eyes of society.

bèlla said:

I mentioned the value of a moral compass earlier and your comment has me weighing it once more. Many of the things I do aren’t on account of my faith. I don’t need the bible to tell me to give, live decently and so on. The desire to do so is already there. Perhaps that‘s why christians struggle so much. You’re working against your nature. It’s easier to follow the current than swim against it.

~bella

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I find desire is a feeling that can come and go and hard to maintain. Whereas as a principle helping others is a duty. A fruit that tells us we are in Christ and not of the world. Ultimately sacrificing ones life for another for no return. Which goes against human feeling and instinct.

This is suppose to be the Christian calling and its a matter of judgement as to whether we are truely in Christ or just weekend Christians.

Michie said:

I agree. It can turn into a phobia of sorts. Among many other things.

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The subject of the end of the world is affected by my OCD. In fact I just emailed my pastor (priest) about this again today.

AvilaSurfer said:

Zzzzzzzzzzz. This long boring car is over. Have fun.

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Yeah - facts are a bit much when they challenge firmly held personal opinions

High school homecoming celebrations in Mississippi ended in gunfire, with two separate shootings on opposite sides of the state Friday night that left at least eight people dead and many more injured, authorities said.

Six were killed in downtown Leland after a high school football homecoming game in the Mississippi Delta region on the state’s western edge, according to the county coroner. On the east side of the state, a pregnant woman was among the dead, Mississippi Gov. Tate Reeves said.

Some 20 people were injured in the gunfire after people gathered in the downtown area following the game...

Meanwhile, police in the small Mississippi town of Heidelberg in the eastern part of the state are investigating a shooting during that community’s homecoming weekend that left two people dead.

Both of them were killed on the school campus Friday night, Heidelberg Police Chief Cornell White said.

ViaCrucis said:

As much as I think this topic can be worthwhile to discuss in nuance, that's not going to happen here.
In this particular instance, however, I feel that this is an attempt to deflect.
So for our purposes here: I oppose abortion as morally wrong. Which I also stated already in my previous statement.

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ViaCrucis said:

Yes. Obviously so.
Let's explore this topic more.
If Israeli soldiers attacked Palestinians and kidnapped Palestinian families, held them hostage, and if Hamas responded by bombing Israeli towns and villages (including civilian buildings like hospitals, schools, and synagogues) would your position be the same as the one you hold?
More specifically: Is your position, morally speaking, that killing innocents is wrong (no matter who does it); or is your position, morally speaking, that Hamas is wrong? Does the religion, ethnicity, nationality, or identity of the people involved change your position morally? Or do you maintain a universal moral rubric?
Do you believe that the life of a Palestinian is of equal value as the life of an Israeli? Do you believe the life of a Muslim is of equal value to a Jewish person?

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Since it's my post and I brought it in, it's fine to discuss abortion.
Not a deflection.

First, hamas attacked Israel on 10/7/23.
So would you expect them to just dust off the dead people hamas murdered, bury them and go on with life without any retaliation?
It was an act of war on innocent people just going about their day. Children having fun with their families.
Should they have turned a blind eye to it and invite hamas over for tea after the funerals?
Killing innocent ones world wide is wrong...and hamas is evil.
All innocent life is of value, even innocent ones growing in the womb. Is your moral rubric just for those you can see outside the womb, but not the innocent growing ones you can't see in the womb?

Michie said:

Pope Leo XIV has put a spotlight on the risks of artificial intelligence in his choice of theme for next year’s World Day of Social Communications, as the Vatican emphasizes the important role of Catholics in media and AI literacy.

The pope’s choice of theme for the 60th World Day of Social Communications 2026, published Monday, is “Preserving Human Voices and Faces.” The day is celebrated every year on Jan. 24, the feast of St. Francis de Sales, patron saint of journalists and writers.

The Vatican’s explanatory note emphasizes the risks of AI, including that it “can generate engaging but misleading, manipulative, and harmful information, replicate biases and stereotypes from its training data, and amplify disinformation through simulation of human voices and faces.”

The theme of the World Day of Social Communications was released as the Vatican’s communication department is struggling to stem the tide of “deepfakes,” false images and videos of Pope Leo XIV saying and doing things he did not say or do.

Continued below.

Vatican: Catholics must respond to AI threat to authentic, human communication

The pope’s choice of theme for the 60th World Day of Social Communications 2026, published Monday, is “Preserving Human Voices and Faces.”

www.catholicnewsagency.com

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These are legitimate concerns about abusive misuse of AI. Part of what I’m trying to do with my research is create an ethical approach to AI which is radically different from how most people presently use it, in response to the concerns raised by Pope Leo XIV. AI is only good if it is anti-humanizing, something which promotes rather than detracts from the sacredness of the imageo dei.

joymercy said:

I think it's possible he's a widow, as death comes for everyone, young and old. so he's not too young to be one.

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Not that I want anyone dead but...ok

Chesterton said:

Would I let it vote? Only if Elon Musk selects the team who designs it

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That said I’m not a huge fan of Grok 3 compared to its competitors from chatGPT - it was faster but had a number of limitations. However in all fairness I have not had a chance to evaluate Grok 4.

boughtwithaprice said:

Even the Orthodox who I believe deny the immaculate conception due to disagreements with doctrine on original sin, recognize that the term Kecharitomene means Mary has been kept free from sin

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To be more precise, we do not believe our glorious lady Theotokos and Ever Virgin Mary is guilty of voluntary sin. And our understanding of original sin is not that you are forensically guilty of Adam’s transgression, but rather that the fallen state of humanity is like a hereditary illness which results in most of us sinning with every thought, but through the grace of God, we can not only be forgiven for sin but given the ability to overcome the sinful passions, as St. Anthony the Great was able to do through great struggle in the desert, in the face of repeated onslaughts of different kinds of diabolical temptations and demonic attacks.

All Christians should pay attention to the Life of Anthony, because St. Athanasius, who wrote it, is also responsible for our 27 book New Testament Canon and also defended the faith against Arianism, the denial that Jesus Christ is God Incarnate, in His divinity of one essence with the Father and the Holy Spirit, and likewise consubstantial with us in His humanity (St. Athanasius in particular insisted on the term “of one essence”).

At any rate, regarding the Theotokos, she was able to resist sin because with foreknowledge that she would consent to give birth to Him in the person of the Son and Logos, God specially graced her, as indicated by St. Gabriel when he addresses her as “Kecharitomene,” which was not a title used for St. Stephen the Illustrious Protomartyr, who was the first Christian to win a crown of martyrdom and is greatly venerable, but the Theotokos who carried God in her womb is uniquely venerable.

I don’t understand what motivates people to try to deny or downplay the holiness of the Theotokos. The word “Holy” means something set aside and consecrated, and the the Blessed Virgin Mary was consecrated as the Holy Theotokos, the immaculate* vessel by which Christ our True God was carried, who gave birth to Him and raised Him as His only biological parent.

I also don’t understand why people would attack the doctrine of the perpetual virginity, a doctrine accepted and commended not just by all Early Church Fathers but also by Martin Luther, John Calvin, Thomas Cranmer and John Wesley, and a doctrine which is plainly indicated by the same scripture its opponents use to try to attack it - many of these same people are opposed to the idea of holy celibacy and a monastic vocation despite the fact that St. Paul praised virginity and celibacy as being superior even to marriage, a theme echoed elsewhere in the New Testament. Now marriage is not wrong, but the idea that holy celibacy is wrong is unscriptural.

Perhaps our Lutheran friends @MarkRohfrietsch @ViaCrucis or @Ain't Zwinglian might have insights, or our Catholic friends @Michie @RileyG @Xeno.of.athens and @chevyontheriver or our Orthodox friends @prodromos @jas3 and @FenderTL5 , because I myself am utterly bewildered by this phenomenon.

It is not new however; antidicomarianism was documented by St. Epiphanios of Cyprus in the late fourth century, and was also a motivating factor behind the dreadful schism caused by the Christological error of Nestorius, who abused his position as the Patriarch of Constantinople to use force to try to suppress the veneration of Our Lady as Theotokos, and to justify this opposition to her veneration, developed a distorted Christology by manipulating certain speculations of Theodore of Mopsuestia into a radical Christology of separation and division between the divinity and humanity of Christ, one which compromises the idea of the Incarnation by leaning towards the idea of the Divine Logos and the man Jesus being two separate beings united by a single divine will (itself another Christological error, Monothelitism).

David Lamb said:

Yes, I should have mentioned, it is clear from the bible that when angels appear to people, they assume human form, but even so they are still spiritual beings.

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And I believe you already have known all along, they cannot reproduce at all.
Just as humans cannot reproduce with things that are not human.

RileyG said:

It wasn’t an order. It was a request that Jesus honored. Simple.

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If simple, what so much idolatary and confusion ?

Or, what request ? (in the Bible, not in tradition)

bèlla said:

I know who he is but never delved into his teachings. My time at Moody taught me a lot about the influence many have over believers and they’ll take their words as gospel. I remember a session in Precepts when we’re sharing our feedback on the lesson and one of the women in the class kept quoting John MacArthur. Every reference she had came from him and she wasn’t the only one. There was a deaconess seated near me who was bothered. I saw her expression and she said they treat him like a God and I agreed. Half the class were quoting him.

The point was driven home during a service. I was sitting with my prayer partner and the deaconesses and the pastor’s wife was in front of us. My prayer partner looked at our pastor and said he’s a fine man. I told her be quiet. You don’t know what he’s like behind closed doors. And said jokingly, he’s getting on her nerves just like yours is. His turned around and laughed and nodded and said yes.

They put them on pedestals but they’re not infallible. Believers are seduced by their public face but I’m not. My parents used to drive that home growing up to prevent us from being too trusting and believing what we see. They were never starstruck about ministers of any stripe and weren’t afraid to express their concerns. That wasn’t common back then.

That experience was impactful and I stopped listening to Moidy radio afterwards. I felt there were too many voices and that would make it difficult to find the leaven. Several years passed before I listened to anyone. And I only choose one to gauge my spirit‘s response. You’ll miss a lot when there’s too many. At this point I’m leery of the majority. But there’s one I like whose message is kingdom centered. Everything he says goes back to that and he addresses sin as well.

Max Lucado has always struck me as a ”feel good.” When I look at the covers on his books I think of Debbie Macomber. I don’t expect to be challenged. I could be wrong but I doubt it. Resources are nice but it isn’t the word and if you don’t understand the source you can’t discern the other.

~bella

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Bella, thank you for sharing all of that. Yes, we need to not put our trust in other human beings, and we should not treat anyone like they are a god to be worshipped, and that includes politicians and preachers. And we should test everything we hear or read against the Scriptures taught in their correct biblical context. And sadly there are many wolves in sheep's clothing among us who are leading people astray by the thousands or millions. Yes, Max Lucado is a "feel good" preacher, but one of the most deceitful of them all in the things he teaches which are so antibiblical. And I am not saying that he never teaches anything truthful, but that his teachings have many false narratives among them. Sue

Colo Millz said:

St. Paul writes to the Hebrews (11:6): “He that cometh to God must believe that He is, and is a Rewarder to them that seek Him”. It is asked by many: “Can man, without the light of faith, by his reason alone, know that God exists?” He certainly can. For the 18th Psalm says: “The heavens show forth the glory of God”; and St. Paul writes to the Romans (1:20): “The invisible things of Him (of God) from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made; His eternal power also and Divinity”. Hence the Vatican Council, in 1870, defined that it is possible for the existence of God, the Beginning and the End of all things, to be gathered with certainty from created things, by the aid of the natural light of human reason (Sess. III, Ch. 2).

Charles Coppens, A Systematic Study of the Catholic Religion, Nineteenth, Twentieth and Twenty-First Editions (St. Louis, MO; London: B. Herder Book Company, 1917), 117.

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Akanakten believe in one God and it could have been the one true God. The priests hated him for it.