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  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Does the Hebrew grammar of Daniel 9:24–27 support Christian Widener’s “double seventy-weeks” interpretation?

The graph indicates that the Daniel 9:27 covenant is made 30 days after the abomination in Jerusalem -

30 days after the start of the 1290 days. The covenant is 'cutting the great tribulation short'.

The 1260 days of the 2 witnesses are the exact 1st half of the covenant. It is occurring after the abomination in Jerusalem but before the abomination in Mystery Babylon ('Shinar' in Zech 5).

The end of the 1290 days is the mid-point of the 7 year covenant (1260 days into it). The end of the 1290 days is the 7th Trumpet.

Day 1335 is the 45th day into the '2nd half' of the 7 year covenant. The 2nd half (1260 days) is cut short to 45 days.
The second set of seventy weeks started in1542.
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DHS gives $10K bonuses to TSA agents who went 'above and beyond' during gov't shutdown

United States Secretary of Homeland Security Kristi Noem announced Thursday that Transportation Security Administration employees who worked during the government shutdown will receive $10,000 bonuses as the longest shutdown in U.S. history has come to an end.

During a Thursday press conference at Bush Airport in Houston, Texas, Noem announced that the agency was distributing bonus checks to TSA employees across the country who continued to work without pay during the government shutdown.

While Noem handed out bonus checks to several TSA workers standing beside her at the press conference who went “above and beyond” during the shutdown, she stressed that the DHS will “continue to evaluate every single employee that helped during the shutdown and stepped up and went above and beyond.”

Continued below.

What were your expectations as a new Christian?

Looking to get a little more insight from multiple people from multiple backgrounds on this. Thank you in advance to anyone who responds.
I'm not sure if I can help, but I'll answer :)

-When you first became a Christian, what did you expect life in the church to be like?
Everyone helps everyone, everyone is kind, caring and trustworthy.
-What were your hopes or assumptions about how things would go?
Warm/ Fuzzy/ Bunny land. I figured that nothing would be hard, and life would be fairly simple.
-What was your first experience with the church community?
I grew up in a non-denominational church so my first experience, I would say I was too young to form an opinion. If issues came up, I just assumed that's how things went. I also didn't look to much into anything and didn't question anything either.
-Did those expectations match reality, or were there surprises?
Polar opposite. I found most people to be hypocritical, self-righteous, egotistical, arrogant and cold-hearted. I also found that life is harder when you follow Christ lol but it's well worth it.
-How do you feel now about your place in the church?
I left the "church" in the scheme of a physical building where people congregate. I've tried several others but I haven't found a single church where actions back up what is being taught and I'm not the type of person that will let something like hypocrisy slide. We can disagree on theology on smaller issues but if the church is run by hypocrites, I'm out. I am aware though that it's most likely due to where I live. I kind of feel like I live in a city with a perpetual dark atmosphere. I am trying to move out of this state and I'm hoping and praying God is leading me to a better place.
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US Attorney's Office for SDNY was running an active investigation into Epstein and Maxwell's co-conspirators until it was killed by Trump's DOJ in Jan

I remember, before Trump became president. Some female tried to take Epstein and Trump to court. She was harassed so badly by Trump supporters. She withdrawn the complaint.
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MARK OF THE BEAST - REVELATION 13-14; 17; 18

When were you “with me.” You just disputed everything I said. None of which was futurism.
It’s only complicated when people try to make the Bible’s prophecy about the end of the world.
The simplest interpretation of the Mark of the Beast - the one that says the prophecy means exactly what it says! - is the one also most universally rejected, sadly. :( Login to view embedded media
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Do you keep the Sabbath? (poll)

1. 1 Cor 7:19 'What matters is KEEPING the COMMANDMENTS of God"
Ask a Jew how many commandments God gave only to Israel, and they will tell us 613. Jesus kept them all.
Without the Law... there is no sin Rom 4, and no need for grace or the gospel
Well, there is scripture we agree. Now, please explain the fact that you are only interested in telling us that we are only responsible for ten of them
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B flat B♭

Now who's mocking ?
Your husband must have had a good influence on you, because while he was alive, despite the disagreements you were a very likeable person.
You seem to have changed for the worse since his passing, as I'm finding very little to like about your current interactions in these threads. I too have lost loved ones, though not my wife, thank God, but I won't presume to try and give advice. Please do consider how the manner in which you are posting has changed and make an effort to get back to how you were. I'd like to be able to call you a friend despite our disagreements but cannot in good faith consider that with your current attitude.
God bless.
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Harvard conservative magazine is suspended by its own board after publishing article laced with Nazi rhetoric

I don't know what kind of good you think you're doing, diminishing Christianity down to the level of Islam.
I’m not diminishing Christianity; I’m comparing Early Medieval legal codes. Judaism, Christianity, and Islam all addressed the harm being done to minor wives at that point in history and offered appropriate remedies. You have to remember it was during a brutal period in history when those codes were written. Child marriage was the norm, and while historical context doesn’t excuse it, it does explain why those codes were written.

...If only the truth of your motivations could be revealed to their fullest. Because to me, it appears mostly destructive
I believe that having an understanding of history is important.
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Are the Jews Israel, or is the church Israel? Or does it depend on the context of the passage?

Nonsense. You are only saying this because of doctrinal bias. The NIV has one of the better translations of that verse because it shows that the Israel of God refers to all who follow the rule of being a new creation in Christ with neither circumcision (being a Jew) nor uncircumcision (being a Gentile) having anything to do with it.

(NIV) Galatians 6:14 May I never boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, through which the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world. 15 Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything; what counts is the new creation. 16 Peace and mercy to all who follow this rule—to the Israel of God.

But, even with the way it's worded in the KJV text, it's wrong to assume that the word "and" before it says "upon the Israel of God" implies that the Israel of God is a separate entity from those who walk according to the rule of being made a new creation in Christ regardless of being circumcised (of being a Jew) or not.

(KJV) Galatians 6:14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world. 15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature. 16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

If the word "and" before "upon the Israel of God" implied that the Israel of God was a separate entity from those who have been made a new creature/creation in Christ, then does that mean those who fear God are a separate group than God's servants in the following verse?

Revelation 19:5 And a voice came out of the throne, saying, Praise our God, all ye his servants, and ye that fear him, both small and great.

Clearly, those who fear God are His servants, so just because the word "and" comes before "ye that fear him" does not imply that those who fear God are a separate group or entity from God's servants. Obviously, God's servants are those who fear Him. Similarly, Paul saying "and upon the Israel of God" in Galatians 6:16 does not imply that he was differentiating between the Israel of God and those who have been made a new creation in Christ. He was simply referring to all those who have been made a new creation in Christ as "the Israel of God".

Galatians was written before Paul's final visit to Jerusalem in Acts 21.

If the Israel of God, is us, and he taught us that we are dead to circumcision (Galatians 5:2), then what James and the elders accused him of in Acts 21:18-25 would have been correct.

That is how I know the Israel of God in Galatians 6:16 is not us
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Why do people hate ICE...

Pope Leo offers his strongest criticism of Trump yet

[The Pope] is, she said, citing a church tradition stretching back more than 100 years on the issue, that includes ensuring the rights of families to remain together and protecting their spiritual needs.

'Rare': Catholic bishops prepare to send Trump a ‘special message’

The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops announced it will take a stand for migrants whom the Trump administration has targeted in an aggressive crackdown that has prevented many from receiving communion, according to The Washington Post.

The message on Wednesday is viewed as "rare" as the last one was in 2013, and requires two-thirds agreement by the bishops.

I bet Trump will have a 'special message' for them, too!
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Trump suggests he’ll release Jeffrey Epstein ‘client list’ if elected: ‘I’d have no problem with it’

Rep. Anna Paulina Luna says she will vote to release Epstein files, that it’s ‘wrong to implicate the president’

The congresswoman said she wants to see a list made public of “the alleged perpetrators and criminals that were engaged in the trafficking of victims.”

“I will tell you that from the get-go I have been actively against any pardons that might exist for Ghislaine Maxwell,” Luna said. “I just think that she’s a terrible person. She should not be getting any special treatment.”

[Luna did not sign the discharge petition, but many people are saying that a few dozen Republicans will vote to release the files.]

ETA: Don Bacon, Tim Burchett, Rob Bresnahan...
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US Citizens detained for hours during massive immigration raid that empties Chicago apartment building in the middle of the night

So far the government has alleged only two gang members were among those arrested. This is what required helicopters and zip-tying citizens.

Reporting Highlights

  • Chicago Raid: Agents rappelled from a helicopter to raid an apartment complex “filled” with Tren de Aragua gangsters. ProPublica found little to support the government’s claims.
  • Immigrants Speak Out: Federal officials declined to release the names of 37 immigrants detained in raid. ProPublica has identified 21 of them and spoken with a dozen.
  • A Bust? Immigration officials said they arrested just two members of Tren de Aragua. ProPublica talked with one and found no criminal records in his past.
Shortly after midnight on Sept. 30, some 300 agents from Border Patrol, the FBI and other agencies stormed the 130-unit apartment complex. SWAT teams rappelled from a helicopter, knocked down doors and hurled flash-bang grenades. They arrested 37 immigrants, most of them Venezuelans, who authorities say were in the country illegally. Agents also zip-tied and, for several hours, detained many U.S. citizens.

Federal prosecutors have not filed criminal charges against anyone who was arrested. Nor have they revealed any evidence showing that two immigrants arrested in the building belonged to the Tren de Aragua gang, or even provided their names.

That “raises a legitimate question as to whether any of the people in that building were really considered susceptible to prosecution,” said Mark Rotert, a former federal prosecutor and defense attorney in Chicago.

[Propublica identified one of the 'gang members'.] Our review of criminal records indicates that Chicago police arrested Parra for drug possession and driving without a license after a traffic stop last year, but the charges were dropped. We found no other arrest records.

Because of the lack of information provided by DHS, it is difficult to assess the accusations that Parra and another Venezuelan, who has not been named, belong to Tren de Aragua. A DHS spokesperson said one of the two men “was a positive match” on a watch list for terrorists. We checked several lists of alleged gang members that are kept by Venezuelan law enforcement officials and the international law enforcement agency Interpol; Parra’s name was not on those lists.

Nathan Howard, a U.S. citizen, was asleep in a fifth-floor apartment when the raid began. He saw the helicopter and the agents storming into the building from a stairwell on the roof. He was temporarily blinded by bright white lights as agents threw a flash-bang inside the apartment.

“It’s 20,000 of them running through my house like we got Saddam Hussein in the closet,” he said.

Cohen, a 40-year law enforcement veteran and former SWAT team member, questioned the decision to have agents descend from helicopters on ropes. Helicopters are routinely used for observation and support during raids. But in cities, the tactics known as rappelling, in which agents are attached to the ropes, and fast-roping, in which they are not attached, are typically reserved for extreme scenarios such as hostage rescues because of the risks of injury to agents and of a helicopter mishap to the public, experts said.

Cohen said he has done hundreds of searches, including in gang-controlled buildings, but “I have never rappelled out of helicopters in those operations.”
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Toronto City Hall Announces Plan to Fly Palestinian Flag Next Week

A Canadian nonprofit organization has succeeded in persuading the city staff of Toronto to fly the Palestinian flag at city hall next week in recognition of the “State of Palestine’s Independence Day” on Saturday.

U.S. bishops pass directive forbidding transgender surgeries at Catholic hospitals

Catholic hospitals in the United States are explicitly forbidden from carrying out transgender-related surgeries on individuals who believe themselves to be the opposite sex, the U.S. bishops said this week.

The prelates, gathered at the plenary of the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops (USCCB) in Baltimore, voted on Nov. 12 to direct hospitals to “preserve the integrity of the human body” when treating individuals with gender dysphoria.

Such individuals often seek surgery to make their bodies conform to that of the opposite sex. But in updated guidance, the bishops said that while Catholic health care providers must employ “all appropriate resources” to mitigate the suffering of such patients, they can use “only those means that respect the fundamental order of the human body.”

The new rule makes into explicit USCCB policy what the bishops expressed in a doctrinal note in 2023 when they said Catholic providers must not take part in procedures that “aim to transform the sexual characteristics of a human body into those of the opposite sex.”

Continued below.

What is God’s ‘Kin-dom’?

The kingdom is not a physical place, building, or a mere organization, but a condition of being where God's authority is acknowledged and obeyed. It is characterized by righteousness, peace, and joy in the Holy Spirit.

The Kingdom is not really the subject of this thread though, but the unbiblical “kin-dom”, an idea potentially heretical since God the Father, Son and Holy Ghost, three uncreated coequal and coeternal persons sharing the uncreated essence of the Father, ever one God, has no equals; there is no one like God, and His ways are inscrutable.

That said God does have a human mother and human relatives thanks to the the Incarnation, for God the person of the Only begotten Son and Word did take on our human nature by being born of the Blessed Virgin Mary, the Theotokos, and thus became consubstantial with us, as reflected in His name Emanuel.

Thus in rejecting the idea of the kin-dom we are rejecting the rejection of the Kingdom and of equality with God and not the idea of biological and consubstantial kinship with God, and also of tampering with the Lord’s Prayer, the Our Father.
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Young earth vs Old earth?

I can help you speed up your journey.


  1. Genealogy is the study of your family, from the distant past right up to the present day. Genealogy records are the historical sources that make this study possible, providing key details about your ancestry which allow you to piece together stories of past generations.

    Genealogy records explained
    There are many different types of genealogy records – each type contains different information

  2. Genesis Chapter one is the events that takes place, in the beginning - six days of creation. Genesis 1:1
    Genesis 2:1-3 the narration concludes the events...
    1 And so the heavens and the earth were completed, and all their heavenly [a]lights. 2 By the seventh day God completed His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because on it He rested from all His work which God had created [b]and made.

    Genesis 2:4 The narrator informs his reader that he is now going to give the history of those events in Genesis Chapter one.
    This is the history of the heavens and the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,

    He does not give the history in chronological order. Nor does he give every detail.
    He is selective.
    He starts by saying... (Genesis 2:5, 6
    5 Now no shrub of the field was yet on the earth, and no plant of the field had yet sprouted, for the Lord God had not sent rain upon the earth, and there was no man to [d]cultivate the ground. 6 But a [e]mist used to rise from the earth and water the whole [f]surface of the ground.

    That first statement even verifies it is a historical account.

Can you see why, or do you need help? :grin:
That's your homework to relocate your thinking cap.
I'll know if you find it by your response. No. I'm not giving you any more hints... yet.. :smile:
And what are your thoughts on how the teledoths noted above do not give history, but continue the story? Such as with Noah's children being born, followed by the story of Noah's ark?
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