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Adventists at the Crossroads of Legalism and Righteousness by Faith

The group that publishes AToday and Sepectrum are well known long time left fringe

I used to run down their rabbit trails a lot only to end up with nothing but a hand full of their sand and circular arguments and endless nickles and dimes.

I prefer actual substance
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Erika Kirk slams conspiracy theories

Fox & Friends Slams Tucker Carlson and Candace Owens for Charlie Kirk Conspiracies

The conspiracies are being propagated by the very same right wing pundits that exist in the very same right wing conspiracy theorist circle where Charlie Kirk trafficked.
Yeah. I, as a MAGA conservative, disavow and reject these conspiracy theories.
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Jack Smith tells House Judiciary Committee he could prove Trump engaged in a 'criminal scheme' to overturn 2020 election

Former special counsel Jack Smith told a congressional committee Wednesday that his team found "proof beyond a reasonable doubt” that President Donald Trump engaged in a “criminal scheme” to overturn the results of the 2020 election,according to portions of his opening statement obtained by NBC News.

Trump also “repeatedly tried to obstruct justice” to keep secret his retention of classified documents found during an FBI search in Mar-a-Lago, Smith told members of the House Judiciary Committee during a closed-door hearing.

Smith said his team turned up “powerful evidence that showed Trump willfully retained highly classified documents after he left office in Jan. 2021, storing them at his social club, including in a bathroom and a ballroom where events and gatherings took place.”

House Oversight Committee Chairman Jim Jordan, R-Ohio, subpoenaed Smith to testify as part of Republican efforts to investigate the special counsel's office.

Pushing back at criticism over his team's decision to obtain and analyze the phone call records of nine congressional Republicans, Smith told members of the committee that those records “were lawfully subpoenaed and were relevant to complete a comprehensive” investigation.

"President Trump and his associates tried to call Members of Congress in furtherance of their criminal scheme, urging them to further delay certification of the 2020 election.”

“I didn’t choose those Members," Smith added, “President Trump did.”

Smith is not expected to testify about Volume II of his report, which focused on Trump’s handling of classified documents.

After Trump’s team moved to block its release, [Judge] Cannon banned the release of that report, as well as the sharing of “any information or conclusions in Volume II” with anyone outside the Justice Department.

Is there another '1st World' country, where our darkskin-Black friends get arrested for having mental health crises?

In case you are wondering, I got the bits about your device and browser from the google link you posted. This is why we should all try to practice good net hygiene.
Oo! Do me next! What am I projecting into InfoSapce?
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ICE Agents swarmed by protestors in Minneapolis

"Federal agents were forced to deploy pepper spray and other crowd control measures after a sizable mob of Somali and far-left rioters surrounded them as they conducted deportation operations in Minneapolis on Tuesday."
Did you watch the video? There's no riot there. Why do you call them rioters?
They were interfering with a federal law enforcement operation, continuing to block access after a lawful order was given.
That's true and certainly an arrestable offense.

It's still not a riot.
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Didascalia Apostolorum Teaching of the Apostles inspired scripture

I don't have to listen to the whole text to know better.
You don't have to listen to the whole text, just glance at more than the first couple of sentences. You only have to read to paragraph 3 to see that he says Christians aren't under the Law, and paragraph 6 to get to the part I quoted.
It only took me less than 5 mins on that.
I would've been surprised if you had spent any longer on it and still been so wrong. What's more surprising is that you came away from that fully convinced that God Himself told you it was wrong because it promotes the Law, when in fact it is very explicit that Christians aren't under the Law. I would hope that that would give you pause about whether it was really the Holy Spirit you were listening to.
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There’s a Giant Flaw in Human History

You do this a lott. You pick out one aspect and ignore the rest. Between those links they clear state that this is a science wide problem and not just within the medical sector. So you are making a strawman and misrepresentation of what the articles are actually saying.
If the problem is especially bad in archaeology it should have been relatively easy to provide a link which show this.
Another fallacy and thats why I don't like debating you. You tend to throw in these personal jibes that is completely unnecessary. This is proving my point exactly that skeptics immediately and automatically equate everything said as conspiracy and psuedoscience.
What has this got to do with equating your nonsense with Erik Von Daniken's book?
If you haven't read the book then stop making stupid personal based opinions trying to pass them off as facts.
Alternatively if you have read the book explain why it's conclusion of aliens being the cause is less valid than the use of transcendental knowledge which also produced zero evidence.
Do you mean like you just literally did lol. You cheery picked the one article on bias in peer review that mentions the medical sector to make out that this was only about the medical sector.
Anyone with a half a brain would not use two examples of peer review issues in medicine as an example of a problem in archaeology.
Just just equated everything I said as quack and offered no evidence. But even so just dismissing it all as conspiracy is itself a disqualifier. Thus your arguements are from personal incredulity and ignorance because you have obviously ignore most of what is said and you know it.

Your doing it again. Assuming that what I have said is conspiracy or quack. What have I said that is not within the scope of todays sciences.
What hope do you have in being able to put forward a coherent argument when you do not understand the meaning of words like conspiracy?
This is the very argument from ignorance you constantly engage in and project on others.

Don't confuse the spectualtion in trying to workout how the ancients gained their knowledge through their experiences and beliefs with science.

Lets establish a basis as to where you draw the line. It seems you do not believe in anything but empiricle science as to what is knowledge of the world and reality. Is that right.

So therefore any spectualtion about transcedent knowledge such as through cultural beliefs or direct conscious experiences is unreal and but rather make believe. Is that right.

Where have I lies. Or is this lie concocted based on the many strawmen you have created and attributed to me.
What a load of rubbish, you have turned this thread into a lie fest by deliberately ignoring every piece of counter evidence given and then claiming no such evidence exists. It's called lying by omission.
As result your lies a more than a distraction they completely undermine your efforts in putting forward a coherent argument in defending what is basically pseudoscience.
Another logical fallacy. This time an either/or ie criticising Hawass or peer review means attacking science and archeology altogether. It does not follow.

It is well known that Hawss holding a lot of power and authority has used his position to control the information coming out. It is well know that there is bias and gatekeeping.

It seems reasonable in a debate about the insistence of using specific gatekeeping rules that the credibility of such is brought up. Its rather hypocritical considering I have spent most of this thread having to defend the sources I have linked. Another example and red flag of bias.
This is another example of lying, since you were unable to provide a single example of unethical peer review in archaeology, you decide to discredit the entire field on the behaviour of a single individual.
Whether the individual is actually guilty of your accusations is another story.

This thread is not about you having to defend your sources but your disgraceful level of dishonesty in having to make a point.
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Obama care collapsing.....

4 Republicans defy Speaker Johnson to force House vote on extending ACA subsidies

Republican Reps. Brian Fitzpatrick, Robert Bresnahan and Ryan Mackenzie, all from Pennsylvania, and Mike Lawler of New York signed on Wednesday morning, pushing it to the magic number.

[Vote could come in January.]
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Anybody know if Rob Reiner is okay?

What are people actually expecting?

What? Do they think that there's some magical number of outrage threads that'll finally turn people? "Boy, this one more brick up on the Trump bad wall could be the one that finally gets them to see the error of their ways and bow to our will"
When the outrages and illegalities continue on a daily basis, would you have everyone stop reacting and just accept the new MAGA world? At least we don't have to manufacture these outrages - they are real and egregious.
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Why is so much nonsense coming from America?

Shoplifting is against the law, and for good reason. And theft is morally wrong.

But if the wealthy are out stealing bags of gold, I'm probably going to be less worried about when a poor mother steals a loaf of bread to feed her kids. Especially if a big reason why her kids are starving and she's poor is because the wealthy are stealing the gold.

But I can't help but wonder... at what point do I have the right to tell that mother that feeding her children is wrong? That seems like an incredibly presumptuous thing for me to do... to assume that I have the right to judge the actions of someone who's shoes I've never walked in. Perhaps God has that right, but I'm not God.

If there's one thing that I can be sure of, it's my ignorance. So whether it's a mother shoplifting bread to feed her children, or a crackhead shoplifting iPhones to feed his habit, I always try to keep in mind that while I may be able to judge what's legal, I'll never be certain about just how good I am at judging what's moral.
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Utah Doctor Charged with destroying COVID-19 vaccines and giving children fake shots…Off the hook!

Pam Bondi Dismissed Charges Against a Surgeon Who Falsified Vaccine Cards. It Emboldened Others With Similar Cases.

Dr. Kirk Moore had been on trial for five days, accused of falsifying COVID-19 vaccination cards and throwing away the government-supplied doses.

The Utah plastic surgeon faced up to 35 years in prison if the jury found him guilty on charges that included conspiracy to defraud the United States. Testimony had paused for the weekend when Moore’s lawyer called him early one Saturday this July with what felt to him like unbelievable news.

U.S. Attorney General Pam Bondi had ordered Utah prosecutors to drop all charges, abruptly ending his two-and-a-half year court battle.

Moore was one of at least 12 health care professionals charged after giving or selling fraudulent COVID-19 vaccine cards since 2021, according to cases identified by The Salt Lake Tribune and ProPublica through government news releases and media clips. Those charged include midwives, nurses, pharmacists and another surgeon. Eight were charged in federal court by the Biden administration; prosecutors from California, New York and New Jersey brought state charges against four others.

Other than Moore, only one of these health care workers went to trial: a Chicago pharmacist whom a jury found guilty of selling on eBay blank vaccine cards that he had stolen from the Walgreens where he worked. The rest pleaded guilty and were sentenced to a mix of probation, home arrest and, in a few cases, prison. Many also were professionally disciplined with fines or suspension of their medical licenses.

Of those 11, the Chicago pharmacist appealed his conviction but the U.S. Supreme Court in November declined to hear his petition; his attorney told The Tribune and ProPublica that they are exploring a presidential pardon. One other health care worker said she, too, would like to be pardoned by Trump.

--

Moore met with The Tribune and ProPublica in his clinic in the Salt Lake City suburb of Midvale.

Moore referred to COVID-19 vaccines as “bioweapons” a dozen times and said he distrusts how quickly the government facilitated the vaccines’ rapid development and distribution. He said he concluded the vaccines were unsafe after conducting his own online research

The plastic surgeon said that he believes all vaccines are “poison” and that they have not been adequately tested — a view he says he has held for more than two decades. [Sounds like an unbiased Internet researcher!]

some children who received saline shots at their parents’ request falsely believed they were being vaccinated against COVID-19, according to court filings and Moore. This was a breach of medical ethics

Moore’s medical license is in good standing.
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Why do people hate ICE...

The problem is the repeated, constant conflating all Muslims with Islamists.

Funny how if a Christian commits an act of extremism isn't not an indictment against Christianity. I can point to a long history of extremism and violence committed by self-professed Christians. Does that mean Christians are violent--that Christianity is a religion of violence? I certainly don't think so, I'm a Christian, I'm committed to following Jesus who commands that I love and exhibit peace and abstain from violence. Yet the majority of Muslims, the world over, who follow and practice Islam without engaging in acts of violence, are still bundled together with every act of religious extremism committed by a Muslim somewhere, or with the most extreme, hyper-authoritarian expressions of Islam that can be found.

Should I, as a Christian, be judged because of the actions committed by the Kingdom of Castille during the Reconquista or the Spanish Inquisition?

No no, perhaps it's a difference in our respective holy texts. Christians have the Bible, and Muslims have the Qu'ran. And surely there aren't Christians who have used things written in the Bible to justify acts of cruelty. I mean could you imagine?

Okay so then maybe it's a difference in what happens when a religion becomes a super-majority and tries to enact a theocratic or near-theocratic form of government, and creating blasphemy laws or legislating beliefs and morals based on a particular interpretation of a religion--oh right, Reconquista, Spanish Inquisition, Crusades, Jewish ghettos, pogroms, the English Commonwealth, Tyndale being burned at the stake, Salem witch trials....hmm.

And we have all sorts of people calling themselves Christians who want to enact Christian Sharia, it's called Christian Nationalism.

Don't worry, I'm sure we'll hear all kinds of excuses for why Muslims, specifically, are really bad. And it won't at all be hypocritical, double standards, or double-speak at all.
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I hold a view similar to the Open View of God.

Mark Quayle said:
No. If he caused it, and that is reality, then whatever is real within that reality is caused by God. To characterize something within that reality as uncaused is therefore logically self-contradictory.

What? We are all causers. Even inanimate facts are causers. But we are not uncaused.

Do you not understand the difference between First Cause, and subsequent causes? The law of causation says that every effect is caused. And I say that the law of causation is universally pervasive. Even you speak that way, and with good reason, until suddenly you back off about God causing.

I'm sure you have heard of the chains of causation. As far as I know, all effects are also causes, and all causes have multiple effects. These interwoven "chains" are always there, right down to the point where you decide what you decide. And God did that. God made that. God spoke that reality into existence.
And that reality is one in which at least some of the participants make new reality. That's how God made us. I think it's one way we are made in God's image.
That characterization is false. You choose to do those things. I would love to hear you show me something for which God is not first cause.
What do you mean by "first cause"? Do you mean that the first causer causes in a predetermined way for all subsequent causers? Then there are many things for which God is not the first causer. If I write a sentence, like this one, God is the first causer in that without His causation of me, and all the things that preceded me such that I came to be (not to mention all the things that happened after I came to be that shaped my personality), but He is not ordinarily the first causer of my thoughts and actions. In other words, His first causation was not a sufficient cause of my writing of this paragraph. More was needed.
Even YOU believe God is the creator of all that is. If he is that Creator, and if there is sin, then he caused that there be sin.
No, not in a predetermined fashion.
You continue to group God into our level with the rest of reality.
Only insofar as that is how He describes Himself.
Disclaimer: Now this that follows, I'm not saying is fact, but it points toward something you ignore: God does not reside with us within this reality, in the same way that we are within and bound to this reality. He MADE this reality. Consider the notion that we are mere thoughts in God's head —again, I'm not saying that notion is true, but it points at a truth. God is not like us.
I'm not sure how that notion helps, but if you are presuming that our thoughts are only God's thoughts, the Bible tells us you are incorrect.
Nope. Your insistence that you choosing what God knows you will choose means that you do not actually choose, is insistence on vapid notions. God knowing (and causing) what you choose is the only way you even CAN choose. I wish you would find anywhere in the Bible that teaches that human choosing is a result of plain chance, or even, that human choosing is pure spontaneity on the part of the chooser.
Why is that necessary? You seem to be saying that if God is not directing our every choice, the choice must be random. Why?Are you saying that God did not create us capable of making choices?
You cannot do it. Nor can you show it logically. All you can do is reiterate your thesis based on circular thinking. You keep trying to prove I am wrong by assertion alone.
Welcome to the club.
Go back to the beginning. God. God is first cause, and, btw, the ONLY first cause. There can be only one first cause, and that is God. EVERYTHING else, therefore, is result.
God is not a sufficient first cause to produce my post.
You don't even engage me on this —you only keep asserting that choice by definition means uncaused choice (in various different words) and that therefore my claim is false.

There's a reason you don't engage me on this. You are insisting on self-determination.
Why is self determination a problem? He didn't say "self-creation" after all
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The Saving results of the Death of Christ !

Christs Death alone saved and redeemed them He died for, hear the testimony of the elders who sit around the Throne Rev 5:9

And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; 10
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Pastors Resign From Greg Locke’s Church, Allege Spiritual Abuse; Locke Disputes Claims

Hmmmm...

On one hand, I'm not surprised that a pastor that comes across as abrasive, brash, bullying and dictatorial in the pulpit would be equally abrasive, brash, bullying and dictatorial outside the pulpit.

On the other hand, that the fact that the resigning pastors have a book about their experiences in the works and this whole timeline and messaging lines up so as to make maximum $$ and publicity from the book doesn't speak well for them either.

Pot, meet kettle perhaps?
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Chains of Bondage

The law of Moses is one whole, and its partial observance is the breaking of the law. If you keep only the Ten Commandments but reject the hundreds of other parts of the law, you are a transgressor of the law. Not one jot or one tittle shall pass from the entirety of the law before it is fulfilled. Matt. 5:17-19. / John 19:30.

I would agree to a point. God's Commandments, Statutes and Laws are all ONE unit, "God's Commandments". It is un-Biblical to say God's Law was different for Caleb than it was for Danial, or to say God's Laws, Statutes and Commandments given to Abraham's Children were different than God's Laws, statutes and Commandments given to Abraham.

But there was a LAW that Abraham wasn't given, that wasn't "ADDED" to God's Commandments, Statutes and Laws until after the Golden calf event some 430 years after Abraham.

Jer. 7: 22 For I spake not unto your fathers, nor commanded them in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt, concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices:

23 But this thing commanded I them, saying, Obey my voice, and I will be your God, and ye shall be my people: and walk ye in all the ways that I have commanded you, that it may be well unto you. (God commanded Abraham the same thing in Gen. 17:1)

24 But they hearkened not, nor inclined their ear, but walked in the counsels and in the imagination of their evil heart, and went backward, and not forward. This is speaking to the Golden calf event when God was going to wipe them all out and make a great nation out of Moses, but had mercy on them and "ADDED" the sacrificial Priesthood Works required for men for the remission of their sins, "Till the Seed should come". (Paul speaks to this in Gal. 3)

This would be a Temporary Priesthood Law, according to the Priesthood Covenant God made with Levi, (After the Order of Aaron) that was prophesied to "Change" After Those days. It pertained to how God's Laws, statutes and Commandments were administered, and how the remission of a man's sins were provided for. (You can find reference to this in Jer. 31 where God Defines HIS Promised New Covenant) This Law was to be in force, until the Prophesied Priest, "After the Order of Melchizedek" should come. Moses speaks of Him in Duet. 18. David Speaks of Him in Ps. 110:4.

So it is true for instance, after the resurrection of the Lord's Christ, that if a man took a goat to a Levite Priest for the remission of his sins, this man was breaking God's Laws, and had refused to "Hear Moses and the Prophets", who all foretold of the Christ. Because the Pharisee taught for doctrines the commandments of men and not God, they were blind to this truth. But Zacharias, Simeon and Anna, who "Yielded themselves" servants to obey God, they knew the Christ before HE was even born.

I think your post fails to address these very important Biblical Truths, that show us that the Law of Moses was NOT "one whole law", as the Scriptures themselves clearly point out.

1 Sam. 15: 22 And Samuel said, Hath the LORD as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices, as in obeying the voice of the LORD? Behold, to obey "is better" than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams.
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