Belk said:

No. Try addressing real issues, not the ones you make up to easily defeat.

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If the issue is people being fooled with a $2000 check, I predict that hardly anyone will change their opinion about Trump and the people who hate him the most will gladly take the cash only to turn around and trash him for it.

comana said:

This doesn’t prevent qualified immigrants from getting CDLs, the only change is the expiration date will align with the visa expiration date.

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But it will prevent employers from hiring truckers who they "think" are legally allowed to drive trucks in this country, but aren't.

PloverWing said:

Some of this is going to be natural climate. Much of Iran is naturally fairly arid (or so Wikipedia tells me ). In the comparison, I don't know whether you mean Georgia the state or Georgia the country. The US Atlantic coast typically gets lots of rainfall in most places. I know less about Georgia the country, but I think its climate is also naturally less desert-y than Iran.

A better comparison might be a place like Arizona, much of which is naturally arid.

People can live in arid places if there's a source of water and they use the water carefully, but if there's a drought, they're more vulnerable than wet coastal areas are. Droughts can be a judgment from God, hypothetically, but I'm more inclined to attribute them to natural causes. I don't think Arizona is especially sinful, for example.

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Fair point! Okay, so Arizona got 7.49 so far this year. But with this in mind, wouldn't God bless a nation with more rain even if it was a desert if they were following him? Like for example, the nation of Chile is 70-89% Christian and their desert Atacama, is known as the worlds driest desert but this year, it bloomed. (link)

The archtypical Pharisee is everywhere around us. It’s interesting that Christ did spend a good part of his ministry exposing these people, explaining their doom. And just like Abraham said, if they do not believe the words of Moses, neither will they believe if one rises from the dead.

They’re good at trying one’s patience and faith. Is that the only reason why they’re here?

Hentenza said:

I hear you. That’s what I meant in the last part of my post. I was an advisor with CF back when we came out with the statement of faith. I was part of the advisory team that developed it. There was a lot of thought put into it and there was a lot of input from the membership then. CF was a bit different then and was very busy. We even had forums for non Trinitarian churches like the JWs, Mormons, and Christadelphians. Gnostics could even post in that forum. Now we have a watered down version of what it was. With that said, the statement of faith was not intended to define who was a Christian and who was not but merely to determine where they could post. Now is used to determine who can actually post in the Christian sections of the forum.

As far the doctrinal differences, I like to use 2 Timothy to make my point.

“But evil people and impostors will proceed from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived. You, however, continue in the things you have learned and become convinced of, knowing from whom you have learned them, and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is inspired by God and beneficial for teaching, for rebuke, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man or woman of God may be fully capable, equipped for every good work.”
‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭3‬:‭13‬-‭17‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

2 Timothy 3:16 All Scripture is inspired by God and beneficial for teaching, for rebuke, for correction, for training in righteousness | New American Standard Bible - NASB (NASB2020) | Download The Bible App Now

All Scripture is inspired by God and beneficial for teaching, for rebuke, for correction, for training in righteousness

bible.com

Evil and impostors will deceive. There are two types of people some evil and some impostors. Some of these are deceiving and some have been deceived. The evil ones we can just rebuke in Jesus name and move on but the ones that have been deceived is a group that we can teach and correct. I remember many Mormons and JWs back then that converted to Trinitarian denominations after realizing the foley of their doctrine.

The basics of the gospel, like Christ dying in the cross for our sins, is based on sound scripture teaching which Paul and the apostles taught. 2 Timothy was written in the mid to late 60’s while Paul was in prison in Rome so he was privy to the arguments against Christianity by groups like the gnostics, Roman philosophers, and other secular philosophies of the time, hence he was warning Timothy and the church to be on the look out. So we are still looking for the same things these days and groups like the Mormons and JWs fit the bill.

Other than the obvious though some denominations judge others that believe in the Jesus of the gospels by what I call non salvific doctrines. Doctrines that have no effect on our salvation. Doctrines like universalism and soul sleep for example do not question the Jesus of the gospel but some will question their Christianity and in CF can only be posted in the controversial theology forum. I believe that salvation is by grace through faith in Christ so as long as they can define the Christ of the gospel then I am not going to question their Christianity. So the body of Christ in my opinion are those Christians that believe in the Jesus of the gospel.

Sorry for the winded post.

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Thanks for your response and well thought out reply! I appreciate the explanations and I can agree with this!

Always in His Presence said:

Did you read it in context?

1 Cor 3:9 For we are God’s fellow workers; you are God’s field, you are God’s building. 10 According to the grace of God which was given to me, as a wise master builder I have laid the foundation, and another builds on it. But let each one take heed how he builds on it. 11 For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if anyone builds on this foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, 13 each one’s work will become clear; for the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire will test each one’s work, of what sort it is. 14 If anyone’s work which he has built on it endures, he will receive a reward. 15 If anyone’s work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.​

​

That would be at the judgement


Heb 9: 27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,

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Agree, that passage is referring to our judgment. After death. And exactly what do you think is happening in that passage when it refers to the truth that our works will be revealed by fire and tested by fire. And if those works are burned up we will suffer loss but will be saved through fire?

Always in His Presence said:

2 Cor 5:21 21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

If we have been made the righteousness of God through the sacrifice of Christ are we not sanctified.

Not shown anywhere in Scripture/

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We are in the process of being sanctified. Otherwise, why is God disciplining us so we can share in his holiness (Hebrews 12:10)? Why are we told to strive for the holiness without which we will not see the Lord (Hebrews 12:14)?

Why does St. Paul, when speaking about the possibility of his sharing in Christ's resurrection tell us that "Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect; but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own" (Philippians 3:11-12)?

Why does Paul tell the Corinthians that "beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from every defilement of body and spirit, and make holiness perfect in the fear of God" (2 Corinthians 7:1)?

None of that makes any sense if sanctifcation occurs completely and perfectly at the initial moment of salvation.

So once Christ dwells within us, he begins to sanctify us. We can cooperate and move towards perfection steadily, or we can resist, backslide, and drag our feet. If we follow the latter course we are more likely to experience the chastisement by God spoken about in Hebrews 12. But only once this sanctification process is complete are we ready for heaven. A place where we no longer sin because we no longer have any attachment to sin. We truly become one of the "just men made perfect" as Scripture calls those in heaven.

I don't know who does the live strem videos best... Nice little 15 minute summary here...

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Judge appears skeptical of Lindsey Halligan’s appointment as interim US attorney​

At a James Comey / Leticia Jame motion hearing at federal court today, the Judge in anticipating of receiving the Grand Jury transcript that Lindsey Halligan neglected to provide the first time it was requested, came up at today's motion. The Judge noted despite the second request the transcript is still not there. In response the DOJ with Halilgan at the helm responded, one doesn't exist. And the reason why it didn't exist was because there was no court reporter there. I kid you not. In their motion defense the DOJ lawyer argued that DOJ Pam Bondi had reviewed the transcript in a signed statement.



I mean either someone or all of them are lying to the judge. Under any other presidency or congress these folks would have been hauled into congress to answer questions of incompetancy and/or fired. But this is the Trump admin where incompetance takes a back seat to loyalty.

Chesterton said:

I noticed. Otherwise you would have made an argument rather than just bald assertions.

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We can't know everything, but we can know what knowing everything would have to entail or mean to some degree, and then use that knowledge to challenge or modify some of our current beliefs, which are/have been wrong a lot classically or historically, etc.

God Bless.

# 1 ONE GROUP. are those under the LAW. and the LAW of Moses does count for today as Christ BLOOD

has NOT YET BEEN CRUCISFIED on the Cross. !!

#. 2 Those who are in the BODY of CHRIST

# 3 THOSE that are UNBELIEVERS'

# 4 THOSE UNDER THE NEW COVENANT

dan p

prodromos said:

I wouldn't have a problem

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Looks like you're the shot-caller in this joint. Thank you, brother! I'll get started when I can.

I’ve been studying Daniel 9:24–27 closely and created a detailed clause-by-clause chart of the prophecy, including Hebrew words, chiastic layers, and proposed historical and eschatological fulfillment. My translation emphasizes that the 70 weeks are “divided out” (נֶחְתַּךְ), and verse 25 mentions “the second sixty” (בַּשְּׁנַיִם שִׁשִּׁים), suggesting a second 70-week cycle beyond the first 70 fulfilled historically (457 BC – 33 AD).


══════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════
Verse | Phrase / Clause | Hebrew Key Words | Chiastic Layer | Fulfillment / Date Marker
──────|----------------|-----------------|----------------|-------------------------
9:24 | There are divided out seventy weeks | נֶחְתַּךְ | A – Divine Purpose | Dual cycle: first 70 (457–33 BC), second 70 (1542–2032 CE)
9:24 | For your holy city | קָדְשְׁךָ | A | First 70: Jerusalem rebuilt 457–408 BC
9:24 | And your people's rebellion | עַמְּךָ | A | Second 70: Israel aligns with man of sin, 1967–2032 CE
9:24 | For the restraining of lawlessness | לְכַלֵּא חַטָּאת | A | Second 70: restraining the man of lawlessness (2 Thess 2), 2025–2028.5 CE
9:24 | Marked out for the coming punishment of purging | עָוֹן | A | Second 70: end of tribulation / Day of the Lord, ~2032 CE
9:24 | For the sealing of the vision and the prophet | וּלְחָתֵם חָזוֹן | A | Second 70: vision fully realized in eschatological age, ~2032 CE
9:24 | Unto the age of righteousness; anointed holy of holies | צֶדֶק, וְלִמְשֹׁחַ קֹדֶשׁ קָדָשִׁים | A | Second 70: age of righteousness begins, ~2032 CE
──────|----------------|-----------------|----------------|-------------------------
9:25 | From the word that went forth | מִן-מֹצָא דָבָר | B – Starting Points | First 70: 457 BC decree; Second 70: 1542 CE Suleiman rebuilds
9:25 | For the restoration and building of Jerusalem | לְהָשִׁיב וְלִבְנוֹת יְרוּשָׁלִם | B | First 70: 457–408 BC walls rebuilt; Second 70: 1542 CE walls rebuilt
9:25 | For a ruler and an anointed one for Jerusalem | נָגִיד וּמָשִׁיחַ | B | First 70: Ezra & Nehemiah; Second 70: typological “anointed ruler” / covenant leadership, 1967–2032 CE
9:25 | It shall take seven sevens to be built | שִׁבְעָה שִׁבְעִים | B | First 70: 49 years, 457–408 BC
9:25 | Returned at the second sixty | בַּשְּׁנַיִם שִׁשִּׁים | B | Second 70: 1967 CE, second 60th week, pivotal chiastic marker
9:25 | Anguish and diligence in streets | — | B | Both 70s: First 70 = post-rebuilding trials; Second 70 = tribulation, 2025–2032 CE
──────|----------------|-----------------|----------------|-------------------------
9:26 | Two and sixty weeks after | שִׁשִּׁים וּשְׁנַיִם | C – Pivot | First 70: Messiah cut off, 26–33 AD
9:26 | None of the Messiah will be cut off | וְאֵין לוֹ | C | First 70: preserved remnant of faithful Jews, 26–33 AD
9:26 | People of the ruler shall come like a flood | עַם-נָגִיד יָבוֹא בַּשֶּׁטֶף | C | Second 70: eschatological armies / enemies, 1967–2025 CE
9:26 | City and sanctuary destroyed | הָעִיר וְהַקֹּדֶשׁ יִשָּׁחְתּוּ | C | First 70: 70 AD temple destruction; Second 70: final judgment & abomination destruction, ~2032 CE
──────|----------------|-----------------|----------------|-------------------------
9:27 | He shall cause many of the covenant to prevail | וְהִגְבִּיר בְּרִית לָרַבִּים | D – Central Climax | Second 70: 2025 CE start of final 7-year week
9:27 | For the week and a half of one | וְחֲצִי הַשָּׁבוּעַ | D | Second 70: mid-week, 3½ yrs into final week, 2028.5 CE
9:27 | Upon offering and sacrifice he shall bring to end abominations | מִנְחָה וְזֶבַח … שִׁקּוּצִים | D | Second 70: eschatological cleansing of temple / people, 2025–2032 CE
9:27 | Until the one who makes desolate pours out what is decreed for consummation | שֹׁמֵם | D | Second 70: consummation / Day of the Lord, ~2032 CE
══════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════
Notes:
- Chiastic pattern: A–B–C–D–C’–B’–A’
- Hebrew keywords highlighted for structural clarity
- Second 60th week = 1967 CE pivotal marker
- Restraining lawlessness = 2 Thess 2 reference; final week = revealing of man of sin

Questions for the community:

1. Does the Hebrew wording and syntax provide linguistic support for two distinct 70-week cycles, rather than a single 490-year timeline?


2. Can the chiastic pattern (A–B–C–D–C’–B’–A’) be reasonably defended from a grammatical and syntactical standpoint?


3. Are there any objections from the Hebrew text itself (singular/plural forms, verb agreements, semantic scope) that might favor a single-cycle interpretation?



I’d love insights from scholars or practitioners experienced in Biblical Hebrew, Daniel studies, or eschatological prophecy analysis.


---
══════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════
DANIEL 9:24–27 DUAL 70-WEEK CHIASM
══════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════
CHIASTIC LAYER: A B C D

FIRST 70 WEEKS — HISTORICAL FULFILLMENT
──────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────
457 BC 408 BC 26 AD 33 AD 70 AD
|---------------|---------------|---------------|---------------|
Word goes 7 weeks Messiah Messiah cut Temple
forth: decree (49 yrs) appears off (וְאֵין לוֹ) destroyed
to rebuild Built walls (נָגִיד/ People of City & Sanctuary
Jerusalem /city מָשִׁיחַ) the ruler destroyed
(מִן-מֹצָא completed rejected (הָעִיר וְהַקֹּדֶשׁ)
דָבָר, בִּירוּשָׁלִם) Messiah)
נָגִיד וּמָשִׁיחַ)

Verse refs: 9:24–26

──────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────
SECOND 70 WEEKS — MODERN / ESCHATOLOGICAL FULFILLMENT
──────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────
1542 CE 1967 CE 2025 CE 2028.5 CE 2032 CE
|---------------|---------------|---------------|---------------|
Word goes Second 60th Start final Midpoint of Consummation
forth: Suleiman week marker 7-year week week, half- / Day of Lord
rebuilt walls (בַּשְּׁנַיִם Many of the week (וַחֲצִי ends / holy
of Jerusalem שִׁשִּׁים) covenant הַשָּׁבוּעַ) place anointed
(מִן-מֹצָא prevail (וְהִגְבִּיר)
דָבָר)

Abominations cease (שִׁקּוּצִים)
Until the one who makes desolate pours out decree (שֹׁמֵם)

Verse refs: 9:24–27
──────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────
CHIASTIC STRUCTURE KEY:

A — Holy City / People’s Rebellion (v.24)
B — Starting points / restoration (v.25)
C — Messiah cut off / people of ruler (v.26)
D — Many of covenant prevail / final week & half-week / cleansing (v.27)
C’ — Mirror of C: eschatological “people of ruler” & destruction
B’ — Mirror of B: second 60th week / Jerusalem returned
A’ — Mirror of A: consummation / sealing up / age of righteousness
══════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════

pasifika said:

Thank you for the post, the "deeds of the law" is referring to the old covenant law as a whole. Not just animal sacrifices because sacrifices applies when you sin and needed forgiveness, as if no sacrifices then there is no forgiveness of sin (both animal sacrifices and law goes hand in hand). The new covenant though is forgiveness by believe in the Gospel no animal sacrifices. Christ is our sacrificial lamb. Believe in Him and your sins will be forgiven.

You cannot keep any commandments given under the old covenant the lamb as was only given so we can see our sinful ways. So you can never show love by trying to keep the Sinai law.

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I think you and Paul don't see eye to eye, because he says in (Rom. 7:7,12) (v.7) What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, THOU SHALT NOT COVET.

Paul asked a question, is the law sin? He said God forbid, he said the only way that he knew what sin was, was by the law.

(v.12) Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good. Why in the world would a Christian want to do away with something that God said is holy.

Paul says in (Rom. 4:15) Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression. If there is no law there is no sin.

We must realize everybody has laws by which we must operate by, the governments have laws, your job have laws, your card games have laws, even the boy scouts have laws. But now you are going to try and convince yourselves that the creator of the world has no laws by which we must live.

Larniavc said:

Hoist. It’s hoist.

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LOL. Duly corrected.

DaisyDay said:

American deported:

Man deported to Laos despite US court order blocking his removal, attorneys say

District judge told Ice to keep Alabama man in US while he showed what judge called ‘substantial claim’ to citizenship

www.theguardian.com

​

Immigration officials have deported a father living in Alabama to Laos despite a federal court order blocking his removal from the US on the grounds he has a claim to citizenship, the man’s attorneys said on Tuesday.​

​

US district judge Shelly Dick last week ordered US Immigration and Customs Enforcement to keep Chanthila “Shawn” Souvannarath, 44, in the United States while he presented what the judge called his “substantial claim of US citizenship”, court records show. He was born in a refugee camp in Thailand but was granted lawful permanent residence in the US before his first birthday, according to court filings.​

​

But Souvannarath on Sunday messaged his wife on WhatsApp and told her he was in Dongmakkhai, Laos, according to a screenshot she shared with the Associated Press. The message ends with “love y’all”.​

​

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He's not legally a citizen. He was not born here and was never naturalized. His legal argument goes against immigration law. There is nothing in the law that says you are a citizen just becauae your parent becomes one. How do I know? I'm from an immigrant family. My dad became naturalized before me. We were told that I and my sister had to be naturalized too before we were citizens. I did it before I was 18 because it was harder and more costly afterward.

Apple Sky said:

What's this got to do withe the moon ?

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It's your turn to answer some questions.

GoldenBoy89 said:

Who is she going to sue, the voters?

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Beats me. It's all entirely legal. If I was Newsome then if they do go ahead then I'd copy out the summons verbatum, change California to Texas and sue them back.

Stopped_lurking said:

It remains to show that all infinite regresses in ontology and epistemology are vicious. Or that this one is at least.

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It remains to be shown that either is even possible, let alone whether or not they are coherent.

Dikaioumenoi said:

Those who were appointed to eternal life, did what? They believed.

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Yes. And? I said that it doesn't say they were appointed to believe. Which is true. Is there something you don't understand about that?

Dikaioumenoi said:

It is not believers who were appointed to eternal life on account of their belief. It was those who were appointed to eternal life, who consequently believed on account of that appointment.

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Wrong. That doesn't line up with the rest of scripture. Does it matter to you if you interpret that verse in a way that doesn't contradict other scripture, including Acts 13:46 which talks about the Jews who were there and rejected the gospel judging themselves unworthy of everlasting life, implying that it was their choice to believe the gospel or not? In your doctrine, God alone judges people to be unworthy of everlasting life by not giving them faith rather than anyone judging themselves unworthy of everlasting life by choosing to reject the gospel. God has appointed that anyone who believes will have everlasting life (John 3:16). That does not mean He appointed anyone to believe, as if people don't have a choice in the matter. Acts 13:46 shows that people do have a choice in the matter. Why interpret Acts 13:48 without taking Acts 13:46 and other scriptures into account?

Without addressing any particular post here is my view on Biblical "eternal punishment"
Jeremiah 13:11
(11) For as the girdle cleaveth to the loins of a man, so have I [God] caused to cleave unto me the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah, saith the LORD; that they might be unto me for a people, and for a name, and for a praise, and for a glory: but they would not hear.
Jeremiah 13:14
(14) And I will dash them one against another, even the fathers and the sons together, saith the LORD: I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy, but destroy them.
Matthew 7:22-23
(22) On that day, [day of judgement] many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, didn’t we prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many powerful deeds in your name?’
(23) Then I [Jesus] will declare to them, ‘I never knew you. Go away from me, you lawbreakers!’
[When Jesus says never He does not mean some day by and by]
Romans 1:24
(24) Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Romans 1:26
(26) For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
Romans 1:28
(28) And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

camille70 said:

Google is still free but I like being helpful so...

LMGTFY

LMGTFY

lmgtfy2.com

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I didn't say he coined the name only that he distanced himself because not one of his promises about the ACA came true

1. You can keep you plan - wrong
2. You can keep your doctor - Wrong
3. Health insurance cost will go down - Wrong

Here is the truth:

1. Premiums have increased by 80%.
2. From 2010 to 2023, the average premium for family coverage increased 80%, from just over $13,000 to nearly $24,000.
3. Total healthcare costs for a family of four now exceed $30,000 per year—increasing from $18,000 per year when Obamacare was passed.
4. Deductibles have increased over 50% since Obamacare was implemented in 2013.

Remember this beauty?

Boston on October 30, 2013, President Obama promoted the Affordable Care Act (ACA) and emphasized its affordability. He stated that “for many Americans, health insurance will cost less than the cost of your cell phone bill or cable bill.”

RestoreTheJoy said:

Extremist activists are the ones who are violent in the political realm. Everyone else either writes to congressmen or peacefully protests somewhere, standing around with signs.

No one who is committing violence, assaulting officers, attacking others, spitting on or screeching at anyone is a "deeply committed" rational person. Irrational people commit violence (unless they are just psychopaths/sociopaths and know full well what they are doing- get them off the street).

Show me news articles of non-extremists charged with/convicted of violent crimes.

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I'll give you an opportunity to re-read the post you wrote to which I was responding. Then, I hope you will address my points and not erect a straw man by changing your definition of extremist mid-stream. I was looking for an open discussion, not a reply that looks like a rhetorical trick.

Christs saving death will result in everyone He died for, receiving a Divine Call into the enjoyment of the eternal inheritance. Heb 9:14-15
14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

Eph 1:13-14

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth[The Call], the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.9

fli said:

Romans 8:33 Who shall bring a charge against God's elect? It is God who justifies. 34 Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died, and furthermore is also risen, who is even at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us. 35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? 36 As it is written: "For Your sake we are killed all day long; We are accounted as sheep for the slaughter." 37 Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us. 38 For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come, 39 nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. NKJV

Paul asks who will bring a charge against God's elect? He answers his question in the same verse, it is God who justifies. Then Paul asks who condemns us. Then He answers that question- it is Jesus. God the Father has granted all judgment to Jesus. Next Paul defines the love Jesus has for us. In verse 39 Paul states that no created thing can separate us from the love of God which is in Jesus.

John 15:1 "I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. 2 Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit. NKJV

Jesus is the vine and the Father, who is not a created thing, is the vinedresser. The vine dresser, the Father, separates all unfruitful branches from Jesus.

John 15:5 "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing. 6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. 7 If you abide in Me, and My words abide in you, you will ask what you desire, and it shall be done for you. NKJV

Jesus went on to say that we must abide in Him. If we do not abide in Jesus, we will be unfruitful, and the Father will separate us from Jesus. So, what work must we do to abide in Jesus?

1 John 3:22 And whatever we ask we receive from Him, because we keep His commandments and do those things that are pleasing in His sight. 23 And this is His commandment: that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment. 24 Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us. NKJV

If we keep the 2 commandments given in verse 23, we abide in Jesus. Anyone who abides in Jesus is the elect.

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And 1. John 3:22. and 23 witten to thwb. BODY. of CHRIST and ONLY PAUL. , the Apostles to GENTILES has written

to. the BODY. and Peter says that. Paul writes things that are HARD to. be understood and Peter is not our Apostle

And we were CHOSEN. // ELECTED before the OVER THREW. OF THE WORLD in Eph 1:4. !!

And we were PLACED INTO CHRIST. in 1 COR. 12:13. !!

AND IN. 1 Cor. 12:15-17 we. are CHRISTS FEET , HIS HANDS , WE ARE HIS EYES , ARE HIS EARS , His SENSE OF HEARING

and his SENSE OF SENSE ''

It mes we are CHRIST !!

AND 1 JOHN 3:22 and 23 IS NOT THE BODY OF CHRIST as 1 John is. WRITTEN to ISRAEL. and not to the

BODY OF CHRIST. and I will say you. are following , what yet in. the FUTURE , like the GREAT. TRIUBATION !!

Just wondering , just. who. taught you about. 1 John 3:22 and 23 , just. asking. ??

# A And I see. the following groups. !!


# B. BEGINNING with the OLD COVENANT GROUP

#B. THE NEW COVENANT GROUP

# C THE BODY of CHRIST GROUP

# D The NONE BELIEVERS GROUP


Where do you say. you are AT ???

dan p

AV1611VET said:

Many of these "new techniques" were pushed hard on us.

The New Age gurus wanted desperately to get scientific accreditation for their practices.

That way they could get government subsidization for their nonsense.

Here's one example from AI Overview:

The American Psychological Association (APA) was founded in 1892 with the explicit goal of "the advancement of psychology as a science," meaning it was established to formally recognize and promote psychology in a scientific manner from its inception. However, the official goal wasn't formally established until 1906, and a major reorganization in 1945 solidified the integration of applied and academic psychology, further demonstrating psychology's scientific standing.

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In this case it was very old techniques.