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Do you believe in Creationism or Evolutionism?

View attachment 371629


BIBLE VERSES WHICH TAKEN LITERALLY SUPPORT A FLAT EARTH-CENTERED UNIVERSE

Ecclesiastes 1:5
The sun rises and the sun sets, and hurries back to where it rises".


1 Chronicles 16:30 NIV

Tremble before him, all the earth!
The world is firmly established; it cannot be moved.

]Revelation 7:1 - "After this I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth,
back the four winds of the earth..."


Isaiah 11:12 NIV

..... he will assemble the people of Judah

from the four quarters of the earth.


Isaiah 40:22 NIV

He sits enthroned above the circle of the earth,
and its people are like grasshoppers.
He stretches out the heavens like a canopy,
and spreads them out like a tent to live in.


Job 28:24 NIV

for he views the the ends of the earth
and sees everything under the heavens.
***********************************************************************************

CHARGES BROUGHT BY THE CHURCH AT GALILEO'S TRIAL (1533)


The proposition that the Sun is the center of the world and does not move from its place is absurd and false philosophically and formally heretical, because it is expressly contrary to Holy Scripture.

The proposition that the Earth is not the center of the world and immovable but that it moves, and also with a diurnal motion, is
equally absurd and false philosophically and theologically considered at least erroneous in faith.

*****************************************************************************

1) Just as with EVOLUTION, a literal interpretation of the Bible in 1533 supported the proposition of the earth as flat, immovable and at the center of the solar system!

2) Any scientifically based research that challenged this concept of the universe was dismissed as ABSURD, FALSE PHILOSOPHICALLY ERRONEOUS IN FAITH and THEOLOGICALLY CONTRARY TO SCRIPTURE!

3) Just as with Evolution, the concept of a heliocentric solar system in and of itself does not challenge the existence of GOD but merely forwarded alternative timelines and processes compatible with scientific research!

4) It was not until 1992, following 13 years of investigation, that Pope John Paul representing the Catholic Church, formally admitted its error concerning the prosecution and condemnation of Galileo

5) The Pope also acknowledged that Church theologians had erred when they transposed a question of scientific investigation into the realm of faith!

6) For those supporting a literal interpretation of Creation, while ignoring scientific evidence to the contrary, to be consistent they should also support the view of an immovable earth at the center of the universe - given that as with a 7 day Creation there are sufficient verses in the Bible that would support such a proposition!


Ellesmore,
All the *flat earth verse supports* you list can be alternatively used for round earth doctrine… you are not seeing the forest for the trees
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Pepper Sprayed While Evangelizing

This was obviously criminal. I am glad that the police was involved.
Consider now if to return, Jesus said clearly do not return to where you are not wanted-take yourself and go somewhere else. You have to consider where you are going. In Matthew 10:14, Jesus instructed his disciples that if a town did not welcome them, they should "leave there and shake the dust off your feet".
I want to say something to as a woman-it might be more difficult for some women to have men speaking to them about aboration in public places.
I want to say something else, in events and colleges religion can be abused and become extreme, Chriatanity is not the main culprit...but extremism grows in colleges...so may be we have to look again in rallies if they are the right places to go...I post on a student board where people are looking for help and it is peaceful.
I wrote this post recently on extremism in colleges and so this worries me a bit having personal experience of this. I will share this here with you-
May be inviting yourself to talk at a university society group for Christanity and speaking to the college about how you can help.
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There’s a Giant Flaw in Human History

Thanks to @Stopped_lurking for the updated version of the Maximus.energy link.
Rather than resolving the issues I made of the original link, this latest version adds more problems.

(1) What has happened to V18, the amazing vase with circularity and concentricity dimensions below scanner detection limits. It no longer appears to be in the scatter plot graph (Fig 8) despite a comparison image (Fig 11) with a modern vase.
If it has been excluded from the data, a comparison image is highly inconsistent. Putting V18 in the too hard basket if it still falls below scanner detection limits does not resolve anything.

(2) Here is an excerpt from the revised link.

comment1.png


The standard error SE as statistical noise is defined by the equation.
SE = σ/√n where σ is the standard deviation and n the sample size.
A sample size of only 100 cuts for both surfaces is too small and the real circularity and concentricity data can be drowned out by the noise.

The other issue it is a good idea to introduce the standard deviation σ but why is it only applied to the concentricity error and not the RMS circularity error?
A more correct application of σ is made in point (4).

(3) Another excerpt from the link.

comment2.png


It is logical to exclude cuts through handles and damaged areas of the vase but also worn-out areas?
How does the exclusion conditions for circularity and concentricity differentiate between a worn-out area and a variation due to the production of the vase?
In the case of the so called ‘precise vases’ where variations are at micron levels(?), the danger is throwing out the baby with the bath water by making filtering too aggressive producing lower circularity and concentricity values and making the vases ‘more precise’ than they actually are.

This leads to Point (4)

(4) Maximus.energy and Artifacts Foundation appear to only quote the average and median value respectively for circularity and concentricity on vases but not σ. Given theirs is a statistical analysis this is highly irregular. The standard deviation provides an insight into the production variation of the vase.

Taking this into consideration I got GPT-5 to add σ to the code we had developed earlier in the thread for circularity and concentricity calculations of the OG vase.
Firstly running an ideal shaped tube as the calibration.

dense_tube_std.png


The results are consistent with a 'perfect' object.

Next the OG vase.

Vase_OG_std.png


Given the standard deviations are high relative to the median values for circularity and concentricity indicates extreme variability in production which is atypical of a modern lathe.

An enormous advantage in using AI as an assistant it has access to mathematical and statistical libraries where in this case it has used MAD (Median Absolute Deviation) to establish the cut-off which filters out features such as the handles and damaged areas.

Some values are excluded below the cut-off due to the use of area filters which filters out scanning artifacts and z range filters which keep the z slices in the 2%-98% range and filters out odd shaped cross sections.

Cutoff.png

The metric of 0.674 mm for the OG vase is considerably higher than the 0.027 mm for Artifacts Foundation as the filtering used is far less aggressive than what ever method Artifacts Foundation are using and a random condition used by Maximus.energy.
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Hell doesn't exist and there is no eternal suffering, instead bad peolle just cease to exist

Like what good does it do for a mouse to pray to the cat god , the cat protector that turns the mice over to the cat?!
That one's a few too many for me. We're mice, and God is a Cat God? You're gonna have to 'plain that analogy for me.

A prayer that God does not listen to, has no answer at all.
I'll mark you down as "undecided".
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Trump's reputation will age like fine wine

Ha ha ha ha ha!

Do you KNOW who you are quoting? What his reputation is?

Dude - it's like accepting praise from Vladimir Putin.

Come on - it's been 5 minutes since Trump gave Putin the red carpet treatment to validate this dictator for absolutely NOTHING in return - how about he welcomes another dictator across to shake hands and make silly speeches? Don't all the demagogues need to hang out now and then? Surely Trump should offer the same red carpet treatment to Orban - he might feel left out otherwise! ;)
(He's the reason Hungary is almost on the verge of being kicked out of the EU.)

Oh come on, he was the opening speaker for CPAC in 2022. That's hardly dictator quality.
  • Haha
Reactions: eclipsenow
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Post-tribulation Rapture Believers Safe House

I was not talking about the great tribulation. The beast of prophecy that is often called Antichrist gains the following from all the earth, God's judgements come then with all the unrepented ungodliness there is then. So the collapse comes first, Mystery Babylon is the type for that. Then it is possible for that one who is the beast in prophecy to gain the following of all the world with the promises being made, ungodliness is the cost for it.
Revelation 11:18.
This world will be at peace immediately before the start of the Trib (the 7-year Tribulation). The state of the world immediately before the Trib is revealed in 1 Th 5:1-3.

The AC starts the Trib that officially begins in Rev 6:1-2. The AC is set in motion for the timeframe from the start of the Trib through Rev 19:20, when the AC is killed.

Rev 19:21 precedes Matt 24:29, the official end of the Trib.

The seal judgments through seal 6 take up all of Rev 6. The 7th seal begins in Rev 8:1.

Rev 7 is an interlude within Rev. We know from Rev 7:16 (famine and scorching heat) that Rev 7 spans from the 4th seal (famine) in Rev 6:8 to the scorching heat in the 4th bowl in Rev 16:8-9.

Rev 7 truly spans most of the Trib from the 4th seal to the 4th bowl (great tribulation). To further validate this, “great tribulation” is cited in Rev 7:14, which is two verses before Rev 7:16 and its scorching heat that is only found in the 4th bowl.

I’m pointing these facts about Rev 7 to simply prove its time range stems from the seals through to the bowls. That is the width and breath of Rev 7. That is why it’s called an interlude because its timeframe does not fit between Rev 6 and Rev 8.

In summation: The AC is put in motion, starting the 7-year Trib, in Rev 6:1-2. The AC is active until he’s killed in Armageddon in Rev 19:20.

The Trib ends in Rev at Rev 19:21. Then, Matt 24:29, the official end to the Trib. Then, the 2A (2nd Advent) In Matt 24:30.
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Curious as to what precisely makes Full-Preterism considered an non orthodox heresy?

How is it besides the point if it's the very reason we're labeled "heretics" without any scriptural justification? Look at post 2 for his reason for calling full preterists heretics.

How is this not the second coming?
Here in Hebrews it is clearly stated He appeared a first time to take away sins and will appear a second to bring salvation to those who were presently and eagerly waiting for Him.
Hebrews 9:28so also Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many; and He will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who eagerly await Him.

Here's a list of those revealed by the Holy Spirit to be eagerly waiting for Him in the first century.
https://biblehub.com/greek/553.htmhttps://biblehub.com/greek/553.htm
Your probably not aware that the phrase "second coming" does not exist in the Bible. It is however replete with examples of the coming of the Lord.



The Bible has dozens of examples where the Lord physically and literally came down to earth on certain days to administer judgment, oversee calamity and fulfill promise and prophecy. These days of the Lord where he physically and literally comes down to the planet is where the Bible's doctrine of the coming of the Lord comes hails from. What does not exist in the Bible is the phrase "the second coming." Unlike the phrase "the Trinity" that is also not in the Bible but that at least goes along with what the Bibles teaches. The idea of a "second" coming or advent changes the Bibles teaching on the matter and renders the Bible's prophecy incomprehensible. Which by the way is design of the phrase. To turn peoples eyes away from the supernatural clarity of the Bible's prophecy and turn those eyes to something the Bible does not prophesy at all. Apocalyptic end of the world scenarios. See more...

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The Schumer Shutdown

Says all MAGA when confronted with reality.


So predictable it's cliché!​

You've drunk MAGA cool aid and believed the father of lies.

Republicans​

Several Republican officials and organizations, including President Donald Trump, Vice President JD Vance, the Senate Republican Conference, and Speaker of the House Mike Johnson, falsely accused[110][111][112] Democrats of demanding free health care for undocumented immigrants.[113] This is based on Republican claims—which independent reporters, analysts and oversight bodies have disputed or not substantiated at the scale claimed[114][115]—that there has been widespread fraud in Affordable Care Act enrolment.[116]

Yadda yadda yadda

"Oh look - the government is shut down because of this awful "OTHER" group! Blame the OTHER! GET THEM OUT! Send them to concentration camps!"

Demagoguery 101




Unless you can trace your family line back 10,000 years - you're an immigrant.
We're all immigrants.

And really - what percent of America's 330 MILLION people are we talking about?

And what's WRONG with them? They're MORE law abiding and generate MORE GDP than they cost!?

Didn't immigration build America's economy?

I put to you that you are probably in a MAGA church with MAGA friends who whisper MAGA memes and sound-bytes to each other!

But if you calmed down from this Fox inflated fury, slowed down, and actually read more objective news, you might learn more about the world.

You might learn to respect how little each of us can actually fit in our heads about the world we think we know.

You might learn to respect that 'self-evident truths' you've been whispering to each other in MAGA land might not actually be reflected in reality. That excellent statistics collected by Texas crime officials and Homeland security, that have then been analysed by peer-reviewed Social Science experts, show your 'undocumented' migrants do half the violent crime and a quarter the property crime of the average American-born citizen, and the work they do contributes vastly more to GDP than any welfare costs.

So basically - everything you said above is wrong a dozen times over!​

Everything in your post is filled with falsehoods and false information.
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Why we Christians still have to struggle with sins?

No Jesus didn't fulfilled it completely. The Gospel of Luke, will reveal what Jesus meant when He said in (Matthew 5:17 & 18), that He came to fulfill and no letter would pass from the law until all is fulfilled. Looking at Luke chapter 24:14-44, you will find that , this is when Jesus had been crucified and Peter and others were at the grave site and they were contemplating the events that had occurred. Verse 16, tells you that Jesus had come among them but they did not know Him. In verse 17, Jesus asks them what were they discussing,


(17) And he said unto them, What manner of communications are these that ye have one to another, as ye walk, and are sad?


In verse 19 and 20, they explained to Jesus what had taken place, still not recognizing Him. Verse 21, tells why they were sad, they had expected Jesus to restore Israel. (Israel as a nation , had a history of being conquered by other nations. They had been split into two kingdoms and the northern kingdom had already been taken into captivity prior to this time. All that remained was Judah, Benjamin, and Levite, and now it had been taken over by Rome.) Now this was the 3rd day since Jesus crucifixion and they were in question because to them nothing had changed. Israel still remained in its same state. Note what Jesus says to them in verse 25:


(25) Then he said unto them, O fool, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:


Now the prophets had spoke of many things that Jesus was to do when He came. However they were just focused on the redemption of Israel. That is why Jesus told them in verse 25 that they were not bringing into remembrance all the things that were spoken of Him by the prophets. He reminded them in verse 26 that He had to suffer first and then enter into glory. He then in verse 27 went over all that the scriptures had to say concerning Himself. Following is verse 27,


(27) And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, He expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning Himself.


The following verse explains what Jesus meant in (Matthew 5:17) where He said He came not to destroy the law but to fulfill. Jesus says in (Luke 24:44) And He said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which are written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.
It is pretty clear on the face of it what Jesus is saying, and it is not that when He cried, "It is finished," it actually wasn't. Jesus is speaking in the past tense. "These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you,..." And what were the words he spoke back then? "That all things must be fulfilled." You see, he said that all things must be fulfilled that were spoken of him when he was yet with them, but now he is no longer with them as he was before, and now all things have been fulfilled. When Jesus said, "It is finished." You can bet your bottom dollar it was.
Here Jesus makes it clear that all things written about Him in the Old Testament must be fulfilled. Knowing that all things must be fulfilled by Jesus, as long as heaven and earth is still here, tells us that the law (Commandments) are still here as well and must be kept. We have to understand that all things are not fulfilled because Jesus ministry was cut off, which will continue at his second coming.
Of course, this is not the case, as I just pointed out. People who believe as you do can never say with certainty if they have kept God's law good enough or even what is good enough. Many people trying to work their way to heaven try to reduce God's Law to a manageable size by interpreting how to keep it in a way that they feel they can do it.

If they listen to the Holy Spirit and see the purity God actually demands, they would wilt like cut flowers in the sun. Jesus said it. You must be perfect as God. People who are working to keep the commandments to be saved can only say they love Jesus, but in reality, you can't love someone whom you don't know whether they are coming to destroy you or save you.

They worship a God who says to them Love and obey me, or I will kill you. To love like that is not love at all. Secretly, all of these people are afraid of God, afraid they have not done enough, that they have failed somehow. They are spiritually insecure creatures whose doubts and fears about their own salvation prevent them from true worship and adoration.
In Leviticus, 23rd Chapter the Sabbath day and the High Holy Days which begin I believe on the new moon. Are the feast of the Lord's. These days are to be observe in their season. In Colossians 2:16-17, "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days. Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ. These feast days are the plans of God, they represent the future, with example from the past. All Holy Days are not to eat or drink, such as the atonement, but still to be observe. So this is actually what a person would say to someone who do not keep these feast day of the Lord, if they were judging them on those High and Holy Sabbath days, they were keeping. They would quoted Colossians 2: 16-17. So if you keep the first day of the week, Sunday, Easter and Christmas Paganism, then it makes no sense to use this verse. You cannot worship other days and God’s, that’s not written in the Bible to do, and then use the Bible to justify it. So if you keep another day thats not written in the Bible, then you are doing something on your own, thus it would really be contradictorily.
If Sabbath keeping is so important for salvation, why can't those who try to earn God's favor by "keeping" it agree on how it should be kept? How can you even know if you are keeping it. People who are working for God's free gift may do certain things on the Sabbath, such as going to church and reading their bible, and yet they will buy on the sabbath in certain cases. Is the Sabbath so unimportant that it doesn't matter what you actually do on that day as long as you carry the label of "Sabbath Keeper?"

If being a "Sabbath Keeper" is just a title, then what difference does it make?
Paul explained this in; (Hebrews 10: (v.1) For the law (what law, the law of animal sacrifice?) having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. (v.9) Then said he, (Jesus) Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first that he may establish the second. (v.10) By which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. 11 And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins: 12 but this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God; 13 from henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool. 14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

The point that is not understood is that we all have sin, but until Jesus came, there was no way of getting out from under your sins. So God institute a Priesthood and laws that went with the priesthood to control the sinning, and so the Lord use animal Sacrificial laws, even though it could not remove sins.

When Jesus died on the cross that was the end of the first covenant, which consisted of the blood of animals and the keeping of God’s commandments. And his death also brought in the second covenant, which consist of the blood of Jesus and the keeping of God’s commandments. (v.18) Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.
This verse means Jesus’ one sacrifice is sufficient forever; no further sacrifices (animal or human) are required. It means obedience and repentance are a result of salvation.


  • Hebrews 10:12“But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God.”
    Jesus’ sacrifice is final and complete.
  • 1 Peter 3:18“For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God.”

Summary: No more animal sacrifices are needed, because Christ’s sacrifice is perfect and final.
In other words, no more animals are going to die for your sins. (20) by a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;
This shows we have direct access to God through Christ, not through an earthly priesthood or temple rituals.


  • John 14:6“I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.”
  • Ephesians 2:18“For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.”

Summary: The “new and living way” is Jesus Himself, our mediator — not a new set of sacrifices or temple system.
(21) and having an high priest over the house of God;
Yes, Jesus is now our High Priest in heaven — not any earthly priest.


  • Hebrews 4:14–16“Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God… Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace.”
  • 1 Timothy 2:5“For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.”

Summary: Jesus is the only High Priest we need — no earthly sacrificial system remains.


(v.26) For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins.
This does not mean a believer who sins has no hope. It means rejecting Christ’s once-for-all sacrifice leaves no other sacrifice available. If we reject the Son, there’s nowhere else to turn.
  • “Willful sin” doesn’t mean every time you fall short or mess up.
  • The Greek shows it means to keep on sinning deliberately, as a chosen lifestyle — approving of what’s wrong instead of repenting.
  • It’s like turning your back on Jesus and saying, “I don’t care — I’m doing what I want.”

  • A believer who sins but then feels conviction, repents, and returns to Christ is not who this verse is warning.
    But someone who sins with no desire to change and rejects God’s authority is in the danger Hebrews describes.


    Summary of the Greek:

    • “Hekousiōs” = willfully, deliberately.
    • “Hamartanontōn” = ongoing sin, not a single act.
    • Together: “to keep on sinning deliberately.”
    • Meaning: willful rebellion or approval of sin, not accidental weakness.
Now do we understand what’s being said here? If you sin willfully after you have knowledge of what the truth is, no more animals are going to die for you. (v.27) But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. Now if you are being deceived into believing that once you are under God’s grace you no longer have to keep his commandments, all you have to look forward to is the day of judgement and the lake of fire (fiery indignation).
You are saying that God says love and obey me, or I will do the most horrible things to you. But the reality is that "Sinning willfully” leads to a “fearful expectation of judgment,” not because God is eager to condemn, but because He alone provided the only way of salvation — Jesus.
If someone rejects that, there’s nothing else left to save them. He is the only salvation.
God had Peter to clearly warn people about some of Paul’s writing. (2Peter:3:15-16) (v.15) And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; (v.16) As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. Now let us take heed to this warning, we can’t ignore all the bible and just concentrate on a hand full of verses out of the writings of Paul. Because some of Paul’s writing is hard to be understood.
"For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God." 1 Cor 1:18
Please stop trying to teach, you are doing more harm then good, you are not understanding Pauls writing.
This is not true. Your teachings are defacing God and presenting him as an ogre who demands love under the threat of death or worse. It is the same lie the serpent spat out at Eve in the garden when he suggested that God was a demanding tyrant keeping her from her full potential.
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Church meeting with minister - can you help?

Hi all,

I've secured a meeting with the minister and director of ministries at my church to go over some of the issues I have regarding their teachings or, rather, lack of with regards to sin, in the main.

I have tried to be very diplomatic and understanding in our email correspondence, so I hope that they will see that I am acting in good faith as a concerned member of the congregation.

Further to this, I just wanted some advice from you with regards on how/if to address certain points.

My issues are as follows:
  1. Sin, the definition, how it pertains to our world, avoidance of, engagement in and why Jesus was/is needed to save us from sin, is and has not been addressed in the year I have been attending
  2. Sermons are only about 'love' and historical information in the Bible with no mention of how any of it pertains to modern life
  3. Sermons are 20-30 minutes long following 30-45 minutes of torturous 'praise worship' sprinkled throughout requests for donations, volunteering, charity and 'upcoming events'. I liken this time to the trailers before a movie starts
  4. There is no call to the alter. People who want to talk about being saved are invited to 'find a member' to discuss this with after the sermon concludes. How can a new person find people they don't know?
  5. The format for services seems to follow a US theme so is very commercial in nature. I was raised in 'megachurches' where the pastors ran the church like a business instead of like a church and I feel this church is using the same trainers. I did, in fact, mention to this in passing to the lead minister who didn't confirm or deny that there was an influence from the US
  6. The 'lead' pastor didn't respond to my initial email to the office regarding above and has instead, I assume, asked another minister to deal with my emails and raise a meeting request. I find this offensive. I intend to clarify why this is with the attendees but does this seem strange to anyone else? Happy to reconsider being baffled or offended in light of alternate views
  7. The church continually references being multi-national but I feel like the sermons are watered down due to English not being the first language of many so I am missing out on learning, spiritual growth, as a result
If you've made it this far, thanks for reading.

I want to ensure that the discussion I have with those in attendance is Christ led. I am praying about this, almost daily, as meeting with a church to question their approach is not something I have ever done. I would value advice on how/if to address the points above.

If I am not convinced of their sincerity/motives, it will mean that I will leave the church and seek a new one but I wanted to make sure that the current church had a chance to address some of these things before I abandoned ship.

Many thanks for your help in advance and God bless.

Being that church leaders are typically set in their thinking by personal disposition along with commitment to certain principles they think the Lord has "lain upon their hearts," you probably won't move the needle on the dial very much if any. If you're going to chat with them and let them know that you think they need to make improvements, go into it with a grain of salt or two since they most likely will dismiss your claims. It won't be because you didn't do it correctly. It'll simply be the case since you're dealing in real time with fellow human beings, especially with those who may feel assured of their position as leaders.

In other words, try to go into it with some patience and low expectations.
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Mississippi School Homecoming Celebrations Turn Deadly as 8 People are Killed 20 Injured in Separate Shootings

Universal background checks, including private sales, would make it harder for criminals to get guns.

Safe storage laws would reduce gun thefts, which is a significant source of firearms used in murders.

A ban on assault-style weapons and high-capacity magazines would result in fewer deaths in mass shootings.

Preventing convicted domestic abusers, domestic abusers under restraining orders, and people with stalking convictions from owning firearms would prevent a lot of people from being killed in domestic violence incidents.
-
Well how to compare Mississippi with California, is to take the section of California who racial makeup matches the Mississippi Delta's and compare murder rates. Because 100% of the killing in Mississippi are blacks killing blacks and see how the gun laws in California are working to prevent murder.
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The History of the “Two Laws” Theory in Romans 3:20

So you choose which commandments of the tablet of 10 to follow then because, for one, you or your church do not keep the 4th commandment. I warned you to be careful of your answer but you were not.
It’s not me choosing; the whole church, while holding that the ten commandments must be obeyed did it that way-and continued to down through the centuries. Because that’s what they received from the beginning. A couple of brother Christians put it this way.

We all gather on the day of the sun, for it is the first day [after the Jewish sabbath, but also the first day] when God, separating matter from darkness, made the world; and on this same day Jesus Christ our Savior rose from the dead. St Justin 90-165 AD

Those who lived according to the old order of things have come to a new hope, no longer keeping the sabbath, but the Lord's Day, in which our life is blessed by him and by his death St Ignatius of Antioch 50-100 AD

They had the Torah and knew it well, along with the new testament writings that were available before the canon was determined. And in addition to that, they had nearness to the fact, the historical events, themselves; St Ignatius was a disciple of John, for one.
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‘If we ever had a leak of this chat we would be cooked’: 7 months of shocking private messages among rising GOP leaders

Thousands of private messages reveal young GOP leaders joking about gas chambers, slavery and rape.

View attachment 371585

And people are perplexed as why things like DEI exist.
These may be the future of the Republican party, but surely a apple from the tree.
"When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time."--Maya Angelou

Is the ‘joked with a colleague privately’ excuse used for Jay Jones still valid?
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