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Landon Caeli · 2025-11-13T20:23:26-0600

I agree with @calicocat. Islam is an abomination.

MarkSB · 2025-11-13T20:16:34-0600

Aldebaran said:
He and his party succeeded in getting the government open again, which was a defeat to Schumer and his friends. So it sounds like he's a better leader than Schumer.

Party politics is what's wrong with the whole situation. But you go ahead and just keep drinking that Kool Aid.

concretecamper · 2025-11-13T20:15:54-0600

I refuse to sing "Amazing Grace" because it contains heretical ideas.

Fervent · 2025-11-13T20:11:20-0600

2PhiloVoid said:
Those are excellent points for us to think about in this discussion, and it reminds me all the more as to why I attempt to maintain solidarity and to avoid unnecessary debate with all other Traditionally Trinitarian Christians as much as I can.

As I am sure you would agree, a little hermeneutics goes a long way. Too often we jump into trading verses with little actual discussion and exchange, trying to prove each other wrong even if it is damaging to our fellowship. I say this as a participant and an observor.

MarkSB · 2025-11-13T20:07:37-0600

Larniavc said:
Like when they stopped taking MMR? Like when vaccines were made without thimerosal? Do you have any other non-evidenced harm causing anti-science hypothesis’ you would like to promote?

Breatherianism for example?

It... was a joke.

But, noted. Poe's law certainly seems to apply to ardent MAGA supporters.

HARK! · 2025-11-13T20:07:00-0600

(CLV) Ac 24:14
"Yet I am avowing this to you, that, according to the way which they are terming a sect, thus am I offering divine service to the hereditary God, believing all that is written, according to the law and in the prophets,

(CLV) Ac 24:5
For, finding this man a pestilence and |stirrer of insurrections among all the Jews who are on the |inhabited earth, besides a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes,

(CLV) Ac 28:22
Now we count it worthwhile to hear from you what your disposition is. For, indeed, concerning this sect, it is known to us that everywhere it is being contradicted."

(CLV) Ac 28:23
Now setting a day for him, more came to him in the lodging, to whom he expounded, certifying to the kingdom of God, besides persuading them concerning Jesus, both from the law of Moses and the prophets, from morning till dusk.

I won't continue in the folly of debunking what I have already debunked.

Gene2memE · 2025-11-13T19:56:28-0600

Landon Caeli said:
In a sign that things are definitely going well for his second term, Donald Trump is promising to send cash to every American. Tucked away in a series of posts on Truth Social that railed against recent setbacks for his tariff scheme, Trump promised a tariff dividend for every American worth several thousand dollars.

“People that are against Tariffs are FOOLS! We are now the Richest, Most Respected Country In the World, With Almost No Inflation, and A Record Stock Market Price. 401k’s are Highest EVER. We are taking in Trillions of Dollars

Trump promises $2000 tariff dividend to all Americans

The president is trying to save his tariff scheme with the promise of cold, hard cash

www.yahoo.com

Let's do some simple maths:

US tariffs collected to end of Sep-2025: $174 billion
US tariffs collected to end of Sep-2024: $58 billion

US tariffs per month (3-month average): $29 billion

Expected tariffs for 2025: $270-275 billion
Expected tariffs for 2026: $290-310 billion

US population (Jul-2025): 342 million

342 million x $2,000 = $648 billion.

Congratulations, you've now collected negative $350 billion in tariffs.

It's no wonder the rest of the world alternates between pointing and laughing and being noisily sick when considering the current US administration.

Guojing · 2025-11-13T19:52:48-0600

keras said:
Not right.
The Israel of God in the New Testament:
God’s work with and the development of His people, all faithful Israelites in the Old Testament is continued in the New Testament. Those who presumed that ancestry gave them privileges were chastened. John the Baptist’s strong language indicates how seriously God viewed their pride and arrogance.
John said to the crowds coming out to be baptized by him, "You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath? Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. And do not begin to say to yourselves, `We have Abraham as our father.' For I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham. The axe is already at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire. Luke 3:7-9

Jesus gives a similar warning to those who were trying to trap him: Abraham is our father, they answered. “If you were Abraham’s children,” said Jesus, “then you would do the things Abraham did”. John 8:39 Jesus goes even further in Matthew 8 when he praises the faith of a Gentile Roman Centurion: I tell you the truth, I have not found anyone in Israel with such great faith. Matthew 8:10

Jesus then goes on to make a prediction: I say to you that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the feast with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven. But those who were born to the kingdom will be thrown outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Matthew 8:11-12
Here Jesus is warning his Jewish hearers that unless they recognize him as their Messiah they will be excluded from the Kingdom.

This is how we are to understand Paul when he specifically uses the expression: Israel of God in Galatians 6:16. Peace and mercy to all who follow this rule, even to the Israel of God. Galatians 6:16 For those who hold to a rapture to heaven, they have to think Paul is referring to Jews, or at least Christian Jews, but this simply refutes everything he has said in the first five chapters of this letter.

In Galatians 3:23-29, Paul says we are saved by God’s grace and justified by faith alone in Jesus Christ. Paul is emphatic - people are not saved by ethnicity , by circumcision, by offering animal sacrifices or by keeping the Law of Moses.

In Galatians 4:21-31, those who follow Jesus, are likened to the free children of Sarah. Those seeking to be justified by the Law have been alienated from Jesus and are likened to the children of Hagar. Quoting Genesis 21, they will, he warns: never share in the inheritance…. Paul speaks of our freedom in Christ and our new life in the Holy Spirit. He contrasts living by the Spirit with living by our sinful nature.

See what Paul is saying? We have a choice – grace or law, faith or works? When Paul writes: Peace and mercy to all who follow this rule, [and or even] to the Israel of God, he is obviously referring to all the followers of Jesus who have rejected the legalists who wanted to impose circumcision and the keeping of the Torah Law.

John Stott provides one of the best explanations of this verse: ‘All who walk by this rule’ and ‘the Israel of God’ are not two groups, but one. The connecting particle: ‘kai’ should be translated ‘even’, not ‘and’, or be omitted, as in the RSV. The Christian church has a direct continuity with God’s people in the Old Testament. Those who are Christians today are the true circumcision - Phil. 3:3, ‘Abraham’s offspring’ Galatians 3:29 and ‘the Israel of God’.

And don’t worry about the phrase ‘walk by this rule’ either. The Greek word ‘rule’ is kanon and simply describes a carpenter’s or surveyor’s plumb line. John Stott says, This is the ‘canon’ of Scripture, the doctrine of the apostles, and especially in the context of Galatians 6 the cross of Christ and the new creation. Such is the rule by which the church must walk and continuously judge and reform itself.

In the closing sentences of this letter, Paul is quoting an ancient prayer he would have prayed all his life on the Sabbath. Known as the additional 19th benediction to the 18 benedictions, and based on the Aaronic blessing of Numbers 6:24-26, God is asked in the final prayer for ‘Peace… and mercy on us and all Israel: your people.’ Now Paul prays this blessing on the Jewish and Gentile Christian believers in Jesus for they are the ‘Israelites of God’.

You ignored the premises leading to the conclusion.

JSRG · 2025-11-13T19:34:06-0600

Fervent said:
The suit is alleging that Latino demographics were used as a proxy to draw the maps, making them racially gerrymandered rather than politically gerrymandered.

Yes--as this article explains:

https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/prop-50-justice-department-lawsuit-newsom/3804447/

(I would like to greatly thank the article for actually giving the name of the case via its posting of the legal complaint, it is so annoying how many articles will report on a case without ever bothering to say what its name is)

Strictly speaking, the Department of Justice didn't make the lawsuit; the lawsuit already existed by the California Republican Party, the Department of Justice then joined this already-existing lawsuit.

calicocat · 2025-11-13T19:29:06-0600

Benaiah468 said:
The Christian belief that Jews are not saved stems from religious conflicts during the emergence of Christianity and its subsequent separation from Judaism. It is based on the view that Jesus is the Messiah and Son of G-d, which is not recognised as such by Jews, and has led to a long history of discrimination and the idea that Jews are damned because of their rejection of Christian doctrine.

Paul agonized in Romans 9-11 that he'd almost go to hell if his own people the Jews didn't and penned zingers like this:

Philippians 3:5-9

5 Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
6 Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

Romans 3:19-20

19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Galatians 2:15-16

15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Do you think that someone who follows rabbinical Judaism can be justified by God apart from Christ?

The Barbarian · 2025-11-13T19:28:50-0600

Servus said:
That's actually the point. There's endless smear campaigns as if he's up for reelection.

I doubt if he's still sneaking into kid's dressing rooms these days.

Chesterton · 2025-11-13T19:24:56-0600

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Chesterton · 2025-11-13T19:20:28-0600

Ride horses on dangerous escarpments.

SOURE

Chesterton · 2025-11-13T19:18:33-0600

Understand what?

Chesterton · 2025-11-13T19:17:55-0600

Our french fries're fantastic.

LSAN

durangodawood · 2025-11-13T19:16:45-0600

Say it aint so said:
....I mean either someone or all of them are lying to the judge. Under any other presidency or congress these folks would have been hauled into congress to answer questions of incompetancy and/or fired. But this is the Trump admin where incompetance takes a back seat to loyalty.

I think you mean incompetence drives the bus. (Because, generally, competence has a lot to lose signing on to this corrupt clown show.)

eclipsenow · 2025-11-13T19:14:45-0600

ViaCrucis said:
If we end up with Trump as a forever president, as dictatorships go (though at his age "forever" is a stretch) don't worry you'll probably get your dream of imprisoning political opponents and dissident voices.

And all of us anti-Trump folk will get to live out our lives in concentration camps and reeducation centers.

Daddy Trump will make the "leftists" pay for exercising their constitutional guaranteed free speech. Because in Trump's America, dissent is the same thing as treason.

MAGA utopia at its finest.

It reminds me of the scene in Harry Potter where McGonagall is going up against Umbridge, and Umbridge accuses McGonagall of disloyalty for daring to question her methods.

International agencies have already downgraded America from a full democracy to a flawed democracy. There are only four categories with the first being full democracy and the last being total dictatorship.

Trump's narcissism leads him to lie and lie again about anyone who has ever stood up to him. That people swallow his lies astonishes me

eclipsenow · 2025-11-13T19:11:13-0600

contratodo said:
And he will open his mouth in blaspheme against God, to blaspheme God's name, and His tabernacle (God's tabernacle is outside of the sky) and them that dwell in heaven (outside of the sky)
Revelation 13:6. Is telling us that the beast will speak blaspheme about what is outside of the sky.

He cast down some of the host of the stars and trampled on them....
He cast down the truth to the ground.
Daniel 8:10,12

Prophetically we therefore see truth related to the stars being cast down.

You appear to be reading apocalyptic symbols that are laid in with theological importance as geographies. In other words, as having a postcode. You cannot possibly read this book until you can speak the language. Just as one must learn ancient Greek in inner theological school, to understand revelation one has to understand how the ancient world used these apocalyptic symbols, which requires reading some of the other apocalyptic symbolism of the time. Or you could just wrote Dr Paul Barnett.

Servus · 2025-11-13T19:10:08-0600

The Barbarian said:
Russiagate saw about a dozen Trump underlings convicted or pleading guilty. Let's hope Epsteingate is as productive in snaring the creeps.

Don't know that any "underlings" are guilty of anything but maybe obstruction of justice. Matt Gaetz's pedo problem isn't related to Trump's problems. But if there was a conspiracy to block the investigation,that could take down some perps at the top of the Justice Department.

Point is, Russiagate is a good analogy. Republicans claimed it was a witch hunt until one criminal after another was taken down. So far, just two nailed in the Epstein affair, but now the facts are starting to surface and it looks like Trump had a very good reason for trying to cover it up.

Russiagate led to some convictions that had nothing to do with Russiagate itself. Which is pretty much the definition of a witch hunt.

Valletta · 2025-11-13T19:04:14-0600

Clare73 said:
Is there any mention in the OT of the OT being inspired?

There is more in the OT than in the NT. But clearly not all books make that claim, and of course a book that was in consideration for the Bible but didn't make the list could have falsely claimed being inspired. But there you go, we know the canon from Sacred Tradition, not from the Bible itself. Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture are said to go hand in hand. Some of the teachings handed down through the Apostles, the deposit of the faith, are quite explicit in the Bible while others are not.

sjastro · 2025-11-13T19:02:23-0600

stevevw said:
Listen to all these experts who themselves provide no peer review. Talk about Woo. Double standards and bias proving my point that this was a lynch job from the start.

This whole thread has been turned into one big logical fallacy of ad hominems one after the other lol.

Don't let hypocrisy get in the way, referring to me as some random individual on a social media site not fit to challenge your so called experts is ad hominem attack.
The problem is your gross ignorance in failing to comprehend your so called experts are not experts at all if flaws can be found by random individuals as myself.
Your idiotic obsession with moulded limestone concrete casing stones was suggested by me being refuted with a simple high school chemistry HCl drop test described in post #1184. When taken further by the true experts in their fields of petrology, palaeontology and archaeology the use of moulded casing stones is beyond doubt complete utter nonsense.

On the subject of softening granite why did the builders of Menkaure's pyramid who was the fifth pharaoh of the 4th dynasty start off with the first 16 courses with granite casing stones but complete the remaining courses in Tura limestone resulting in 25% granite and 75% limestone casing stones?

granite-casing-blocks-menkaure-s-pyramid-back-pyramid-pyramid-menkaure-smallest-three-main-pyramids-365208208.jpg

The answer is ridiculously simple, there was no granite softening technology as using dressed granite casing stones was extremely time consuming to make using abrasion cutting, pounding and smoothing. The evidence suggests Menkaure died before his pyramid and mortuary temple were completed resulting in the builders finishing the pyramid with softer limestone.

Hentenza · 2025-11-13T18:57:13-0600

SabbathBlessings said:
Something to consider about Jesus

Col 1:16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. 17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist.

Jesus is God. Jesus is the One who created heaven and earth- Exo20:11. Jesus is the One speaking at Mt Sinai. Jesus is the One who told us how to keep the Sabbath.

Jesus never became the Sabbath, or became Lord of the Sabbath He IS Lord of the Sabbath, and has always been -He has given it as a blessing for all mankind starting at Creation Mark2:27 Exo20:8-11. Resting with God on His Sabbath and Holy Day.

In my opinion, I do not think we should speak for God on something He took ownership of, that is His and He created and tells us why. He also tells us He does not change.

This is what the Lord said about the Sabbath

Isa 56:2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”

The Sabbath is something man does, not just something God does, so we therefore can disregard His clear instruction of how we are to keep the Sabbath. Jesus said Mark 3:4 Then He said to them, “Is it lawful on the Sabbath to do good or to do evil, to save life or to kill?” But they kept silent

Jesus never got rid of His law, He said so plainly in Isa 42:21 Mat5:17-30 and we can still do evil on the Sabbath by defiling it.

He told us clearly what man should be doing on the Sabbath. This is written by God Himself- I know of know one greater than He- why Jesus said plainly not a jot or tittle can pass from His law because He is owner of it, not us.

Exo 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates.

Isa 58:13 “If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the Lord honorable,
And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
Nor finding your own pleasure,
Nor speaking your own words,

Jesus said this:

Mat 11:28 Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29 Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am [a]gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.”

Which this is what He was referring to, rest from our sins,

Psa 38:3 There is no soundness in my flesh because of thine anger; neither is there any rest in my bones because of my sin.4 For mine iniquities are gone over mine head: as an heavy burden they are too heavy for me.

Jesus who is Lord of the Sabbath said come to Me and I will give you rest and still kept the Sabbath going to church reading the Word of God Luke4:16 as did His disciples Jew, Gentiles and almost the whole cities, just as He predicted Isa56:6-7 Acts 13:42, 44, Acts18:4

The rest we enter into Christ no one is in rebellion to Him or His commandments (Rom8:7-8) including the 4th commandment. What Hebrews is warning about why those who in their trial of the wilderness did not enter His rest, because they liked their sins more than their love for Jesus to come to Him, do His will and turn (repent) forsaking their sins Pro28:13

Heb4:6 Since therefore it remains that some must enter it, and those to whom it was first preached did not enter (why did they not enter?) because of disobedience,

What were they disobedient of in the trial of the wilderness?

Eze20: 13 Yet the house of Israel rebelled against Me in the wilderness; they did not walk in My statutes; they despised My judgments, ‘which, if a man does, he shall live by them’; and they greatly defiled My Sabbaths. Then I said I would pour out My fury on them in the wilderness, to consume them. 14 But I acted for My name’s sake, that it should not be profaned before the Gentiles, in whose sight I had brought them out. 15 So I also raised My hand in an oath to them in the wilderness, that I would not bring them into the land which I had given them, ‘flowing with milk and honey,’ the glory of all lands,16 because they despised My judgments and did not walk in My statutes, but profaned My Sabbaths; for their heart went after their idols.

The Sabbath is connected to the very first commandment (and is the Power behind all of them) - to thou shalt not have other gods before Me, the Sabbath commandment tells us which God that is, the God of all heaven and earth and everything in it. Exo20:11 Why the Ten Commandments are all interconnected breaking one we break them all- James2:11

Heb4:11 Let us therefore be diligent to enter that rest, lest anyone fall according to the same example of disobedience.

I believe God means what He says about keeping the Sabbath day holy. He never treated this commandment any different than the other commandments, they are all written by God, all under His mercy seat, not a jot or tittle can pass, we cannot edit God's own Testimony written by God Himself Exo31:18 God warned us His times and laws would be changed, which is the Sabbath and we see a clear history of this change being made and those who claimed to change the Sabbath centuries ago, said they did so based on their own sense of power over the word of God. The end time battle comes over our worship which is who we obey. Rom6:16 Mat15:3-14 Mark7:7-13 Rev14:11-12

Jesus never gave Himself a commandment, the commandments are for us to keep, the Sabbath is something man does. Those who enter His rest Also ceased from their works as God did, on the seventh day. Heb4:10 Heb4:4 Exo20:11

If we stick with the Bible and what God says, He will lead us on the narrow path back to Him. Jesus said many would come to deceive us before He returns. If we live by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God Mat4:4 and abide in Him, He will safeguard us. Pro3:5-6 Pro30:5-6

One of the last verses in the Bible before the Second Coming of Jesus Christ

Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city

The same c&p with the same verses that have been refuted over and over. Jesus is indeed God. Jesus did indeed create everything. Jesus is the alpha and the omega, the beginning and the end. Jesus is perfectly capable and powerful to complete one covenant and give us another. He is perfectly capable and powerful to fulfill the law including the 10 commandments. He is perfectly capable and powerful to fulfill the 4th commandment on Himself ( not the Strawman of becoming the sabbath that you stated in your post) and declare Himself Lord of the Sabbath. Our rest now is in Jesus not in one day.

joymercy · 2025-11-13T18:54:39-0600

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Philippians 3:5-9​

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Philippians 3:5-9

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