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ThatRobGuy · 2025-12-02T14:15:10-0600

BCP1928 said:
You don't give our Constitution enough credit.

If the land that is now the US had been attained via conquest by Muslims instead of Christians & Deists, do you think such a document would've ever been drafted (with concepts like separation of church and state, and checks and balances), or would it have followed the pattern of other Muslim conquest, where after the "convert or die" phase of the process is over, the first thing to be done is establish a cleric who will rule with an iron fist and harshly punish those who step out of line based on a religious code that also acts as a legal code?

NxNW · 2025-12-02T14:12:52-0600

rambot said:
IT actually jives, LITERALLY perfectly.

Jibe, not jive.

After seeing that three times today, I had to say something.

AutisticAnglican · 2025-12-02T14:12:52-0600

Y'all gotta check Against Heresies by Irenaeus of Lyons

Here's a budget option from a Public Domain Translation & collects all 5 books into 1
Against Heresies

Alternatively if you want a modern translation the team at Paulist Press has the best one albeit quite expensive & the books are sold individually with the exception of Books 4 & 5 which are sold together as 1 book

Book 1
55. St. Irenaeus of Lyons - Rev Walter J. Burghardt SJP, Dominic J. Unger : PaulistPress
Book 2
65. St. Irenaeus of Lyons - John J. Dillon, PhD, Dominic J. Unger : PaulistPress
Book 3
64. St. Irenaeus of Lyons - Matthew C. Steenberg : PaulistPress
Books 4 & 5
72. St. Irenaeus of Lyons - John J. Dillon, PhD, Scott D Moringiello : PaulistPress

I highly recommend reading as it provides context about the early church before the 1st council of Nicaea.

bob121 · 2025-12-02T14:12:33-0600

Hvizsgyak said:
Which shouldn't be a problem, right? I feel we should debate secular society with our Christian ethics and morality. It might not influence the secular person who posted the trolling topic but it gives the third parties reading the posts something to think about. Possibly they may find that Christians and Christianity's ethics and morality (which come from God) have alot to offer the world. I follow alot of your posts and I feel God is influencing me through some of those posts. I appreciate that alot (don't mind the word "alot" being misspelled, it's one of those Mandela effects - I swear it was spelled that way in another parallel universe ).

I’m with you—polite, public debate is worth it, not to win the troll but to leave bread-crumbs for the silent third-parties who later DM, “I never knew Christians thought like that.”
If grace stays on the keyboard, the Spirit can use even our push-backs to chip away at someone’s never-considered-that wall.
Keep planting those breadcrumbs—you never know which lurker will pick one up and hunger for more.

And hey, I reckon NZ is that parallel universe—down there we glue our vowels together like “alot,” “sweet-as,” and “yeah-nah.”
So if ‘alot’ ever looked right to you, it’s just the Kiwi-spell-checker you may have come across once. Keeps things real for sure.

NxNW · 2025-12-02T14:10:32-0600

another_lost_guy said:
Doesn't. 3 dimes are still nearly worth a quarter.

No, they're worth more.

another_lost_guy said:
Oh really? Not according to your next post.

But by your parameters you can't call someone an insider trader unless they were convicted or prosecuted because we can't read minds. But you still call Martha stewart an insider trader even though she wasn't convicted or prosecuted.

We're splitting hairs here, I think. I was refuting your claim that it would be difficult to prosecute a public figure like Pelosi, by pointing out that Stewart was prosecuted. It was a related crime, at least.

another_lost_guy said:
Just not Pelosi, since you like Pelosi.

Thats an interesting assumption.

another_lost_guy said:
Which means you are inconsistent with your labels and therefore concede the argument

Sounds like we both misremembered the specific crime she was convicted of, but it was in the ballpark. Your claim stands refuted though.

Michie · 2025-12-02T14:09:57-0600

Actor Jonathan Roumie, who stars as Jesus Christ on the acclaimed series “The Chosen,” returned to “The View” Dec. 1, where he discussed meeting Pope Leo, Hallow’s 25-day Advent prayer challenge, and the impact “The Chosen” has had on others and himself.

“I don’t think it would have the same kind of authenticity,” Roumie said in response to cohost Ana Navarro, who asked if Roumie would be able to play Jesus if he weren’t as “spiritual and religious” as he is.

“I think what I bring to the role is my relationship to Christ, is my relationship to Jesus, my love for him,” said Roumie. “And so by taking on his love for humanity and trying to recreate that, it’s made me a better person. It’s made me want to love people.”

Continued below.

Jonathan Roumie on ‘The View’: 2 ‘Lifelong Atheists’ Became Christians After Watching ‘The Chosen’

Actor Jonathan Roumie, who stars as Jesus Christ on the acclaimed series “The Chosen,” returned to “The View” Dec. 1.

churchleaders.com

Ignatius the Hermit · 2025-12-02T14:07:50-0600

iluvatar5150 · 2025-12-02T14:07:16-0600

Oompa Loompa said:
You are attempting to distract away from the topic with whataboutisms. That is a red herring.

Try reading the thread again, buddy. It was the OP, in post #3, who posted two links entirely unrelated to the events of post #1. I was responding to part of his post #3. If you think that subject is off-topic, take it up with him.

Oompa Loompa · 2025-12-02T14:06:48-0600

rambot said:
you go ahead and be you.

Just remember: EVerything you're doing is useless and unhelpful.

So if you had the goal of helping someone with this treatment you are not. In fact, you are actively making their lives worse.

Right now, my goal is to take that woke trans garbage that the left is trying to force feed me and shove it back into their face. To be clear, I am not going to go around insulting people for no reason. But if someone expects me to feed their delusion to spare their feelings, they are in for a rude awakening.

Richard T · 2025-12-02T14:06:19-0600

timf said:
The Irish prisoners starved to death around 40 days +.
You will die sooner without water.
The only thing I found useful about fasting is that it acts like a timer reminding yourself that you had intended to pray about something.

Mozambique pastor dies attempting 40-day Jesus fast Here is a sad story of a pastor dying without water because he tried to fast like Jesus.

I do know a pastor and some in his church that fast 21 days, and a few of them 40 of no food. I have heard a sermon from them on how to do this practically using a little bit of prune juice, and vitamin supplements. I think too that one does not start off on 40 days. I would try 3, then work it up a bit.

I personally like Kenneth Hagin's short book entitled"Commonsense Guide to fasting" https://gthinkers.org/spiritual_books/Kenneth E. Hagin A common sense guide to fasting..pdf.pdf
Basically, he talks of biblical examples in fasting and how very few are called beyond 3 days at a time. If that were to occur then the Holy Spirit would lead just as they did Jesus.

durangodawood · 2025-12-02T14:06:09-0600

ThatRobGuy said:
.....
That's not to say they don't have a great engineering department. But I think their "artsy" stuff and progressive campus culture is the thing they're known for.

In the same way that OSU has perfectly respectable STEM departments, but they're known for Division 1 athletics.

How did I miss this part.

Cal actually has some of the very best STEM programs in the whole country. Across the board. It is widely known for those - unless your only source of knowledge in this world is recent culture wars axe grinders. Between faculty and alums, the list of Nobel prize winners is ridiculous.

For sure Berkeley (town and U) has a certain radical subculture. But the other 90+% is just doing normal college stuff at a high level.

wing2000 · 2025-12-02T14:06:06-0600

Servus said:
I already know Trump's reasons for pardoning Hernandez, but I wanted to see you list them.

I don't care what Trump's reasons are because nothing could justify pardoning a convicted president who used his country as a staging ground for importing hundreds of tons of cocaine into the United States. What's the point of blowing up small boats if one head of the cartel snake is given a free pass?

Michie · 2025-12-02T14:05:30-0600

Pastor Arrested for Allegedly Aiding Church Members in Covering Up Deadly Hit-and-Run

Juan Wilson, a Texas pastor, has been arrested after allegedly helping a parishioner hide his vehicle after the parishioner was involved in a fatal hit-and-run.

churchleaders.com

CoreyD · 2025-12-02T14:05:07-0600

Job 33:6 said:
It's not my responsibility to show you that the NT authors were exegeting the OT. The onus is on you to show that they were.

I did. However, you said nothing in response to it.
I showed that you are asserting that

Scriptures such as Psalm 22:18; Psalm 78:1, 2; Psalm 91:11, 12; Isaiah 6:8-10; Isaiah 9:1, 2 are not prophetic of the Messiah, which makes Jesus and his followers out to be liars, since they all said, these prophetic utterances were fulfilled in the Messiah. John 19:23-24; Matthew 13:34-35; Matthew 4:6; Luke 4:10, 11; Matthew 13:14-15; Matthew 4:12-16; Matthew 2:15, 16... as well as his people. Romans 9:25; 1 Corinthians 15:55 (Hosea13:14); Mark 7:6; Luke 3:3-6; John 1:23 (Isaiah 40:1-5);
Where the Greek scriptures quote the Hebrew scriptures, these were interpretations of the Jews, applying texts to someone they felt was the Messiah, and therefore the Greek scriptures are a farce, since Jesus did not really fulfill these prophecies... In fact they were not even prophesies. So...
Jesus is a liar, and he lied when he said I told you that everything written about me in the law of Moses and the prophets and in the Psalms must be fulfilled.” Luke 24:27, 44 “You search the Scriptures because you think they give you eternal life. But the Scriptures point to me! If you had believed Moses, you would believe Me, because he wrote about Me." John 5:39, 46
Luke 22:37 For the time has come for this prophecy about me to be fulfilled: ‘He was counted among the rebels.’ Yes, everything written about me by the prophets will come true.” is not true. This is referring to Jerusalem - Zion.

I showed you that all these texts including Jesus words speak of the words of the Prophets being fulfilled at present, or future, in the Messiah or his people.

Job 33:6 said:
Did Mathew ever say "hey, just so you all know, Hosea 11:1 was originally about Jesus".

In fact, he didn't.

Why did you say 'original'?
Matthew said Hosea's words were fulfilled upon the Messiah, when Joseph was told to take Jesus out of Egypt.
The fact is, when God put those words on Hosea's tongue, God is the one who had in mind the application, and for us to decide and make the claim that God meant them only for Israel in Egypt, we would have to ignore what God inspired Matthew to write, and exalt ourselves above a level of a human.
I humbly accept that God inspired Matthew to apply Hosea's words to the Messiah, because God was uttering a Messianic prophecy.

The fact is, the text in the Gospels, and the apostles writings say that the words of the prophets are fulfilled there and then, either towards the Messiah, or his people?

What you are in fact saying is that God does not use two fold prophecies, nor does he insert Messianic prophesies in the Hebrew texts, written in the Prophets and Psalms....
Did Moses really write about Jesus. Or what was that a Jewish interpretation, put as Jesus' words? John 5:39, 46

Paul quoted Hosea 13:14, as having fulfilment in the future. “Where, O Death, is your victory? Where, O Death, is your sting?” 1 Corinthians 15:55
Was that a Jewish interpretation?

I leave you to what you want to do here as well.
As they say in Jamaica, "I dun wid dat."

FaithT · 2025-12-02T14:01:31-0600

Michie said:
AI overview:

While the lily is more commonly associated with Mary in Christianity, the lotus flower can represent her as well, symbolizing purity and divine beauty, much like the lily. Both flowers represent purity and are often found in artwork and churches dedicated to the Virgin Mary.

Similar symbolism

Purity: Both the lily and the lotus are used to symbolize purity because of their ability to rise from muddy water or dark places unstained and pristine.

Divine beauty: The lotus is seen as a symbol of divine beauty and grace, qualities also attributed to Mary.

Church art: The lotus is depicted in some ancient churches dedicated to Mary, according to Oxford Academic.

More common association with Mary

The Lily: The lily, especially the white lily, is the more prominent flower linked to Mary. It was carried by the Archangel Gabriel during the Annunciation and is often used in art to represent her.

Other flowers: Other flowers, such as roses, violets, and bluebells, also have specific connections to Mary in Christian tradition.

That makes me feel better about my doubts about having a lotus flower box, not that I was all that concerned about it anymore anyway.

Michie · 2025-12-02T13:59:42-0600

During a rapid-fire portion of the “Room for Nuance” podcast, 9Marks President Jonathan Leeman was asked to share a belief from the last five years that he no longer holds.

Leeman was named 9Marks’ new president in April. He explained that in 2018—while speaking alongside now-President Emeritus Mark Dever at a 9Marks-at-9 event during the SBC annual meeting—he publicly allowed for the possibility that Christians could, in some circumstances, vote for a pro-choice political candidate. He said, “I think that was wrong.”

“I think it was 2018, at the SBC, we did a 9Marks-at-9, in which Mark and I on stage talked about the freedom to vote for pro-choice or pro-life candidates,” Leeman explained. “Not because we believed in pro-choice, we are both vigorously opposed to it, but we recognized or we believed that there was still space for Christians to [vote for a pro-choice candidate].” Leeman said, “There’s multiple rocks on the scale.”

Continued below.

9Marks President Jonathan Leeman: Creating Space for Christians To Vote Pro-Choice ‘Was a Mistake’

During a rapid-fire portion of the Room for Nuance podcast, 9Marks President Jonathan Leeman was asked to share a belief from the last five years that he no longer holds.

churchleaders.com

FaithT · 2025-12-02T13:58:37-0600

Michie said:
What a reaction!

What A Reaction

Kid gets statue of the Virgin Mary for Christmas ✝️ pic.twitter.com/SLjWGD2Wfi — Catholic Quotes (@CatholicQuote12) December 1, 2025

spiritdaily.org

That’s so sweet!

Factotum · 2025-12-02T13:58:18-0600

Michie said:
Welcome!

¡Gracias!

keras · 2025-12-02T13:58:14-0600

BelieveItOarKnot said:
unless you believe you are spiritually protected.

I do believe the Lord will protect His own, those who 'Call upon the Name of the Lord, shall be saved. Acts 2:21

Zechariah 9:15-16 The Lord of hosts will protect His people...On that Day, He will save them, like a flock, for they are precious to Him. Isaiah 61:10

Psalms 37:18-19 The Lord watches over the righteous, when times are bad, they will not be distressed.

Job 22:30 He will deliver the innocent, because their hands are pure.

Psalms 91:1-16 ...He will rescue you, you will not fear the terrors abroad.

Psalms 121:1-8 Our help comes from the Lord, He will guard your life.

Psalms 109:31 The Lord stands at the right hand of the poor and saves them from trials.

Isaiah 51:16 I keep you covered under the shelter of My hand.

Psalms 97:10-12 He keeps His loyal servants safe and rescues them from the wicked.

Jeremiah 17:7-8 Blessed is anyone who trusts in the Lord, they will be like trees by a stream, when the heat comes it has nothing to fear.

Nahum 1:7 The Lord is a sure protection in times of trouble and cares for all those who make Him their refuge.

Psalms 60:4-5 To those who fear the Lord, He will show the way to escape from trouble.

Psalms 37:9 For evildoers will be destroyed, those who trust in the Lord will prosper in the Land.

Isaiah 26:20 On that Day, I will come to your aid.

Daniel 12:1 There will be a time of anguish, but at that time, Your people will be delivered, all those whose names are written in the Book of Life.

2 Thessalonians 1:7 ...to give you relief when the Lord Jesus comes in blazing fire.

Joel 3:16 The Lord roars from Zion, the heavens and the earth shudder, but He is a refuge for His people and a defence for Israel.

Ecclesiasticus 34:13-17 Those who fear the Lord will live, for their trust in Him can keep them safe. The Lord keeps watch over those who love Him, He is their shield and support, a shelter from the scorching wind and the heat of the sun. He raises their spirits and gives healing, life and blessings. Apoc.

RamiC · 2025-12-02T13:57:55-0600

Hello, welcome. There is an area here on CF that might be able to help you more, The Ancient Way - Eastern Orthodox .

Michie · 2025-12-02T13:54:12-0600

Podcaster Joe Rogan recently revealed more about his ongoing journey toward Christianity, explaining he has been moved by the kindness of Christians he knows at church and that he has grown convinced the Bible is not entirely mythical.

"I think they're relaying a truth," Rogan said of Christians during a Nov. 30 episode of the "American Alchemy" podcast.

“I don't think it's myth. I don't think the whole thing is myth, but I don't think it's entirely accurate either," he said.

Rogan went on to note that he was recently discussing the Book of Revelation with his daughter, and that he told her nobody knows how the prophecies in that book will play out.

He went on to say he finds the Bible fascinating, even though he remains unsure how much of it is literally true. He also said he has taken note at how kind the Christians have been at the church he has been regularly attending, which is reportedly a non-denominational church in Austin, Texas.

Continued below.

Joe Rogan finds Bible 'fascinating,' notes Christian kindness: 'I don't think it's myth'

Podcaster Joe Rogan recently revealed more about his ongoing journey toward Christianity, explaining he has been moved by the kindness of Christians he knows and has grown convinced that the Bible is

www.christianpost.com

FaithT · 2025-12-02T13:53:37-0600

mourningdove~ said:
I'm not going to attempt to analyze your situation, but I will share that thru the years I've heard numerous successful comedians talk about this very same thing ... how they can make us all laugh ... and be the funniest person in the room ... but inside they are feeling the things that you've described. IRL, they personally deal with depression, loneliness, etc.

(Some that easily come to mind are former Saturday Nite Live cast members.)

I don't know what it all means, but I share this just to say that I don't think your experience is unique to just you.

I’ve heard and read about comedians who’ve said the same thing.

another_lost_guy · 2025-12-02T13:51:39-0600

rambot said:
I don't remember that. Because it didn't happen. He commuted the sentences of members of the same organization but not people who actually bombed it.

Susan rosenberg was involved in the 1971 Capitol bombing

The Liturgist · 2025-12-02T13:48:00-0600

Mockingbird0 said:
Nor do I know of any reliable evidence that Matthew preached in Parthia, Pontus, or Ethiopia.

It’s in the Orthodox Synaxaria. Can’t get much more reliable than that.

Mockingbird0 said:
Further I know of no reliable evidence that the Apostle Matthew is the same as the Evangelist Matthew.

I know of no reliable evidence that they were different people, nor is the idea even popular (in contrast to the idea, popular among liberal mainline Christians, that St. John the Apostle, St. John the Evangelist, and St. John the Divine were three separate persons).

another_lost_guy · 2025-12-02T13:46:12-0600

Hans Blaster said:
As noted by others, democracies and republics are not mutually excusive. The US is both, Saudi Arabia is neither, the UK is a democracy, but definitely not a republic (unless the local peasants gave Chuck 3 a "French haircut" in the last hour.)

Well I enjoy the idea of Supreme Court justices being appointed for life without voters' opinions mattering. Should be left up to the king to make decisions like that. And i guess voters technically elect the king...Oh wait no there's an electoral college too ^_^

So win-win

Hans Blaster said:
Natural is an old fashioned term for what is now known as science. I can assure you that we do not depend on the philosophical notion of a creator to do our work.

And we have seen the fruits of that in recent years as happiness levels plummet.

Hans Blaster said:
Not to any significant extent, particularly US law.

Actually Catholic canon law paralleled the legal development of much of Europe, which then influenced US law.

Hans Blaster said:
I would have disagreed with you when I was a Christian.

Good thing I am me, then

Hans Blaster said:
If you'd said "arts and culture (and even science)" I could have agreed at least for the Medieval and Renaissance periods, but exploration is funded by kings and princes (and later merchants) looking for power and/or wealth.

Monarchy is based! Good to see another Divine Right of Kings enjoyer. I must point to the obvious here, Christopher Columbus was funded by Catholic Monarchs

Hans Blaster said:
Kepler is reasonably great (don't know the other two), but I don't how his work is a product of Christianity.

He is Christian

Hans Blaster said:
I don't really care for church architecture. Too many pointless frills. I like the modern stuff: Art Deco, Prairie style, etc.

Bad.

Hans Blaster said:
"What have the Romans ever done for us?"

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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