B flat B♭
- Conspiracy Theories
- 2266 Replies
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CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
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There’s a Giant Flaw in Human History
- By sjastro
- Physical & Life Sciences
- 1491 Replies
Here is a plaster cast taken from Khufu's granite sarcophagus which is located in the King's chamber in the Great Pyramid.
Plaster casts are designed to accentuate surface details such as striations.
If the 4th dynasty Egyptians used diamond tipped circular saws for cutting granite not only would the striation patterns be circular but the kerf or groove width is constant. Instead we see straight parallel grooves and a variable kerf indicating a saw with abrasives were used where the variable kerf was caused by crushing of the abrasive probably sand against the granite during the sawing process.
Plaster casts are designed to accentuate surface details such as striations.
If the 4th dynasty Egyptians used diamond tipped circular saws for cutting granite not only would the striation patterns be circular but the kerf or groove width is constant. Instead we see straight parallel grooves and a variable kerf indicating a saw with abrasives were used where the variable kerf was caused by crushing of the abrasive probably sand against the granite during the sawing process.
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There’s a Giant Flaw in Human History
- By stevevw
- Physical & Life Sciences
- 1491 Replies
Yes sorry I get confused with posters. It was a standout as it was contradictory to what all other objections.
Nevertheless you seem to believe that we must find the device before being able to make any determinations about what caused the actual marks. I think this is not necessary for obvious reasons.
Yes I made an exaggerated example to hit home the illogical thinking. Lets say it was a precision part that looks a part that goes into a Porche. This will have much of the same precision of a vase that has been lathed. We don't need to find the manufacturing machine that made that part.
We can say as it meets the requirements of machining by its signatures. As opposed to say a hand made part without machining which for good reasons is not how we make precision parts.
Its ironic really. Because we don't have the traditional tools and device in the records for back then. Yet you and others are quite happy to accept this method without finding the device.
Petrie was excavating from the later 19th century. I would like to see any examples of attempts to create these vases back then. I have a feeling they were not as precise. Even today manufactures say that replicating these vases is not easy and requires specialist machining. Especially on the inside.
Well this is the point. Who is saying this. The skeptics will always want more and more and more evidence which can be overly demanding. Whereas many institutions, dealers, and most importantly the market says they are the real deal.
They are often good enough to be guranteed their worth and to be housed in museums and referred to as examples of predyanstic works. I would rather fall on the side with the mainstream acceptance that a few hyper skeptics.
Lol you do realise Your actually making a case for advanced tech using wheels and laths with modern day bearings to stablise the work for OLga to achieve this. Without it she would not have been able.
Then well we have not even began to mention the interior which was nowhere near the level of the vases and an impossible task to be marking little spots on a wheel to then reach in and chip away. Not does her method look anything like the near perfect arcs cut into the stone Petrie mentions. Or what we clearly see on the insides.
A Note on the ‘Replica’ Vases
The ‘replica’ vases ‘O1’ and ‘O2’ were made by Olga Vdovina in collaboration with the antropogenez.ru. The objective of the replication effort was to show that it was possible to make stone vases using stone, wood, and copper tools known to ancient Egyptians.
I must point out that Olga Vdovina made the vase ‘O1’ using a plastic rotary table supported by a ball bearing to control the outer surface accuracy through rotation by painting the elevated spots with a sharpie marker
The use of modern technology in making the ‘O1’ vase represented a significant deviation from the initial objective of antropogenez.ru to use only the tools available to the ancient Egyptians.
Nevertheless, both vases are classified as ‘IMPRECISE’ according to the proposed quality metric. This remarkable circularity was achieved due to the use of the ball-bearing supported rotary table, which is a contemporary piece of technology that was not available to the ancient Egyptians.
Astonishing Precision of Predynastic Egyptian Stone Vessels: A Metrological Study
Support The Research Do you want to know the truth about our past? Fuel the research. Your participation matters and makes the difference. Download Paper For complete details, download my paper: Pr…
maximus.energy
Yes and thats my whole point. Now your thinking outside the circular. The use of heat and fire to shape objects. A natural phenomena that is enhanced by humans. I mentioned the softening of stone which is a similar logic.
But it seems askeptics only want certain alternative ways that align with modern tech which then means that anything that looks similar must have been made with some sort of primitive tool and sheer rubbing from the beginning to create everything we see.
If for example we found burn marks or evidence of burning or heating to shape these vases then you would have to by logic of your example on wood be open to such alternative ways.
Petrie actually pioneered modern archeology. He is like the Einstein of phsyics. His measures though not down to the micron were what set the science of archeology. He rigidly recorded every detail.
Yes modern tech was not available and thats why his opinion is untainted. He is just observing and measuring a new thing almost. But they did have the lathing principles at that time. In fact it would have been the new tech for that time and well known by scientists in the field. They were at the forefront.
In fact none of Petries contemporaries disagreed with his measurements and explanations of the methods. They just did not like the idea of actually saying that this was like modern tech or required modern ways of lathing. Or lathing at all.
Lol your now subjectively making claims about Petries motives and thinking to use as evidence to undermine him. Just because he says something that many, even his contempories agreed with and can see with their own eyes.
The reason he gave away vases as gifts was that there were so many. These were not all precision vases. They were the minority being at the top of the best exanmples and reserved for royalty. But he did so for some as that was the kind of person he was and I would say that back then the whole thing about vases and auctions and precision was not a thing.
But none of this is relevant to the facts that he recorded the precision and marks on the vases and gave his best opinion from a scientific explanation for what may have caused them. But this is not rocket science either. Theres a big difference between exact arcs that are cut into vases and pounding, chipping and rubbing.
Here it is again. The reduction of anyone who dares suggest the same findings must all be deluded and are seeing things that are not there. Like some contagious mental disorder that causes them to be fooled. Never any thought that repeated findings may be good science lol.
So wait now your doing it to Petrie. He is looking directly at the arcs in the vases. What he depicts in only a small example. But he is looking directly at them and with his vase expertise telling us how the arc is uniform and meets exactly when reset. The steps around the lip stepped up with the same exact arc.
But you believe the pictures prove him wrong because of what you think they look like. I would rather believe Petrie and others who have actually measured and tested these vases.
Actually Max mentions this. He says he is already publishing them on his site. They are open articvles available for peer review and this is actually happening right now. Whether that is taken to a jouranl I don't know. But whats the difference. Both are open to scientists to peer review.
Like I said the hostile reception and biases of those who even suggest such things even before it is explained is not a good environment and is usually hestitant in even allowing such articles.
But he has published stuff.
Observation of neutron emission during acoustic cavitation of deuterated titanium powder - Scientific Reports
Possibility of nuclear reactions in solid state is intriguing for two reasons: (1) It provides a means of studying nuclear processes in conditions that are much different from traditional plasma-filled reactors or particle accelerators; (2) it dramatically lowers the cost and complexity of the...
www.nature.com
So he is a scientists and thinks in such terms and not some whacko that is deluded into thinking aliens or Atlantis created these vases lol.
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The Schumer Shutdown
- By A2SG
- American Politics
- 861 Replies
Because the Republicans are causing the suffering of some who depend upon government money, and this is the only leverage the Democratic party has right now. Certainly, the GOP has not proven themselves open to negotiation up to this point, why should democrats expect it after the GOP gets what they want?
I understand, the leader of the Republican party isn't exactly known for his ability to negotiate in good faith, but let's give it a try, see what happens? Might even help reduce the suffering of some who depend upon government money. Assuming the GOP cares about those folks.
-- A2SG, a pretty wild assumption, I grant you....
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Democrats wobble as pressure to end shutdown ramps up
- American Politics
- 46 Replies
My article is linked, and has sources for their statements within the article. You posted the lies from the Trump White house itself. An org that will lie like no tomorrow. The org that has claimed it has a plan to make healthcare better and cheaper which would make this whole shutdown moot. But we both know that too is a lie. So one more time. If you or the White house of the GOP have to make up claims as a argument, then all of you have no argument.I don't know which particular source this is, but going to the same sources that have been spreaders of hoax after hoax is not logical. Do you know the old saying, "Fool me once . . ?" There were over 2 million non-citizens receiving Medicaid before the big beautiful bill became law. Democrats can argue that they were legal due to Biden administration polices but they are illegals now. The GOP tightened up the wording in the law to prevent them from taking taxpayer dollars, why do you think the Democrats are still demanding the wording in the new law be removed? It's the same tactic they use over and over, while people were pouring over our southern border and they were even secretly flying people in, they told their base the border was safe, secure, and closed. It took some Republican senators getting past the secrecy and recording what was going on, and then the Texas governor busing people to Democrat cities in order for some to realize they had been lied to:
“They’re angry… They’re frustrated that the Congress — at least in the Senate — is focused on paying for health care benefits for illegals as opposed to paying their paychecks for the great work that they provide to the American people.” (Watch)
Democrat Shutdown Jeopardizes America’s Skies
Democrats’ reckless government shutdown — now dragging into its third week — has plunged America’s air traffic control system towards a tailspin. Whilewww.whitehouse.gov
To add, here's Snopes. An AP factcheck. A Georgetown U factcheck, US Today news and so on.
I know they aren't the Mooney Paper, Murdoch Inc, The Epoch Times or Prager U, but maybe there's a case for dabbling in reality.
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