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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

Cars are in Daniel 12.

No they're not.

Revelation 18:23 for the "medicine".

Nothing in there at all about medicine.

Voting and such would be covered by Romans 13.

No, that's Paul talking about Christian behaviour, not the act of voting itself.

We should view everything from a biblical perspective as Christians, letting it dictate what we consider to be true and good.

And you're welcome to do so. But don't expect anyone else to accept or agree with you.
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

neither is the internet, cars, antibiotic medicine, basic painkillers, voting, basic human rights and all manner of things we use today. They're not of the Bible. Is using and accepting those believing in the anti-Christ too?


Cars are in Daniel 12.
Revelation 18:23 for the "medicine".
Voting and such would be covered by Romans 13. We should view everything from a biblical perspective as Christians, letting it dictate what we consider to be true and good.
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

Yes exactly, he was not talking very poetically, he was talking to people, actually to attempt to remove those protective layers around, truth.

And, surprise surprise, you can still use poetic language when you talk to people. Which is what Neil Armstrong was doing; he was using poetic language.
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

Believing in the anti Christ deception does. Those who go completely along with what the world preaches, will be deceived by the coming antichrist. The idea that the earth is a globe is of the world not of the Bible, as shown in this thread.

And neither is the internet, cars, antibiotic medicine, basic painkillers, voting, basic human rights and all manner of things we use today. They're not of the Bible. Is using and accepting those believing in the anti-Christ too?
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

No, he's not talking to me or you, he's talking to a group of people wanting to join NASA. Again: context
Yes exactly, he was not talking very poetically, he was talking to people, actually to attempt to remove those protective layers around, truth.
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

Does your salvation REALLY hinge on the world being round or flat? Is your soul REALLY at stake for saying the Earth is round?
Believing in the anti Christ deception does. Those who go completely along with what the world preaches, will be deceived by the coming antichrist. The idea that the earth is a globe is of the world not of the Bible, as shown in this thread.
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

Sure his words are a little poetic, but also clear, we leave you much that is undone...there are... breakthroughs are available to those (in context, you) who can remove one of truths protective layers.

No, he's not talking to me or you, he's talking to a group of people wanting to join NASA. Again: context. (Which you're going to spin out of context if 5... 4... 3... 2.. 1...)
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

Poetic language
Sure his words are a little poetic, but also clear, we leave you much that is undone...there are... breakthroughs are available to those (in context, you) who can remove one of truths protective layers.
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

No it does not, like this thread shows, your arguments will shatter. The creation shows the truth of God's word. The globe model is Satan's great deception leading to the days of the beast and false prophet. Revelation 13:6 Daniel 8:10,12

Nothing has been shattered, and this thread has shown only that you'll repeat Bible verses until you're blue in the face. All that's doing is showing that you can quote Bible verses.

Does your salvation REALLY hinge on the world being round or flat? Is your soul REALLY at stake for saying the Earth is round?
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

And yet God's own creation, that has been studied for centuries from all points of the compass, shows that the Earth is a round globe
No it does not, like this thread shows, your arguments will shatter. The creation shows the truth of God's word. The globe model is Satan's great deception leading to the days of the beast and false prophet. Revelation 13:6 Daniel 8:10,12
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Who then can be saved?

Salvation is by the Holy Spirit Titus 3:5.
He changes a believer from the inside out and therefore that believer does good works.
Righteousness is given by God to believers.
A believer receives the Holy Spirit for free by grace, just for believing in the death and resurrection of Christ, for the purpose of good works that were pre ordained for that believer to do.
Could you please confirm that you don't believe that salvation is a result of your choice to believe in the death and resurrection of Christ. If this is what you believe then you were not saved by grace, but you were saved by your choice to believe.
The bible sates that faith is not of yourself, but it is the gift of God, lest anyone boast. We can easily turn our "faith" into a work, and claim that we were saved by "our" faith, as if we didn't receive it from God as a gift of salvation.

I was saved by Gods grace, through His gift of faith, so I received both grace and faith as gifts, and I have nothing to boast about and all the glory of salvation belongs to God.
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The Lutheran Hail Mary and the Orthodox Angelic Salutation

It is well known that Calvin opposed the ubiquity of Christ's body, because he thought that even in the resurrection Christ's human nature had normal human limits. While I admit that we don't know what precisely a resurrection body is like, I'm trying to imagine how a human would deal with the prayers of a billion people.

This is probably a peculiarly Reformed point of view.

Because eternity is timeless and risen humanity is glorified - you’re thinking linearly and ignoring Theosis.

Also with regards to the human nature of Christ, Calvin was in error - we partake of both natures, clearly, for St. Peter calls us partakers of the Divine Nature, but since God is omnipotent, Christ our Lord is able to make His body locally present in unlimited quantities, and the Holy Spirit can descend on the bread and wine and convert it into the Body and Blood of our Lord during the Divine Liturgy. “What is impossible for man is possible with God.” It should be noted that this is meet and appropriate, because John 6 makes it plain our salvation depends upon eating the Body and Blood of Christ, and like the rich young ruler in Luke, who prompted our Lord to say “It is easier for a camel to pass through the eyes of a needle than for a rich man to be saved” to which the Apostles astutely answered “Who then can be saved?” which demonstrates a surprising grasp of economics, since they recognized that poverty is always relative, and thus the words of our Lord would effectively preclude their salvation as well as that of most others, our Lord answered “what is impossible for man is possible with God.”

Thus, the Pelagianism Calvin so ardently opposed to would actually favor a denial of the Real Presence of the Eucharist, since the miracle of the Eucharist which is ordinarily required for our salvation is something only God can do, thus making us dependent upon God for our salvation and precluding us from saving ourselves (indeed, the only situations where one would not have to partake of the Eucharist for salvation also depend on God - that being, special grace from Christ Pantocrator, such as that He granted to St. Dismas, the Good Thief, martyrdom, or the baptism of blood, which is an opportunity available to very few, and still fewer trust the Holy Spirit within them to be able to claim a crown of martyrdom when one is offered, as was demonstrated during the Diocletian persecutions, and finally the Baptism of Desire, where a catechumen perishes before receiving Baptism or likewise the similar situation where in churches which do not immediately communicate those who have been received, one dies between reception and partaking of the Eucharist. All of these require providential conditions - one cannot arrange to be a martyr for example (St. Anthony actually tried to get martyred during the height of the Diocletian persecution, resulting to literally obstructing Roman soldiers in the hopes they would arrest him as a Christian, but merely got shoved out of the way, and in response to this failure he pursued a different form of martyrdom in the desert, inadvertently following in the footsteps of the mysterious St. Paul the Hermit resulting in the formation of monasticism as documented by St. Athanasius in The Life of Anthony.

Thus, what Martin Luther etched in the table at the Marburg Colloquy in response to Zwingli applies to Calvin as well: HOC EST CORPUS MEUM. Although Calvin came closer to a correct theology by (at least insofar as I recall) acknowledging a spiritual presence, which is still inadequate, particularly given that the Divinity of God and His humanity are consubstantial and cannot be divided, as Calvin, if memory served, reluctantly acknowledged in admitting the correctness of the term Theotokos, and the Patristic doctrine of the Eucharist (both that of the Chalcedonians, and of the miaphysite Oriental Orthodox, whose Christological Orthodoxy is attested to by the Hymn of St. Severus, Ho Monogenes* (which could not have been composed by a Monophysite or a Nestorian, and likewise by the confiteor ante communionem of the Coptic Orthodox Divine Liturgy) also does not confuse them or make Christ a hybrid.

The problem with Reformed theology in general and Calvin in particular is the application of human constraints combined with an ignorant incredulity - for example, Calvin supposed, incorrectly, indeed if I recall actually claimed that the relics of the Cross present in Europe were sufficient to account for the mass of a galleon, but a French scientist proved Calvin completely wrong on this point in the 19th century by measuring all relics then accounted for and determining the total mass accounted for a third of the Cross. If we include the intact wing of the Cross the Ethiopian Orthodox Church claims to possess, we have maybe half of it, at best, not counting the relics which were destroyed.

And of course Calvin does bear some responsibility for the severe destruction of priceless cultural artifacts by reintroducing Iconoclasm to Europe together with Zwingli.

* The provenance of this anaphora as the work of Mor Severus of Antioch is demonstrated by the fact that it is used as the introit of the Syriac Orthodox divine liturgy, much more prominently than its position in the Eastern Orthodox (and Armenian Orthodox) liturgy, where it is still prominent, as the usual conclusion to the typical psalm of the Second Antiphon; excluding the possibility that Emperor Justinian wrote it, as some of my fellow Eastern Orthodox claim, given the extreme persecution of the Syriac Orthodox committed in his name; rather, the probable explanation is that proposed by several, that Justinian added Ho Monogenes to the Orthodox liturgy during the period when he was actively pursuing reconciliation with the Oriental Orthodox, indeed being married to a Syriac Orthodox Empress, St. Theodora, and also the attribution by some to St. Athanasius seems very unlikely, since the issues addressed by the hymn had only begun to appear at the very end of the life of St. Athanasius, is likely the result of the Armenians, who during a period of schism with the other Oriental Orthodox went through a phase of denying the validity of the theopaschite theology of St. Severus of Antioch while, like all Oriental Orthodox, strongly venerating St. Athanasius, perhaps even moreso than the Eastern Orthodox; indeed the only surviving anaphora of the 13 or so once used by the Armenians is the Anaphora of St. Athanasius, unrelated to the Ethiopian anaphora of the same name, which is in fact an abridged version of the Hagiopolitan Anaphora of St. James)..
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

Aliens are not throwing asteroids at us, it is a deception, outside of the sky is water and the city of heaven, just as the Bible describes.

The sun rejoices as a strong man to run a race, it's circular path is from one end of the sky to the other and nothing under heaven is hid from the heat of it Psalm 19 KJV.

And yet God's own creation, that has been studied for centuries from all points of the compass, shows that the Earth is a round globe.
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

The Earth isn't flat, it's a round globe, all of science and God's own creation shows that to be true. /

Aliens are not throwing asteroids at us, it is a deception, outside of the sky is water and the city of heaven, just as the Bible describes.

The sun rejoices as a strong man to run a race, it's circular path is from one end of the sky to the other and nothing under heaven is hid from the heat of it Psalm 19 KJV.
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Who then can be saved?

How does this not contradict what you just said to me in this post?


You just said that we can’t do anything unless God gives it to us to someone else then told me that we can act against His will. So when someone sins or reflects God are they acting according to His will or against it?
We need to make the distinction between the two types of people in the world. Gods people, the elect can't do anything to obey the gospel unless God gives us the ability to obey.
Likewise, the reprobate can't do anything to obey the gospel, because God does not give them the gift of grace and faith, because it's not His will that they be saved.

But you need to understand that God is not responsible for the evil which the reprobate do. He allows them to do it and it does serve His will because He will show Hi hatred of sin by punishing them with eternal torment in the lake of fire. If they didn't sin, then there would be no way for God to demonstrate His wrath and justice. So yes Gods will will be done, even through the wicked.
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

What is it that he was not referring to? Truth related to outerspace? You are saying that after reading the full speech you think he was not referring to truth related to outerspace?!

He wasn't talking about a literal truth.
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The Final Experiment (Flat Earth Bites The Dust)

misquoted and quote-mined Neil Armstrong's speech to refer to something he wasn't referring to, even
What is it that he was not referring to? Truth related to outerspace? You are saying that after reading the full speech you think he was not referring to truth related to outerspace?!
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