Latest activity

Fervent · 2025-07-18T18:55:11-0500

tall73 said:
For man to be responsible he has to make choices. Does that mean that, however you see God's decree, that there is still room for people to choose something, thereby having accountability?

Certainly God planned the cross. God planned for Joseph to be in Egypt, both examples that you noted.

He also used the choices of sinful men, which they did not intend for good, to glorify Himself.

But is your view that they were determined to be evil to begin with?

To use an extreme example, if an assassin designed a robot programmed to kill anything that moved, and put it in position to take out his target, would the robot be responsible if it killed the target? Wouldn't the one who built the robot be responsible?

I don't think that Adam and Eve were programmed to sin. As you mentioned, I think they had the capacity to do so, but chose to sin.

In that respect they are responsible for their actions.

Since the fall things get a bit more complicated, due to sin now being in the world, and that gets into a whole other discussion of the nature of the fall, and post-fall anthropology.

But if Adam and Eve had a choice, then that means that God can still be sovereign,, yet allow for choice within the parameters He set.

If Adam and Eve had no choice, how are they any different than the robot? How can they have responsibility?

Be wary of trickery that Calvinists typically engage in, such as defining "choice" not as a voluntary action but "selecting what you desire". Calvinism teaches that everything, including the fall, was God's intentional design to bring glory to Himself by "delivering" a lucky few from the horrors He designed for the unelect to endure based solely on His eternal design. When presented with verses like 2 Peter 3:9 and 1 Timothy 2:4 they suddenly attribute God two wills, thereby commanding what He would not have.

friend of · 2025-07-18T18:54:58-0500

zoidar said:
That is if you believe this to be about individual salvation.

Why wouldn't it though? Rom 9 specifically names two individuals, Jacob and Esau

fhansen · 2025-07-18T18:51:32-0500

enoob57 said:
View attachment 367554
I just thought everyone should see this ha ha… I rest my case… as you are without reason giving yes and no in the same instance… I really can’t reply to anything of this because it’s unreasonable!

God, in His wisdom, can reconcile the fact of His soveriegnty with the ability to make man a morally accountable being. So it's not either/or but both/and, with man's participation required. The church came to the understanding that God, existing in eternity and in His omniscience, knows our choices beforehand and uses them for His purposes, without predetermining them. He certainly predestines none to hell.

XrxrX · 2025-07-18T18:50:27-0500

Guojing said:
I actually asked you a very simple question, "Who were the beast and the false prophet at AD 70?"

If you don't know or don't wish to answer, just say so.

No, you asked if "I thought they are nobodies".. and you're going on the assumption I'm a full preterist, which I'm not. So, I don't claim "Everything" was fulfilled in 70AD. What I do claim, are the scriptures that speak of Who is the true Inheritor of the promises of Abraham, and it's verbatim Jesus. Would you agree with that?

enoob57 · 2025-07-18T18:49:16-0500

1 John 2:15-16 (KJV)
15Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
16For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

God says this about His Word
Hebrews 4:12 (KJV)
12For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

when listening to Joel Osteen, it is very clear, He is about the world and the things in it! He says it’s God’s blessing, but is it?

lifepsyop · 2025-07-18T18:48:31-0500

AaronClaricus said:
There's absolute dating and relative dating. Absolute dating is based on physics.

Okay, so you believe that with this methodology you are gaining absolute knowledge about the age of the Earth. Good for you! :oldthumbsup:

Ignatius the Kiwi · 2025-07-18T18:47:47-0500

timothyu said:
Nonsense. Unless of course our self-interest which is another matter altogether, overlies God's will. Self is the culprit, not sex.

Marriage is always in one's self interest, be it for relationships, for sex, for children, whatever. Why do you allow such a selfish expression of humanity to be practiced without condemnation when it is better to be reliant on God alone? Or do you think God isn't enough for any man or woman? Doesn't Saint Paul say it is better to marry? Doesn't Jesus say we should seek first the Kingdom of God? Is seeking our own pleasure in earthly things seeking the Kingdom? Clearly it isn't.

Do you actually see how your hypercritical standards of worldliness can apply to literally anything. Power is not the only worry in this world, there are all sorts of temptations and evils yet power is necessary especially in how we relate to other people. Yet you think it is somehow uniquely deserving of Christians avoiding because of what exactly? Because you misinterpret the bible?

timothyu said:
No, I told you we had a leader here that did that but did it right. His concept of personal gain was not for self but was that ALL have access to equal heath care and a decent retirement.

Oh so there is a political order we can appeal to. Was this leader you admire a Christian?

timothyu said:
Already answered that.

No you didn't but people of your persuasion never can because they are ashamed of the implication. That we apparently only exist as a serf class. If you disagree with this accusation then say you disagree with it. But to disagree with it is to suggest that Christians can be in positions of power, can be part of politics.

dlamberth · 2025-07-18T18:45:25-0500

It took evolution 300 million years ago to cut off the production of Coal.
This first 4 minutes of this video goes into a lot more information into how coal was produced than I understood. The rest is a plea for money to plant trees.

Login to view embedded media

timothyu · 2025-07-18T18:43:18-0500

Ignatius the Kiwi said:
Because it is a worldly activity that distracts from the purity of our devotion to God

Nonsense. Unless of course our self-interest which is another matter altogether, overlies God's will. Self is the culprit, not sex.

Ignatius the Kiwi said:
You have spent this entire thread arguing that Christians in power is evil, and wrong.

No, I told you we had a leader here that did that but did it right. His concept of personal gain was not for self but was that ALL have access to equal heath care and a decent retirement.

Ignatius the Kiwi said:
Also can you answer the question directly.

Already answered that.

Tuur · 2025-07-18T18:35:14-0500

An AI story. Problem is, there are three different ways to do the first half, and I'm not happy with any of them.

zoidar · 2025-07-18T18:33:42-0500

Carl Emerson said:
This denies God's right to choose before birth - clearly stated in Romans 9

9 For this is the word of promise: “At this time I will come, and Sarah will have a son.” 10 And not only that, but there was also Rebekah, when she had conceived twins by one man, our father Isaac; 11 for though the twins were not yet born and had not done anything good or bad, so that God’s purpose according to His choice would stand, not because of works but because of Him who calls, 12 it was said to her, “The older will serve the younger.” 13 Just as it is written: “Jacob I have loved, but Esau I have hated.”

That is if you believe this to be about individual salvation.

enoob57 · 2025-07-18T18:30:34-0500

I just thought everyone should see this ha ha… I rest my case… as you are without reason giving yes and no in the same instance… I really can’t reply to anything of this because it’s unreasonable!

prodromos · 2025-07-18T18:28:54-0500

Apple Sky said:
I'm not out to impress anyone, I just tell it as it is.

The vape video did it for me.

Witsit Vapes It - The Final Experiment Fakery Exposed!

Witsit Vapes It - The Final Experiment Fakery Exposed!

153news.net

That was trivially debunked, but you don't watch the videos that debunk your sources, do you?

prodromos · 2025-07-18T18:27:16-0500

Apple Sky said:
Rubbish, after watching a few videos it was obvious it were faked.

The only thing obvious is that you will believe what you want to believe.

Dan Perez · 2025-07-18T18:23:32-0500

keras said:
How anyone could believe such nonsense, is unfathomable.

Revelation 12:14 & 17 tell us exactly where Gods Christian peoples will be during the 42 month time of the 'beast' in world control.
The Christians who kept the Covenant with God, as per Daniel 11:32, will be kept safe on a distant earth location.

Those who do violate the Covenant*, will have to face persecution and possible/probable martyrdom. But it will be them who Jesus will bring back to life and who will reign with Him. Revelation 20:4-5 The two Witnesses, Rev 11:1-13, are included with these people.

*Those Christians who agreed to a peace treaty; Daniel 9:27, with the leader of the secular peoples, instead of trusting in the Lords protection.

And what you call nonsense is. written in 2 Thess 2;3 -4- 8.

dan p

Yarddog · 2025-07-18T18:21:48-0500

d taylor said:
-

Why would God tell someone something that is not supported by The Bible.

Just because you say that it's not supported doesn't mean that it's not.

I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
Matthew 16 : 19

Hentenza · 2025-07-18T18:21:44-0500

Hank77 said:
OK, but if they are true, would the first count towards doing something very important and helpful to the people in her district? In the second case, would this count as fulfilling her responsibilities to a national effort?

Wiki usually sites work very well.

AOC doubled her fundraising total for Texas storm victims to $4 million, as she joined fellow lawmakers in Houston to continue relief efforts

Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Saturday said her fundraising effort for Texans suffering after winter storms doubled to $4 million.

www.businessinsider.com

YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.

www.youtube.com

WATCH: Sen. Gillibrand, Rep. Ocasio-Cortez hold news conference on postal banking

Didn't realize that Texas was in her district. All politicians are going to want the spotlight. As far as the postal banking I doubt that her intention was to save money to poor rural people, who usually vote republican, rather than giving immigrants a free way to send money back home.

Akita Suggagaki · 2025-07-18T18:18:43-0500

Gregory Thompson said:
Okay I think it's clearer in my mind now.

At first I thought it was about the trinity and the church. But that isn't it.

What I was reading was using the trinity as a reference to illustrate that all the Perfected personality traits of God are one in the same way the Trinity is one with no modalist or partialist language.

Quite often one would say, God is like this but saying He is like that is misguided though both characteristics are in the scripture and traditions of the church teachings.

Thanks for sharing, it was a good one to unpack.

I still am unpacking. But I see the reference to the Trinity as the same soert tof mystery.

Ignatius the Kiwi · 2025-07-18T18:18:21-0500

timothyu said:
Why should they? It's not a sin in its proper format.

Because it is a worldly activity that distracts from the purity of our devotion to God. It can lead to all sorts of sins and marriage is not a perfect means of preventing sexual sin. Your main objection to power is that it corrupts, therefore shouldn't we as Christians abstain from all worldly activities and temptations? Why do you allow an outlet in the case of sex within marriage which not only distracts from God but causes all sorts of evil?

timothyu said:
Power is not forbidden. Power for the benefit of self, especially at the expense of others is forbidden.

You have spent this entire thread arguing that Christians in power is evil, and wrong. That the Church suffered a great apostasy with Constantine. Power, especially command of government is always at the expense of someone. The criminal for instance. Is it wrong for a Christian ruler to punish a criminal? Should we allow people to do evil without any resistance, using only our words to convince them otherwise?

timothyu said:
He said render unto Caesar what is Caesar's and unto God what is God's. Two separate worlds.

Have you given all your money to the government Timothy? Why not? Have you given all your possessions to the poor? Why not? Why aren't you perfect? You demand perfection of every Christian before you and say they were all corrupt and forsook the word of God, yet why haven't you lived by your own principles? Why are you so attached to worldly goods?

Also can you answer the question directly. Are Christians to be a serf/servant class that must abstain from political power and control? You and others like you always avoid answering this directly. So please, answer.

AaronClaricus · 2025-07-18T18:17:37-0500

lifepsyop said:
There's not much point in me responding to something you claim is already known 'absolutely'.

There is a long history of scientists claiming to have strong data-driven evidence of long ages, such as the age of the earth itself, a date which has deviated by billions of years. I'm sure you believe that it's all figured out now, I just don't share that belief.

There's absolute dating and relative dating. Absolute dating is based on physics. Radioactive elements decay. In the case of volcanics, it's usually uranium 235 and 233 into specific isotopes of lead. They decay at different rates providing two calculations which serve as physical/natural clocks.

The old issues with the age of the earth are long over. And they knew of the weaknesses when they published. Back then the sample size was quite large, much larger than a single zircon. And zircons have a property that allows them to grow extra layers. These day sample size is a single zircon and they only select high quality samples so the age is know to within 10,000 years. The age of the earth has hardly changed in 75 years, and within the estimated range of the first high quality experiments using meteorites. Which were all formed in a 3 million year long period at the very beginning of the solar system. Less the materials that were ejected from planets during collisions. These days we have earth rocks that are almost that old. With more discoveries likely in the future.

timothyu · 2025-07-18T18:13:03-0500

Ignatius the Kiwi said:
Yet you don't advocate Christians all give up sex.

Why should they? It's not a sin in its proper format.

Ignatius the Kiwi said:
Why is power the only real forbidden thing to the Christian?

Power is not forbidden. Power for the benefit of self, especially at the expense of others is forbidden.

Ignatius the Kiwi said:
Do you believe Jesus intended Christians to be a political serf class always subordinate to non-Christians?

He said render unto Caesar what is Caesar's and unto God what is God's. Two separate worlds.

Ignatius the Kiwi · 2025-07-18T18:10:59-0500

RDKirk said:
Jesus was repeatedly confronted with political enticements or traps throughout the Gospels. In each instance, He either avoided the political snare or reframed the issue to focus on His Kingdom rather than earthly power.

1. Taking up an earthly kingdom Himself

Scripture: Matthew 4:8–10; Luke 4:5–8
Political Enticement:
Satan offers Jesus "all the kingdoms of the world and their glory" in exchange for worship.
Movement/Position: World domination through political or military power.
Jesus’ Response: “It is written, ‘You shall worship the Lord your God and him only shall you serve.’”
Interpretation: Jesus rejected the offer of political control over earthly kingdoms, refusing to establish His mission through worldly power.

2. Enticement by the Zealots

Scripture: John 6:14–15
Political Enticement: The crowd wants to “take him by force to make him king.”
Movement/Position: Messianic nationalism – a popular uprising to install Jesus as a political Messiah against Roman rule.
Jesus’ Response: “He withdrew again to the mountain by himself.”
Interpretation: Jesus refused to become a political figurehead or revolutionary leader, even when offered popular support.

3. Enticement to either oppose or align with Roman rule

Scripture: Matthew 22:15–22; Mark 12:13–17; Luke 20:20–26
Political Enticement:
Pharisees and Herodians try to trap Him by asking whether it is lawful to pay taxes to Caesar.
Movement/Position: They aim to force Him to either endorse Roman occupation (alienating nationalists) or oppose it (inviting arrest).
Jesus’ Response: “Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s.”
Interpretation: Jesus avoids endorsing or rejecting Roman rule; He separates civic duty from divine loyalty.

4. Criticism of Sadducees

Scripture: Matthew 22:23–33
Political Enticement: The Sadducees--who collaborated with Roman authorities--sought to trap Jesus in a politically safe, rationalistic denial of resurrection.
Movement/Position: Sadducean status quo, aligned with Roman peace and temple authority.
Jesus’ Response: He affirms resurrection and undermines their premise.
Interpretation: Jesus refuses alignment with this one of the two most politically powerful religious establishments.

5. Criticism of Pharisees

Scripture: Matthew 23:23
Political Enticement: By pandering to the Pharisees, Jesus would have had their support.
Movement/Position: The Pharisees had the admiration and loyalties of the common people and the best populist network.
Jesus' Response: He hotly castigates the Pharisees, even to casting doubt on their eternal salvation.
Interpretation: Jesus refuses alignment with the second of the two most politically powerful religious establishments.

6. Before Pilate: “Are You a King?”

Scripture: John 18:33–37
Political Enticement: Pilate questions Jesus about His kingship, a potential political threat.
Movement/Position: Roman concern about rebellion and Jesus' possible role as a revolutionary leader.
Jesus’ Response: “My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight... But now my kingdom is from another place.”
Interpretation: Jesus explicitly disclaims political ambitions or earthly kingship.

So you are of the opinion that we as Christians must be a serf or servant class of non believing rulers? If a Christian finds themselves in a place of political leadership is he obligated to hand power to non-Christians? Take in mind also I am not suggesting that Christ's ministry existed in order to create nations, yet I do not see how it follows from this that Christians may not organize themselves into nations if they happen to convert a majority. Is the majority of Christians duty bound to rush to the nearest Atheist or Pagan and have them rule over us?

Ignatius the Kiwi · 2025-07-18T18:10:14-0500

RDKirk said:
The Christian nation is the Body of Christ.

I am talking about a community of people that has organized itself into a large organization or nation state. Do you disagree with said community using aggression to police itself and live according to it's principles? Maybe for instance being aggressive against Satanists and prohibiting them from expressing themselves publicly and not allowing them to blaspheme Christ, as they are wont to do.

eclipsenow · 2025-07-18T18:10:03-0500

Hi all,
as much as I disagree with almost everything about Trump with every fibre of my being, I personally doubt there could be anything devastating against him in the Epstein files simply because I'm sceptical about conspiracy theories - and feel human beings are too prone to leaking something THAT big!

Mind you - decades ago I was a Department of Community Services officer in the NSW government. I can tell you with some authority that sick, powerful men in a society do cluster together and form paedophile conspiracies. They form networks to enable their sick addictions.

Leaks like this can be kept quite by the same logic with which NATO have not nuked Russia - it's Mutually Assured Destruction. I don't have details on me, but have read departmental training material on various local cabals in NSW back in the day. The only stuff more disturbing? When this gets combined with "Ritual Abuse" - when it gets into Satanic stuff. Even us DOCS officers were not to attempt investigating THAT stuff - we would tell our managers who would escalate it to a special unit. (I like to think of them as a child welfare version of Mulder and Scully! Fortunately I never had a case like that. But the curiosity of this old X-Files fan does sometimes make me wish I knew more about that special unit. From a distance. I don't even know the unit's name!)

The thing that makes me sceptical about a cabal in Federal Administrations - especially under Trump - is the sheer scale - and the venomous energy of those he burns! Think about the vast number of public servants he has yelled "You're fired!" at like he's the star of his own reality TV show. I guess he still is? Unfortunately for us, it's called "The News!"

If any of the more bitter ex-staffers knew anything - surely it would have been leaked by now?

HOWEVER - having said all that - Trump is not helping himself!

QUIZ TIME: Trump has explained away the Epstein files by claiming:-
A: They're one of America's largest conspiracies - written by Obama and Hilary Clinton and Democrats and "Losers and Criminals of the Biden Administration",

B: Then tried to blame the Democrats for NOT releasing the files THEY created!?,

C: In doing so contradicted US Attorney General Pam Bondi who says there ARE NO Epstein files (even though she had them on her desk in February),

D: Anyone who asks about Epstein all these years later is a bad person. (Even though he still can't stop lying and crying about the 2020 election 'being stolen' and a thousand other petty grievances he has with anyone ever who has ever opposed him or his policies.)

E: Said of his own MAGA base asking these questions - "Let these weaklings continue forward and do the Democrats work, don’t even think about talking of our incredible and unprecedented success, because I don’t want their support anymore!"

F: ALL OF THE ABOVE!
30 seconds thinking time...
...
...
...
...
ANSWER:
The correct answer is E - all of the above!

Well done! You have demonstrated you have a grip on logical inconsistencies and self-contradiction. Just as his MAGA base are starting to discover!

This was his first ever "Truth Social" post to get MORE COMMENTS than likes - indicating the MAGA base want to question him more than adulate him. This is a new low with his OWN base - and now he is turning on his own base as 'weaklings'. Interesting times.

Full coverage here on Australia's ABC
Login to view embedded media

d taylor · 2025-07-18T18:08:56-0500

Yarddog said:
God told me that about 15 years ago. I believe him.

-

Why would God tell someone something that is not supported by The Bible.

Latest activity

Latest activity

WATCH: Sen. Gillibrand, Rep. Ocasio-Cortez hold news conference on postal banking​

Filter

Forum statistics

Share this page

WATCH: Sen. Gillibrand, Rep. Ocasio-Cortez hold news conference on postal banking