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ralliann · 2025-10-14T11:21:49-0500

Say it aint so said:
We have labor shortages in those fields of work where those other than US citizens fill the void. It's not about cheap labor, it's about labor period. There were farmers offering deceit wages, free dwelling and 401k plans and still couldn't get Americans to work. And yes, we are in need of legal migration in this country. We still have labor shortages. No one disputes that.

Then fight to fix it.

NewLifeInChristJesus · 2025-10-14T11:16:30-0500

Xeno.of.athens said:
do you believe that God cares about how you worship him?

Yes.

23 But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him. 24 God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth. (Jn 4:23–24)

Say it aint so · 2025-10-14T11:16:28-0500

ralliann said:
What do you desire? This cheap labor, or citizens? We have a waiting list for immigrants as it is. We are not in need of legal immigration in this country. Guest workers does not make for a slave class. These go back home with pretty good money in their pocket.

We have labor shortages in those fields of work where those other than US citizens fill the void. It's not about cheap labor, it's about labor period. There were farmers offering deceit wages, free dwelling and 401k plans and still couldn't get Americans to work. And yes, we are in need of legal migration in this country. We still have labor shortages. No one disputes that.

Colo Millz · 2025-10-14T11:15:14-0500

I am thinking of the Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe:

After Aslan’s death and resurrection, he meets the Pevensie children again. Lewis writes:

“Aslan and Edmund walked together in the dewy grass, talking. But no one ever heard what Aslan was saying, and no one ever heard what Edmund said either.”

The conversation is deliberately left private.

But Edmund is completely changed - he is humble, brave, and loyal.

When the battle comes, he risks his life to save others (breaking the Witch’s wand).

Later, Aslan tells the others simply,

“Here is your brother ... and there is no need to talk to him about what is past.”

Now, what we are essentially doing is taking private bets between us as to what Aslan said to Edmund.

But my own particular bet is that Aslan does not say - "Ok Edmund, I sacrificed myself to save you from the Ice Queen, now you're completely free from all moral requirements whatsoever, do whatever you want and SIN BOLDLY!"

Jipsah · 2025-10-14T11:14:17-0500

ViaCrucis said:
America isn't mentioned in Scripture,

That seems to bother a lot of folks. After all, we're the A Number 1!

NewLifeInChristJesus · 2025-10-14T11:12:54-0500

JohnB445 said:
Which sin would be worse than murder

37 Jesus said to him, “ ‘You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and great commandment. (Mt 22:37–38)

If this is the first and greatest commandment, wouldn't it follow that breaking it would be the first and greatest sin?

ralliann · 2025-10-14T11:12:09-0500

Desk trauma said:
Not something I said.

Then why bring it up? The governments these people live in control the wealth. Their cartels control businesses as well. A real problem in the avocado business. Dealing with this corruption is another way to deal with this situation.

River Jordan · 2025-10-14T11:10:27-0500

Platte said:
My point would be there is an unreasonable jump from any evidence to a Macro evolution conclusion

I don't think the creationists here fully appreciate how, after seeing your above opinion, the reaction from just about every scientist would be something like "So?" Kind of the same reaction you'd get after showing geographers some of the flat earth threads in here.

Of course the reality is 99.99% of scientists will never even know about your opinion in the first place. I guess I'm mostly wondering if you think your opinions on this matter are noteworthy?

Apple Sky · 2025-10-14T11:09:23-0500

Hentenza said:
Is a really big bubble. Really really big bubble.

Oompa Loompa · 2025-10-14T11:09:16-0500

bèlla said:
Have you ever been a farmhand or did work of that nature? I spent a season on a local production farm to learn how to garden but I wouldn’t want to do it for a living nor are young people required to follow suit. Automation is the future and I posted articles from WSJ acknowledging the same and they’re already doing it. Most farmers don’t want to pay a livable wage. They want the cheapest labor they can get.

~bella

Balancing Technology and People: The Evolving Role of Farm Workers in Automation

The progression toward automation is partly based on a shortage of workers, but it is part of a natural progression. Switching from work that is heavily dependent on people—whether it's you, family members or hired employees—can be complicated.

farms.extension.wisc.edu

Top 5 Agricultural Technologies 2025: Shaping the Future of Farming

These 5 trends are transforming agriculture—but one of them is way ahead of the rest. Find out which one is changing farming forever.

robovision.ai

The Future of Farming: Top AgTech Trends and Innovations to Watch in 2025 - AgTech Breakthrough

To feed a growing worldwide population the agricultural technology sector undergoes significant changes during 2025. Agriculture technology is vital for meeting rising food demand while mitigating climate risks, with 41% of farmers citing weather as a top concern in 2024. Agricultural technology...

agtechbreakthrough.com

ralliann · 2025-10-14T11:08:59-0500

Oompa Loompa said:
Doesn't matter what the pay or conditions are. They just don't want to get their hands dirty, preferring the comfort of an office than in a field environment.

Gen Z isn't looking to make blue collar work a career

While some of Gen Z are filling trade positions, data suggests few intend to stay there for the long haul.

www.newsweek.com

The bottom line is that Gen Z would rather remain unemployed and living with their parents while looking for a job with good pay and working conditions that doesn't involve getting their hands dirty. Many of them would prefer settling for a job with lower pay with ideal working conditions than higher paying jobs what require them to sweat. For many of Gen Z, blue collar is beneath them.

This is so true. Entitled is an attitude fostered for a long time. Elitism run amuck in this country. I AM TO GOOD FOR ANY OF THAT. It is for the less than people. For these a slave class can be ok.

Studyman · 2025-10-14T11:06:50-0500

Mercy Shown said:
You say:
You’re correct that Jesus did not perform Levitical rituals — but not because those laws were “added” later as a temporary system separate from God’s true Law.
Scripture says those sacrifices were part of the Mosaic covenant itself given through Moses at Sinai, not “added after” the golden calf.

Exodus 24:6–8

Thank you for actually reading my post before responding this time, I very much appreciate it.

OK, so lets look at the verse you use to support the religious philosophy that a common man that sinned, was required by God's LAW, to take a goat to the Levite Priest, to provide for the remission of his sins the "FIRST TIME" Moses went up on the mount.

First, God made His Offer of a Covenant to the people, same as He did Abraham some 430 years earlier.

Ex. 19: 4 Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and how I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto myself. 5 Now therefore, "if ye will obey" my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, "then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me" above all people: for all the earth is mine:

6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, "and an holy nation". These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

7 And Moses came and called for the elders of the people, "and laid before their faces" all these words which the LORD commanded him.

8 And "all the people" answered together, and said, "All that the LORD hath spoken "we will do". And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD.

After this, in chapter 20, God gave the People His 10 Commandments.

You will notice, if you are interested in what is actually written, that there is NO WHERE in this agreement between God and the people, where THIS Law was given to them "Because of Transgressions". So according to what God actually teaches, these Laws were not "ADDED" because of Transgressions at all. There was a LAW "ADDED", but as anyone can clearly see, it wasn't the 10 Commandments, it wasn't Passover, it wasn't God's Sabbath. It's right there before your own eyes.

So what does the verse you referenced actually say?

Ex. 24: 1 And he said unto Moses, Come up unto the LORD, thou, and Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel; and worship ye afar off. 2 And Moses alone shall come near the LORD: but they shall not come nigh; neither shall the people go up with him. 3 And Moses came and told the people all the words of the LORD, and all the judgments: and all the people answered with one voice, and said, "All the words which the LORD hath said will we do". 4 And Moses wrote all the words of the LORD, and rose up early in the morning, and builded an altar under the hill, and twelve pillars, according to the twelve tribes of Israel. 5 And he sent young men of the children of Israel, which offered burnt offerings, and sacrificed peace offerings of oxen unto the LORD. 6 And Moses took half of the blood, and put it in basons; and half of the blood he sprinkled on the altar. 7 And he took the book of the covenant, and "read in the audience of the people": "and they said", All that the LORD hath said "will we do", and be obedient.

8 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold "the blood of the covenant", which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.

Where does God or Moses require that a man bring a goat to a Levite Priest for the remission of his sins? Please show me in the verses you referenced? Remember, the "LAW" Paul is speaking to that was "ADDED", wasn't ADDED until 430 years after Abraham.

Men have offered peace offerings and burnt offerings to God since the beginning. "And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering:"

Gen. 4: 18 And Noah went forth, and his sons, and his wife, and his sons' wives with him: 19 Every beast, every creeping thing, and every fowl, and whatsoever creepeth upon the earth, after their kinds, went forth out of the ark. 20 And Noah builded an altar unto the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and "offered" burnt offerings on the altar.

Gen. 22: 13 And Abraham lifted up his eyes, and looked, and behold behind him a ram caught in a thicket by his horns: and Abraham went and took the ram, and "offered" him up for a burnt offering in the stead of his son.

Ex. 10: 24 And Pharaoh called unto Moses, and said, Go ye, serve the LORD; only let your flocks and your herds be stayed: let your little ones also go with you. 25 And Moses said, Thou must give us also sacrifices and burnt offerings, that we may sacrifice unto the LORD our God.

So MS, just look at all the lies and deceptions that you and I have been influenced by that are exposed in just these few verses.

Exposed Lie #1. The Entire Law that God gave to Moses was "ADDED" "Because of Transgressions".

As you can see by accepting the Word's of God in your own Bible, this is a false teaching that this world's religions have promoted to both of us since our youth, and long before that.

Exposed Lie #2. The "LAW" Commanding a common man to bring a goat to a Levite Priest in order to provide for the forgiveness of his sins, was Commanded by God to Israel, before Israel broke the Covenant, "Ratified in Blood" the First Time Moses went up to God.

As you can see, there were no Commandment of God "Commanding" a common man to sacrifice animals for his sins anywhere before Israel broke the Covenant they had made with God.

Exposed lie #4. The practice of free will sacrifices and burnt offerings to God existed long before even Abraham was born, and were part a true believers honor towards God before Moses even Left Egypt. These are symbolic of the Glory, honor and respect true believers show to God through their obedient works. These were not part of the "LAW" Paul spoke to that were not "ADDED" until 430 years after Abraham.

If men could just turn away from the internet preachers, and place their trust in God, or as Paul teaches, "Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members (Eyes, hands, feet,) as instruments of righteousness unto God.

If only you and I could engage in honest discussion and answer each others questions in search of God's Righteousness, there is so much influence from the "course of this world" that can be exposed, just as the 4 deceptions we have already exposed.

I asked you once to answer me, "Why did God tell Moses to get out of His way so HE could wipe Israel out?" I would also ask, since you are on this forum preaching to me, "Why did Moses have to go up to God a 2nd time?" Wasn't the "covenant" God made with them already established?

Again, if a man would turn away from this world's religious system, including the religious websites, and place their trust in God, you will find that Israel "Broke the Covenant". It was gone, Israel had become like Sodom, and God was ready to wipe them out.

But Moses interjected on their behalf, and went up for them a 2nd Time to secure "another Covenant", which still included the 10 Commandments and many of God's eternal judgments, statutes and Laws that Noah and Abraham knew, that were given the first time, just like on the First Covenant. But on the 2nd Time Moses went up, God "ADDED" Laws, because of the great transgression, concerning sacrifices and burnt offerings required by the individual for sin.

PTW · 2025-10-14T11:06:40-0500

Yum!

Chicken Fried Steak?

ralliann · 2025-10-14T11:05:57-0500

BPPLEE said:
They have to have time to protest

Many are also funded..

fhansen · 2025-10-14T11:05:14-0500

Hentenza said:
A huge difference. If the law is still required then Jesus sacrifice was for nothing.

The law is no longer our master, God is; that's the differnce between the old and new covenants! He fulfills the law in us; He 'puts it in our minds and writes it on our hearts'.

Apple Sky · 2025-10-14T11:04:56-0500

Strong in Him said:
The sun is 93,000,000 miles away.

It can't be else we wouldn't get images like this;

ralliann · 2025-10-14T11:04:26-0500

Desk trauma said:
It’s a fantasy.

Bringing in immigrants helps this how?

Desk trauma said:
Drugs get into each and every maximum security prison in the country. Think we can lock the border down tighter than our maximum security prisons?

Where there is a will, there is a way. Bringing immigrants into this country stops this how?

Colo Millz · 2025-10-14T11:04:05-0500

Jesus didn’t abolish the Law — he transformed it from an external code into an interior grace.

Galatians 6:2

Always in His Presence · 2025-10-14T11:03:32-0500

RocksInMyHead said:
Can't have the military going unpaid - that's how you get a coup.

Why would Schumer want a coup? Hmmm.... I wonder

They can't stop him with indictments...
They can't stop him by criminal charged - even the ones that won
They can't stop him with over 900 inquiries and complaints his first term
They can't stop him with a two year 40,000,000 investigation involving 1,000,000 pages of information - 2,500 subpoenas interrogations on two continents by - 19 government attorney's - 40 special agents.
They can't stop him by elections
They can't stop him after he was shot on national TV
They can't stop him by endless complaints
They can't stop him by endless accusation of any one of a number of things
They can't stop him by getting him thrown off the ballot for re-election
They can't stop him through the courts

Perhaps you are right - a military coup might be something Schiff wants

River Jordan · 2025-10-14T11:02:23-0500

o_mlly said:
So once again, the usual retort: I must be ignorant to question the evo theory.

No, your ignorance is evidenced by the content of your posts, such as apparently being confused about what a monotreme is.

o_mlly said:
Perhaps you are not aware of this sub-forum title: Creation & Theistic Evolution.

And people post all kinds of odd beliefs here, like that the earth is flat and NASA is one big hoax. I honestly don't see your posts any differently.

If you think Christianforums is the best place to have an in-depth debate about evolutionary biology instead of actual science sites, I guess that's your opinion.

o_mlly said:
Science, especially retrospective sciences, can never make conclusions, only provisional claims.

Sure.

Christsfreeservant · 2025-10-14T11:01:23-0500

“For through the grace given to me I say to everyone among you not to think more highly of himself than he ought to think; but to think so as to have sound judgment, as God has allotted to each a measure of faith. For just as we have many members in one body and all the members do not have the same function, so we, who are many, are one body in Christ, and individually members one of another. Since we have gifts that differ according to the grace given to us, each of us is to exercise them accordingly: if prophecy, according to the proportion of his faith; if service, in his serving; or he who teaches, in his teaching; or he who exhorts, in his exhortation; he who gives, with liberality; he who leads, with diligence; he who shows mercy, with cheerfulness.” (Romans 12:3-8 NASB1995)

My husband brought up the subject of “church” with me this morning, so we talked together about that and what it means and what church is biblically, and what it is supposed to be like and operate like biblically speaking. For he was looking into that subject for himself. And we also discussed the subject of what church is not, from a biblical perspective. Then later I read the next passage of Scripture in line for my daily reading, and this passage of Scripture is one very good biblical example which answers those questions.

First of all the church is not what so many have turned it into being. It is not a building which is called “church.” It is not a physical place you go to once or twice a week and then you leave and go someplace else. It is not a church denomination ruled by denominational heads. It is not a business incorporated (merged, joined, united) with the government and the world, being marketed to the people of the world, following worldly means and methods of what to do to draw in large crowds of people from the world.

[Matthew 21:12-13; John 2:13-17; Acts 5:27-32; 1 Corinthians 1:10-13; 1 Corinthians 3:1-9; 2 Corinthians 6:14-18; Philippians 3:18-19; Revelation 2:1-29; Revelation 3:1-22; Revelation 13:5-8; Revelation 18:1-5]

The church is the body of Christ, the universal body of believers in Jesus Christ who by faith in Jesus Christ have died with Christ to sin and who are now to be living to please God in walks of surrender to God in obedience to his commands. Collectively we are the church. And we are to gather together for the teaching of the Word (not just one teacher), for prayer, for biblical Christian fellowship, for the breaking of bread, and in order that we might encourage and exhort one another to walk worthy of God.

[Matthew 5:13-16; Matthew 28:18-20; John 4:31-38; John 13:13-17; John 14:12; Acts 1:8; Acts 2:14-18,42-47; Acts 26:18; Romans 10:14-15; Romans 12:1-8; 1 Corinthians 12:1-31; 1 Corinthians 14:1-5; Galatians 6:1; Ephesians 2:8-10; Ephesians 4:1-16; Ephesians 5:11-21; Ephesians 6:10-20; Philippians 2:1-8; Colossians 3:12-16; Titus 2:11-14; Hebrews 3:13; Hebrews 10:23-25; James 5:19-20; 1 Peter 2:9,21; 1 John 2:6]

And all of us within the body of Christ have been given gifts of the Spirit which we are to actively be putting into use for the building up of the body of Christ to maturity in our walks of faith in obedience to our Lord. And we have all been given spiritual ministries (our body parts) within the body of Christ, the church, which we are to be doing for the strengthening and encouraging of one another, within the body of Christ, in our walks of faith, in obedience to our Lord in holy living and in the forsaking of all sins.

The purpose of our gatherings is not to be lopsided, where only a few get to do the ministering while the majority sit as spectators who get to sing along with songs picked out by only one person, and who get to listen to sermons usually taught by only one person (their sermons not usually tested by anyone). There is not to be no room for the rest of us to utilize the Spiritual gifts we have been given in the body parts which God assigned us for the mutual encouragement of one another in our walks of faith. We all matter!

And this passage of Scripture does not list all the gifts of the Spirit or how they are to be used. So also read 1 Corinthians 12:1-31 and Ephesians 4:1-16 and the other Scriptures posted above to get most of the full picture.

The point is that the church is not what is commonly being called “church,” but it is the collective body of believers in Jesus Christ throughout the entire world. And it is important that we gather together in the sharing of our gifts and ministries, assigned to us by God, for the mutual encouragement of one another in our walks of faith in the Lord Jesus. But we can have as few as two of us or more in a gathering, and we are supposed to gather daily, and location can be anywhere appropriate, including on the internet, like now.

Zeal for Your House

Based off Jn. 2:17; Ps. 69:9
An Original Work / August 1, 2016
Christ’s Free Servant, Sue J Love

Zeal for Your house, it consumes me.
Lord, I love my times with You.
I love to worship You and sing Your praises.
Time in Your Word brings me closer to You,
List’ning to You speaking to me,
Gently guiding me in truth.

Lord, You are my life’s example,
Showing me how I should live.
I love to walk with You where’er You lead me.
No greater joy have I when serving You.
Loving, giving, resting in Your strength,
I’m yielding to Your will.

Zeal for Your house, it consumes me.
See the church turned upside down:
Marketing ventures taking place of worship,
Men of the gospel turning into clowns.
Gospel message made appealing,
So the world will feel at home.

Lord, we need a great revival.
Turn their hearts, Lord, back to You.
Open the blind eyes, turn them all from darkness,
Lord, to the light. May they return to You,
Turn from their sin, forsake idols,
Be restored to God again.

Login to view embedded media
We are One Body in Christ
An Original Work / October 14, 2025
Christ’s Free Servant, Sue J Love

ralliann · 2025-10-14T11:01:17-0500

bèlla said:
Have you ever been a farmhand or did work of that nature? I spent a season on a local production farm to learn how to garden but I wouldn’t want to do it for a living nor are young people required to follow suit. Automation is the future and I posted articles from WSJ acknowledging the same and they’re already doing it. Most farmers don’t want to pay a livable wage. They want the cheapest labor they can get.

~bella

It is a livable wage for guest workers. They go home with good money in their pockets in their home countries.

fhansen · 2025-10-14T11:00:57-0500

Hentenza said:
Do you worship on Saturday? Do you keep the Jewish Sabbath holy?

No, we fulfill the Sabbath requirement, that obligation to God, on the Lord's Day as Christians always have. That's a way in which the Spirit of the law is still fulfilled-and can't be used to, for example, now condone murder since the Law forbids it.

Colo Millz · 2025-10-14T10:57:40-0500

Hentenza said:
Because that is not my argument.

Your argument is as follows:

Jesus "fulfilled the law" (Greek plēroō) so there are no more requirements of any "Jewish law" on us.

Um - what about the ten commandments?

STRAWMAN!

I'm sure you're just going to reply to this with "nope" or something like that.

Colo Millz · 2025-10-14T10:56:56-0500

Jesus "fulfilled the law" (Greek plēroō) so there are no more requirements of any "Jewish law" on us.

Um - what about the ten commandments?

STRAWMAN!

Doesn't sound very logical to me.

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