Does the day of Christ resurrections tell us to change the worship of Sabbath?

[Leaf473]

Good day Leaf473,

You say:

"No, I'm not convinced of that. I agree that there is great wisdom in the law, and that the principles of all of the instructions in it are important."



The fact that you are not convinced, in a sense, makes this endeavor of yours, a case of putting the cart before the horse.

Persons who are sincerely trying to discern the truth, would seek to determine,...

...if the primary arguments are valid or not.

Is one of the primary arguments that there is a difference between the law of God and the law of Moses?

Bible Gateway passage: Luke 2:24 - New American Standard Bible

and to offer a sacrifice according to what has been stated in the Law of the Lord: “A PAIR OF TURTLEDOVES OR TWO YOUNG DOVES.”

www.biblegateway.com

An animal sacrifice is called the law of the Lord. (I assume that the law of the Lord is the same as the law of God.)

So it's not true that we keep all of the law of God.

We do keep all of the law of God as it relates to us today. That's where I think discussing particular laws is helpful

If they are, clearly supporting the position that, the ten commandments are still to be observed by the Church, then the next step would be to determine which of the associated laws are also applicable.

If the primary arguments, do not support the continued observance of the ten, then any attempt, to determine whether or not, other laws are also to be observed, would be a waste of time and effort.

It would seem then, that your aim is not to discern truth, but to convince others of the validity of your position. This is what you refer to as, "unclouding", the issue by asking these questions. You think, "trip them up with these, and cause them to abandon their folly, and also prevent others from joining the same".

Only the weak would fall for this tactic. If you are not able to address adequately, the primary arguments, then it is a clear sign that your position is on shaky grounds. I suspect you are also among those who have failed to heed the warning Peter gave about Paul's writings.(II Peter 3:16)

I have addressed questions, you have asked in another thread, and am still willing to do so here, even though your approach is somewhat like that of the Pharisees, in Jesus' time. They only sought, to trap Him with their questions, not to get to the truth. Note however, I am not Jesus, and so I may not have an immediate answer, to every situation.

However, since I am assured, of the validity of my primary arguments, I am assured that an answer will come even as the Lord promised:

"If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him."(James 1:5)

You also distort and downplay, the example in scripture, which shows how issues like this, can be addressed. You say Timothy should:

"But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain."



Now if these were referring to the issues we are discussing and situations like that in Acts 15, then you may be in breach by joining this discussion. Even the one in Acts 15 should not have taken place according to your reasoning.
Note that the passage says nothing about, length, just dispute, and so whether you like it or not, based on your application of the passage, this is a dispute.

However, as far as I am concerned, the Acts 15, incident, was not of the type being described by Paul in Titus 3, and neither is the contentious discussions, about the continued validity, of the ten commandments and its associated laws, which go on here. Jude had urged that, we earnestly contend for the faith.

You should research more, about the contentions, between, the Hillell and the Shammai, schools of the Rabbins, and the petty questions they were asked at times.

With all this in mind, you may want to reconsider your approach.

It is not good, that one should have the view, that if a law or command from God, seems difficult or impossible, to observe, then this means it is no longer applicable. We should seek to establish the validity of the command, first, and then seek God's help, in observing the same.

Whatever your decision, you should also consider the following, which you seemed to have missed, or ignored in the questions I asked.

Paul told Timothy the following:

"And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus."(II Timothy 3:15)

The scriptures which Timothy knew from a child were the Law and Prophets.

Read how Paul further instructed him:

"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works."(II Timothy 3:16,17)

So the law and the prophets would make him wise unto salvation and are to be used for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness and would make him perfect and furnished for every good work.

However you say otherwise. You claim:

"...there is great wisdom in the law, and that the principles of all of the instructions in it are important."

Whom do you expect me to believe? You or Paul?

Now, situations may arise, like the one in Acts. Timothy and all sincere brethren, would most likely seek counsel from the elders, or apostles, and have the issues resolved. (The book to the Hebrews was written to address many of these issues about the relevance of the law.)

And this is how it can be done today, but of course for such deliberations to be profitable, then the primary arguments would have to be settled prior to this.

You and I, are not settled on this, and so I know this dispute/discussion will not be profitable.

Your take on the events of Acts 15, was a bit misleading. Below is another way of looking at the issues being resolved there. For certain the final decision was not just about giving christians:

"...instructions to help them get along with the Jewish Christians and any gentiles who are still offended by idols."

I am sorry for the lengthy response, but thought it would be best, you understand where I am coming from, so you don't waste your time.







The Truth About Acts Chapter 15



Many persons as they interpret the events of Acts chapter 15, arrive at a conclusion which the passage and good sense do not support. They say;

"If Sabbath observance was a requirement of the Church, it would have been included among those necessary things,..." .

Are we to believe there is no other command of the Law which applies to the Church? Was this a comprehensive list given by James as to the way of life of a Christian or did he only mention some of what is required; or what should not be done? If that which James mentioned
(Acts 15:20-21,29) is all that Gentile Christians should not do then Christianity today is filled with many unnecessary things.


These persons like many others have misunderstood this passage and have imposed on it things which it does not say. This passage rather than making the Gentile more different from the Jew, draws him closer to the Jewish way of life.


Some claim, "...Gentile converts...were ignorant of Jewish Laws" and that "Sabbath keeping:...was unfamiliar to the Gentiles."


The scriptures do not support this.


Gentiles were among those who were in the synagogues on the Sabbath. (See Acts 13:42-48; 14:1;17:1-4; 18:1-4).


In Acts 15 also, James states that; "For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath." (Acts 15:21).


Jewish historian Josephus supports this, "...the multitude of mankind itself have had a great inclination for along time to follow our religious observances; for there is not any city of the Grecians, nor any of the Barbarians, nor any nation whatsoever, whither our custom of resting on the seventh day hath not come... as God pervades all the world, so hath our law passed through all the world also." (Against Apion, 2, 40).


Circumcision - The Point of Contention


The main dispute in Acts 15 was the vexed question of circumcision. Certain disciples were of the view that to be saved, Gentiles had to be circumcised and keep the Law of Moses i.e. they had to keep all the commands in the Law, both those of the sacrificial and of the Ten Commandment system. Note that an uncircumcised person could not take part in the Passover in the Old Covenant (Exodus 12:45-48).


It was being explained by Peter that both Jews and Gentiles will be saved through grace i.e. God's love in allowing His Son to die for us, rather than by sacrifices. (See Acts 15:7-11; Ephesians 2:8-13; Hebrews 9:11-14). Notice that the things mentioned are closely linked to either the sacrificial systems of the Jews or that of the Gentiles and to make it clear what is expected of the new converts then these things were mentioned.


(1) Gentiles had a practice of partaking in food offered to idols (I Corinthians 10:19-21).

(2) Fornication was a part of the rituals performed by Gentiles in service to their gods. (Numbers 25:1-3; I Corinthians 10:8; Deuteronomy 23:17-18; I Kings 14:24)

The Lion Handbook, "The World's Religion" had this comment on Canaanite religion; "According to Hebrew and Greek writings, popular worship included ritual prostitution and other excesses." [Page 66].

(3) Blood was used for atonement in the Old Covenant and was not to be consumed. Animals were to be properly killed to remove the blood. The heathen also drank blood in worship of their gods. A practice which Israel adopted (Psalm 16:4; Ezekiel 33:25; Leviticus 17:11-14).

Strangled animals i.e. animals which die of itself were given to the stranger or alien in the Old Covenant but now James is saying the Gentile should not partake of such an animal i.e. he should be like the Jew. (See Deuteronomy 14:21; Acts 15:29).


The Gentiles coming into the Church should not adopt the sacrifice of circumcision nor should they Continue in their own sacrificial practices of fornication, offering and eating food offered to idols and drinking of blood. The fact that James referred all to Moses, being read in the synagogues on the Sabbath in every city, shows he was not rejecting the whole of the Law, as all things, the Gentiles should abstain from, are proscribed by the Law. (See Acts 15:20-21).


Do Christians Abstain From Things Strangled And Blood

"And whatsoever man there be of the children of Israel or of the strangers that sojourn among you, which hunteth and catcheth any beast or fowl that may be eaten; he shall even pour out the blood thereof and cover it with dust...ye shall eat the blood of no manner of flesh:..." (Leviticus 17:13-14).


It is this command that James is repeating in Acts 15. How many Christians today actually obey this command?


To this writer's knowledge, only Jewish and Moslem butchers take special care to see that animals are butchered in a manner to cause the blood to be drained properly. Other butchers use methods which technically result in the blood remaining in the animal and hence most Christians end up eating the blood in the flesh.


Rather than giving permission to abandon the Sabbath, the conference in Acts 15 has placed more responsibilities on Gentile Christians.These persons attitude is common, as many have not realized what is expected of them. The practice of blood transfusion may also be affected by this command. I urge all to repent of disobeying the commands in Acts 15:20, 29 and of placing the subject of the Sabbath in the passage when it clearly was not a part of the discussion.

 

[Leaf473]

Good day Leaf473,

You say:

"No, I'm not convinced of that. I agree that there is great wisdom in the law, and that the principles of all of the instructions in it are important."



The fact that you are not convinced, in a sense, makes this endeavor of yours, a case of putting the cart before the horse.

Persons who are sincerely trying to discern the truth, would seek to determine, if the primary arguments are valid or not.

If they are, clearly supporting the position that, the ten commandments are still to be observed by the Church, then the next step would be to determine which of the associated laws are also applicable.

Is there a passage of scripture that talks about the idea of:

When dealing with the law, first consider the Ten Commandments in isolation. Then move on to the other laws.

I'm not aware of a passage that says that. Is there one?

If the primary arguments, do not support the continued observance of the ten, then any attempt, to determine whether or not, other laws are also to be observed, would be a waste of time and effort.

It would seem then, that your aim is not to discern truth, but to convince others of the validity of your position. This is what you refer to as, "unclouding", the issue by asking these questions. You think, "trip them up with these, and cause them to abandon their folly, and also prevent others from joining the same".

Only the weak would fall for this tactic. If you are not able to address adequately, the primary arguments, then it is a clear sign that your position is on shaky grounds. I suspect you are also among those who have failed to heed the warning Peter gave about Paul's writings.(II Peter 3:16)

I have addressed questions, you have asked in another thread, and am still willing to do so here, even though your approach is somewhat like that of the Pharisees, in Jesus' time. They only sought, to trap Him with their questions, not to get to the truth. Note however, I am not Jesus, and so I may not have an immediate answer, to every situation.

However, since I am assured, of the validity of my primary arguments, I am assured that an answer will come even as the Lord promised:

"If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him."(James 1:5)

You also distort and downplay, the example in scripture, which shows how issues like this, can be addressed. You say Timothy should:

"But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain."



Now if these were referring to the issues we are discussing and situations like that in Acts 15, then you may be in breach by joining this discussion. Even the one in Acts 15 should not have taken place according to your reasoning.
Note that the passage says nothing about, length, just dispute, and so whether you like it or not, based on your application of the passage, this is a dispute.

However, as far as I am concerned, the Acts 15, incident, was not of the type being described by Paul in Titus 3, and neither is the contentious discussions, about the continued validity, of the ten commandments and its associated laws, which go on here. Jude had urged that, we earnestly contend for the faith.

You should research more, about the contentions, between, the Hillell and the Shammai, schools of the Rabbins, and the petty questions they were asked at times.

With all this in mind, you may want to reconsider your approach.

It is not good, that one should have the view, that if a law or command from God, seems difficult or impossible, to observe, then this means it is no longer applicable. We should seek to establish the validity of the command, first, and then seek God's help, in observing the same.

Whatever your decision, you should also consider the following, which you seemed to have missed, or ignored in the questions I asked.

Paul told Timothy the following:

"And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus."(II Timothy 3:15)

The scriptures which Timothy knew from a child were the Law and Prophets.

Read how Paul further instructed him:

"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works."(II Timothy 3:16,17)

So the law and the prophets would make him wise unto salvation and are to be used for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness and would make him perfect and furnished for every good work.

However you say otherwise. You claim:

"...there is great wisdom in the law, and that the principles of all of the instructions in it are important."

Whom do you expect me to believe? You or Paul?

Now, situations may arise, like the one in Acts. Timothy and all sincere brethren, would most likely seek counsel from the elders, or apostles, and have the issues resolved. (The book to the Hebrews was written to address many of these issues about the relevance of the law.)

And this is how it can be done today, but of course for such deliberations to be profitable, then the primary arguments would have to be settled prior to this.

You and I, are not settled on this, and so I know this dispute/discussion will not be profitable.

Your take on the events of Acts 15, was a bit misleading. Below is another way of looking at the issues being resolved there. For certain the final decision was not just about giving christians:

"...instructions to help them get along with the Jewish Christians and any gentiles who are still offended by idols."

I am sorry for the lengthy response, but thought it would be best, you understand where I am coming from, so you don't waste your time.







The Truth About Acts Chapter 15



Many persons as they interpret the events of Acts chapter 15, arrive at a conclusion which the passage and good sense do not support. They say;

"If Sabbath observance was a requirement of the Church, it would have been included among those necessary things,..." .

Are we to believe there is no other command of the Law which applies to the Church? Was this a comprehensive list given by James as to the way of life of a Christian or did he only mention some of what is required; or what should not be done? If that which James mentioned
(Acts 15:20-21,29) is all that Gentile Christians should not do then Christianity today is filled with many unnecessary things.


These persons like many others have misunderstood this passage and have imposed on it things which it does not say. This passage rather than making the Gentile more different from the Jew, draws him closer to the Jewish way of life.


Some claim, "...Gentile converts...were ignorant of Jewish Laws" and that "Sabbath keeping:...was unfamiliar to the Gentiles."


The scriptures do not support this.


Gentiles were among those who were in the synagogues on the Sabbath. (See Acts 13:42-48; 14:1;17:1-4; 18:1-4).


In Acts 15 also, James states that; "For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath." (Acts 15:21).


Jewish historian Josephus supports this, "...the multitude of mankind itself have had a great inclination for along time to follow our religious observances; for there is not any city of the Grecians, nor any of the Barbarians, nor any nation whatsoever, whither our custom of resting on the seventh day hath not come... as God pervades all the world, so hath our law passed through all the world also." (Against Apion, 2, 40).


Circumcision - The Point of Contention


The main dispute in Acts 15 was the vexed question of circumcision. Certain disciples were of the view that to be saved, Gentiles had to be circumcised and keep the Law of Moses i.e. they had to keep all the commands in the Law, both those of the sacrificial and of the Ten Commandment system. Note that an uncircumcised person could not take part in the Passover in the Old Covenant (Exodus 12:45-48).


It was being explained by Peter that both Jews and Gentiles will be saved through grace i.e. God's love in allowing His Son to die for us, rather than by sacrifices. (See Acts 15:7-11; Ephesians 2:8-13; Hebrews 9:11-14). Notice that the things mentioned are closely linked to either the sacrificial systems of the Jews or that of the Gentiles and to make it clear what is expected of the new converts then these things were mentioned.


(1) Gentiles had a practice of partaking in food offered to idols (I Corinthians 10:19-21).

(2) Fornication was a part of the rituals performed by Gentiles in service to their gods. (Numbers 25:1-3; I Corinthians 10:8; Deuteronomy 23:17-18; I Kings 14:24)

The Lion Handbook, "The World's Religion" had this comment on Canaanite religion; "According to Hebrew and Greek writings, popular worship included ritual prostitution and other excesses." [Page 66].

(3) Blood was used for atonement in the Old Covenant and was not to be consumed. Animals were to be properly killed to remove the blood. The heathen also drank blood in worship of their gods. A practice which Israel adopted (Psalm 16:4; Ezekiel 33:25; Leviticus 17:11-14).

Strangled animals i.e. animals which die of itself were given to the stranger or alien in the Old Covenant but now James is saying the Gentile should not partake of such an animal i.e. he should be like the Jew. (See Deuteronomy 14:21; Acts 15:29).


The Gentiles coming into the Church should not adopt the sacrifice of circumcision nor should they Continue in their own sacrificial practices of fornication, offering and eating food offered to idols and drinking of blood. The fact that James referred all to Moses, being read in the synagogues on the Sabbath in every city, shows he was not rejecting the whole of the Law, as all things, the Gentiles should abstain from, are proscribed by the Law. (See Acts 15:20-21).


Do Christians Abstain From Things Strangled And Blood

"And whatsoever man there be of the children of Israel or of the strangers that sojourn among you, which hunteth and catcheth any beast or fowl that may be eaten; he shall even pour out the blood thereof and cover it with dust...ye shall eat the blood of no manner of flesh:..." (Leviticus 17:13-14).


It is this command that James is repeating in Acts 15. How many Christians today actually obey this command?


To this writer's knowledge, only Jewish and Moslem butchers take special care to see that animals are butchered in a manner to cause the blood to be drained properly. Other butchers use methods which technically result in the blood remaining in the animal and hence most Christians end up eating the blood in the flesh.


Rather than giving permission to abandon the Sabbath, the conference in Acts 15 has placed more responsibilities on Gentile Christians.These persons attitude is common, as many have not realized what is expected of them. The practice of blood transfusion may also be affected by this command. I urge all to repent of disobeying the commands in Acts 15:20, 29 and of placing the subject of the Sabbath in the passage when it clearly was not a part of the discussion.

 

[daq]

Is one of the primary arguments that there is a difference between the law of God and the law of Moses?

Bible Gateway passage: Luke 2:24 - New American Standard Bible

and to offer a sacrifice according to what has been stated in the Law of the Lord: “A PAIR OF TURTLEDOVES OR TWO YOUNG DOVES.”

www.biblegateway.com

An animal sacrifice is called the law of the Lord. (I assume that the law of the Lord is the same as the law of God.)

So it's not true that we keep all of the law of God.

We do keep all of the law of God as it relates to us today. That's where I think discussing particular laws is helpful

Good luck with that, if you were to believe all of the theories, (and there are probably more), there is a "law of Moses", a "law of God", a "law of Christ", a "ceremonial law", and a "moral law", and even a "kingdom of heaven" which according to some is supposedly not the same as "the kingdom of God".

 

[Clare73]

And if we believe both Testaments?

The OT is understood in the light of the NT.

That's why there are no more bloody religious sacrifices in the NT.

 

[Clare73]

Good day,

You do realize you cannot love nor fulfill the law unless you actually do the things which both love and the law demands. John gave the example:

Love is the commitment to provide the necessities for well being to those who are unable to do it for themselves just as one provides them for oneself.

There is no scripture which says Jesus is our Sabbath rest. This is an invention of men.

And the Trinity?

You do not understand Heb 3:7-4:11.

 

[Gary K]

The OT is understood in the light of the NT.

That's why there are no more bloody religious sacrifices in the NT.

You have that just backwards. That which precedes explains that which is newer. In any book you read if you skip the first 2/3s of the book you're lost as for an explanation of what is going on where you started. It doesn't matter what kind of book it is a novel, a textbook, or the Bible which God has so lovingly given us.

Without the first 2/3s of the Bible you would be an evolutionist. you would have no idea as to the divinity of Jesus or the prophecies that do so much to confirm the authenticity of the NT.

You would have no idea why Peter said we have a more sure word of prophecy. The Psalms wouldn't exist. You'd have no idea why the Jesus is called the son of David or who David is.

 

[Gary K]

Love is the commitment to provide the necessities for well being to those who are unable to do it for themselves just as one provides them for oneself.

And the Trinity?

You do not understand Heb 3:7-4:11.

And just what does the Trinity have to do with safwan's comment?

And you think it is love for God to ignore the one commandment Jesus told us to remember?

 

[reddogs]

Good luck with that, if you were to believe all of the theories, (and there are probably more), there is a "law of Moses", a "law of God", a "law of Christ", a "ceremonial law", and a "moral law", and even a "kingdom of heaven" which according to some is supposedly not the same as "the kingdom of God".

I think everyone is clear on Gods Ten Commandments....

 

[Leaf473]

I think everyone is clear on Gods Ten Commandments....

I think most everyone is clear on what the Ten Commandments are. How we apply them today, that's where people see it differently, imo.

 

[Gary K]

I think most everyone is clear on what the Ten Commandments are. How we apply them today, that's where people see it differently, imo.

Tell me, what will you do on judgement day and find out you've been wrong all this time?

 

[Leaf473]

Tell me, what will you do on judgement day and find out you've been wrong all this time?

I will do the same thing everyone who doesn't have perfect knowledge will do.

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 13:12 - New American Standard Bible

For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully, just as I also have been fully known.

www.biblegateway.com

Check out that footnote, if you wish. The word they translated "dimly" is literally "in a riddle".

I am thankful that we are declared righteous based on what we believe, not on having all wisdom

Bible Gateway passage: Romans 4:23-24 - New American Standard Bible

Now not for his sake only was it written that it was credited to him, but for our sake also, to whom it will be credited, to us who believe in Him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead,

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

I will do the same thing everyone who doesn't have perfect knowledge will do.

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 13:12 - New American Standard Bible

For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully, just as I also have been fully known.

www.biblegateway.com

Check out that footnote, if you wish. The word they translated "dimly" is literally "in a riddle".

I am thankful that we are declared righteous based on what we believe, not on having all wisdom

Bible Gateway passage: Romans 4:23-24 - New American Standard Bible

Now not for his sake only was it written that it was credited to him, but for our sake also, to whom it will be credited, to us who believe in Him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead,

www.biblegateway.com

Sorry, but it will be too late for that.

Revelation 22: 10 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand.
11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

This why I have put forth so much time and effort to reach you.

Just as before the flood the people had a time of probation to believe Noah and repent but when the door to the ark was shut it was to late to change.

 

[Leaf473]

Sorry, but it will be too late for that.

Revelation 22: 10 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand.
11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still:

and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still:

Amen to the scriptures, and I am thankful that I am declared righteous now

Bible Gateway passage: Romans 4:9-10 - New American Standard Bible

Is this blessing then on the circumcised, or on the uncircumcised also? For we say, “FAITH WAS CREDITED TO ABRAHAM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS.” How then was it credited? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised;

www.biblegateway.com

...and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

This why I have put forth so much time and effort to reach you.

I appreciate your time and effort

One thing you could do, if you wish, is follow up on this discussion

Do you remember our previous conversation about Leviticus 15:12? I believe I can find it again, if you wish.

I'm still not clear if you believe that is a law that we need to follow literally or not.

Bible Gateway passage: Leviticus 15:12 - New American Standard Bible

However, an earthenware vessel which the man with the discharge touches shall be broken, and every wooden vessel shall be rinsed in water.

www.biblegateway.com

###############

Just as before the flood the people had a time of probation to believe Noah and repent but when the door to the ark was shut it was to late to change.

Amen, that's why I have believed and repented.

Bible Gateway passage: Ephesians 5:8 - New American Standard Bible

for you were once darkness, but now you are light in the Lord; walk as children of light

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

Amen to the scriptures, and I am thankful that I am declared righteous now

Bible Gateway passage: Romans 4:9-10 - New American Standard Bible

Is this blessing then on the circumcised, or on the uncircumcised also? For we say, “FAITH WAS CREDITED TO ABRAHAM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS.” How then was it credited? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised;

www.biblegateway.com

I appreciate your time and effort

One thing you could do, if you wish, is follow up on this discussion

I'm still not clear if you believe that is a law that we need to follow literally or not.

Bible Gateway passage: Leviticus 15:12 - New American Standard Bible

However, an earthenware vessel which the man with the discharge touches shall be broken, and every wooden vessel shall be rinsed in water.

www.biblegateway.com

###############

Amen, that's why I have believed and repented.

Bible Gateway passage: Ephesians 5:8 - New American Standard Bible

for you were once darkness, but now you are light in the Lord; walk as children of light

www.biblegateway.com

Sorry. I'm not going down any more rabbit trails with you;

So you now are now keeping the seventh day Sabbath? Repentance and reformation go hand in hand.

Proverbs 28: 13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.

 

[Leaf473]

Sorry. I'm not going down any more rabbit trails with you;

All scripture is profitable.

If a person wants to teach me about the law, I'm willing to listen. But I will ask questions to see if what they present deals with the whole law.

So you now are now keeping the seventh day Sabbath?

Definitely, according to my understanding of it. If a person has a different understanding of the Sabbath and the law, then we have something to discuss

Repentance and reformation go hand in hand.

Amen!

Proverbs 28: 13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.

Amen again!

Bible Gateway passage: Mark 10:47 - New American Standard Bible

And when he heard that it was Jesus the Nazarene, he began to cry out and say, “Jesus, Son of David, have mercy on me!”

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

All scripture is profitable.

If a person wants to teach me about the law, I'm willing to listen. But I will ask questions to see if what they present deals with the whole law.


Definitely, according to my understanding of it. If a person has a different understanding of the Sabbath and the law, then we have something to discuss


Amen!


Amen again!

Bible Gateway passage: Mark 10:47 - New American Standard Bible

And when he heard that it was Jesus the Nazarene, he began to cry out and say, “Jesus, Son of David, have mercy on me!”

www.biblegateway.com

So you are now keeping the seventh day Sabbath?

 

[Leaf473]

So you are now keeping the seventh day Sabbath?

I'm keeping all of the commandments of God according to my understanding of them

Bible Gateway passage: Deuteronomy 6:17 - New International Reader's Version

Be sure to obey the LORD’s commands. Obey the terms and rules he has given you.

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

I'm keeping all of the commandments of God according to my understanding of them

Bible Gateway passage: Deuteronomy 6:17 - New International Reader's Version

Be sure to obey the LORD’s commands. Obey the terms and rules he has given you.

www.biblegateway.com

So you are still disobeying the fourth commandment.

Proverbs 14: 12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

If you remain in violation of the 10 commandments there will be no second chance as I showed from Revelation. God's mercy has limits as the flood demonstrated. Today our world is no different than in the days of Noah as the thoughts of men's hearts are only evil continually. This means Jesus is coming again soon.

 

[Leaf473]

So you are still disobeying the fourth commandment.

Well, I'm disobeying your interpretation of the scriptures, yes

Proverbs 14: 12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

If you remain in violation of the 10 commandments there will be no second chance as I showed from Revelation. God's mercy has limits as the flood demonstrated. Today our world is no different than in the days of Noah as the thoughts of men's hearts are only evil continually. This means Jesus is coming again soon.

 

[Gary K]

Well, I'm disobeying your interpretation of the scriptures, yes

And if you come up to judgment day and find out you're wrong?

You've said you don't think God views me as disobedient or self righteously trying to earn my salvation so where does that place you?