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  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Christian music star is doing something no one else has done


Brandon Lake may just be the most popular concert artist in Christian music history.

Yet, he made it clear — right from the start of his sold-out concert at the SAP Center in San Jose — that he was far from being the true star of the show on Sunday night.

“Tonight is not about me,” said the singer-songwriter, who is a worship pastor at Seacoast Church in South Carolina. “But it is about one man — and His name is Jesus.”

Lake proceeded to turn the Shark Tank into a massive revival tent, leading a crowd that he announced on stage as 15,000 attendees through a 2½-hour-plus set of some of the most powerful contemporary Christian music (CCM) songs of recent years.

That all of this was happening in the heart of Silicon Valley/Bay Area — widely known as one of the least religious and most “unchurched” areas in the country — only made this accomplishment more impressive, greatly underscoring the historic nature of Lake’s trajectory as an artist.

Simply put, this 35-year-old talent is drawing attendance numbers at the box office that are simply astounding — arguably beyond anything ever seen in the CCM genre before.

Trump's history of acts of kindness and generosity

but in general he would have to be a nice guy to his household/personal staff because if he was not there would be a conga line of staff listing their woes.
Not necessarily - excessive wealth and a habit of suing first and asking questions later likely do a lot to keep people's lips sealed. As would gratuitous use of NDAs. It's not like a housekeeper would be able to afford to defend herself from a defamation suit filed by Trump, spurious or not.
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Six Democrats urge military members to 'refuse illegal orders' in viral video; Hegseth responds

If a person can't read, they don't need to be in the military.
If anyone could interpret the Constitution just by reading it, there would be no need for the Supreme Court

Hey, did you know that civilians didn't have the right to remain silent (5th Amendment) until 1966?

Military had it from the moment the document was ratified, but civilians didn't have it until 1966.

That's because nobody had interpreted the 5th Amendment as including civilians until 1966.

Admiral Holsey sure knew it was illegal.
He knew he personally didn't like it, and had the option to retire.
  • Agree
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Church is boring

There is no participation and no questioning allowed.

I have found this to be true in some kinds of churches, but there are others in which the congregation participates more actively in the worship.

@Lybrah , you've said that you don't like to sing or stand up, so I don't know how this is for you. Do you prefer a style of worship where you mostly sit and listen, or do you prefer a style of worship where you get to participate actively? If the latter, I can recommend some kinds of churches you may want to visit.
  • Agree
Reactions: timothyu
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House Democrat exchanged texts with Epstein during 2019 congressional hearing

From the link:

In one exchange, Epstein texted Plaskett: “Cohen brought up RONA - keeper of the secrets,” referring to — and misspelling the first name of — Rhona Graff, a longtime Trump assistant.​
Plaskett responded: “RONA??” She added at 2:25 p.m, “Quick I’m up next is that an acronym,” suggesting that she would be questioning Cohen soon.​
Epstein responded: “Thats his assistant.”​
At 2:28 p.m., Plaskett began questioning Cohen and asked about Graff, along with other Trump associates he had mentioned, according to the Post.​
And...?

At worst, I could fault her for not checking the info that she got from a known criminal, but that's a pretty minor quibble, all things considered.
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Are the Jews Israel, or is the church Israel? Or does it depend on the context of the passage?

1. The Bible says we (the redeemed of all nations and ethnic groups) have been grafted into 'an Israeli tree' (Romans 9-11). Is that an ethnic or spiritual tree?
The term "Israeli tree" does not appear in the bible.

2. The Bible says we who were once aliens from the "citizenship of Israel" have now been brought in through the blood of Christ to that privileged place (Ephesians 2). Is that ethnic or spiritual Israel?
The bible does not say that Gentiles have been brought into being citizens of Israel. Gentiles and Jews by virtue of believing in Jesus has been brought into being citizens of the Kingdom of God.

The Kingdom of God is spiritual. Differently, the Kingdom of Israel is an earthly nation chosen by God to a part of his plan.

Jesus said in John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

So why do you want to be part of the nation of Israel, and not a citizen of the Kingdom of God, Jesus's kingdom ?
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Church is boring

I haven’t been going to church in a while. I feel like it’s boring. I find myself daydreaming and the sermons are good, but I really don’t like to sing or stand up. I like just saying prayers and even though the sermons are good, I don’t feel like going. I’m not really getting anything out of the Bible study, either, which is online. When I do go to church, I do tithe.
Am I falling away or is this not the right church for me? The people are nice.
How about finding a story changer, and not a story teller? I suggest you expand your horizons, ask God for ministers that can touch your heart and move you to want to worship, fellowship and hear from God. Here is one such preacher that I found. Login to view embedded media Eastwood Anabe, from Ghana.
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Campus Prayer at Univ. of South Florida interrupted by harassers; felony hate crime charges filed against two men

I still oppose the idea of hate crime laws being leveraged to insulate "circumstances of choice" from criticism and/or mockery.

That aside...

If this was a group of people doing this at some Christian gathering (no matter how hostile the rhetoric), would it be getting escalated to the level of "felony hate crime"?

I've seen videos of some Christian content creators going to areas near college campuses to do demonstration and getting literally physically assaulted, and all that ever comes of it is misdemeanor charges, or the police just break it up and send both parties their separate ways.


I would perhaps be more receptive to the concept of religious affiliation being included under the "hate crime provisions" umbrella if we didn't have a large subset of the country that evaluates everything through a "punching up vs. punching down" lens.
This is the start of Islam getting privileged protected status, just like how the threats of violence led to cartoons censoring themselves and capitulating to the Muslim image ban. Next step, Islamic blasphemy laws masquerading as "hate crime" laws.
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Pray that Canadian & Indian trade negotiations r guided by The Holy Spirit so that there r talks that will allow for more Christian missionaries visas

Pray that Canadian & Indian trade negotiations r guided by The Holy Spirit so that there r talks that will allow for more Christian missionaries visas:

I would pray too that India quits persecuting Christians. Hindu Extremists Threaten Genocide Against Christians
I pray too that Canada is careful in normalizing their trade with India until religious freedom and other human rights is obtained.
  • Prayers
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MARK OF THE BEAST - REVELATION 13-14; 17; 18

The Lord sent His Holy Spirit to guide us into all the truth of the Lord`s character and His purposes. (John 16: 12)

Character.

Thus we read of the Lord in the midst of the churches as the Head of His Body, the one who is the First and Last, risen from the dead, He who is the word of God, (sharp two-edged sword) the very Son of God, who has the Holy Spirit (7 fold Spirit) who is holy and true the Amen and faithful and true witness. Quite a description there.


Then we move on to seeing the Lord on His own throne the Father set up, (Ps. 2: 6 Rev. 4: 2) with His body, (Rev. 4: 4) and the Lord worshipped by angels and the Body of Christ.


Purposes.

It is a throne of judgment with `lightnings, thundering and voices..` (Rev. 4: 5) Then the Father gives His Son the scroll with what will be judged by the Son. (John5: 27) From then on we read of the judgments .................till all things new.

So I don`t read as in `toughen up princess.`
You're smothering the question with other theology. Good points - as far as I can tell.

But not answering the main question I ask futurists.

Are you a futurist still? Maybe I'm speaking at cross purposes.

How has the majority of this book been relevant to the church if it's mainly about the last generation that will ever live?

John's friends in Asia Minor were being fed to lions, and futurists would pretend he says "You think that's bad - wait till you see what's coming in 2000 years!"
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Young Girls Were Sexually Abused by a Church Member (Old Apostolic Lutheran Church, MN). They Were Told to Forgive and Forget.

The girl pleaded not to go.

She fought with her father on the drive over, screaming and crying in his truck until they arrived at the office building for Bruckelmyer Brothers, a home construction company on the outskirts of Duluth, Minnesota. She was just entering her first years of grade school.

In the office, two men were waiting. One of them was Clint Massie, who the girl had recently told her parents had touched her genitals and groped her under her shirt. The other was Daryl Bruckelmyer, a preacher and leader of the Old Apostolic Lutheran Church down the road, where the girl’s family worshipped. Massie was a respected member of the congregation. Bruckelmyer had asked them all to the meeting, according to the girl’s account to police years later.

In front of the girl, her father and Bruckelmyer, Massie asked her for forgiveness. Looming over her, the three men wept. Then the girl’s dad and preacher allowed the man who had been sexually abusing her since kindergarten to hug her.

“It was one of the worst things ever,” she told police some 15 years later.

Over the course of about 20 years in two states, Massie had, according to court documents and by his own admission, sexually abused children within the Old Apostolic Lutheran Church, or OALC, community. He touched girls under blankets when their parents were present, in the backseat of a car with other passengers — even in the pews at church. His abuse was such an open secret among the tight-knit congregation that mothers warned their daughters to stay away from him.

[Church leaders knew] But they never reported Massie’s crimes to police, as required by the law. Instead, Bruckelmyer and other leaders in the church encouraged the victims to take part in forgiveness sessions — which allowed Massie, now 50, to continue abusing children, according to an investigation by the Minnesota Star Tribune and ProPublica.

...

The investigator now had two victims. They gave him the names of others they suspected had also been abused by Massie. Kleffman tried to contact them, but some were reluctant to cooperate. One woman told Kleffman that Massie had asked for forgiveness. The sin, she said in the recorded call, was “washed away in the blood of reconciliation.”

“It is gone forever,” she told Kleffman.

“So you’re following what the church says to do,” Kleffman replied.

“I am following what God says to do,” the woman told him, before hanging up.

Chicago kicks off the Christmas season with 7 teenagers shot, cops injured, one man dead

This is partly due to social media which allows anyone to gather influence over large groups and spread their message. This has been cultivated for years now. The idea that minorities can rise up and disrupt entire cities.

But also I think how there is a loss of respect for authority which has been cultivated into recent generations. It began with making young people adults before their time. Giving them rights over their own parents. Promoting defiance of authority in the name of individual rights.

The idea being promoted that you have to stand out and make a noise to be noticed. That disruption gets you attention. That this is a legitimate form of action.

That doing the wrong thing does not lead to any bad consequences. Even rewarded. Weak on crime, policies that send the message that there is no punishment for wrong doing in the name of some good intentioned protection of the volnurable.

The inevitable breakdown of the family and fatherless children. Especially young males. The promotion of radical ideology in place of long held truths based on biblical principles.

This makes for a perfect storm of societal breakdown.
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Are the Jews Israel, or is the church Israel? Or does it depend on the context of the passage?

Paul was saying that of the Jews - a person who is truly a Jew is one inwardly - by believing in Jesus.

Paul was not saying that a Gentile by virtue of believing in Jesus is a Jew.

The only thing that matters is if a person is a Christian or not. Believers in Jesus are Christians. Just go with that.
Can you answer these simple questions?

1. The Bible says we (the redeemed of all nations and ethnic groups) have been grafted into 'an Israeli tree' (Romans 9-11). Is that an ethnic or spiritual tree?
2. The Bible says we who were once aliens from the "citizenship of Israel" have now been brought in through the blood of Christ to that privileged place (Ephesians 2). Is that ethnic or spiritual Israel?
3. The Bible says that Jew and Gentile alike, have now been graciously merged together into "the Israel of God" (Galatians 6:15-16). Is that ethnic or spiritual Israel?
4. The Bible says we are 'Jews' and we are "the circumcision" today (Romans 2:25-29; Philippians 3:3 and Colossians 2:11). Is that ethnic or spiritual Jews?
5. The Bible says we are "the children of Abraham" (Romans 4:11; 4:13-15; 4:16-18; 9:6-8; Galatians 3:7-9; 3:12-14; 3:16 and 3:26-29) today. Are we the ethnic or spiritual "children of Abraham"?
6. The Bible says we now reside and abide in "Jerusalem" and "Mount Zion" (Matthew 21:42-46; John 3:3; Romans 9:33; 11:26; Ephesians 1:3; Ephesians 2:4-6; Philippians 3:20; Hebrews 12:22 and 1 Peter 2:5-10). Is that natural physical earthly "Jerusalem" and "Mount Zion" or is that spiritual heavenly "Jerusalem" and "Mount Zion"?
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the myth of flat earth debunked again

Let’s talk avoid how Einstein had to rewrite the laws of physics to explain why no motion of the earth was detected.
Galileo did it centuries earlier. We all experience it every day in cars or trains or planes. If you spill your coffee at 500 mph, it falls in your lap, not toward the back of the cabin.
  • Agree
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Happy Thanksgiving Day..or...Happy Turkey Day? which honors God more?




  • HAPPY THANKSGIVING DAY? or HAPPY TURKEY DAY?


    As we approach one of our favorite times to celebrate with family, friends, and in-laws, we think about this special time called "Thanksgiving." Yet we hear of some calling it "Turkey Day". So which is it? "Thanksgiving" or "Turkey Day?" Which is correct? Well, let's think about it for a bit.

    We celebrate Thanksgiving on the 4th Thursday of November, yet this was not the original date. It was set as the 4th Thursday of November by the US Congress in 1941. So, when was the first Thanksgiving celebrated in the Massachusetts Colony in 1621? No one knows for sure. We believe it was between the end of September and mid-November, when the crops were gathered in. It wasn't a one-day festival of celebration, but rather a three-day celebration.

    It was similar to the Biblical Feast of Tabernacles or Sukkot, which is celebrated between the end of September and mid-October. During this time Israel praised God for the crops and blessings bestowed upon them by God. The Feast of Tabernacles or Sukkot is celebrated every year for 7 days, and one extra day.

    So, let's talk about the food at the first Thanksgiving late in the year of 1621. We know that the native Americans of the Wampanoag tribe were a God sent, Squanto being the mediator. After a disastrous 1620, the Wampanoags helped them farm and grow vegetables, so, besides wild turkeys, they also had venison, or "deer meat" hunted by the Indians, so, why not call it "Deer Day?" or "Pumpkin Day?" after all, they probably had those too. The menu probably consisted of: "wild turkey, deer meat, corn, squash, bay oysters, clams, and fish. But everyone seems to be focused on the Turkeys. What's with that, you turkey?

    It's great to feast on oven-roasted turkeys, stuffing, and all the trimmings, and have the friends and family over, and eat pumpkin pie, pecan pie, apple pie, or whatever pie you like. (Here in El Salvador, those are nonexistent) You have to make them from scratch. Everyone sits down after dinner, watches football on the tube, and grandpa goes to sleep in the easy chair, and the football game watches grandpa instead.

    It's great to have this good time, but let's give thanks to whom thanks is owed, not to the creation (the turkey) but to the creator (God).
    Yes, he created the turkeys and the rest of the birds on day 5 of creation, yet HE is the creator and to HIM must we give thanks.

    When Thanksgiving comes around this Thursday, a good idea might be a table discussion of why we are thankful; the football game can wait. I would probably be like grandpa, asleep in the chair while the football game is going on. Sports are boring to me, unless I can actually play in the game personally.

    Well, let's see. What do we have to be thankful for? Well, we have food on the table and we have our health to eat the food. We have money to buy the food, and we must have jobs to make the money to buy the food. We thank God that we have families, which makes working and providing for them all worthwhile. We have clothing because I doubt we sit around the dinner table in our birthday suits. We have homes where we live, and even AC in some places (not here, only at the Malls, in the banks, and in the supermarkets). We have fresh air to breathe (I guess that depends on where you live), we have parks, and places for R & R (here, the ocean for swimming and surfing). We have our congregations where we go to receive God's WORD.

    Yet we also have something precious we can not buy, and that is the gift of Salvation through Jesus Christ (Yeshua HaMashiach) and the promise of eternal life with HIM in Heaven, and a place set aside for us to live by his side for all eternity. We have the abilities through the Holy Spirit (Ruach HaKodesh) to serve the LORD while we are Earth-bound, and we can look forward to eternal Shalom and fellowship with God forever.

    So yes, Happy Thanksgiving to all.


    (best result, bake the turkey in an oven bag, that way, it won't dry out) Here. The best we can hope for is slices of turkey ham from the deli, or a small smoked, boneless turkey (that usually costs more than we care to spend).

Happy Thanksgiving!


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Posted just now
HAPPY THANKSGIVING DAY? or HAPPY TURKEY DAY?


As we approach one of our favorite times to celebrate with family, friends, and in-laws, we think about this special time called "Thanksgiving." Yet we hear of some calling it "Turkey Day". So which is it? "Thanksgiving" or "Turkey Day?" Which is correct? Well, let's think about it for a bit.

We celebrate Thanksgiving on the 4th Thursday of November, yet this was not the original date. It was set as the 4th Thursday of November by the US Congress in 1941. So, when was the first Thanksgiving celebrated in the Massachusetts Colony in 1621? No one knows for sure. We believe it was between the end of September and mid-November, when the crops were gathered in. It wasn't a one-day festival of celebration, but rather a three-day celebration.

It was similar to the Biblical Feast of Tabernacles or Sukkot, which is celebrated between the end of September and mid-October. During this time Israel praised God for the crops and blessings bestowed upon them by God. The Feast of Tabernacles or Sukkot is celebrated every year for 7 days, and one extra day.

So, let's talk about the food at the first Thanksgiving late in the year of 1621. We know that the native Americans of the Wampanoag tribe were a God sent, Squanto being the mediator. After a disastrous 1620, the Wampanoags helped them farm and grow vegetables, so, besides wild turkeys, they also had venison, or "deer meat" hunted by the Indians, so, why not call it "Deer Day?" or "Pumpkin Day?" after all, they probably had those too. The menu probably consisted of: "wild turkey, deer meat, corn, squash, bay oysters, clams, and fish. But everyone seems to be focused on the Turkeys. What's with that, you turkey?

It's great to feast on oven-roasted turkeys, stuffing, and all the trimmings, and have the friends and family over, and eat pumpkin pie, pecan pie, apple pie, or whatever pie you like. (Here in El Salvador, those are nonexistent) You have to make them from scratch. Everyone sits down after dinner, watches football on the tube, and grandpa goes to sleep in the easy chair, and the football game watches grandpa instead.

It's great to have this good time, but let's give thanks to whom thanks is owed, not to the creation (the turkey) but to the creator (God).
Yes, he created the turkeys and the rest of the birds on day 5 of creation, yet HE is the creator and to HIM must we give thanks.

When Thanksgiving comes around this Thursday, a good idea might be a table discussion of why we are thankful; the football game can wait. I would probably be like grandpa, asleep in the chair while the football game is going on. Sports are boring to me, unless I can actually play in the game personally.

Well, let's see. What do we have to be thankful for? Well, we have food on the table and we have our health to eat the food. We have money to buy the food, and we must have jobs to make the money to buy the food. We thank God that we have families, which makes working and providing for them all worthwhile. We have clothing because I doubt we sit around the dinner table in our birthday suits. We have homes where we live, and even AC in some places (not here, only at the Malls, in the banks, and in the supermarkets). We have fresh air to breathe (I guess that depends on where you live), we have parks, and places for R & R (here, the ocean for swimming and surfing). We have our congregations where we go to receive God's WORD.

Yet we also have something precious we can not buy, and that is the gift of Salvation through Jesus Christ (Yeshua HaMashiach) and the promise of eternal life with HIM in Heaven, and a place set aside for us to live by his side for all eternity. We have the abilities through the Holy Spirit (Ruach HaKodesh) to serve the LORD while we are Earth-bound, and we can look forward to eternal Shalom and fellowship with God forever.

So yes, Happy Thanksgiving to all.


(best result, bake the turkey in an oven bag, that way, it won't dry out) Here. The best we can hope for is slices of turkey ham from the deli, or a small smoked, boneless turkey (that usually costs more than we care to spend).

"[T]his may be interpreted allegorically"

As for the Bavarian bishops, you probably know their history. Bavarian Catholicism has had a curious relationship with Rome for a very long time. When the unification of Germany was accomplished by Otto Von Bismarck, the Bavarian Catholics found themselves as relative aliens in a Lutheran and Reformed conglomerate. In any event, we shall see how Pope Leo relates to them. Hopefully, truth and peace will prevail.

Amen to that my friend.
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"[T]his may be interpreted allegorically"

I have encountered many truly amazing allegorical interpretations of scripture which hardly align with orthodox teaching.

Indeed, chiefly among liberal Western pastors, both Protestant and Catholic, who embrace Alexandrian exegesis based on the misconception that it provides freedom to innovate.
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The 144,000

How is this related? The first resurrection is about the patrician families of Rome, the plebs come after. This was simply my point.

Also not Orthodox doctrine as far as I can tell, but perhaps I’m wrong, to which I would defer to @prodromos or @HTacianas or @FenderTL5 or @Chesterton .

Are you Eastern Orthodox? Because your profile indicates this.
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Imitatio Christi - is the following Biblical?

Sickness, pain, disease does not imitate, nor does it honor God, because it is not from God.

The point isn’t that the sickness honors God, it is that God, having put on our humanity and having suffered with us, is alongside us and does not just understand but has of his own voilition experienced our suffering, to the point of suffering death, in order to it.

This is why on Pascha we Orthodox sing this Troparion:

Christ is risen from the dead, trampling down death by death, and on those in the tombs bestowing life!

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