Hans Blaster said:

Influence and control are different things, Steve. You wanted to know who "controls" society. I gave the only answer that makes sense: No one. This is because no one person or group "controls" society, certainly not the government. Societies evolve under a wide variety of influences. When authoritarians *try* to control societies, their efforts break eventually.

Click to expand...

On the flip side, the assumption that someone must be in control (despite the lack of viable visible suspects) leads straight into conspiracy theory territory.

BCP1928 said:

I don't think any body is.

Click to expand...

You may not be, but clearly there were others who do take that approach (evidenced by the level of defensiveness that pops up almost immediately)

This isn't the first thread where I've given that same balanced approach simply acknowledging that there are some people out there who abuse the system, and was immediately met with a defensive response of "well, you're not a doctor so you can't say for sure"

But I've always found that to be something of a flimsy rebuttal.

One doesn't need to be a doctor to accurately identify the obvious cases.

The same way that if a kid has been dreading giving a speech at school all week, and when Friday rolls around, insists they're sick and need to stay home, and as soon as their parent calls them off, they seem to perk right up 20 minutes later and appear to be fine.

...a parent doesn't need to have gone to Harvard Medical school to accurately diagnose that as "idontwanttogiveaspeech-itis" lol

BCP1928 said:

Some time ago, about the time that Harrington's The Other America came out there was a good deal of public discussion about poverty, hunger and welfare. William Buckley was well known then as a Conservative thinker (though he wouldn't be accepted as one now) and he was annoyed about claims of hunger in America being blamed on conservatives. He proposed the following solution, that certain commodities be given away free to anyone who wanted them. Thus, no one, however poor, need go hungry, so stop complaining. I don't remember what the commodities were, flour, oil, powdered milk.things like that based on the then current age surpluses, but entirely adequate for survival nutrition and cheap at the time.

The Republicans rejected it because somebody might get that food who didn't deserve it and means testing would have made it very expensive and would have saved very little by preventing cheating. He was not entirely serious about the plan but only to address the issue of some kind of "minimum income" or "negative income tax" for the poor. And here we are today, considering the same issue. If we give away too much welfare then people will not want the crappy, low paying jobs we have for them.

Click to expand...

I'm familiar with Buckley to a degree

Although, I believe the negative income tax idea was the brain child of Milton Friedman, was it not?


With regards to the underlying question and same issue being discussed today.

You have to consider the time period lens with which those were being seen through.

I don't think your average rank-in-file republicans necessarily have some fetish for starving poor people.

The Cold War Era (red scare) was in full swing for much of that time period, and even more left leaning publications were telling some horror stories about the ill effects of expansive safety net programs


Even as late as 1990, here's a NY Times piece telling of how West Germany was having major concerns over how to re-integrate East Germans into their economy after entitlement mindsets produced the "I" word I mentioned earlier, indolence. The western world had gotten a 2-decade long front row seat to the worst possible outcomes that can happen when entitlement-based systems go off the tracks.


Through the more modern lens, the issues being discussed, shall we say, aren't "helped" by the fact that the same faction claiming they want to help with bare necessities by preventing entitlement cuts "because we need to do the right thing" in one breath, are also the same ones, in the next breath, advocating for much more sweeping entitlements.

In other words, if the most visible people arguing against entitlement cuts are the same ones out there with signs saying they want free tuition for all, a $30 minimum wage, and getting rid of grading systems in school because the meritocracy is racist, that's going to make conservatives very skeptical of the opposing team's position.

The same way that I would expect Democrats to be leery of any proposal to relax gun restrictions, if the most visible "pro-Gun" types they encountered were a bunch of Ted Nugent types who were arguing for having the right to shoot bazookas off in the back yard, they're going to be resistant to even conceding an inch to the opposing team.

Hentenza said:

Take your pick. Nonsense is nonsense.

Click to expand...

That's what's annoying.

Hentenza said:

I told you

Click to expand...

Thats the issue.

I am going to stick with what Jesus said, no editing

Mat5:18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one [b]jot or one [c]tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Oompa Loompa said:

Or we can blow China back into the stone age. That will help save the world. Or we can do something about the all that nasty water vapor that is warming up the planet.

Click to expand...

Don't be so dramatic. We can afford to take some responsibility on this and lead by example.

Yarddog said:

To whom is called. You cannot understand scripture without it being revealed through God's Holy Spirit.

Scripture says says many are called but few are chosen.

Click to expand...

How can someone know which scripture is accurate? Does the Holy Spirit guide people to the correct one?

Here is what bible says

“ All scripture is inspired by God and useful for refuting error, for guiding people's lives and teaching them to be upright.” 2nd Timothy 3:16 ( Catholic Online version)

Either Paul was mistaken when he wrote this, or if he is correct, then everything in the Bible is inspired by the Holy Spirit and therefore accurate.

ThatRobGuy said:

Wouldn't the ideological counterpart to a Berkley be something more like a Brigham Young University?

Click to expand...

Obviously you read the OP as you wrote it, so you know that DeSantis chose Berkley as the counterpart to his vision of what a university should be. BYU seems totally irrelevant to this dilemma.

ThatRobGuy said:

It would be like if someone was trying to prove that "artsy degrees are worthless", and chose to compare Baylor University (which is more conservative leaning) to one of those for-profit "Art & Design" schools that pop-up every few years before losing accreditation.

Click to expand...

How would it be like that? Both Berkley UC and New College are state universities. New College had been respected until it got taken over and revamped to be what it is now. It's not just some bad private for-profit school but a creature of DeSantis' own making - or unmaking.

Of course! I did! We are grafted into God's tree are we not? (Romans 11:17-19) And what did God tell the Israelite's when it came to foreigners when he gave them the law? To treat them as if they were Israel born.

Leviticus 19:34 (NIV):

"The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the Lord your God."

Click to expand...

Numbers 15:15-16 (NIV)

"The community is to have the same rules for you and for the foreigner residing among you, a lasting ordinance for the generations to come. You and the foreigner shall be the same before the Lord: The same law and the same regulations will apply both to you and to the foreigner residing among you.”

Click to expand...

The root of Christianity is Judaism. God's feasts, his laws and his ordinances. So technically, anyone following Christ is already a Messianic Jew as we are supposed to be following what God wants us to. Do you have to take part in their traditions like the prayers, kippah, tallit or anything that was added? Well, that's entirely between you and God to decide but on the foundation level, we should all still be honoring God's appointed times and rules. So if you want to convert, that is up to you. As someone who grew up with baptist family and have gone to baptist churches, I understand how different it is, so I would say just walk with God and let him guide you.

Edit: I understand you have family lineage, but I wanted to address specifically the religion aspect since you come from baptist.

The Maduro regime is not going to surrender power, and so now a showdown is looming.

Venezuelan President Nicolas Maduro escalated his confrontation with the United States, rallying tens of thousands of supporters across Caracas as he framed the moment as a historic battle for national survival.

Last week, Maduro held up a sword and urged his supporters: “We must be ready to defend every inch of this blessed land from imperialist threat or aggression, no matter where it comes from.”

Click to expand...

NewLifeInChristJesus said:

9 These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes, in that Day, to be glorified in His saints and to be admired among all those who believe, because our testimony among you was believed. (2 Th 1:9–10)​

"Everlasting destruction" sounds long-lasting to me.

Click to expand...

I just watched a video on everlasting destruction. Basically, it means total destruction, not destruction (torment) that lasts forever. But I guess that is his opinion in the video below. I agree with it.

Does Eternal Fire Mean Eternal Torment? - YouTube [Length: 3:43min]
Login to view embedded media

Nithavela said:

They still have to update from "the democrats will lead us to war" to "finally we are being led to war". That demands a full system reboot.

Click to expand...

Goldstein interfered with the banners!

Oompa Loompa said:

Well, are the teachers in the OP conservative or liberal? You know, the ones who are grooming and indoctinating trans ideology onto their students?

Click to expand...

You're just annoyed because they are not being groomed and indoctrinated into yours any more.

I relate very strongly. (I've never considered it OCD, but everything you mention is something I struggle with.)

Servus said:

Yes the myths the left makes up about the right.

Click to expand...

No, that myth was definitely made up buy the right, and being promoted by right-wing garbage factories like Hillsdale 'College and Prager U.

essentialsaltes said:

It doesn't take nerve to insist on one's Miranda rights and search warrants. Everybody has them.

Click to expand...

Those rights should only be for law abiding citizens and not criminals.

Tom D said:

Hmmm....

Click to expand...

Well, explain.

Some of the homeless people we have been evangelizing are starting to come to church.

Its challenging to get them to stay for the entire service.

Many are very anxious and can be overwhelmed just being there.

But they are getting themselves over to the building and inside the door.

Often, there is getting up and down as well as pacing around, sometimes even talking a bit to them selves....

Yet, they are there. They are seeking. There is a light of hope in their eyes.

They respond to being welcomed inside with genuine warmth, and sometimes sitting with them for support.

With a welcome word of support and fellowship, said with sincere warmth, people do respond to that!

I used to believe in an old Earth. Not too sure now...

Virginia Mayo had a thirst for joy amid her Hollywood fame. She found it, just in time, in the Church. Today we celebrate her birthday.

Virginia Mayo knew she was destined to be an actress from age six when she began studying at her aunt’s dance studio in her hometown of St. Louis, Missouri.

This great-great-great-granddaughter of Captain James Piggott -- a George Washington underling at Brandywine -- born Virginia Clara Jones 105 years ago today, would implore her childhood friends to “play show,” she said in Virginia Mayo: The Best Years of My Life (as told to LC Van Savage).

It was the roaring '20s. She soon began appearing in local theatrical shows.
Then life took a turn. The Great Depression hit and her father, Luke Ward Jones, a prominent writer at the St. Louis Globe-Democrat, and president of the PTA, lost his two-decades-long job. He was forced to take whatever work he could just to keep food on the table and a roof over their heads. These hardscrabble years prepared his young daughter’s soul to seek a joy beyond glittering theatrical lights.

Continued below.

It's my favorite, there's two versions I love:

Login to view embedded media
Login to view embedded media

Job 33:6 said:

Context is not given to the original authors. Context is something that the authors write scripture in light of. Just as Moses wrote in Hebrew while Paul wrote in Greek. God did not invent these languages and instruct the authors to write in them. It is not as though Paul was a native Arabic speaker and chose to write in Greek because God gave it to him. Rather Greek is part of his cultural context, and so that's what Paul writes in. It's the same for ancient cosmology. The revelation is shared through the cultural lense.

Click to expand...

Language has nothing to do with it.

God providing a revelation to someone by definition would be in conflict with what they already know and think.

Four people, including three children, have been killed while several others were wounded by a shooter who entered a family gathering in California and opened fire.

San Joaquin County Sheriff’s Office posted an update on Sunday afternoon to its official X account, reporting a mass shooting in Stockton on Saturday in which 15 people were shot.

According to authorities, “a total of 15 individuals sustained gunshot wounds during the incident,” including four deaths. The ages of the deceased were 8, 9, 14, and 21.

The sheriff’s office described the incident as an “active and ongoing investigation,” with police believing it was “a targeted incident” rather than a random act of violence.

Continued below.

RDKirk said:

Yes, it is fundamentally political. My problem with the video from those Congresspeople is that they are shading it as a problem for Corporal Smith to face.

If they don't want the president to go to war with Venezuela, it's up to them to prevent the president from going to war with Venezuela. It's not for Corporal Smith to say, "No." Only another branch of government can check a branch of government.

Click to expand...

What is your perspective on the recent news that the Secretary of Defense allegedly ordered a second strike on a sinking boat due to the presence of survivors?

Yes, it is.

Michie said:

The apostle Paul, for example, wrote that “the gifts and calling of God are without repentance” (Romans 11:29). Paul was writing about Jews who had not accepted Jesus as messiah. He wrote that “as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers’ sake” (Romans 11:28). In other words, they were still the Chosen People because of the promises He made to the patriarchs (Abraham, Isaac and Jacob).

Click to expand...

That conclusion is fine, with the qualification that the "chosen people" who continue in their rejection of the Messiah have been cut off (Rom. 11:20). They are only grafted back in if they abandon their unbelief (Rom. 11:23). Verse 29 doesn't mean they still have a "land promise," it means that God is merciful in continuing to give unbelieving Jews the chance to repent and be grafted back in by following the example of the Gentiles (vv. 30-32).

Michie said:

What did Paul mean by “the gifts”?

Click to expand...

Huh, if only there were another few verses after that one where he elaborated on what he meant.

As for the relationship between dispensationalism and Zionism, whether or not you can point to a couple of writers in the prior two centuries (still very late in Christian history), it's undeniable that the idea that God has simultaneous contradictory covenants (dispensationalism) and the idea that God's promise of land under the Old Covenant continues today (Zionism) go hand in hand, and they both really entered mainstream evangelical thought at the same time and through the same influences.

Valletta said:

As I've said, the problem in Washington, and I've dealt with extensively with Washington corruption, is that politicians and bureaucrats are worried about how things might look, particularly for their own futures. Concentrating on who is going to win the next election soon after someone is elected rather than doing the right thing is a major problem. Trump doesn't shift policies each week, or change his accent when approaching different audiences, you know what you are getting. He was voted in not because people loved his personality, but because he took stances that most Americans supported. There are still hundreds of thousands of children lost by the Biden administration, only a portion of been rescued, and many dangerous criminals that need to be deported. The runaway inflation caused by outrageous spending needs to be kept in check. And Trump will continue to address these problems. As to Democrats, many radical leaders have tried to hide their agendas from the people (the border is safe, secure, and closed, etc.) The radical arm of the Democratic Party, AOC, Mamdami, Omar, etc. and the people who really controlled the Biden administration are trying to destroy many of the policies and values that made our country great. Most of our presidents shared at least some of those values. It is a matter of how the Democrat base reacts, will so many continue to vote Democrat no matter who runs and see our nation destroyed, or will they reject the radical progressive agenda?

Click to expand...

Taking the correct course of action that only has an effect for four years may not truly be right, especially if it could lead the party to lose the next four presidential elections.

As mentioned before, I'm neither Republican nor Democrat, but I believe both parties should remain strong to maintain checks and balances and prevent extreme policies from either side.

President Trump's immigration policy may be effective, but it is alienating 70% of Hispanic Americans. Without securing a majority of the Hispanic vote, neither party will be able to win national elections in the future. Consequently, unless the Democrats make major mistakes, they will have a significant advantage in the coming presidential elections, potentially keeping the GOP out of power for an extended period. Meanwhile, Democrats would be free to implement progressive policies without substantial checks and balances.

Do you believe that "doing the right thing today," while potentially conceding future elections to the Democratic Party and granting unchecked presidential power to a future Democratic president, would ultimately serve America's best interests?