• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Marjorie Taylor Greene to resign in January

There's two different strategic moves that can be played... Once I again, I see some the progressive wing of the Democratic party playing the wrong one (just like the did with Joe Manchin).

Mocking, laughing, and saying "good riddance". (while not having the foresight to see that given the demographics and political make-up for her region, she's certainly not going to be replaced by anyone left of center)

When the smart play now (just like it would've been the smart play with Joe Manchin) would be to say "hey, here's someone who we can actually work with on a few issues that could be a thorn in the side of some of Trump's agenda, even if we can get someone who's with us on 20% of the issues, that's outkicking our coverage compared to anything else we'll ever get from the GA-14 district, let's encourage her to stick around"

What do they think? She'll get replaced by an AOC-type progressive or a moderate republican who's less loyal to Trump? Fat chance...

Just like Manchin got replaced by Jim Justice (after the dems celebrated running him out of town), Marjorie will be most certainly be replaced an ever further right Trump loyalist who dems hate even worse, who will work with them 0% of the time instead of 20% of the time.


A prominent Democrat once said
"It's better to have a few big elephants inside our tent peeing out, than having all of the elephants outside the tent peeing in" (yes I know, it wasn't originally "peeing", I had to change it, the original sounds catchier lol)
Good grief, Rob.

The Dems didn't shove her out. They didn't try to primary her, etc. The Dems had nothing to do with this.

No one (and I mean no one) had any idea she would do this. There was talk of her running for higher office next year instead of for reelection next year, and she may yet do that, but there was no hit of this.

As for MTG, good riddance.
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Can Truth Be Known? How

Of course Truth can be known. Christ promised that the Paraclete will be with His Church forever.


John 14:16 And I will ask the Father: and he shall give you another Paraclete, that he may abide with you for ever:
14:17 The spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, nor knoweth him. But you shall know him; because he shall abide with you and shall be in you.
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Do you keep the Sabbath? (poll)

This is why, in my understanding, so many people argue with you sir. Because of foolish and untrue statement such as the one above. You can find not one word in any of my posts, where I defended the practice of cutting the loose skin off a penis for salvation, and it is my stated position that God doesn't care about the loose skin on a man's penis, contrary to the Pharisees assertion that HE did in the OT. He has always only cared about the heart of man. When HE commanded "Thou shalt not muzzle the mouth of the ox that treadeth out the corn" this was a command about the heart of man, not oxen. When HE speaks about cutting off the loose skin of a penis, it is a command concerning the fleshy heart of man, not the penis for crying out load. When Jesus said to drink His Blood and Eat His Flesh, it is a command about the heart of man, not sifting through the rubble in Jerusalem trying to find a piece of His flesh to eat.

:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Some men must feed the lust of an uncircumcised heart, to become a talebearer among the brethren, by accusing others of defending the Pharisees version of circumcision. You have free will to do so, But it isn't true. I was simply pointing out that Paul wasn't as obsessed as many are, with the physical practice. And that many times his reference to the word "circumcision" was concerning Moses teaching regarding the heart. And many times it was a reference to Jew or non-Jew, such as the case in 1Cor. 7. And sometimes it was a reference to the Literal practice. Like the verse below.

Rom. 2: 24 For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles "through you", as it is written. 25 For circumcision verily profiteth, "if thou keep the law": but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.

You are free to disagree, but please be honest about the words others post.
Sorry, your were a bit cryptic in your post, I couldn't figure out what your point was only that you seem to disagree with me and I jumped to the wrong conclusion. I should have clarified with you first. My motivation however was not trying to falsly accuse you or make something up that isn't true, but it's still my error.
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An Epistemological Look at the Resurrection

Most people don't know who Wittgenstein was, and they definitely don't know what he contributed to philosophy, or to epistemology. I don't have any illusions about people understanding these ideas. Some will, but most won't.

Yes, that's true. Some here won't be familiar with him and some will give up reading your exposition after the first or second post, but I'm hanging in here for the moment. The main reason I know of Wittgenstein is because I had to read a portion of his Tractatus years ago for a 20th Century Analytic Philosophy course I took, along with a small smattering of bits of his work regarding his idea of Language Games.

What I find interesting here is that you've shared that you're an older fellow and a former Christian. I'm just wondering what the main locus of relevance is that you're wanting to share here in regard to the Resurrection.
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What happens if someone dies before they became a believer, is it their fault?

For example, a young man just starting college is murdered. He didn't get to live a long life, while someone else becomes a believer in their 40's.

The person in their 40's had more time to accept Jesus, yet the young man didn't. It seems unfair, but what does the Bible say?

Was the young man probably never would have been a believer anyway? Are we sometimes saved not only because we accepted Jesus, but by chance we survived long enough to accept Jesus as our God? Or does this not make any sense?
The bare minimum is the Sacrament of Baptism. If he ran out of time, too bad for him.
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What Satire are You Reading?

Upon seeing Fred, the old man called out, "Young man, could you lend me a hand with this burden?" Fred hesitated, feeling the press of time on his shoulders. But seeing the old man's struggle, he decided to help. He nodded and approached the man. "Of course, sir," he replied, taking hold of the bag.

Together, they entered the old house. Fred saw that the house looked as if nobody had been living there for a long time.

The old man led Fred and Enzo through a hall and up a winding staircase. "We need to take this to the top floor," he explained. The house was four stories high, and the climb was arduous. The weight of the bag pressed heavily on Fred's shoulders.

As they ascended, Fred couldn't shake the feeling that something was off. The old man's eyes seemed to glint with a strange light, and his movements were almost too fluid, too graceful for someone of his apparent age. Fred wondered whether the old man was truly who he appeared to be.

Finally, they reached the top floor. The old man opened a door, revealing a room filled with strange, bubbling concoctions and mysterious equipment. Fred set the bag down with a sigh of relief, his muscles aching from the effort.

"Thank you, young man," the old man said. "Would you care to stay for lunch? I've prepared a meal that I'm sure you'll find delightful."


Fred hesitated. He was due for an appointment and knew he shouldn't be late. "I'm sorry, but I really must be going," he replied.

But the old man insisted, his eyes narrowing slightly. "Please, I insist. It would be a shame for you to leave without tasting my cooking." He gestured to a table laden with food.

Fred was tempted and hesitated. The food smelled wonderful, and his stomach growled in response. But then, his father's teachings rose up in his mind, reminding him of the importance of punctuality. He realized that he should not be late for his appointment.


"I'm sorry, but I must go," Fred said firmly, stepping back from the table. The old man's expression darkened, and for a moment, Fred thought he saw a flicker of anger in his eyes.

As Fred turned to leave, the old man's demeanour changed abruptly. With a swift motion, he pulled out a hidden bag of soporific powder and threw its contents at Fred. He stumbled backward, narrowly avoiding the powder. The old man's face twisted into a malicious grin.

Fred's heart pounded in his chest as he scrambled to find an escape. Just then, Enzo, sensing the danger, leaped at Ruggero, barking fiercely. The sudden attack caught Ruggero off guard, and he stumbled, giving Fred a precious moment to run.

Fred ran down the winding staircase. He could hear the old man chasing behind him.

Reaching the ground floor, Fred spotted an open window and made a split-second decision. He leaped through it, landing on the grass outside. Ignoring the pain, he scrambled to his feet and ran, with Enzo close on his heels.

Fred didn't stop running until he was far from the house. Then Fred resumed his journey.

The road ahead was blocked by a fallen tree, and a sign indicated that the path was closed to pedestrians. Fred sighed, realizing they would need to find yet another way. Consulting his map, he decided to take a longer route via a hill road that meandered up and around the forest.

The hill road was steep and rocky. Fred and Enzo trudged onward, their pace slowing as the sun climbed higher in the sky. Both Fred and Enzo became very tired and hungry.
________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Suddenly, a food hawker appeared, carrying two plates filled with wonderfully fragrant food. It seemed as though he was offering it to them. Driven by instinct, Enzo leapt forward without hesitation and began eating from one of the plates. Animals act on instinct, but humans are different—they can make conscious choices based on reason and emotion.

Unlike Enzo, Fred hesitated. His father’s teachings echoed in his mind, urging caution. He faced a dilemma where reason and emotion battled for control. Torn between his hunger and his father’s lessons, he struggled to decide. In a moment of prudence, he chose not to eat. The food, as it turned out, was soporific, and the hawker was none other than Ruggero in disguise. To Fred’s horror, Enzo collapsed and lay motionless. Only now did Fred realize—it had all been part of Ruggero’s sinister plot.
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‘Just atrocious’: Trump’s polling numbers just hit a new low



A number of recent polls have shown Trump’s approval rating plunging among Americans in the wake of the government shutdown and the ongoing scandal involving documents connected to the late disgraced financier Jeffrey Epstein. Enten said on Friday that Trump reached a new low in his polling numbers over a 10-day period.​
“I would say this is probably the worst 10-day period for the President in the polls, his entire second term. The numbers are just atrocious,” Enten told CNN’s John Berman.​
He pointed to a number of polls taken in November, noting that Trump’s best poll still places him at a -14 percentage point net approval rating.​
“The best one of the group puts him at 14 points underwater. That’s the Marquette University Law School Poll, tied for the worse he’s ever had on that poll. Fox: 17 points underwater. Marist: 17 points underwater. The Reuters/Ipsos poll: 22 points underwater. And then taking the cake, the AP-NORC Poll: 26 points underwater,” Enten said.​
Trump took a huge dip with Independents, also with Hispanics and blacks. Folks can tell that prices have not come down.

Needing a pastors counsel

Start by praying that God bring someone into your life who can lead you to or through what you need to be resolved. If they can't, they may know the one who can.

This happened to me actually, in 2013 or so.. The start of answered prayer started 3 days later .
I don't feel like I can pray right anymore. I'm scared I'm going to hell. I hallucinated audible demons. I have diagnosed schizophrenia but it felt so real.
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Is the Bible inerrant?

The Quran was standardised twice; by Utman (around 650 CE) when he ordered any other deviating copies around to be burned, and later again in 1924 in Egypt. After 650 CE vowel symbols and pronunciation markers were added in the 8th century CE; originally the Quran was written without those markers. The 1924 standardisation also mainly deals with these markers, not the actual words themselves.

Interestingly it's highly likely the Hebrew TNK/OT Masoretic text with the pronunciation/vowel markers was produced after they noticed how succesful the Quranic addition of pronunciation markers was ... so it seems the Masoretes copied the method from the Islamic world even though the meaning of the markers in the Hebrew text is different from those in the Quran.

But still . .when comparing the earliest versions of Quran manuscripts available with the latest texts - the stability is higher (but please feel free to correct/show me otherwise). Another interesting bit is that printing was used for the Bible from the 15th century CE, but for the Quran printing only started in the 18th century CE (!!) - that's a lot later. When manually copying, the Bible is just much harder to copy (2 different languages and 10 times the volume in characters) - so naturally the fault rate per whole volume is expected to be higher.
Perhaps in a sense there is a higher fidelity, though that is at least a product of survivorship bias given the penchant for destruction of variants. But as far as I am aware, there isn't as open of a process for critical scholarship regarding the manuscripts that do exist. Also, there is the issue of what constitutes a variant given the dialect variance that exists within the manuscripts and the tolerance for at least seven distinct Arabic dialects or "readings". And in addition to the issues you mentioned, there is the unity of the text that is also in play given the relatively late collection into a single codex for the Bible compared to the Qu'ran. My minor quibble with what you had said was simply because it appeared to express a confidence in the Qu'ranic texts that the comparitive interest in critical scholarship creates a slight bias. There is also the issue of the oldest extant manuscript displaying a massive amount of variance from the later standardized texts from chapter order, number, and variant readings beyond the recognized "acceptable" variations.
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Are the Jews Israel, or is the church Israel? Or does it depend on the context of the passage?

Hi Daniel,

Have you ever considered that `Jerusalem` above is made up of two parts - Mount Zion and the city, the New Jerusalem.

`But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem,...` (Heb. 12: 22)

Mount Zion is where the Lord Jesus rules from His own throne. His Father has set Him there.

`I have set my King on my holy hill of Zion.` (Ps. 2: 6) `...a throne set in heaven, and one sat on the throne..` (Rev. 4: 2)

The city part is for the Old Testament Saints.

`But they desire a better, that is a heavenly country. Therefore, God is not ashamed to be called their God, for He has prepared a city for them.` (Heb. 11: 16)

So...Mount Zion is the seat of the Lord`s rule and in the highest, with His Body of believers.

`To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with me on my throne...` (Rev. 3: 21)


Then the city part comes down out of the highest heaven to the universe realm and is the rule over the earth.

`Then I, John, saw the holy city, new Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God,...` (Rev. 21: 2)
Dispies make it up as they go. Your diversion is another erroneous theological invention.
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The new mind. Not politics

Our responsibility is to the kingdom of Jesus. Jesus said not to worry about the cares of this life but to seek the kingdom and God's righteousness and God will take care of us. It's hard to preach and to obey that command when you follow politicians who preach fear, worry, complaints and strife over worldly things. Our dissatisfaction is not with politicians but with God because he is our supplier not man. I will never dishonor God with complaints, fears, worry or strife over worldly things
So we can renounce and shun any responsibility for this world?
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Conservative Marc Theissen column: Trump built a winning coalition. White nationalists will destroy it.

I think my reasoning is rock solid on this.
Yes, I think it is good reasoning.

So would you say that censorship is ever politically expedient?

Part of what you are saying is, "Twitter (under Dorsey) should not have censored Fuentes, because it was politically counterproductive." Part of the problem with this is that Dorsey was not merely a political actor, but also a moral actor. He was doing something that he believed to be good for the country, not merely good for the Democrats. He may well have responded to you by saying, "Yeah, maybe this won't help the Democrats, but it is still the right thing to do."
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The Lord's Wrath - How will it Happen

In today’s situation, we have many who have accepted the Gospel, but who have chosen their own beliefs about what God intends to do for His people and during this forthcoming test, 1 Peter 4:12, they may fail to stand firm in their trust that the Lord will protect them. This won’t lose their salvation, but it will be a serious disadvantage, 1 Corinthians 3:13-15

The great chapter of Isaiah 35:1-10, is one of the many prophesies that describe the Lord’s faithful Christian people entering the holy Land, says: ...no one unclean will go there....The Lord’s people, set free: will enter Zion with shouts of triumph.

Psalms 107 describes how the Lord will help His people to travel to the holy Land. Isaiah 66:18b-21
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House Democrat exchanged texts with Epstein during 2019 congressional hearing

What's that old saying 'don't throw stones if you live in a glass house'. Its funny how on just about every issue the Dems have gone crazy and fixated on in trying to blame Trump and Rep with. It ends up being the exact thing the Dems have done.

You can just about know where the Dems are at by using the very accusations they label Trump with. Those who judge others have to be prepared to be judged by the same standards.
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What we need is an economy that works for most Americans.....

I said it a few times in this thread, if you want to see a meaningful change in our economy in a way that works for more people, society needs to be less enamored with college degrees for the litany of jobs that currently require them, but don't actually need to.
Sure, but I think that change is inevitable.
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