bbbbbbb said:

As for the Bavarian bishops, you probably know their history. Bavarian Catholicism has had a curious relationship with Rome for a very long time. When the unification of Germany was accomplished by Otto Von Bismarck, the Bavarian Catholics found themselves as relative aliens in a Lutheran and Reformed conglomerate. In any event, we shall see how Pope Leo relates to them. Hopefully, truth and peace will prevail.

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Amen to that my friend.

bbbbbbb said:

I have encountered many truly amazing allegorical interpretations of scripture which hardly align with orthodox teaching.

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Indeed, chiefly among liberal Western pastors, both Protestant and Catholic, who embrace Alexandrian exegesis based on the misconception that it provides freedom to innovate.

jonojim1337 said:

How is this related? The first resurrection is about the patrician families of Rome, the plebs come after. This was simply my point.

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Also not Orthodox doctrine as far as I can tell, but perhaps I’m wrong, to which I would defer to @prodromos or @HTacianas or @FenderTL5 or @Chesterton .

Are you Eastern Orthodox? Because your profile indicates this.

Always in His Presence said:

Sickness, pain, disease does not imitate, nor does it honor God, because it is not from God.

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The point isn’t that the sickness honors God, it is that God, having put on our humanity and having suffered with us, is alongside us and does not just understand but has of his own voilition experienced our suffering, to the point of suffering death, in order to it.

This is why on Pascha we Orthodox sing this Troparion:

Christ is risen from the dead, trampling down death by death, and on those in the tombs bestowing life!​

fhansen said:

Well, all who claim to know the full gospel truth based on Scripture alone are asserting infalliblity, whether they acknowledge that fact or not. And then others of us do, indeed, interpret their interpretations as well as interpreting the positions of those who do not go by Scripture alone but who also point to a historic legacy of beliefs that existed before the new testament, at least, was written.

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Infallibility is not the only option, nor is everyone who claims to possess a sufficient gospel understanding for salvation need not even assert indefeasibility for their own understanding.

fhansen said:

The point is that even if we somewhere possess a perfect codified body of Christian beliefs accurately reflecting God's word, that in no way guarantees that anyone will necessarily embrace it. Either way this situation is open to being a messy affair as we less-than-perfect humans have been left here on earth with this treasure, this revelation of God's nature and will, from a God who revealed himself so that His perfect will be done on earth as it is in heaven.

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Good thing we have continued presence of the Holy Spirit.

fhansen said:

Similiarly, even if we possessed the texts fresh from the author's pens, and spoke their language fluently, we still wouldn't necessarily know their intended meanings perfectly.

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Yeah, which doesn't seem to be an issue.

fhansen said:

The bottom line for myself is in understanding that biblical exegesis alone is not at all a sure way to fully or even sufficiently know God's will for man. It's left to all of us to discern, with the help of grace, if and where we hear His voice. I certainly hear it in the bible despite any seeming contradictions, ambiguities, vagueness etc. I hear it more clearly explained in light of the historic understanding of His church. It's interesting that the apostles met in Jerusalem to discuss a matter which they did not resolve by Scripture, via the old testament, but by means of the new revelation they'd received through Christ. Related to this, the Bereans, conscientious as they were in studying Scripture, could not understand it without the still non-biblical imput of disciples who had experienced or been taught about a new Way. Likewise was the experience of the Ethiopian Eunuch with Paul.

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yeah, exegesis alone certainly isn't sufficient. Without the illumination of the Holy Spirit, we would only be spinning our wheels in interpretation.

ThatRobGuy said:

I've gone down the rabbit holes and watched several full Fuentes interviews and know what he believes.

I've even gone as far as watching full length interviews with people far more extreme than Fuentes, like Gypsy Crusader, who's like Fuentes on Steroids (both figuratively and literally)

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See, this is an example of where you need more complete information. Gypsy has/had mental illness and shouldn't even be mentioned in the same sentence as Nick. Would Nick ever refer to himself as a "gypsy"?

ThatRobGuy said:

Your personal insult notwithstanding... what exactly is this "information" you wanted to discuss?

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I apologize. I didn't mean any personal insult, but I can see how it sounded that way.

I'd like to discuss how America should behave as every other country outside of the West behaves - in its own interest.

ThatRobGuy said:

Posting a 90-minute long video of an opinion-based interview isn't a valid rebuttal in a debate.

You're supposed to be giving me a counterpoint, not an hour and half long subjective homework assignment.

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Again, sorry. The last couple of weeks you've seemed interested in the "Fuentes phenomenon". You've written a lot about it, I thought you might be interested in spending some time listening to a clear explanation of it.

Is there something specific to which you'd like to hear a counterpoint?

iluvatar5150 said:

No, it’s not merely the greater exposure that the Groypers are getting. It’s also that they’re becoming more numerous on the right, particularly among their younger ranks. Social media isn’t just exposing these folks, it’s creating more of them. The Republican party of old would have censored this stuff themselves.

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The GOP are courting danger in a movement they cannot control and will not be content to give any quarter to any sense of morality or respectability.

PloverWing said:

The Billy Graham crusades seem different from street preaching, to me, because they were held in a stadium or convention hall, and people chose to attend them. When I think of a street preacher, I think of a guy standing on a sidewalk or street corner holding a sign, or walking up to strangers to interrogate them. Those feel like different activities.

I thought Billy Graham was an excellent preacher, in the classic Southern Baptist tradition. I heard him preach in person several times, and on TV many times.

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I think at the time of Billy Graham this was a time of bold street preachers as well. Culturally that is why Graham became so popular. Because the climate was right for such preaching. Pastors use to give bold sermons. Or fire and brimestone sermons. But it was a time of preaching and we see all the TV evangelists rising around this time as well.

It was a time I remeber where street preachers use to be on street corners or even on soap boxes preaching. You would often see a preacher at the train station somewhere as people go by. Or in a busy street declaring repent and be saved and handing out flyers. While hippy dropouts joining Hare Kristna with their incense and drums lol.

Graham had a way of reaching people. He even used Johnny Cash at one point when he went from the 'man in black' to the 'man in white'.

@2PhiloVoid Back in the day, I kind of ignored bands like Petra and Stryper, but listening to their interviews, I think they were genuine and sincere, and their music was good.

RamiC said:

Or even an errant translation of an inerrant text..."However, a 1631 mistake in an English Bible literally turned a passage – one of the Ten Commandments, no less – on its head. Rather than reading “Thou shalt not commit adultery,” this edition declares, “Thou shalt commit adultery” (Exodus 20:14)." Damnable Typos & the Bible

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Ok, and yet even if we somehow had a perfect translation, that would not in itself guarantee that we'd understand the meaning of Scripture perfectly.

God the Father is the source of all blessings rendered through the Savior Jesus, God the Word, even though the Father has bestowed upon his Son all power in heaven and earth. All through the Book of John, the writer quotes Jesus giving all credit for everything mortal and immortal to God the Father. I will never know in mortality how the work and the glory of the Trinity actually functions. Perhaps all saints who make it to heaven will one day know the divine secrets of God. The laws and physics of God are far beyond the ability of the mortal mind to comprehend. God the Father is the source of all power that he has given to Jesus to create mankind, the world, and all things that have been created, according to John 1. God the Word, Jesus, is the advocate of all mankind before God the Father. That is why everything we say or do should be done in the name of Jesus Christ.

God the Holy Spirit, the Comforter, will convey to the devout sincere Christian the truth of the foregoing. The Holy Spirit is pretty much the Christian's pipeline to knowledge and prophecy. The Father will send blessings through the Holy Spirit to the faithful Christian, as Jesus said the Comforter will do. As we pray to the Father, the Holy Spirit will deliver the knowledge and information that we request, and Jesus is always there to do what he does best, to mysteriously intervene in our lives with his bounteous love for us.

Fervent said:

Even if we had infallible interpreters, we'd be stuck interpreting them as well. Unless you're advocating that each of us is infallible in our interpretations. So it doesn't seem to me that we can affirm either, at least unless we're simply going to be insisting on such matters dogmatically and don't deal in the practical realities involved.

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Well, all who claim to know the full gospel truth based on Scripture alone are asserting infalliblity, whether they acknowledge that fact or not. And then others of us do, indeed, interpret their interpretations as well as interpreting the positions of those who do not go by Scripture alone but who also point to a historic legacy of beliefs that existed before the new testament, at least, was written.

The point is that even if we somewhere possess a perfect codified body of Christian beliefs accurately reflecting God's word, that in no way guarantees that anyone will necessarily embrace it. Either way this situation is open to being a messy affair as we less-than-perfect humans have been left here on earth with this treasure, this revelation of God's nature and will, from a God who revealed himself so that His perfect will be done on earth as it is in heaven.

Similiarly, even if we possessed the texts fresh from the author's pens, and spoke their language fluently, we still wouldn't necessarily know their intended meanings perfectly.

The bottom line for myself is in understanding that biblical exegesis alone is not at all a sure way to fully or even sufficiently know God's will for man. It's left to all of us to discern, with the help of grace, if and where we hear His voice. I certainly hear it in the bible despite any seeming contradictions, ambiguities, vagueness etc. I hear it more clearly explained in light of the historic understanding of His church. It's interesting that the apostles met in Jerusalem to discuss a matter which they did not resolve by Scripture, via the old testament, but by means of the new revelation they'd received through Christ. Related to this, the Bereans, conscientious as they were in studying Scripture, could not understand it without the still non-biblical imput of disciples who had experienced or been taught about a new Way. Likewise was the experience of the Ethiopian Eunuch with Paul.

prodromos said:

Ah, so "trust the media". They've certainly shown themselves to be 'trustworthy'

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No, the media is not trustworthy. But then again, that's not the question I answered.

Hans Blaster said:

You claimed it lined certain shafts and chambers because of their electrical properties. I was merely pointing out that the prestige and implied wealth of using granite was a better explanation. It as if you said the pyramid was capped with gold because it was a conductor, when ostentatious display of wealth and power would be better. (I've heard the capped with gold claim before, though I don't think it is still thought to be the case.)

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This shows how the same evidence can be seen with two different explanations. It seems to me that many examples are explained away as decoration. Like everything was for looks and no function. Thus relegating the Egyptians to artists rather than knowledgable.

Which I think stems back to the design verses naturalistic worldview. Skeptics resist attributing any agency or design to anything humans do as it suggests design in nature or that there is such a thing as a mind capable of actually changing or creating objective reality.

Hans Blaster said:

I'm not sure you've learned it. Batteries, like piezoelectric crystals, can't be a power source unless they are wired together. The trunk-load of batteries and the quartz crystals in granite aren't wired together and you can't make an electrical power source out of them.

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From what I understand the power source needs to be connected in the proper sequence and aligned to be able to work in the first place. The piezoelectric crystals have to fall within a certain range or oscilation to generate or enhance the effect.

Thus the pyramid itself being located in a constantly vibrating location and with additional sources of activity such as siezmic activity or the natural subterrainian activities of the waterways and caverns.

With the additional effects of the pyramids internal layout with specific stones layered in ways that enhance the piezoelectric effect when is concentrated into the chambers and especially the Kings chamber.

For all this to happen I don't think it was an accident or coincident that these specific locations, layouts and other evidence of purposeful treatments to the structure such as thermal activity show some sort of experimentation was going on. I know thats a laymans explanations but it is something along these lines.

Hans Blaster said:

Your "AI" (artificial idiot)

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Its funny how your side uses the same but its ok for them.

Hans Blaster said:

is slamming random things together. "quartz has piezoelectric properties" + "granite contains quartz" + your leading question + a dash of your favorite nutters and their "electric pyramid nonsense" in the "training data" and you get responses like this. LLMs (like the "AI chatbots") are useful tools, but they are just that, tools. GIGO or if you don't know how to use it you will get nonsense results.

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I did not ask any leading questions. I simply put in your statement and not anything I said and that is exactly what popped out. No mention of pyramid power, Atlantis, aliens. Just the simple question (is Granite is a piezoelectric power source).

Once again it is you who keeps injecting the conspiracies of "electric pyramid nonsense". Your taking the simple question about the piezoelectric effects of granite and how it can generate electrical energy through pressure or other forces and assuming its about some conspiracy about alien power.

I am simply looking at the material involved and how it is structured and the possible activities it was subject to to show that it is ideal for generating such activity. Thats it. Step one. Not some conspiracy down the raod that you think its about.

Hans Blaster said:

How?

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By the possible methods the articles have been mentioning. The premise being if the pyramid was built in a certain location to maximize potential natural energy. That the specific internal layout and material also being conducive.

That subjecting the pyramid itself and the internal structures such as shafts and chambers through stressses of various sorts such as heat or sound. Will potentially generate certain effects that will produce desired outcomes such as a concentration of energy in the chambers.

If all the setup and materials can potentially achieve this then this is the logical conclusion. If tests can show that these setups and arrangements can produce the effects. Then its a case of whether this was actually being done. That we find evidence of that stress within the pyramid and stones seems to support this premise.

Hans Blaster said:

lol

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What, lol. Isn't it funny. When I actually link peer review its just laughed at.

Hans Blaster said:

lol

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Hans Blaster said:

What "eyewitness testimony"? Pyramids have been there for millennia.

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The testimony from the ancients themselves that tell us they had this knowledge. That it was from the gods or for the gods. You don't believe them like you don't believe the witnesses of Christ who they said came back from the dead. The fundemental skepticism of all things non naturalistic is a belief and not science.

Hans Blaster said:

Though this is not on topic, it is also false. Eye witnesses are *not* good sources. Our knowledge of Jesus of Nazareth is not based on eyewitness testimony anyway. I suggest you go read a proper source on the origins of the Gospels. But there is no need to discuss it here as it is not the topic.

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So if there is evidence for Christ and the gospels then whats stopping people from then taking up what was claimed as truth.

Or are you just talking about a certain kind of knowledge that can never convince that the supernatural events happened. Or there there can be such alternative knowledge and reality in the first place.

Hans Blaster said:

Which is utterly irrelevant to the principle (ancient, unknown civilizations) and secondary claims (lost ancient rock shaping technology) you have made in this thread.

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This is a either/or fallacy. Its not just about 'rock shaping' but ancient lost alternative and/or advanced knowledge and the possible tech that came from this.

Fundementally as I said and the OP pointed this out. That this is a epistemic and metaphysical belief and not just the science of specific examples. Though they may show the advanced knowledge.

Part of that is labelling good people by assumption and stereotypes of conspiracies and making up stuff simply because they believe or propose an alternative idea about what knowledge is.

That includes Christian scientists or those who are open to alternative metaphysics who can hold both the scientific causes and the alternative ones that could range from spirituality to consciousness beyond brain.

Some skeptics automatically lump everyone into the conspiracy when its not and don't support the claims about the specific ideas that even Hancock have suggested. Even if I also think some like Hancock can drift into spectualtion. He also holds some pretty well accepted and verified ideas. But you don't seem to have the capacity to be able to entertain both sides at the same time. Its either all your way or the highway.

You get married or you don't. You can't control it

d taylor said:

-
​

Here it is.

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In the post to which you linked, you just showed a disc equally spaced between two places. I kept asking you in the thread, post after post after post, what would we see if the moon was on the horizon.

You refused to answer. As you are refusing to do so now. Because it's obvious that we'd all see the same features the same way around. But we don't. So what's your explanation?

Dan1988 said:

Are you suggesting that the vast majority of mankind choses to spend eternity in hell???

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That's certainly what they say. And it sounds better than saying that God chucks the majority of those He's ever created into eternal torment knowing that's where they'd end up based on His design.

Bradskii said:

If the moon is on the horizon, then everyone would see the same thing. We don't. Where do you think this convex disc is anyway?

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Here it is.
Proof the Earth is Flat

Proof the Earth is Flat

Proof the Earth is Flat

Brightfame52 said:

So it's not about their freewill. It's Christ will and power

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All men are drawn.
Many men are called, few chosen.
We are not coerced
Our response is our choice.
'Choose this day who you will serve.'
'Open the door and I will come in and sup with you.'
It isn't complicated.

concretecamper said:

Newsweek, CBC

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Ah, so "trust the media". They've certainly shown themselves to be 'trustworthy'

ThatRobGuy said:

Political currency wins elections evidently... you DO want the Democrats to win, yes?

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at some point you have to let the chips fall where they may.

its not our job to be the morality police, or insist that tax dollars be spent effectively. people are complacent and you have to let them be complacent to the point they get hurt before they wise up and change their ways.

teach your children the games both sides play and invest your money instead of donating it to political campaigns, you'll have more left over at the end of your life.

That is just a pathetic falsehood.
But you do you.