How is the law and sabbath different?

[BobRyan]

John Wesley - 4th Commandment begins in Eden. Gen 2:3

Comment on Exodus 20
20:8The fourth commandment concerns the time of worship; God is to be served and honoured daily; but one day in seven is to be particularly dedicated to his honour, and spent in his service. Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy; in it thou shalt do no manner of work - It is taken for granted that the sabbath was instituted before. We read of God's blessing and sanctifying a seventh day from the beginning, Genesis 2:3 , so that this was not the enacting of a new law, but thereviving of an old law. 1st. They are told what is the day, they must observe, a seventhafter six days labour, whether this was the seventh by computation from the first seventh, or from the day of their coming out of Egypt, or both, is not certain. A late pious Writer seems to prove, That the sabbath was changed, when Israel came out of Egypt; which change continued till our Lord rose again: But that then the Original Sabbath was restored.And he makes it highly probable, at least, That the sabbath we observe, is the seventh day from the creation. 2dly, How it must be observed;

1. As a day of rest; they were to do no manner of work on this day,in their worldly business.
2. As a holy day, set apart to the honour of the holy God, and to bespent in holy exercises. God, by his blessing it, had made it holy; they, by solemn blessing him, must keep it holy, and not alienate it to any other purpose than that for which the difference between it and other days was instituted. 3dly, Who must observe it? Thou and thy son and thy daughter - Thewife is not mentioned, because she is supposed to be one with the husband, and present with him, and if he sanctify the sabbath, it is taken for granted she will join with him; but the rest of the family is instanced in it, children and servants must keep it according to their age and capacity.In this, as in other instances of religion, it is expected that masters of families should take care, not only to serve the Lord themselves, but that their houses also should serve him. Even the proselyted strangers must observe a difference between this day and other days, which, if it laid some restraint upon them then, yet proved a happy indication of God's gracious design, to bring the Gentiles into the church. By the sanctification of the sabbath, the Jews declared that they worshipped the God that made the world, and so distinguished themselves from all other nations, who worshipped gods which they themselves made. God has given us an example of rest after six days work; he rested the seventh day - Took a complacency in himself, and rejoiced in the work of his hand, to teach us on that day, to take a complacency in him, and to give him the glory of his works. The sabbath begun in the finishing of the work of creation; so will the everlasting sabbath in the finishing of the work of providence and redemption; and we observe the weekly sabbath in expectation of that, as well as in remembrance of the former, in both conforming ourselves to him we worship. He hath himself blessed the sabbath day and sanctified it. He hath put an honour upon it; it is holy to the Lord, and honourable; and he hath put blessings into it which he hath encouraged us to expect from him in the religious observation of that day. Let us not profane, dishonour, and level that with common time, which God's blessing hath thus dignified and distinguished.

 

[from scratch]

John Wesley - 4th Commandment begins in Eden. Gen 2:3

Comment on Exodus 20
20:8The fourth commandment concerns the time of worship; God is to be served and honoured daily; but one day in seven is to be particularly dedicated to his honour, and spent in his service. Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy; in it thou shalt do no manner of work - It is taken for granted that the sabbath was instituted before. We read of God's blessing and sanctifying a seventh day from the beginning, Genesis 2:3 , so that this was not the enacting of a new law, but thereviving of an old law. 1st. They are told what is the day, they must observe, a seventhafter six days labour, whether this was the seventh by computation from the first seventh, or from the day of their coming out of Egypt, or both, is not certain. A late pious Writer seems to prove, That the sabbath was changed, when Israel came out of Egypt; which change continued till our Lord rose again: But that then the Original Sabbath was restored.And he makes it highly probable, at least, That the sabbath we observe, is the seventh day from the creation. 2dly, How it must be observed;

1. As a day of rest; they were to do no manner of work on this day,in their worldly business.
2. As a holy day, set apart to the honour of the holy God, and to bespent in holy exercises. God, by his blessing it, had made it holy; they, by solemn blessing him, must keep it holy, and not alienate it to any other purpose than that for which the difference between it and other days was instituted. 3dly, Who must observe it? Thou and thy son and thy daughter - Thewife is not mentioned, because she is supposed to be one with the husband, and present with him, and if he sanctify the sabbath, it is taken for granted she will join with him; but the rest of the family is instanced in it, children and servants must keep it according to their age and capacity.In this, as in other instances of religion, it is expected that masters of families should take care, not only to serve the Lord themselves, but that their houses also should serve him. Even the proselyted strangers must observe a difference between this day and other days, which, if it laid some restraint upon them then, yet proved a happy indication of God's gracious design, to bring the Gentiles into the church. By the sanctification of the sabbath, the Jews declared that they worshipped the God that made the world, and so distinguished themselves from all other nations, who worshipped gods which they themselves made. God has given us an example of rest after six days work; he rested the seventh day - Took a complacency in himself, and rejoiced in the work of his hand, to teach us on that day, to take a complacency in him, and to give him the glory of his works. The sabbath begun in the finishing of the work of creation; so will the everlasting sabbath in the finishing of the work of providence and redemption; and we observe the weekly sabbath in expectation of that, as well as in remembrance of the former, in both conforming ourselves to him we worship. He hath himself blessed the sabbath day and sanctified it. He hath put an honour upon it; it is holy to the Lord, and honourable; and he hath put blessings into it which he hath encouraged us to expect from him in the religious observation of that day. Let us not profane, dishonour, and level that with common time, which God's blessing hath thus dignified and distinguished.

Can't gain converts with the Baptist argument so you switch religions on us to the Methodist. You'll get the same from me. You're arguing religion and not a relationship with God.

 

[annier]

Yes that's correct the covenant issued at Sinai is conditional

Ok, so please respond to what I said and the disagreement you have with it please.

 

[from scratch]

Ok, so please respond to what I said and the disagreement you have with it please.

I though one could more less agree with someone here at least once in a while.

 

[Cribstyl]

I do not think so Cribstyl. The covenant is the promises, it cannot be added to nor taken away from. That covenant was established in Issac.

Ga 3:15 Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man’s covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto.

The covenant given at Sinai, had not yet been confirmed before the people broke it. Therefore the law ( I believe of the levitical priesthood) was added

Sorry for the late response annier...........

My statement was; in Gal 3 Paul implied: The law was added to the promise given to Abraham. It actually means that another covenant was given.
Gal 3 is making the argument that God made a promise to Abraham and that Abraham's response was to believe God(Gal 3:6, Gen 15:1-6). No law or other conditions was given to Abraham. The covenant is a sole promise: "In thy seed shall all the nations of the world be blessed". Here is how Peter explained it to the Jews on Pentecost Act 3:25
Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.

The big questions is; did God add to His covenant? The answer is NO...... His promise to Abraham did not change. The law came as a seperate covenant 430yrs later because the people was tempting God by making demands after freedom from Egypt. Gal 3:17 Gal 3:19
The fact that God made other covenants in time does not nullify or change His previous agreements. In Duet 6 Moses said of the the ten commandments: it was not made with the fathers before.....(not at creation or ever before) Deu 5:3
The LORD made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day.


The promise was established in Isaac because, it was through Isaac's lineage the seed would come (not Ishmael's).

I have sometimes thought that myself. But I think Abraham kept the law of faith. All that Abe did by faith was the law of faith IMO.
Ro 3:27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.

It's only rational that laws are rules given to govern people within stated boundaries. If circumcision was given through Abraham, it is a law when Abraham commanded the people to obey it. The bible is not silent about when God gives laws.

Would God give a law or commandment with a death penalty without a prophet to pronounce it to the people?

 

[Raeneske]

Is that Seventh Day Adventist Reformed? That is the closest I could come to SDR.This simply isn't true according to the prophets. Do you have something from the Bible to back that up? I should love to see it. So far no one has.You already said that. I see no need to repeat my answer. The above will suffice.I see. Now where did you say Jesus says these are His commandments? Don't forget the context of the conversation Jesus was having.Where on earth do you get this? It isn't from the Bible? God is speaking to the COI only.Who did it say can't work? Do you do business on the Sabbath? If you use electricity from a provider you do. Thus you don't keep the Sabbath and sin according to what you posted. This is willful sin. No matter how much you confess and repent, continuation proves no repentance and a love for selfish consuming sin that will bring death.Where does Paul even quote the law in Galatians 5? No where! In fact Paul says if your righteousness comes from the law you reject the righteousness of God and salvation. Jesus has become ineffective - v 4.

Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

The list you quote deals only with sin and not the law. The previous verse says -

But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.Yes I see. You're trying to say since Jesus kept the law we're also to keep the law. But since Jesus didn't teach the law that can't be His mind.

Jesus said -

If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

You need to seriously identify those commandments I bolded. Jesus kept the Ten Commandments which are His Father's commandments.

Did John, a disciple of Jesus not know? He wrote this -

For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

My friend Dr. Luke wrote this -

The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.

Is he also pulling a fast on us? Do I need to bold the details?If one isn't subject to the law (covenant issued at Sinai) they can't violate it. We have a new covenant according to Jesus. Unless you can show there is more than one new covenant it isn't like the previous one (meaning contents not movement). Movement changes nothing.

SDR stands for Seventh Day Remnant.

What prophets predicted that the 10 commandments would pass away? We have prophesies of the law being exalted and being written in our hearts, not passing away.

Jeremiah 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Isaiah 42:21 The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable.

That same law that God wrote with His finger in stone, is the same law that is written in our hearts. Here is a perfect example of the law being written in the hearts of the Gentiles.

Romans 2:13-15 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified. 14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: 15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another

The New Covenant writes the law in our hearts.

Hebrews 10:16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

As for the Law being a transcript of God's character, consider the following similarities, then notice what is blatantly written within the law:

LAW - Romans 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

GOD - Revelation 4:8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come.

Isaiah 45:21 Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.

Matthew 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

God is holy, just, and good. The law is holy, just, and good.

LAW - Psalms 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

GOD - Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Psalms 18:32 It is God that girdeth me with strength, and maketh my way perfect.

The law of the LORD is perfect, and God is perfect. The law converts the soul, and it is God that works on our heart to convert it, making our path perfect.

LAW - Psalms 119:152 Concerning thy testimonies, I have known of old that thou hast founded them for ever.

GOD - Psalms 102:12 But thou, O LORD, shalt endure for ever; and thy remembrance unto all generations.

The testimonies shall last forever, just as God shall last forever.

LAW - Proverbs 6:23 For the commandment is a lamp; and the law is light; and reproofs of instruction are the way of life:

GOD - 1 John 1:5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

2 Samuel 22:29 For thou art my lamp, O LORD: and the LORD will lighten my darkness.

The commandment is a lamp, and the law is light. God is a lamp, and God is light.

LAW - Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

GOD - Hebrews 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

The law is not sin, and Christ was tempted in all points like we are, yet is without sin. And, obviously, Christ and His Father are not sin. Moving on to directly what is contained within the law:

LAW - Exodus 20:5-6 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; 6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

GOD - Exodus 33:19 And he said, I will make all my goodness pass before thee, and I will proclaim the name of the LORD before thee; and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy.

Exodus 34:5-7 And the LORD descended in the cloud, and stood with him there, and proclaimed the name of the LORD. 6 And the LORD passed by before him, and proclaimed, The LORD, The LORD God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth, 7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth generation.

Exodus 34:14 For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:

Written in the law is God's character, a merciful God who forgives iniquity of those that love Him and keep His commandments. We learn that God is a jealous God. We learn that God visits iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children.

LAW - Exodus 20:2 I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.

GOD - John 8:34-36 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin. 35 And the servant abideth not in the house for ever: but the Son abideth ever. 36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

God brought the Israelites out of the house of bondage the same way that we Christians are freed from our bondage of sin. Freedom from bondage to sin is proclaimed even in the law.

LAW - Exodus 20:8-11 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: 10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: 11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

GOD - Genesis 2:1-3 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

The law tells us that God is our Creator. God commands us to work for six days, and rest upon the seventh day as He did. This is what God did during creation week. He worked for six days, and rested upon the seventh. How can we not keep this day as a memorial to God? The day that God made for man, and did not make man for? In creation week, He rested upon the seventh day, blessed it, and set it apart for holy use. So the day that God made for man, man is to set aside for God.

And for the obvious, let us not forget that Jesus kept all 10 commandments. The righteousness of the law is to be fulfilled in us.

Romans 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

If we are not obeying the 10 commandments, how can we say that the righteousness of the law is fulfilled in us? It is Christ in us who keeps the commandments. And if we refuse to do that, then is Christ in us?

It is a mistake to divide the commandments and say that one is only of Jesus and the other is only the Father's.

John 8:28 Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.

John 10:30 I and my Father are one.

The words that Jesus spake are life.

John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

And as Jesus said, if we are to enter into life, keep the commandments.

Matthew 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

What commandments did Jesus mean?

Matthew 19:18-19 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, 19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Jesus mentions murder, adultery, theft, lying, and honouring our parents. Then He says, "and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself". Paul commandments virtually the same thing in Romans 13.

Romans 13:8-10 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law. 9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Paul mentions adultery, murder, theft, lying, false witness, and if there be any other commandment it is briefly comprehended in the saying, thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Paul didn't mention honouring our parents, and Christ didn't mention coveting. Yet Christ mentioned honouring our parents and Paul mentioned coveting. Paul also said if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended as love thy neighbour as thyself. The commandment Paul did not mention explicitly was covered by thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. The commandment that Christ did not mention explicitly was covered by the same words. Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself is a brief comprehension (a summary) of any and all of the last six commandments.

Matthew 22:37-40 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

The two great commandments are likened unto each other. They are similar in some manners. You cannot keep one and not keep the other. If you love your neighbour, you will love God. If you love God, you will love your neighbour.

 

[Raeneske]

Is that Seventh Day Adventist Reformed? That is the closest I could come to SDR.This simply isn't true according to the prophets. Do you have something from the Bible to back that up? I should love to see it. So far no one has.You already said that. I see no need to repeat my answer. The above will suffice.I see. Now where did you say Jesus says these are His commandments? Don't forget the context of the conversation Jesus was having.Where on earth do you get this? It isn't from the Bible? God is speaking to the COI only.Who did it say can't work? Do you do business on the Sabbath? If you use electricity from a provider you do. Thus you don't keep the Sabbath and sin according to what you posted. This is willful sin. No matter how much you confess and repent, continuation proves no repentance and a love for selfish consuming sin that will bring death.Where does Paul even quote the law in Galatians 5? No where! In fact Paul says if your righteousness comes from the law you reject the righteousness of God and salvation. Jesus has become ineffective - v 4.

Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

The list you quote deals only with sin and not the law. The previous verse says -

But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.Yes I see. You're trying to say since Jesus kept the law we're also to keep the law. But since Jesus didn't teach the law that can't be His mind.

Jesus said -

If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

You need to seriously identify those commandments I bolded. Jesus kept the Ten Commandments which are His Father's commandments.

Did John, a disciple of Jesus not know? He wrote this -

For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

My friend Dr. Luke wrote this -

The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.

Is he also pulling a fast on us? Do I need to bold the details?If one isn't subject to the law (covenant issued at Sinai) they can't violate it. We have a new covenant according to Jesus. Unless you can show there is more than one new covenant it isn't like the previous one (meaning contents not movement). Movement changes nothing.

THIS IS THE OTHER PART OF MY RESPONSE.

God was not only speaking to Israel when the 10 commandments were being proclaimed. Please notice that the stranger is included in the 4th commandment. Indeed, it is the stranger that is within the gates of an Israelite, but still the stranger was to keep the Sabbath. The stranger that joined himself to the Lord is also to keep the Sabbath as well.

Isaiah 56:6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

We are the sons of the stranger, the Gentiles, that joined ourselves to the Lord. We are to keep the seventh day Sabbath. Yet not only this commandment are we to keep. We are to keep all the commandments. For not hearers of the law are justified, but the doers of the law shall be justified, as Romans 2:13 tells us. Notice that it does not say that we are justified by doing the law, but we who do it shall be justified. Those who refuse to obey the commandments will not be just before God.

I cannot control what mankind does upon the Sabbath, I can only control what I do on the Sabbath. If mankind wants to spend Sabbath fixing the road, I am not in trouble for driving to church while they fix the road. If mankind wants to stock their stores on the Sabbath, I am not in trouble for going into the store after Sabbath to buy food. So as for using electricity from a business on the Sabbath, I am in more trouble than using a gas heater to stay warm on the Sabbath.

Yes, we are not justified by the law. Those who do the law to justify themselves will be in the same boat as those who do not do the law at all. But those who accept Christ's sacrifice and obey shall be just before God. There is no condemnation in those who are in Christ Jesus.

Galatians 5:19-21 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Is adultery a violation of the law? What about Idolatry? Hatred? Murders?

If you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. But what does the Bible say? Although you are not under the law, you are still not allowed to break the law, that being the ten commandments of course.

Romans 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

You cannot worship other Gods, worship idols, take the Lord's name in vain, break the Sabbath, dishonour your parents, kill, commit adultery, steal, lie, or commit adultery simply because you are not under the law.

Now Paul speaks about circumcision in Galatians 5, and there is nothing here that has me telling you to be circumcised. We are to keep the 10 commandments, that is what I am telling you. The words of Christ, and the words also of Paul show that the commandments still must be kept.

Jesus did teach the law.

Matthew 19:17-19 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. 18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, 19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Jesus taught that we are to do the commandments if we are to enter into life. He Himself mentioned five of the commandments, then we see "and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself." If we do those things, we shall love our neighbour as ourselves. Jesus did not leave out the 10 commandments. Jesus magnified the law, and made it honourable. He showed how far reaching the commandment go. They are not meant to be just literally followed. They are meant to be followed in the heart as well. Not a word left Christ's lips that did away with the ten commandments.

We are to love God with all our heart, soul, and mind, and we are to love our neighbour as ourselves. This Jesus commanded us to do. These are but summaries of the law, as Jesus showed, and as Paul showed.

Christ said it is easier for heaven and earth to pass than for one tittle of the law to fail:

Luke 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.

Then He continued:

Luke 16:18 Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery.

If you put away your wife, and marry another, you commit adultery. Has adultery passed away? Was Jesus telling us that adultery was only until John? Or does Jesus show how far reaching the adultery commandment is here? Does Jesus do away with any of the Ten Commandments? No, not a single one.


You are not under the law, but being under the law has not given you a license to break it. If you are in Christ, you have no condemnation when you fail. But you are to repent, and stand up again. If you refuse to keep the law at all, how can you be in Christ? Christ did not such works.

The New Covenant may not be like the Old Covenant. But it certainly contains the Ten Commandments, which were in the Old and are in the New, written in our hearts, which are found in heaven.

Revelation 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

What is in the ark of his testament? I have done a study on this, but the only reason the ark has a name other than "ark" is because of the Ten Commandments. Not until the Ten Commandments were placed in the ark was the ark called either ark of the testimony, or ark of the covenant. The Ten Commandments are called the Tables of Testimony & The Tables of the Covenant. And yes, testament and covenant are used interchangeably.

Within the ark of the testament, contains the original testament found in heaven. The Ten Commandments written upon this planet are a copy of that which was written in heaven first. It is the same as the sanctuary services, which were similar of that which is actually done in heaven by the Son of God.

This Great Original Testament is obeyed even by the angels.

Psalms 103:20 Bless the LORD, ye his angels, that excel in strength, that do his commandments, hearkening unto the voice of his word.

We are to obey the Ten Commandments. Every single precept.

Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Revelation 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

 

[from scratch]

Ok, so please respond to what I said and the disagreement you have with it please.

I thought I did. you talked about a conditional covenant being broken and I agreed. I also talked about the New Covenant we have which is a replacement and non conditional on our part except acceptance.

Are you asking what I have against the Old Covenant? The answer is nothing as it doesn't apply in part or whole to me as a Christian. Have I forbade any to observe the law? if so where? I certainly have referred people to Gal 5:4 which says one must choose between the covenants. To choose the covenant of the law means one rejects salvation as the verse states.

 

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SDR stands for Seventh Day Remnant.

Thanks. Essentially there is no difference. The SoF is basically the same as the SDA SoF.

What prophets predicted that the 10 commandments would pass away? We have prophesies of the law being exalted and being written in our hearts, not passing away.

I suggest you read the Bible for yourself and not through the lens of your church. Yes I know that sounds like obfuscation. But I read your next comment which quotes only 1/3 of a sentence. This is common of the SDA and your flavor SDR apparently. My I suggest you consider and study the previous 2 verses with at leas a concordance actually defining the words used. I highly recommend Bible Hub: Search, Read, Study the Bible in Many Languages I think you should also consider more closely the words of Moses in Exodus and Deuteronomy on the covenant and the law.

Jeremiah 31:33

Isaiah 42:21

I present you with John 1:17, 15:10 for starters.

That same law that God wrote with His finger in stone, is the same law that is written in our hearts. Here is a perfect example of the law being written in the hearts of the Gentiles.

Like I said you need to study Jeremiah 31:31- and 32 with the site I directed you to. It isn't put out by any church I've ever been affiliated with to my knowledge.

Romans 2:13-15

The Bible says there are no doers of the law in Ps 14, 53 and Rom 3:23, so you're outa luck. And don't tell me you keep the Sabbath according to Ex 20:8-11.

The New Covenant writes the law in our hearts.

No Madam it doesn't say that anywhere in the Bible. Now quote me again Jer 31:33. Verse 32 says not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake that Moses identified as the Ten Commandments in Deut 4:13. Moses further said this covenant wasn't given to any one else. in 5:3

Hebrews 10:16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

Unfortunately this My law spoken about isn't the law issued at Sinai as chapter 8 and Jeremiah 31 show.

As for the Law being a transcript of God's character, consider the following similarities, then notice what is blatantly written within the law:

LAW - Romans 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

While you ignore verse 6. Verse 6 in no way interferes with v 12 with which I agree to.

GOD - Isaiah 45:21 Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.

Matthew 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

These 2 quotes in series promote a lie unintended by the Speaker and the author. Your meaning disagrees with the Psalms I referred your to. Jesus can't do that. Jesus showed that no one can comply and is the reason the rich young ruler left dejected. Note that Jesus didn't argue with him about the keeping of the law. The law provides no salvation. It only provides for death and is justly called the ministration of death.

God is holy, just, and good. The law is holy, just, and good.

Agreed! How bout them cookies?

LAW - Psalms 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

GOD - Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Not in the sense you intend to imply. Here is where some personal study would do you a great deal of good. Your intention with these 2 verses is to show Jesus issued the Ten Commandments. Moses didn't talk to Jesus at Sinai.

Psalms 18:32 It is God that girdeth me with strength, and maketh my way perfect.
The law of the LORD is perfect, and God is perfect. The law converts the soul, and it is God that works on our heart to convert it, making our path perfect.

I think this is a misunderstood passage by you as indicated by your idea of Mat 5:48.

LAW - Psalms 119:152 Concerning thy testimonies, I have known of old that thou hast founded them for ever.

GOD - Psalms 102:12 But thou, O LORD, shalt endure for ever; and thy remembrance unto all generations.

The testimonies shall last forever, just as God shall last forever.

IOW there is no New Covenant.

LAW - Proverbs 6:23 For the commandment is a lamp; and the law is light; and reproofs of instruction are the way of life:

Yes madam.

GOD - 1 John 1:5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

Certainly madam.

2 Samuel 22:29 For thou art my lamp, O LORD: and the LORD will lighten my darkness.

The commandment is a lamp, and the law is light. God is a lamp, and God is light.

LAW -Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

See verse 6. The school teacher has done his job and is dismissed. Gal 3:24, 25.

GOD - Hebrews 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

If Jesus is your high priest He is a sinner and violates the law. Fortunately the law no longer has jurisdiction. LK 24:44 shows Mat 5:17-18 to be completed and allows for Heb 7:12 without a violation of the law. All priests were from Levi according to the law. So jots and tittles of the law have indeed passed.

The law is not sin, and Christ was tempted in all points like we are, yet is without sin. And, obviously, Christ and His Father are not sin. Moving on to directly what is contained within the law:

Who said it was?

LAW - Exodus 20:5-6 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; 6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

And to whom is this given to? And why are you using it? I'm not threatened.

GOD - Exodus 33:19 And he said, I will make all my goodness pass before thee, and I will proclaim the name of the LORD before thee; and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy.

Exodus 34:5-7 And the LORD descended in the cloud, and stood with him there, and proclaimed the name of the LORD. 6 And the LORD passed by before him, and proclaimed, The LORD, The LORD God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth, 7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth generation.

So....

Exodus 34:14 For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:

Are you suggesting something here?

Written in the law is God's character, a merciful God who forgives iniquity of those that love Him and keep His commandments. We learn that God is a jealous God. We learn that God visits iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children.

LAW - Exodus 20:2 I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.

GOD - John 8:34-36 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin. 35 And the servant abideth not in the house for ever: but the Son abideth ever. 36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

What makes one free? Is it the law? No its a Who that makes one free. See my signature.

God brought the Israelites out of the house of bondage the same way that we Christians are freed from our bondage of sin. Freedom from bondage to sin is proclaimed even in the law.

Where is this? Please quote it.

LAW - Exodus 20:8-11 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: 10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: 11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Seeing this condemns you I've no idea why you quoted it.

GOD - Genesis 2:1-3

What does this passage say? I don't find the word Sabbath in the whole book of Genesis. And while we're here where does it say anything about man's participation? Why does this day not end like all the other days of creation?

The law tells us that God is our Creator. God commands us to work for six days, and rest upon the seventh day as He did. This is what God did during creation week. He worked for six days, and rested upon the seventh. How can we not keep this day as a memorial to God? The day that God made for man, and did not make man for? In creation week, He rested upon the seventh day, blessed it, and set it apart for holy use. So the day that God made for man, man is to set aside for God.

You need to study the word rested which is the same word God used about the Sabbath through His prophet.

And for the obvious, let us not forget that Jesus kept all 10 commandments. The righteousness of the law is to be fulfilled in us.

Yes madam. Now what did Jesus tell us to do?

If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Note Jesus didn't tell us to keep His Father's commandments.

Romans 8:4

If we are not obeying the 10 commandments, how can we say that the righteousness of the law is fulfilled in us? It is Christ in us who keeps the commandments. And if we refuse to do that, then is Christ in us?

I don't think you understand what you said here. And the commandments are carnal.

It is a mistake to divide the commandments and say that one is only of Jesus and the other is only the Father's.

Divide what commandments? Jesus said very plainly His commandments aren't the Father's commandments. Jesus also said I give you a new commandment. If this is so it can't be the Father's commandment.

John 8:28 Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.

John 10:30 I and my Father are one.

Ah the classic Jesus is the Father statement. What you're trying to show here violates your SoF that I read.

The words that Jesus spake are life.

John 6:63.

Yes madam.

And as Jesus said, if we are to enter into life, keep the commandments.

Only when taken out of context which violates the Psalms. I don't need Paul's words here.

Matthew 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

see above comments.

What commandments did Jesus mean?

Matthew 19:18-19

Jesus mentions murder, adultery, theft, lying, and honouring our parents. Then He says, "and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself". Paul commandments virtually the same thing in Romans 13.

None of which include the Sabbath. Why?

Romans 13:8-10

Paul mentions adultery, murder, theft, lying, false witness, and if there be any other commandment it is briefly comprehended in the saying, thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Paul didn't mention honouring our parents, and Christ didn't mention coveting. Yet Christ mentioned honouring our parents and Paul mentioned coveting. Paul also said if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended as love thy neighbour as thyself. The commandment Paul did not mention explicitly was covered by thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. The commandment that Christ did not mention explicitly was covered by the same words. Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself is a brief comprehension (a summary) of any and all of the last six commandments.

You obviously don't read Paul very well, if at all.

Matthew 22:37-40

The two great commandments are likened unto each other. They are similar in some manners. You cannot keep one and not keep the other. If you love your neighbour, you will love God. If you love God, you will love your neighbour.

So why don't you keep the law (specifically the 4th commandment)?

Whew!!! I wasn't going to tie into your post. Now I must walk the dogs in the dark. Rats. Sorry I had to limit your quotes to references to post. I typically break these long posts into several but got in a hurry and spent more time editing than I would have by doing several posts.

 

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THIS IS THE OTHER PART OF MY RESPONSE.

God was not only speaking to Israel when the 10 commandments were being proclaimed. Please notice that the stranger is included in the 4th commandment. Indeed, it is the stranger that is within the gates of an Israelite, but still the stranger was to keep the Sabbath. The stranger that joined himself to the Lord is also to keep the Sabbath as well.

You did read that God told Moses to call the COI did you? God didn't say call the COI and the stranger(s). The stranger is mentioned and not addressed. Further more if you care to read the commandment is only about the stranger with in their gates. This lets me out and doesn't apply to me even if there was no New Covenant. If you want to apply it to all gentiles as your following quotes shows, all gentiles must comply with Ex 12:48 which makes them as one born in the land and no longer are they strangers.

Isaiah 56:6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

We are the sons of the stranger, the Gentiles, that joined ourselves to the Lord. We are to keep the seventh day Sabbath. Yet not only this commandment are we to keep. We are to keep all the commandments. For not hearers of the law are justified, but the doers of the law shall be justified, as Romans 2:13 tells us. Notice that it does not say that we are justified by doing the law, but we who do it shall be justified. Those who refuse to obey the commandments will not be just before God.

Sorry we're not sons of the stranger. Well at least I'm not or can't trace my linage back far enough. Not a single one of my known relatives joined the covenant made with Israel that I know of. I'm not about to either. I've gat a better covenant based on promises - not law. All I have to do is accept the covenant and there is no performance requirements list I need to check. The Spirit won't lead me to sin and doesn't lead me to the law I've been delivered from.

I cannot control what mankind does upon the Sabbath, I can only control what I do on the Sabbath. If mankind wants to spend Sabbath fixing the road, I am not in trouble for driving to church while they fix the road. If mankind wants to stock their stores on the Sabbath, I am not in trouble for going into the store after Sabbath to buy food. So as for using electricity from a business on the Sabbath, I am in more trouble than using a gas heater to stay warm on the Sabbath.

Typical SDA opinion that amends the law. If you use electricity that goes through a meter you're doing business receiving goods on account requiring another to work. That madam violates the 4th you quoted to me.

If you drive to church on the Sabbath you've mounted your ass and commanded him/her to work also forbidden by the 4th. BTW a vehicle is the modern day beast of burden replacing the ass and ox. My SDA neighbor says his truck is a vehicle when drives it to church and an ox when it gets in the ditch. This way he avoids violating the commandment on both accounts -NOT! He succeeds in lying only to himself. Every one else knows the truth. Do we need to mention the other things such as NG and water?

Now consider Ex 16 on the matter. They were to stay in their tent.

Yes, we are not justified by the law. Those who do the law to justify themselves will be in the same boat as those who do not do the law at all. But those who accept Christ's sacrifice and obey shall be just before God. There is no condemnation in those who are in Christ Jesus.

Sorry but that isn't found in the Gospel and Jesus says any who do anything else besides go through the Door are thieves - John 10.

Galatians 5:19-21 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Is adultery a violation of the law? What about Idolatry? Hatred? Murders?

Paul isn't addressing the law here. He's addressing sin (works of the flesh).

If you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. But what does the Bible say? Although you are not under the law, you are still not allowed to break the law, that being the ten commandments of course.

Now wait a minute there sweetie. Now allowed to break the law or not allowed to sin? Didn't Paul say God forbid in Romans 6:1? And you even quoted v 15 below. Yes I know you all sin is a violation of the law. Where does the law require faith? But not having it is sin (Rom 14:23) stated exactly the same way as the often half quoted 1 John 3:4.

Romans 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

You cannot worship other Gods, worship idols, take the Lord's name in vain, break the Sabbath, dishonour your parents, kill, commit adultery, steal, lie, or commit adultery simply because you are not under the law.

Here you're more talking one can't sin rather than violate the law which has no jurisdiction. We have a New Covenant which means the other one has nothing to say to the Christian just like Paul says. The word under implies obligation to. Delivered from means no longer obligated to just like not under.

Now Paul speaks about circumcision in Galatians 5, and there is nothing here that has me telling you to be circumcised. We are to keep the 10 commandments, that is what I am telling you. The words of Christ, and the words also of Paul show that the commandments still must be kept.

No madam. you didn't read v 4 did you? It says make a choice for the law or grace. If you choose the law you have no salvation.

Jesus did teach the law.

Nope He didn't madam.

For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.

Matthew 19:17-19 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. 18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, 19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Is Jesus telling someone to do something impossible? Nope! He's giving a fool his demanded answer. Now the fool (rich young ruler) said he had done all those thing from his youth and Jesus commended him on the truth - so explain why he left dejected. Doesn't the Palms ring true here? I think so.

Jesus taught that we are to do the commandments if we are to enter into life. He Himself mentioned five of the commandments, then we see "and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself." If we do those things, we shall love our neighbour as ourselves. Jesus did not leave out the 10 commandments. Jesus magnified the law, and made it honourable. He showed how far reaching the commandment go. They are not meant to be just literally followed. They are meant to be followed in the heart as well. Not a word left Christ's lips that did away with the ten commandments.

My advice is to read John 10.

We are to love God with all our heart, soul, and mind, and we are to love our neighbour as ourselves. This Jesus commanded us to do. These are but summaries of the law, as Jesus showed, and as Paul showed.

So explain how one could love and commit any of those things. Impossible. But that isn't teaching the law or the Ten Commandments.

Christ said it is easier for heaven and earth to pass than for one tittle of the law to fail:

Luke 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.

Yet didn't you say Jesus a priest? How can this be seeing the law requires a priest to be from the tribe of Levi. Wouldn't hat make Jesus a sinner? So how can this be? Easy madam, jots and tittles have passed from the law. Al things were fulfilled according to the words of Jesus in LK 24:44 a direct explanation of Mat 5:17-18. Don't keep the Ten Commandments? Oh yeah I keep forgetting they've been amended to allow for modern conveniences. Who gave that authority? Naw, you don't keep the Sabbath, atleast the one in the Ten Commandments.

Then He continued:

Luke 16:18 Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery.

If you put away your wife, and marry another, you commit adultery. Has adultery passed away? Was Jesus telling us that adultery was only until John? Or does Jesus show how far reaching the adultery commandment is here? Does Jesus do away with any of the Ten Commandments? No, not a single one.

That isn't a fair question. Was adultery a sin before the law or did the law create sin? Romans 5:13 says sin was before the law. Gal 3:19 says the law was added because of transgression (sin).

You are not under the law, but being under the law has not given you a license to break it. If you are in Christ, you have no condemnation when you fail. But you are to repent, and stand up again. If you refuse to keep the law at all, how can you be in Christ? Christ did not such works.

If one isn't obligated to something they can't violate it. You're saying license to sin in a PC way to avoid the rules here.

Lets say you married another after the divorce. Now what you repent and get forgiveness of your sin. Are you now to sin with another divorce and sin yet more by taking back your divorced spouse? What a web we weave.

The New Covenant may not be like the Old Covenant. But it certainly contains the Ten Commandments, which were in the Old and are in the New, written in our hearts, which are found in heaven.

No madam it doesn't like the verses I quoted. You've just published a double tongued statement.

Revelation 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

What is in the ark of his testament? I have done a study on this, but the only reason the ark has a name other than "ark" is because of the Ten Commandments. Not until the Ten Commandments were placed in the ark was the ark called either ark of the testimony, or ark of the covenant. The Ten Commandments are called the Tables of Testimony & The Tables of the Covenant. And yes, testament and covenant are used interchangeably.

Within the ark of the testament, contains the original testament found in heaven. The Ten Commandments written upon this planet are a copy of that which was written in heaven first. It is the same as the sanctuary services, which were similar of that which is actually done in heaven by the Son of God.

So... what is your proof?

This Great Original Testament is obeyed even by the angels.

Psalms 103:20 Bless the LORD, ye his angels, that excel in strength, that do his commandments, hearkening unto the voice of his word.

We are to obey the Ten Commandments. Every single precept.

I feel sorry for you. The Palms testify against you. and thus you have no salvation. The wages o f sin is death but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus - not the law. You can have my wages - I don't want them. I love the gift much more.

Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

it appears you don't know either.

Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

You have no idea what this talking about. You think its the Ten commandments just like the above verse you quoted.

Revelation 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

ditto - No one can have the right to the tree of life through the law. You can't obligate God. You can only have access through Jesus like He said John 10.

 

[LarryP2]

In order to understand the law, one must first grapple with the way Judaism has interpreted its own law. First and foremost, there is no such thing in Judaism as "The Ten Commandments." There are 613 Commandments in Judaism, each of which is equally important. You keep all or none of them. This is the understanding of the Apostles when they wrote about "The Law." The "4th Commandment" is subsumed into this body of 613 commandments. You are not allowed to opportunistically pick and choose whatever parts of the Mosaic law that are merely convenient for you to keep. Judaism bans Gentiles from keeping the Sabbath. It enforces the prohibition against Gentiles keeping the Sabbath with the Death Penalty. You must fully convert to Judaism if you wish to keep ANY of the 613. The seven Noahide laws are the laws that apply to Gentiles, under the overall structure of Jewish law.

At the Council of Jerusalem in 50 AD, the Apostles decided that it was unnecessary for the Gentile Christians to keep the Jewish laws. Only the Noahide laws applied to the Gentiles, and Sabbath Keeping is emphatically not one of those. For a Christian to insist on Sabbath keeping reeks of historical and cultural ignorance. Do you have ANY idea of how offensive it is to observant Jews for some ignorant Christian to announce they are "keeping the Sabbath?"

Keeping the Jewish law of the Sabbath is completely and irrevocably non-Christian. If you want to keep the Sabbath, then by all means convert to Judaism.

 

[maco]

Do you have ANY idea of how offensive it is to observant Jews for some ignorant Christian to announce they are "keeping the Sabbath?"

The religious Jews get very mad when Gentiles honor the seventh day because they, just like you, think the Sabbath is only for the Jews.

Acts 13:44-45 On the next Sabbath day, almost the whole city gathered to hear the word of the Lord. When the Jews saw the crowds, they became very jealous. They said evil things against what Paul was saying.

But God thinks differently. God says the Sabbath is for all people. He wants His house to be a house of prayer for all nations.

Isaiah 56:6-8 “I will also bless the Gentiles who commit themselves to the Lord, who serve him and love his name, who worship him and do not desecrate the Sabbath day of rest, and who hold fast to my covenant. I will bring them to my holy mountain of Jerusalem and will fill them with joy in my house of prayer. I will accept their burnt offerings and sacrifices, because my House will be called a house of prayer for all nations. For the Sovereign Lord, who brings back the outcasts of Israel, says: I will bring others, too,besides my people Israel.”

 

[LarryP2]

The point I was trying to make is that NO modern Sabbatarians are actually keeping the Sabbath. They THINK they are. They CLAIM they are. They really want the rest of us to accept their claims, as though we are supposed to not think of how ridiculous and absurd they are.

But they are not. They are not even CLOSE to keeping it. And at the same time, their cultish Ebionite Heresy drives them to imagine themselves superior to other Christians who worship the Resurrected Christ instead of their dead special Jewish.

Modern Sabbatarians are similar to an adolescent that fantasizes they are a brilliant General because they have watched a war movie. The "Sabbath" that Sabbatarians THINK they are keeping is a hilarious, Americanized Processed Cheese Product version of the Sabbath. It bears NO resemblance to the Real Thing. American protestant "Sabbath Keepers" resemble someone that thinks Pizza Hut serves Italian food, or that Doritos are genuine Mexican food.

Christians who worship on Sunday have abandoned the laughably-absurd delusion that ANYBODY who is not a Jew is keeping the Sabbath.