Seats in European Parliament for Russia and Ukraine

[Love365]

Russia and Ukraine need seats in European Parliament.

 

[Desk trauma]

Then they should go through the process of qualifying for them.

 

[Love365]

Then they should go through the process of qualifying for them.

They live in Europe.

Locking them out is dumb and dangerous.

 

[Desk trauma]

They live in Europe.

Which allows them to make the reforms needed and apply for membership.

Locking them out is dumb and dangerous.

They are not locked out, they are free to make reforms and apply for membership.

 

[Love365]

Which allows them to make the reforms needed and apply for membership.


They are not locked out, they are free to make reforms and apply for membership.

Between 1993 and 2014,
did France, Germany, or the United States,
ever say in public that Russia could join the European Union?

 

[Gene2memE]

Russia actively rejects the notion of EU membership. It has in the past and it still does today.

Russia doesn't want to be in the EU.

 

[Love365]

Russia actively rejects the notion of EU membership. It has in the past and it still does today.

Russia doesn't want to be in the EU.

Russia rejects the EU because
the EU rejects Russia.

If the European Union wrote love letters to Russia,
Russia might want to join the EU.

 

[Desk trauma]

Between 1993 and 2014,
did France, Germany, or the United States,
ever say in public that Russia could join the European Union?

Don’t know nor care.

 

[Arcangl86]

Russia rejects the EU because
the EU rejects Russia.

If the European Union wrote love letters to Russia,
Russia might want to join the EU.

No, Russia rejects the EU because joining the EU requires some ceding of sovereignty which Russia will not do.

 

[Love365]

No, Russia rejects the EU because joining the EU requires some ceding of sovereignty which Russia will not do.

Like what?

 

[Arcangl86]

Like what?

Like being bound to European legislation, even if they disagree with it.

 

[Love365]

Like being bound to European legislation, even if they disagree with it.

Laws related to carbon emissions or gay marriage are too Left wing for Russia to follow.

Let them opt out of laws like that.

 

[Arcangl86]

Laws related to carbon emissions or gay marriage are too Left wing for Russia to follow.

Let them opt out of laws like that.

Which would defeat the whole purpose of the EU.

 

[Love365]

Which would defeat the whole purpose of the EU.

The purpose of the European Union is to stop wars,
by having debate in Parliament.

 

[Gene2memE]

The purpose of the European Union is to stop wars,
by having debate in Parliament.

No. It isn't.

 

[Love365]

No. It isn't.

Do you support free speech?

 

[Arcangl86]

The purpose of the European Union is to stop wars,
by having debate in Parliament.

Uh, no. While the origins are to stop war, it was by ensuring the market for strategic resources were so integrated that it wouldn't be possible for a single member to engage in war with the others. Now peace is still a goal of the EU but so is general human development and they do it through economic regulations. The Parliament is there to help determine what those regulations end up being, not to be a debating society or forum for intergovernmental conversation.

 

[Gene2memE]

Do you support free speech?

Yes.

That has nothing to do with the topic at hand though. Russia has freedom of speech. It can't speak at a particular venue, because it's not a member of the group that gets to use the venue. Just being in Europe isn't enough (ask Turkey, or the UK).

If I can't speak to the National Press Club, because I'm not a member of that organisation, how does that impinge on my free speech?

Russia rejects the EU because the EU rejects Russia.

Yes. It might have something to do with Russia being an authoritarian state that doesn't follow international law....

If the European Union wrote love letters to Russia, Russia might want to join the EU.

I'll be an egomaniac and quote myself from early May on the same topic:

Russia doesn't want in join the European Parliament. Because, in order to do so they'll need to join the EU. And, in order to join the EU, they'll need to do a couple little things.​

​

Like having a working democracy with open, free and fair elections monitored by international observers.​

Along with conforming to EU political, security and economic aims set by the Council, Commission and Parliament.​

They'd also have to meet basic human rights standards as laid down by the European Court of Justice and European Court of Human Rights, along with adopting EU rules and regulations.​

They'd need a government that works to the rule of law - which means they'd not only need to end fighting in Ukraine, but they'd need to give back Crimea and the parts of Georgia it has occupied, as well as the parts of Moldova where it's in de factor control.​

Their economy would also have to be completely retooled to meet the stable market economy provisions and to adopt the euro.​

​

​

Russia COULD try to meet the Copenhagen Criteria for EU entry, but the country's present leadership doesn't want ANY of that. It's up to Russia to meet the criteria for membership. It not up to the EU to circumvent its own rules for Russia's gratification.​

 

[Love365]

Back when the UK was in the EU,
they kept using the British Pound.

 

[Gene2memE]

Back when the UK was in the EU,
they kept using the British Pound.

Because they negotiated an exception as signatories to the Treat of Maastricht in the early 1990s. That the sort of leverage you what you get when you've participated in common European economic institutions for the previous 20+ years.

If you think that after Brexit the EU is going to allow another currency opt out, I've got real-estate in Atlantis I'd like to sell to you.