Why are you a Baptist?

[Markie Boy]

Amen, well said ! And we do thank God for His mercy and that it's new every day.

So I need to go look at those passages, but you laid it out well enough to peek my interest.

Can I ask - do you believe in the Once Saved Always Saved perspective? Heads up - looking to learn here - not stir the pot.

 

[atpollard]

Can I ask - do you believe in the Once Saved Always Saved perspective? Heads up - looking to learn here - not stir the pot.

"Once Saved Always Saved" means different things to different people.

• I believe THIS: God most certainly finishes what God starts.
  • John 6:37-40 [NASB] "Everything that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I certainly will not cast out. For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that of everything that He has given Me I will lose nothing, but will raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day."
  • Philippians 2:13 [NASB] "for it is God who is at work in you, both to desire and to work for His good pleasure."

• I do not believe THIS: People can be saved and continue to live like reprobates (unsaved destined for hell).
  • Matthew 7:21-27 [NASB] "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?' And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; LEAVE ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.' Therefore, everyone who hears these words of Mine, and acts on them, will be like a wise man who built his house on the rock. And the rain fell and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and yet it did not fall, for it had been founded on the rock. And everyone who hears these words of Mine, and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand. And the rain fell and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell--and its collapse was great."
  • Romans 6:1-2 [NASB] "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase? Far from it! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?"
  • Galatians 6:7-8 [NASB] "Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a person sows, this he will also reap. For the one who sows to his own flesh will reap destruction from the flesh, but the one who sows to the Spirit will reap eternal life from the Spirit."

Color Code:

• Jesus Said
• Apostle Said

 

[Dave G.]

So I need to go look at those passages, but you laid it out well enough to peek my interest.

Can I ask - do you believe in the Once Saved Always Saved perspective? Heads up - looking to learn here - not stir the pot.

I think the key to this is many think they are saved, they sit in churches every Sunday, they do a great job of looking the part. Yet actually are not born again believers, they practice religion but there was never that relationship with Jesus Christ. Because the evidence is fruit of the Spirit or put another way the changed man. Once truly born again the progression of things is change, you are not who you were in terms of your heart. There should be some evidence of that measured by the fruit even initially but the rest will come over time.

Also while there will be some works, as we are saved unto good works. But the attributes of the fruit of the Spirit is in our attitude in Galatians 5:22-23.

Galatians 5:22-23​

Amplified Bible​

22 But the fruit of the Spirit [the result of His presence within us] is love [unselfish concern for others], joy, [inner] peace, patience [not the ability to wait, but how we act while waiting], kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control. Against such things there is no law.

If sealed unto the day of redemption means anything ( and it certainly does) I doubt a true reborn person would walk away from the faith and leave Jesus. And I even question if they could. Back slide ? Sure, but that's not walking away. No they go out from us but were never of us.

 

[dunk_x]

I grew up in a baptist church in my elementary school-age years, then in middle school age we began attending another church planted by our baptist church. That church then became a mega-church. I much prefer the baptst church instead of the mega churches. When I read the Baptists statement of faith, I agree with what it states more than other denominations.

 

[Markie Boy]

I think the key to this is many think they are saved, they sit in churches every Sunday, they do a great job of looking the part. Yet actually are not born again believers, they practice religion but there was never that relationship with Jesus Christ. Because the evidence is fruit of the Spirit or put another way the changed man. Once truly born again the progression of things is change, you are not who you were in terms of your heart. There should be some evidence of that measured by the fruit even initially but the rest will come over time.

Also while there will be some works, as we are saved unto good works. But the attributes of the fruit of the Spirit is in our attitude in Galatians 5:22-23.

Galatians 5:22-23​

Amplified Bible​

22 But the fruit of the Spirit [the result of His presence within us] is love [unselfish concern for others], joy, [inner] peace, patience [not the ability to wait, but how we act while waiting], kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control. Against such things there is no law.

If sealed unto the day of redemption means anything ( and it certainly does) I doubt a true reborn person would walk away from the faith and leave Jesus. And I even question if they could. Back slide ? Sure, but that's not walking away. No they go out from us but were never of us.

That was pretty well put. I struggled with the idea that was presented to me that someone could "get saved", and never their whole life show any works.

But yet, there are so many warnings of apostasy in the New Testament, along with Jesus' statement to "Strive to enter through the narrow gate", and abiding in Him. Why bother warning of apostasy, and not just stress the "get saved so you are good to go" aspect.

 

[mourningdove~]

That was pretty well put. I struggled with the idea that was presented to me that someone could "get saved", and never their whole life show any works.

I have been wondering what kind of 'works' you might be expecting 'to see'?

I do get what you are saying ... truly, I do ... but I personally have learned to be very careful in attempting to judge the works ... fruit ... I see or do not see in others' lives, because sometimes there ARE indeed works, and fruit, but these have been, and are being, expressed more privately in a person's life, and for a variety of different reasons. The works, the fruit, are there. I just cannot always 'see' them ... but God does.

 

[Markie Boy]

I have been wondering what kind of 'works' you might be expecting 'to see'?

I do get what you are saying ... truly, I do ... but I personally have learned to be very careful in attempting to judge the works ... fruit ... I see or do not see in others' lives, because sometimes there ARE indeed works, and fruit, but these have been, and are being, expressed more privately in a person's life, and for a variety of different reasons. The works, the fruit, are there. I just cannot always 'see' them ... but God does

I hear you. I guess what I was referring to is when you see explicitly wrong actions, where you should be seeing right ones. It's not as much the lack of or good works you don't see, but the things you do see that should be good but are not.

 

[Dave G.]

I have been wondering what kind of 'works' you might be expecting 'to see'?

I do get what you are saying ... truly, I do ... but I personally have learned to be very careful in attempting to judge the works ... fruit ... I see or do not see in others' lives, because sometimes there ARE indeed works, and fruit, but these have been, and are being, expressed more privately in a person's life, and for a variety of different reasons. The works, the fruit, are there. I just cannot always 'see' them ... but God does.

Who Markie was replying to was me and my post on the fruit of the Spirit/ what we call the changed man ( or woman of course). Mourningdove, the evidence is in our new nature.Sometimes it's just we don't do or desire the sinful past things we might have done. Or a willingness to pray.. Etc. And while you may or may not head on down to the soup kitchen to serve up bowls of soup, you certainly may desire to pray for those who do or for those who show up. These are new desires that rise up inside of us that didn't before.

Some of it is just following a desire the Holy Spirit puts on your heart. Not many years ago, I received this compelling need to go the hospital and pray and read for 15-30 minutes or so in the chapel. It went on three days in a row. I always wrote a prayer or scripture in the register. I had no idea why I was going there but the order of things seemed to be to go and pray. On the third day, I saw someone had written into the register, they or she had lost 2 little girls. It didn't say how but my heart just poured out. I thought that was all but while there I got this compelling need to pray for the doctors and administrators, again not sure just why. But in particular to pray for their wisdom. Then it was done. But that wasn't all because covid hit next. I wanted to go back to the chapel and pray but the hospital was closed to that type of visitor. No my opportunity was right then when I believe the Spirit was moving me to go. Only two people know that I did this, least till right now. One said that I can pray anywhere, you don't have to go the the hospital chapel ! Well that's true but it's also not what the Holy Spirit seemed to be laying on my heart. The other was my then wife, who didn't question it at all. She later died at home, they think she floated a massive clot giving her a heart attack.

 

[Christopher0121]

I'm learning that it is because I was chosen before the foundation of the world.

However, my story is a long one. I'll shorten it.

In my earliest memories my mom identified as being Southern Baptist. She had just gone through a divorce and wasn't attending church at the time. A neighbor invited her to a Pentecostal church. Turns out, it was Oneness Pentecostal. I served there until I was 33 years old. I even served in ministry.

When I was 33 years old my wife left me. I was devastated. She left to escape what she recognized as spiritual abuse. I don't blame her. The Oneness Pentecostal church I was attended was very legalistic (UPCI). Naturally I was removed from ministry. That didn't bother me. In fact, after my wife left it was a relief not to have to get up in front of everyone. However, the phone stopped ringing. The invitations to go out to eat or fellowship that was routine with my friends dried up almost over night. The church didn't seem to know what to do with a divorced person who was in ministry. Eventually, discouraged, feeling abandoned, and experiencing a lot of self-loathing I left the church. I tried to attend another UPCI church, but church had become a very painful subject for me. It hurt to even drive into the parking lot. And since this church had members who fellowshipped my old church, it seemed forming friendships was an uphill battle. It became so disheartening, I quit going to church altogether and I closed the door on the idea of ever attending a church.

I began dating a woman and soon it turned into a long term relationship. We had both been married before and so the idea of getting married wasn't a priority for either of us. During this time my wife had began seeing someone else, but she and I became really really good friends. Me and my new love interest dated for about 12 years. The relationship became increasingly toxic in the final couple years. My ex-wife and my best friend both had an intervention with me and begged me to consider leaving the woman I was seeing. I took everything they said to heart. And so I decided that yes, I had to leave. I had spent a week planning my escape. One day after she went to work, I called me friend and we moved me out. My ex-wife put me up in a hotel to ensure I had a place to go. Would you believe my ex paid for me to stay in a hotel for 3 months??? I thank God for my ex-wife.

So, now I was on my own. I eventually found my own place and got on my feet. Then it happened... I had a heart attack. While in the hospital I just laid there looking at the ceiling thinking about my son (with my first love) and fearing I'd die and leave him without a dad. I was in and out of consciousness and I was heavily medicated. I simply prayed that God would have mercy on me. While in recovery I began reading my Bible. I began to see the Trinity on nearly every page of the NT. I began to also see God's grace and total control on ever page of the Bible. I didn't know what was happening to me.

Being Oneness Pentecostal most of my life I couldn't believe I was actually seeing the Trinity on the pages of the Bible. I had only attended Oneness Pentecostal churches, so I didn't know where to start. So... I started with the oldest tradition I could find. There is a Catholic church a few blocks from my house, so I began attending. I took instructions as a catechumen but, when it became time to officially become Catholic, I declined. I just couldn't believe what they believed. I couldn't practice what they practiced. I tried. I even had an altar at home where I prayed my Rosary and did my Lectio Divina. I really really, tried. I understood their tradition and what they claimed was the biblical bases for their tradition, but I couldn't see it in Scripture. So, I closed the door on Catholicism.

I visited Eastern Orthodox, and it just felt like a more confused version of Catholicism.

I didn't know what to do. I was starting to feel discouraged again. So, I began studying on my own. I discovered that the notion of God's being in total control is called "sovereignty". This spoke to me deeply. After my heart attack I had seen this in Scripture and I realized God was in total control because the day of the heart attack all my plans for my life at that point were forever changed. I certainly wasn't in as much control as I had assumed. As I began studying God's sovereignty I stumbled upon the doctrines of grace (TULIP). And as I studied TULIP I stumbled on this old confession I had never heard of.... the 1689 London Baptist Confession of Faith. As I began reading it just to know more about it, it began to really resonate with me. I would weep through various chapters as I read it. It was like I was realizing who I really was in Christ Jesus for the first time in my life at 45 years old. I began studying the 1689 LBCF and the Bible side by side. I felt like my eyes were being opened. That's when memories began to flood my mind about my mom's early days when she talked about being Baptist. How my grandfather was a Baptist Sunday School teacher. And I wept as I realized... I was a Baptist. Not by my own will or effort... but by God's grace.

I then began looking for Baptist churches in my area and discovered a Reformed Baptist Church that holds to the 1689 LBCF. And it was not even a full 10 minute drive from my home.

I'm still learning. But that is the why and how I became a Baptist, namely, a Reformed Baptist.

May God bless and keep all of you and yours.

Chris