Kid's Corporal Punishment - a Risk to Mental Health

[Hammster]

Does this mean that God approves of kids developing anxiety and depression later in life or is he just indifferent to it?

Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God.
— Philippians 4:6

 

[ximmix]

Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God.
— Philippians 4:6

Ok, telling anxious people not to be anxious. I'm sure that works just fine.

 

[Hammster]

Ok, telling anxious people not to be anxious. I'm sure that works just fine.

It does for God’s children.

 

[ximmix]

It does for God’s children.

But not for the ones in the OP it seems like.

 

[Hammster]

But not for the ones in the OP it seems like.

I have no idea.

 

[cow451]

Try an experiment:

Go down to the local jailhouse. Gather up all the incarcerated folks and ask them this question:

Raise your hand if you were spanked as a child. I wager that 100% of the hands will go up.

Spanking or not spanking isn't going to determine whether your parenting is adequate. Most spanking is done because it is much quicker than talking it out and using time out, etc. That makes it neither good or bad.

 

[RDKirk]

Try an experiment:

Go down to the local jailhouse. Gather up all the incarcerated folks and ask them this question:

Raise your hand if you were spanked as a child. I wager that 100% of the hands will go up.

Spanking or not spanking isn't going to determine whether your parenting is adequate. Most spanking is done because it is much quicker than talking it out and using time out, etc. That makes it neither good or bad.

Might be different if you go to a minimum security prison where the white collar criminals are.

 

[Hammster]

Try an experiment:

Go down to the local jailhouse. Gather up all the incarcerated folks and ask them this question:

Raise your hand if you were spanked as a child. I wager that 100% of the hands will go up.

Spanking or not spanking isn't going to determine whether your parenting is adequate. Most spanking is done because it is much quicker than talking it out and using time out, etc. That makes it neither good or bad.

Or some of us are just being biblical.

 

[cow451]

Might be different if you go to a minimum security prison where the white collar criminals are.

I don't play tennis anymore, so I don't get to visit the upper crust of criminality. I suspect the percentage is still very high, especially among miscreants from the former Confederate states

 

[cow451]

Or some of us are just being biblical.

Being from the South, most of the criminals I have worked with had parents/guardians that went "Old Testament" on them.

 

[Hammster]

Being from the South, most of the criminals I have worked with had parents/guardians that went "Old Testament" on them.

Sure.

 

[cow451]

Sure.

Glad we can agree. Yankees often use the saying "going Medieval". Same thing. Yankees don't tend to have the same influences as we Bible Belt dwellers.

 

[Hammster]

Glad we can agree. Yankees often use the saying "going Medieval". Same thing. Yankees don't tend to have the same influences as we Bible Belt dwellers.

Do you think kids in the Old Testament needed a different discipline than today?

 

[cow451]

Do you think kids in the Old Testament needed a different discipline than today?

Not playing today.

EDIT: I couldn't find a link that would get past censoring because it would contain a "bad word".

 

[keith99]

@Sketcher
@RDKirk

While you are thinking about the issues associated with hitting a child, consider what you expect of child minding/kindergarten/preschool/early childhood/early elementary minders/teachers when disciplining your children. These are Australian rules but I assume the US would be similar. If you expect this behaviour of people minding your child why would you not apply the same standard to yourself?

Examples of inappropriate discipline:
The following are some examples of inappropriate discipline which may constitute a serious breach of the National Law and/or National Regulations and could potentially be considered criminal matters:
• hitting, pushing, slapping, pinching or biting a child
• force-feeding a child
• yelling at or belittling a child
• humiliating a child
• physically dragging a child
• locking children away (or isolating them)
• depriving a child of food or drink
• unreasonable restraining of a child (this may include restraint in a high chair)
• excluding children from events
• consistently moving children to the office or other space away from the play areas
• moving children to another room as punishment
• verbally or physically threatening a child. Other examples of inappropriate practice are:
• negative labelling of child or family
• criticising a child’s actions or behaviours
• discouraging a child from taking part in activities
• blaming or shaming a child
• making fun of or laughing at or about a child
• using sarcastic or cruel humour with or to a child • excessive use of negative language to a child, such as, “no” “stop that!” “don’t…” “you never...”
inappropriate-discipline.pdf (acecqa.gov.au)
OB

I followed the link you provided. One very noticable lack was that there was no list of appropriate discipline. Reading the list of inappropiate discipline I wonder if they think any appropriate discipline exists.

One in particular astounded me:

criticising a child’s actions or behaviours

It seems it is inappropriate to even tell little johnny that what he did was wrong!

 

[cow451]

It seems it is inappropriate to even tell little johnny that what he did was wrong!

 

[timothyu]

Guess Putin and Zelenskyy were spanked. Superman's dad used to back the half ton over him to punish him.

 

[Mark Quayle]

Don't believe me. Go to the website I gave you in the OP (repeated below), read the summaries of the research then decide. Not only is hitting kids likely to cause problems, it has no known benefits for kids.

Hitting kids is a traditional thing which happens, often without thought, because it's part of the culture in the same way we mistreat minorities.

Research | Global Initiative to End All Corporal Punishment of Children (endcorporalpunishment.org)

OB

I notice you call it "hitting kids". Maybe you haven't considered that a crass misrepresentation of "punishment" or "correction". Let me describe to you how it is done correctly.

My father NEVER spanked me while he was angry. He also was completely consistent; if he said he would spank me, he always did. If he said that a certain infraction (whether deed or attitude) would bear a certain punishment, it always did. Then, when the time came, he first talked to me about what I had done wrong, (and that was usually the worst part of it). My rebellion was broken long before the belt was laid across my thighs. He had me to tell The Lord what I had done wrong, and that I was repenting of it, and then had me lean over the bed, and he spanked me with the belt, "to help [me] remember". Yes it hurt. Yes, I learned. Then he had me go to the person who I had wronged, whether they were child or grown up, and apologize for what I had done.

Statistics studied by those promoting an ideal are subject to disbelief. I expect we have all seen studies to the contrary —I have seen many.

 

[RDKirk]

My father NEVER spanked me while he was angry.

That is probably the critical point of any punishment, whether corporal or not. It should not be done in anger or while angry or as though angry, but be practically a matter of the natural consequence of the act. The stove is not angry at you when you get burned touching it.

He also was completely consistent; if he said he would spank me, he always did. If he said that a certain infraction (whether deed or attitude) would bear a certain punishment, it always did.

That is also an important point, whether the punishment is corporal or not. It must always happen, as surely as a natural consequence. A corollary of that point is that the infraction must be a genuine infraction. If it's not punishable one day, then it's not punishable at all; if it is punishable at all, then it must always be punishable. That's how it avoids being capricious.

Then, when the time came, he first talked to me about what I had done wrong, (and that was usually the worst part of it).

My son, at age four, actually asked me once for the swats without the talk.

But he still got the talk. A large part of that talk was about how unhappy I was to have been placed in that situation, and that was totally the truth.

I would not spank with a belt, though. I don't call that a "spanking," I call that a "whipping," and IMO that's something that was done to slaves (regardless of the fact that I did get whipped as a kid myself). My wife advised me that even my bare hand was too heavy, so my kids got swats on the bottom with a flipflop.

And then a long, quiet hug. "Let's not have to do this again, okay?"

 

[BravoM]

There is nothing wrong with it.
There is a big difference between spanking and other methods vs full on beating and hitting a child with full force or burning them.
Kids know how to push boundaries and if all you're going to do is get "loud" they will walk all over you. Teenagers are generally stupid and disobedient by default.
I see it in some family when a parent won't do it.
I wasn't the worst kid by me and my cousins did our share of bad things. I was spanked and my grandparents even used a switch from which we had to pick from a bush they grew.
I've had no lasting problems nor am "triggered" by it. The problem is parents are too soft on their children.