Has Geocentrism become less popular?

[Mark Quayle]

lol they had "the vax" ready in like 2 months after Covid appeared.

Vaccines are supposed to take 10 years in clinical trials.

Saw the two mice discussing it, "No! I'm not getting it. It hasn't even passed the human trials yet!"

 

[Hans Blaster]

lol they had "the vax" ready in like 2 months after Covid appeared.

Vaccines are supposed to take 10 years in clinical trials.

Come on, give them proper credit. The vaccine makers had a candidate vaccine complete by the end of the weekend once they had the sequenced genome of the virus. A remarkable achievement and advancement in the technologies. It took another 10 months of laboratory and human trials before it was released.

 

[Mountainmike]

lol they had "the vax" ready in like 2 months after Covid appeared.

Vaccines are supposed to take 10 years in clinical trials.

Not sure how this question arrives here,

Overzealous Drug regulation is a serious topic.
developing vaccines takes time depending on nature of vaccine and whether a “ platform“ technology is used.

But FDA trial rules for drugs in well people are way over the top, icosts far too much, takes far too long, it’s hard to even find the correct mix of patients. And the regularory bodies and insanely short patents are the reason drugs are so expensive. It is not drug companies fault!

To get a licence Requires trials in every race group, in various state of health, and condition eg pregnancy.
So it costs a huge amount, takes a very long time, and a phase 3 trial can cost 100-200m and a successful drug costs 500m.
the few successful drugs must allow for all the failures, which is why bug pharma needs huge profits.
Meanwhike it’s the medics - always the medics who contribute nothing - who cream the drug trials senseless

Its also why big pharma has a patent cliff, and it’s why there are no new antibiotics. Normally vaccine production is barely economic. Big pharma doesnt want Originator product now. Far too risky And costly.

In the case of COVID - the approvals were emergency , conditional and temporary On the basis of basic safety only.
That is why it was quick.
The drug companies demanded insurance waiver.
so far less data collected- so suspecting serious side effects isn’t “ anti vax” ,
it’s because the safety testing was all but ommitted.

It is also thanks to such as Boris Johnston it was all so quick. He funded setting up basic safety trial infrastructure and collecting patients long before there was a drug. And he ordered it before anyone knew if it worked Or would pass . EU sat on their hands. Then wanted the product on equal terms.

Society needs to rebalance risk , reward , to make drugs more economic.

The generics are a short term boon, long term disaster depriving profit used for new development.
Through present normal process it takes 7-8 years. But that’s regulator mandated. And by then not much patent is left!

 

[Edwin Wright]

I feel like there used to be more discussion of Geocentrism around. (By Geocentrism I mean the idea that while the Earth is more or less spherical, at least the rest of the solar system (and possibly the whole cosmos) orbits around a fixed Earth).

Have Geocentrists just accepted the Heliocentric structure of the Solar system while maintaining other unconventional ideas like Young Earth Creationism or space skepticism; or have they gone all the way into the almost universal science denial of Flat Earth ideas?

Check out Plane Geodesy and in particular, Science vs. Scientism and Nota Bene: The Fallacy of Spheroidal Earth Geocentrism.

 

[Edwin Wright]

Come on, give them proper credit. The vaccine makers had a candidate vaccine complete by the end of the weekend once they had the sequenced genome of the virus. A remarkable achievement and advancement in the technologies. It took another 10 months of laboratory and human trials before it was released.

I beg to differ. See Dr. David Martin's address to the European Parliament (May 2023):

.

 

[Hans Blaster]

I beg to differ. See Dr. David Martin's address to the European Parliament (May 2023):

Exactly what part of my statement are you challenging? That the teams made an initial vaccine candidate over the weekend? Or that there was 10 months of testing before the vaccine was released?

 

[Edwin Wright]

Exactly what part of my statement are you challenging? That the teams made an initial vaccine candidate over the weekend? Or that there was 10 months of testing before the vaccine was released?

Looks like you didn't watch the video.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Looks like you didn't watch the video.

Of course not. I made a statement challenging your claim and you posted a 20+ minute video. There are no "time stamps" given for quick access to the counter claim, nor any summary. This is a text board, not 4chan.

 

[Edwin Wright]

Exactly what part of my statement are you challenging? That the teams made an initial vaccine candidate over the weekend? Or that there was 10 months of testing before the vaccine was released?

Of course not. I made a statement challenging your claim and you posted a 20+ minute video. There are no "time stamps" given for quick access to the counter claim, nor any summary. This is a text board, not 4chan.

You didn't challenge my claim because I didn't make one. I challenged your claim with the video because the video established for the European Parliament that the (so-called) emergent virus had a long history of laboratory development (as even the mainstream media has now reported); hence, logic would dictate that all bets are off regarding actual vaccine development timelines unless you believe everything you hear in the news. In any case, if you can't get past the (prior) official claim regarding the ostensibly relatively recent development of the so-called vaccine (if that in fact is what it really is), it is useless to continue this exchange. Seriously, "weekend vaccine candidate" ... "10 months testing"; are you kidding me? But believe it if you must.

 

[Hans Blaster]

You didn't challenge my claim because I didn't make one. I challenged your claim with the video because the video established for the European Parliament that the (so-called) emergent virus had a long history of laboratory development (as even the mainstream media has now reported); hence, logic would dictate that all bets are off regarding actual vaccine development timelines unless you believe everything you hear in the news. In any case, if you can't get past the (prior) official claim regarding the ostensibly relatively recent development of the so-called vaccine (if that in fact is what it really is), it is useless to continue this exchange. Seriously, "weekend vaccine candidate" ... "10 months testing"; are you kidding me? But believe it if you must.

This is very sad Edwin. The creation of vaccine candidate over a weekend after the release of the SARS-CoV-2 genome was widely reported at the time (winter 2020). The vaccine they developed took 10 months before it went into release. There were safety tests, effectiveness tests, stage 2 & 3 trials and then production and distribution in the winter 2020/21. Were you sleeping that whole year? There is nothing in any "video" that will "refute" those basic facts.

 

[Edwin Wright]

You didn't challenge my claim because I didn't make one. I challenged your claim with the video because the video established for the European Parliament that the (so-called) emergent virus had a long history of laboratory development (as even the mainstream media has now reported); hence, logic would dictate that all bets are off regarding actual vaccine development timelines unless you believe everything you hear in the news. In any case, if you can't get past the (prior) official claim regarding the ostensibly relatively recent development of the so-called vaccine (if that in fact is what it really is), it is useless to continue this exchange. Seriously, "weekend vaccine candidate" ... "10 months testing"; are you kidding me? But believe it if you must.

This is very sad Edwin. The creation of vaccine candidate over a weekend after the release of the SARS-CoV-2 genome was widely reported at the time (winter 2020). The vaccine they developed took 10 months before it went into release. There were safety tests, effectiveness tests, stage 2 & 3 trials and then production and distribution in the winter 2020/21. Were you sleeping that whole year? There is nothing in any "video" that will "refute" those basic facts.

What actually refutes those "basic facts" are (1) the actual lack of efficacy (almost everyone got infected anyway, with many being hospitalized), and don't tell me that they would have been sicker without the "vaccine" (as is the standard mindless response), and (2) the 40% increase in sudden deaths among working age adults in the 3rd and 4th quarters of 2021) as reported by the insurance companies, the only anomalous factor being the (so-called) vaccine. So it was not a vaccine that was developed over a short period but something else that was developed over a much longer period. See the book "Cause Unknown" The Epidemic of Sudden Deaths in 2021 & 2022 by Edward Dowd (https://www.amazon.ca/Cause-Epidemic-Sudden-Childrens-Defense-ebook/dp/B0BB8JTNJZ). See also Ed Dowd interviewed by Patrick Patrick Bet-David: (

).

 

[Hans Blaster]

What actually refutes those "basic facts" are (1) the actual lack of efficacy (almost everyone got infected anyway, with many being hospitalized), and don't tell me that they would have been sicker without the "vaccine" (as is the standard mindless response), and (2) the 40% increase in sudden deaths among working age adults in the 3rd and 4th quarters of 2021) as reported by the insurance companies, the only anomalous factor being the (so-called) vaccine. So it was not a vaccine that was developed over a short period but something else that was developed over a much longer period. See the book "Cause

You really are blind to my actual question, aren't you. I mentioned 2 facts:

1. That the mRNA vaccine candidates were made rapidly after the release of the full SARS-CoV-2 genome. This is verifiable.

2. That the mRNA vaccines went about 9-10 months of testing before they were released. This is also verifiable.

I made no statements about efficacy or risks only that the post I was quoting in #42 was misstating the facts about the development of the mRNA vaccines for COVID-19.

 

[Shemjaza]

Check out Plane Geodesy and in particular, Science vs. Scientism and Nota Bene: The Fallacy of Spheroidal Earth Geocentrism.

Two issues with that link...

First, is that it's promoting the Flat Earth model rather than the Geocentric model, so not what I was discussing.

Secondly, the writing is seemingly deliberately unclear and the science seems to ignore the simple concepts of momentum and friction.

 

[JohnEmmett]

(almost everyone got infected anyway, with many being hospitalized)

Atheists support the vaccine blindly

 

[Edwin Wright]

Two issues with that link...

First, is that it's promoting the Flat Earth model rather than the Geocentric model, so not what I was discussing.

Secondly, the writing is seemingly deliberately unclear and the science seems to ignore the simple concepts of momentum and friction.

The flat earth model is being promoted because it demonstrates reality. Under what circumstances are the concepts of simple momentum and friction being ignored?

 

[Shemjaza]

The flat earth model is being promoted because it demonstrates reality.

Not at all. a Flat model doesn't explain the behavior of stars across hemispheres, the existence of sunsets, time zones, seasons, the visible movement of the sun across the sky.

Under what circumstances are the concepts of simple momentum and friction being ignored?

The website disputes the Earth's rotation with an idea that once a plane leaves the surface the Earth's surface would move underneath it... this requires you to ignore that the plane and the atmosphere it moves through are affected by the same force gravity as on the ground an move with the rotation of the Earth.

As an analogy you can throw a ball to someone on a bus and it doesn't shoot through the back window at the speed of the bus on the freeway.

 

[Shemjaza]

Atheists support the vaccine blindly

Not blindly, it's a result of many years of success stories where vaccines have improved our lives and protected us from viruses.

Also, atheists are such a small part of the population... much like acceptance of evolution, most people happily using the vaccines are your fellow Christians.

 

[Edwin Wright]

Not at all. a Flat model doesn't explain the behavior of stars across hemispheres, the existence of sunsets, time zones, seasons, the visible movement of the sun across the sky.



The website disputes the Earth's rotation with an idea that once a plane leaves the surface the Earth's surface would move underneath it... this requires you to ignore that the plane and the atmosphere it moves through are affected by the same force gravity as on the ground an move with the rotation of the Earth.

As an analogy you can throw a ball to someone on a bus and it doesn't shoot through the back window at the speed of the bus on the freeway.

You need to go back and review the page in question (carefully) as to what would happen IF the earth were rotating; the fact that aviation exists proves that the earth is not rotating. The ball on the bus is not a relevant analogy because the ball does not leave the moving frame. In the case of north-to-south or south-to-north aviation or a component thereof, there is a change in tangential velocity that would otherwise render a landing impossible, hence the merry-go-round analogy on that page.

As far as the flat earth model is concerned, the arguments are out there. Do your research.

 

[Shemjaza]

You need to go back and review the page in question (carefully) as to what would happen IF the earth were rotating; the fact that aviation exists proves that the earth is not rotating. The ball on the bus is not a relevant analogy because the ball does not leave the moving frame. In the case of north-to-south or south-to-north aviation or a component thereof, there is a change in tangential velocity that would otherwise render a landing impossible, hence the merry-go-round analogy on that page.

As far as the flat earth model is concerned, the arguments are out there. Do your research.

Air planes also do not leave the frame of the Earth. The atmosphere moves with the rotation of the earth.

I've looked for a long time for coherent explanations and none have stood up to scrutiny.

Given that I live in the southern hemisphere most Flat Earth are even more problematic.

 

[Edwin Wright]

Air planes also do not leave the frame of the Earth. The atmosphere moves with the rotation of the earth.

I've looked for a long time for coherent explanations and none have stood up to scrutiny.

Given that I live in the southern hemisphere most Flat Earth are even more problematic.

Subjectively speaking, when the sun sets in your area, how long does it take for total darkness to set in?