AGBIA [All God's Blessings in the Atonement]

[franky67]

For as many as are the promises of God, in Him they are yes; therefore also through Him is our Amen to the glory of God through us. 2 Cor. 1: 20

Psalm 103:3
Who pardons all your iniquities, who heals all your diseases.

 

[JAS4Yeshua]

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[millerrod]

.........................................
see siege i am taking your advice and dusting my shoes see the trail of dirt

 

[franky67]

For as many as are the promises of God, in Him they are yes; therefore also through Him is our Amen to the glory of God through us. 2 Cor. 1: 20

Psalm 103:3
Who pardons all your iniquities, who heals all your diseases.

That was healing,
****************************************************
"And my God shall supply all your needs according to his riches in Glory, IN CHRIST JESUS." Phil 4:19

That was provision

 

[dkbwarrior]

All miracles including healing are true and still happening but keep in mind that the purpose of the miracles and healings were not to keep the Christians healthy, it was a sign to unbelievers to hear the gospel of the Kingdom.

I strongly disagree with this statement; Jesus told us why He was here:

18The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, 19To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
-Luke 4:18-19

I could give you a raft of scriptures, but it is not neccessary. If you think for just a moment you should be able to see just how absurd this is.

Jesus came to set captives free. Captives of sin, captives of demonic oppression, captives of sickness and death, both spiritual and physical.

The idea that the blessings of God are not for our benefit, but only to testify to the reality of God is an idea that I have heard before, but frankly, I consider to have no more merit than "white guilt" in America. It is promoted by a religious establishment that views false humilty to equal real humility. I call it "christian guilt".

The main problem with this idea is that it paints God as a prideful ogre whos only desire is to have the universe prostrate itself before Him. That He only uses a pretense of caring for ones estate in order to impress others with His supposed goodwill, which really isn't goodwill at all, but just a ploy to get more of humanity to worship Him.

But nowhere in the Bible is God called pride. He is however, called love. Love is selfless, and seeks others before itself. This is who God is. One who seeks others goodwill before His own, who wishes the best for others. We in turn, learn what it is to love others by watching how he loves us. As the scriptures say, we love Him because He first loved us.

God does not want prostration, or manipulated worship. God wants a reciprical relationship, that is what the gospel is all about, that we are called friends of God. Not servants, not slaves, but sons.

Peace...

 

[JimfromOhio]

I strongly disagree with this statement; Jesus told us why He was here:

18The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, 19To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
-Luke 4:18-19

I could give you a raft of scriptures, but it is not neccessary. If you think for just a moment you should be able to see just how absurd this is.

Jesus came to set captives free. Captives of sin, captives of demonic oppression, captives of sickness and death, both spiritual and physical.

The idea that the blessings of God are not for our benefit, but only to testify to the reality of God is an idea that I have heard before, but frankly, I consider to have no more merit than "white guilt" in America. It is promoted by a religious establishment that views false humilty to equal real humility. I call it "christian guilt".

The main problem with this idea is that it paints God as a prideful ogre whos only desire is to have the universe prostrate itself before Him. That He only uses a pretense of caring for ones estate in order to impress others with His supposed goodwill, which really isn't goodwill at all, but just a ploy to get more of humanity to worship Him.

But nowhere in the Bible is God called pride. He is however, called love. Love is selfless, and seeks others before itself. This is who God is. One who seeks others goodwill before His own, who wishes the best for others. We in turn, learn what it is to love others by watching how he loves us. As the scriptures say, we love Him because He first loved us.

God does not want prostration, or manipulated worship. God wants a reciprical relationship, that is what the gospel is all about, that we are called friends of God. Not servants, not slaves, but sons.

Peace...

One thing I have learned over the years relating to the "doctrine of salvation", it is not about healing but eternal life. I have to remember that the Bible does not present faith as simply "mental assent to the facts of the gospel" but rather true saving faith involves repentance from my own sin and a complete trust in the work of Christ to save me from sin and make me righteous.

I always believed that the Holy Spirit converts and Christians disciple which means giving up has to do "self" while cost of discipleship has to do with discipling "others". Christianity without discipleship is always Christianity without Christ. Personal discipleship takes months while Church discipleship takes years. God commanded us to disciple but there are those whose mission is to "save" rather than disciple. God knew dscipling is the best way to go. Matthew 28:19 Therefore go and make disciples.

 

[franky67]

"doctrine of salvation", it is not about healing but eternal life. [ Grampa Jim's quote ]

Yes Jim, and eternal life starts the moment we accept Christ, the Kingdom of Heaven [ God ], The Holy Spirit lives inside you, if you refuse to acknowledge Him, and use His Power, and refuse His healing made available to you, then you are greiving Him.

Every blessing from God is by and through Jesus.

Col 1:19, 2:9

"For it was the Father's good pleasure for all the fulness to dwell in Him."
"For in Him, all the fulness of Deity dwells in bodily form."

2 Cor. 1:20

"For as many as may be the promises of God, in HIM, they are yes and amen."

 

[JimfromOhio]

"doctrine of salvation", it is not about healing but eternal life. [ Grampa Jim's quote ]

Yes Jim, and eternal life starts the moment we accept Christ, the Kingdom of Heaven [ God ], The Holy Spirit lives inside you, if you refuse to acknowledge Him, and use His Power, and refuse His healing made available to you, then you are greiving Him.

Every blessing from God is by and through Jesus.

Col 1:19, 2:9

"For it was the Father's good pleasure for all the fulness to dwell in Him."
"For in Him, all the fulness of Deity dwells in bodily form."

2 Cor. 1:20

"For as many as may be the promises of God, in HIM, they are yes and amen."

Actually there is nothing clear in the Bible that every Christians will be healed before they die. Biblically, Jesus will supply all my needs (Phil. 4:19) and that He knows everything about my life (Ps. 139:3), cares about me (1 Pet. 5:7), has the power for every difficulty (Ps. 62:11), is perfecting me to be like Christ (Phil. 1:6), and that nothing escapes Him (Ps. 147:5), that will lead me to be stable, not anxious living.

Corinthians 1:22 "Set His seal of ownership on us, and put his Spirit in our hearts as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come."

2 Corinthians 5:5 Now it is God who has made us for this very purpose and has given us the Spirit as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come.

Hebrews 11:39 These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised. (while they were alive on earth)

 

[franky67]

Actually there is nothing clear in the Bible that every Christians will be healed before they die

No, but what IS clear in the bible is that the healing has been provided, no guarantee that we all receive it.

 

[JimfromOhio]

No, but what IS clear in the bible is that the healing has been provided, no guarantee that we all receive it.

Healing is provided according to God's will, not on faith alone. Not guaranteed.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

It is impossible to separate the blessings of God into those spiritual and those physical, and then suggest that the spiritual ones have all been made good but the physical ones do not matter.

Jesus has saved up from everything that we need to be saved from.
There is nothing that we do have that was not given to us in Christ. There is no blessing, good thing, or promise that was not accomplished in Christ.

Teaching that the blessings of God can be acquired without Christ is mere theism and is a road that leads to the religion of the anit-christ.

 

[JimfromOhio]

It is impossible to separate the blessings of God into those spiritual and those physical, and then suggest that the spiritual ones have all been made good but the physical ones do not matter.

Jesus has saved up from everything that we need to be saved from.
There is nothing that we do have that was not given to us in Christ. There is no blessing, good thing, or promise that was not accomplished in Christ.

Teaching that the blessings of God can be acquired without Christ is mere theism and is a road that leads to the religion of the anit-christ.

I want to be healed but I am NOT to let "God didn't answer my prayers" get in the way because I am thinking eternal sense rather than temporal. God is renewing me from within "in spirit". Even though my human body is subject to death (and is dying) because of sin, however my spirit is alive and renewing in Christ. My temorary body is decaying at the same time, my inner being is being renewed day by day (2 Cor 4:16). "If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit." Galatians 5:25. If my eternal hope rested on how I felt physically, which is temporal, I might as well forget eternal spiritual wealth. I have learned that I am no longer "in the flesh": "You are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him" (Rom 8:9). I have learned that "If Christ is in us, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness" (Romans 8:10). In other words, our human body is subject to death (and is already dying) because of sin, however our spirit is alive in Christ. We have eternal life in our possession, even though our body is dying because of sin. However, as Christians, our spirits are fully alive and thriving "because of righteousness"--because HE is justified and therefore already has "passed out of death into life" (John 5:24). "My temorary body is decaying at the same time, my inner being is being renewed day by day" (2 Cor 4:16).

Faith in Jesus has replaced my temporal doubts and fears with eternal hope when I present my body "as living sacrifices, holy and pleasing to God" (see Romans 12:1-2). A faithful Christian will learn and see to it that my anticipations will conform to the revealed Word of God and I have nothing to doubt or fear in my life or in my death. Looking forward to our eternal inheritance will help us maintain a proper perspective on temporal things and motivate us to praise and adore God.

 

[franky67]

Healing is provided according to God's will, not on faith alone. Not guaranteed.

No, Jim, healing is according to the work of Jesus on earth, which is, of course God's will, and I won't use the word "guaranteed", but I use the word "available", made available by Jesus, and if by Jesus the availability is a sure thing. Jesus said "it is finished" He didn't leave anything out.

Anything Jesus accomplished is a success, and if we say healing didn't come by the cross, then where can we say it came from, nothing from God today, except through Jesus.

 

[JimfromOhio]

No, Jim, healing is according to the work of Jesus on earth, which is, of course God's will, and I won't use the word "guaranteed", but I use the word "available", made available by Jesus, and if by Jesus the availability is a sure thing. Jesus said "it is finished" He didn't leave anything out.

Anything Jesus accomplished is a success, and if we say healing didn't come by the cross, then where can we say it came from, nothing from God today, except through Jesus.

I don't really know if its God's will for me to be healed however, biblically, I do KNOW what God wants from me according to His written word whatever the outcome in my life.

 

[dkbwarrior]

Actually there is nothing clear in the Bible that every Christians will be healed before they die.

Actually, there is nothing clear in the Bible that every Christian will overcome all sin in their life before they die either.

Yet we do not deduce from this that God must will for some Christians to overcome some sins, and some to not. That would not be an obvious and/or probable resolution to the question.

What we deduce from this is that the power to overcome sin is found in faith in God, (Gods will for us to overcome sin being a given), and that each of us is at a different point in their walk of faith, with none of us yet perfected in the flesh.

We could reasonably conclude then the same for healing. We deduce that the power to receive healing comes from faith in God, (Gods will for us to be healed being a given), and that each of us is at a different point in their walk of faith, with none of us yet perfected in the flesh.

Peace...

 

[JimfromOhio]

Actually, there is nothing clear in the Bible that every Christian will overcome all sin in their life before they die either.

Yet we do not deduce from this that God must will for some Christians to overcome some sins, and some to not. That would not be an obvious and/or probable resolution to the question.

What we deduce from this is that the power to overcome sin is found in faith in God, (Gods will for us to overcome sin being a given), and that each of us is at a different point in their walk of faith, with none of us yet perfected in the flesh.

We could reasonably conclude then the same for healing. We deduce that the power to receive healing comes from faith in God, (Gods will for us to be healed being a given), and that each of us is at a different point in their walk of faith, with none of us yet perfected in the flesh.

Peace...

Not all Christians will overcome sin and at the same time, we remain alone with our sin, living in lies and hypocrisy. "If Christ is in us, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness" (Romans 8:10). Through the Sword of the Spirit, we have the power to overcome any temptations and evil that we face in this world. The key to holiness is submitting to the Spirit's control in daily life that will enable us to overcome the human nature and live through grace's sufficiency. Christians are no longer "in the flesh": "You are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him" (Rom 8:9). The Greek word for "dwells" is okv (oike), which means "I inhabit."

 

[dkbwarrior]

Not all Christians will overcome sin and at the same time, we remain alone with our sin, living in lies and hypocrisy. "If Christ is in us, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness" (Romans 8:10). Through the Sword of the Spirit, we have the power to overcome any temptations and evil that we face in this world. The key to holiness is submitting to the Spirit's control in daily life that will enable us to overcome the human nature and live through grace's sufficiency. Christians are no longer "in the flesh": "You are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him" (Rom 8:9). The Greek word for "dwells" is okv (oike), which means "I inhabit."

I agree. I would add this:

Not all Christians will overcome sickness... "If Christ is in us, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness" (Romans 8:10).

(Adding a little more context here for clarities sake:
10And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
-Romans 8:10-11)

Through the Sword of the Spirit, we have the power to overcome any sickness or disease that we face in this world. The key to healing is submitting to the Spirit's control in daily life that will enable us to overcome the human nature and live through grace's sufficiency. Christians are no longer "in the flesh": "You are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him" (Rom 8:9).

(Again, adding a little more context here for clarities sake:
9But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
10And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
-Romans 8:9-11)

The Greek word for "dwells" is okv (oike), which means "I inhabit."

He inhabits, so then He quickens. And He is not talking of quickening the spirit here, but quickening these mortal bodies.

Peace...

 

[JimfromOhio]

I agree. I would add this:

Not all Christians will overcome sickness... "If Christ is in us, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness" (Romans 8:10).

(Adding a little more context here for clarities sake:
10And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
-Romans 8:10-11)

Through the Sword of the Spirit, we have the power to overcome any sickness or disease that we face in this world. The key to healing is submitting to the Spirit's control in daily life that will enable us to overcome the human nature and live through grace's sufficiency. Christians are no longer "in the flesh": "You are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him" (Rom 8:9).

(Again, adding a little more context here for clarities sake:
9But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
10And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
-Romans 8:9-11)

The Greek word for "dwells" is okv (oike), which means "I inhabit."

He inhabits, so then He quickens. And He is not talking of quickening the spirit here, but quickening these mortal bodies.

Peace...

If that was the case, every believer would be healed and not die.

Even though our human body is subject to death (and is dying) because of sin, however our spirit is alive and renewing in Christ. Our temorary bodies are decaying at the same time, our inner being is being renewed day by day (2 Cor 4:16).

2 Corinthians 4:16 (New King James Version) Therefore we do not lose heart. Even though our outward man is perishing, yet the inward man is being renewed day by day.

We will die one day and many Christians have died without being healed.

 

[dkbwarrior]

If that was the case, every believer would be healed and not die.

Well then, again, I fall back to my reflexive argument. As a wise man once said, (the subject being replaced to make the point

If that was the case, then every believer would be saved and not ever sin again.

God is no respecter of persons. He is not up in heaven dispensing blessing on a case by case basis.

Oh I think I will give Jimmy the power to overcome lust, but I will leave Joe with a pornography addiction. And I think Harry will get healed of cancer today, but little 4 year old Martha needs to get hit by a truck, because I want to pluck that pretty little flower for my heavenly garden.

No; God has given us all things that pertain to both life and godliness. Both the physical and the spiritual. And it has all been given to us through the ratification of the Abrahamic covenant by the blood of Christ on the Cross.

3According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
4Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
-2 Peter 1:3-4

It is because the covenant is between God and Jesus that there are no conditions other than faith. And it is because we are In Him that all of these exceeding great and precious promises are yes and amen:

18But as God is true, our word toward you was not yea and nay.
19For the Son of God, Jesus Christ, who was preached among you by us, even by me and Silvanus and Timotheus, was not yea and nay, but in him was yea.
20For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.
-2 Corinthians 1:18-19

God has already given us the power both to overcome sin, and to overcome sickness, and to overcome all the power of the enemy, in all of its manifestations. He did it at the cross.

We are not trying to get God to do something, which is where the critics are being dishonest.

We are receiving what God has already done.

We receive it by revelation of the exceeding great and precious promises.

Faith is believing the promises, and itself is predicated on a revelation of the faithfulness of God. Faith itself is a gift of God which comes with the revelation of the promise.

We will die one day and many Christians have died without being healed.

Many Christians have died without being healed, just as many Christians have died without overcoming all sin in their lives. Neither circumstance proves the will of God for ones life. Only the Word of God dictates His Will, not our circumstance.

Interpreting the Bible by circumstance will only lead one astray, because satan is the god of this world during this present age.

We all may die one day, but we all may not either. Never say never, because you do not know, neither do I.

There is a generation coming who will walk from their corruptible bodies into their incorruptible ones without seeing death. We may be that generation. It will happen when we come into the unity of the faith, unto a perfect man, unto the fulness of the measure of the stature of Christ.

You and I may well walk side by side into that future my friend.

Peace...

 

[franky67]

Oh Yes, My Brother Dbkwarrior Preach The Word,