Absolute proof.. can't deny.. the earth is flat

[Yttrium]

I have had my fill of back and forths especially with christian (like you) who throw The Bible under the bus because of science liars. So if you want to believe in science's creation account go ahead be my guess.

Ya know, I'd just like to throw in a reminder that Aussie Pete is among the vast, vast majority of Christians who are globe Earthers. The flat Earthers are the ones who are the teeny tiny itsy bitsy microminiscule fraction of the billions of Christians on the planet.

And ironically, Aussie Pete is amongst a minority of Christians who also accuse the majority of throwing the Bible under the bus because of science. Pete's minority just happens to be a much larger minority than yours.

 

[The Liturgist]

Santa is as real as your flat earth.

Actually more real, in that St. Nicholas was a real fourth century bishop, of the diocese of Myra, who was at the Council of Nicaea, where he famously slapped Arius (there is a hilarious Russian icon of him doing this which I will include). He acquired his reputation by attempting to secretly give three purses of gold coins from the church treasury to an impoverished family with three daughters, who were facing extreme hardship. He was discovered, and became the patron saint of children.

Note that when he slapped Arius, he was deposed, as the ancient canons of the early church, which are still in force in the Eastern and Oriental Orthodox churches, absolutely prohibit clergy from striking people, but he was later reinstated.

 

[JacksBratt]

The true spiritual condition of an individual can be evaluated. God has given us criteria by which we can discern if a person is born again or not. I do not believe that includes believing that the earth is flat or not.

In my opinion, anyone's belief in a flat or ball earth.... not a salvation issue.

I strongly believe that there are many people that, when viewed by others, would be written off as hell bound all the while be quite saved and destined for eternity with Christ.

While some other people would be viewed as staunch solid heaven bound followers of Christ... will actually be hell bound and will be told "I never knew you" by our Lord and savior.

We cannot always know. Only God knows the heart.

On the FE topic, however, there are many people in the FE camp that were atheists until they heard about the FE, investigated, researched for themselves and then came to hold to the FE view.

Their next step was to understand that an earth or universe system that resembles a "snow globe" as the late Rob Skiba used to put it.... a flat enclosed system... destroyed the evolutionary tale and Darwin's fable as well.

This lead to the conclusion that the universe is a deliberate and magnificent designed system that could only be done by an intelligent creator... as the bible states.

This lead to the final step of acceptance of the bible and it's contents and conversion to Christ.

This is not an uncommon train of events for FE new Christians.

 

[d taylor]

Ya know, I'd just like to throw in a reminder that Aussie Pete is among the vast, vast majority of Christians who are globe Earthers. The flat Earthers are the ones who are the teeny tiny itsy bitsy microminiscule fraction of the billions of Christians on the planet.

And ironically, Aussie Pete is amongst a minority of Christians who also accuse the majority of throwing the Bible under the bus because of science. Pete's minority just happens to be a much larger minority than yours.

It seems like in the Bible it is always a small remnant, that believes God at His word.

Example the two out of the 12 spies who were sent to explore the land.

 

[Aussie Pete]

In my opinion, anyone's belief in a flat or ball earth.... not a salvation issue.

I strongly believe that there are many people that, when viewed by others, would be written off as hell bound all the while be quite saved and destined for eternity with Christ.

While some other people would be viewed as staunch solid heaven bound followers of Christ... will actually be hell bound and will be told "I never knew you" by our Lord and savior.

We cannot always know. Only God knows the heart.

On the FE topic, however, there are many people in the FE camp that were atheists until they heard about the FE, investigated, researched for themselves and then came to hold to the FE view.

Their next step was to understand that an earth or universe system that resembles a "snow globe" as the late Rob Skiba used to put it.... a flat enclosed system... destroyed the evolutionary tale and Darwin's fable as well.

This lead to the conclusion that the universe is a deliberate and magnificent designed system that could only be done by an intelligent creator... as the bible states.

This lead to the final step of acceptance of the bible and it's contents and conversion to Christ.

This is not an uncommon train of events for FE new Christians.

First time I've heard of former atheists becoming FE Christians. I don't know whether to be impressed, to laugh or to cry.

I have no idea why a globe earth has anything remotely to do with evolution. To me, evolution makes as much sense as FE theory. I.e. none.

The difference is that it is simple to disprove FE. And it has been disproven over and over again, even by observation. Evolution cannot be proven by any method, primarily because it is not true. FE likewise cannot be proven and for the same reason. Most certainly the Bible does not support FE theory. And I agree (as I said before) it's not a salvation issue. Believing evolution is irrational for Christians, as far as I am concerned. But some do and likewise, it is not a salvation issue.

 

[d taylor]

-​

Actually flat earth is a very poor name description for God's creation given in The Bible. I would guess that is the reason for no scripture stating the earth is flat in The Bible.

God's creation is more than just earth (land), but when God does speak of the earth (again this means only land/ground in The Bible). He uses descriptions that would be used of land that is flat, like width, breadth, circle.

So yes there are no verses stating that the land is flat, because actually it is not. As the surface of the earth/land is a plain/plane but the area below the surface goes down, maybe a good ways down, 100+ miles?

Who knows, as man has been able to only drill/dig down around 7 miles. So christian's can use the excuse that The Bible never states God created a flat earth. But there are plenty of verses stating God's creation is not the creation being professed by science.

The earth is set on foundations, the earth is stationary and does not move, the earth created by God was a one piece circular area of land (before the flood). The earth has water under it and water above the raqia.

 

[JacksBratt]

First time I've heard of former atheists becoming FE Christians. I don't know whether to be impressed, to laugh or to cry.

That's not surprising. Unless you have researched the concept and actually listened to those who hold the FE view, you would not be aware of their path to their FE belief, would you?

If you go on YouTube and look up video of the talks at the many FE conferences you will hear real, intelligent people talk about their reasons for becoming "Flat Earthers".

I have no idea why a globe earth has anything remotely to do with evolution. To me, evolution makes as much sense as FE theory. I.e. none.

Whether the earth is a sphere, or flat... to me.... has no bearing on my whole hearted belief in six days of creation as stated in Genesis.

However, if you are going to try to sell a Darwinian, evolutionary story.... it cannot be the FE model. Period. So, if you are an atheist... turned to Flat earth belief... You gotta toss the big bang, spinning ball earth with millions of years of evolution.

That leaves "something else" to be the explanation for a "snow globe"... Enter the biblical view.

The difference is that it is simple to disprove FE.

Fantastic... I gotta hear this. Many have tried.. Go ahead.

 

[Yttrium]

Fantastic... I gotta hear this. Many have tried.. Go ahead.

Yeah, Pete is being overly optimistic there. You can't really prove or disprove something to somebody who believes every piece of evidence produced by every possible source is fake.

For example, you could look at plane routes. Take the top 100 cities. Hey, why not spend some more time and take the top 1000 just to be thorough. Find out the flight distance between the cities and the travel times. You can ride on some of those flights and see for yourself. Or get somebody you trust (if that's possible) to take the trip and make a video. You can look over any given route in excruciating detail just to be sure.

Connect the dots. If you put it all together, it matches up to a globe. It does not work on a flat Earth. A lot of the travel times will be too short. There's no way to connect all those dots.

So let's say that the airline industries are performing progressively more and more amazing tricks to fool people. All the airline industries around the world. Considerably longer than NASA was ever around. All to deceive people so that... um... you know, I'm never really sure what the point of that would be. Sounds like a monumental expense for no particular reason to me. But you never know.

 

[Aussie Pete]

That's not surprising. Unless you have researched the concept and actually listened to those who hold the FE view, you would not be aware of their path to their FE belief, would you?

If you go on YouTube and look up video of the talks at the many FE conferences you will hear real, intelligent people talk about their reasons for becoming "Flat Earthers".



Whether the earth is a sphere, or flat... to me.... has no bearing on my whole hearted belief in six days of creation as stated in Genesis.

However, if you are going to try to sell a Darwinian, evolutionary story.... it cannot be the FE model. Period. So, if you are an atheist... turned to Flat earth belief... You gotta toss the big bang, spinning ball earth with millions of years of evolution.

That leaves "something else" to be the explanation for a "snow globe"... Enter the biblical view.



Fantastic... I gotta hear this. Many have tried.. Go ahead.

FE has been disproved over and over again. That FE people don't accept the truth is their problem. Have you come across Sabine Hossenfelder? She has an interesting take on why people stick to FE. If I understand her correctly, it is that they simply do not trust any external source. And it is not that easy to prove a globe earth unless you accept the evidence of others. Reminds me of Doubting Thomas. She says that FE people are wrong, but not stupid. However, I don't know how anyone can reject eyewitness accounts of people who are born again and devoted to truth. They are some of the most gifted, intelligent and able people ever. The only explanation for their testimony is that they are liars. That is even more unlikely, to me at least, than the earth being flat.

I don't know why Evolution requires a rotating globe.

 

[Yttrium]

I don't know why Evolution requires a rotating globe.

Yeah, the age of the planet matters, but not the shape.

 

[d taylor]

-​

If a person was to illustrate (by a drawing or painting ) God's creation, by using the given descriptions in The Bible.

There is absolutely no way they would be able to eventually end up with an illustration of a sphere covered in water. With scatted areas of land on this water sphere, magically floating out in nothing space.

 

[Aussie Pete]

-​

If a person was to illustrate (by a drawing or painting ) God's creation, by using the given descriptions in The Bible.

There is absolutely no way they would be able to eventually end up with an illustration of a sphere covered in water. With scatted areas of land on this water sphere, magically floating out in nothing space.

It is very simple. It really is "floating" in space.
Job 26:7
He stretches out the north over empty space; He hangs the earth upon nothing. He wraps up the waters in His clouds, yet the clouds do not burst under their own weight.…

Six born again Christians have seen the earth from outer space. You don't have to believe me, even though I've traveled most of the earth. But you are calling those six eyewitnesses liars. At least 600 others, maybe some of those born again, have also seen the earth from space. The Coriolis effect of the rotating earth is obvious from pictures of storms. Etc etc etc.

You can't argue from silence. You can believe the testimony of eye witnesses. You have not seen Jesus and you have only eyewitness accounts from His followers and the words of Paul, who never met Jesus before His death and resurrection. Yet you believe them. Why is it so hard to believe eyewitnesses to the form of the earth? They are people, just like you and me (except much smarter and way more talented) and the disciples. They have no reason to lie.

 

[d taylor]

It is very simple. It really is "floating" in space.
Job 26:7
He stretches out the north over empty space; He hangs the earth upon nothing. He wraps up the waters in His clouds, yet the clouds do not burst under their own weight.…

Six born again Christians have seen the earth from outer space. You don't have to believe me, even though I've traveled most of the earth. But you are calling those six eyewitnesses liars. At least 600 others, maybe some of those born again, have also seen the earth from space. The Coriolis effect of the rotating earth is obvious from pictures of storms. Etc etc etc.

You can't argue from silence. You can believe the testimony of eye witnesses. You have not seen Jesus and you have only eyewitness accounts from His followers and the words of Paul, who never met Jesus before His death and resurrection. Yet you believe them. Why is it so hard to believe eyewitnesses to the form of the earth? They are people, just like you and me (except much smarter and way more talented) and the disciples. They have no reason to lie.

Job 26:7 the way it has been translated, is not supported by a single verse in The Bible.

Hang which is the hebrew word teleh

Means to hang, suspend, or support by actual contact. never to hang on nothing: thus, to give a few instances/examples

Genesis 40:19 Within three days Pharaoh will lift off your head from you and hang you on a tree; and the birds will eat your flesh from you.”

Psalms 137:2 We hung our harps Upon the willows in the midst of it.

Ezekiel 15:3 Is wood taken from it to make any object? Or can men make a peg from it to hang any vessel on?


The correct translation which is supported by other areas of The Bible is.

"He spreadeth out the North over the desolate' place (the abyss of waters), and supporteth the Earth upon fastenings (foundations)."

 

[d taylor]

Any christian want to explain:

Explain after Jesus leaves heaven and after spending 7 years tabernacling above the earth in the clouds of heaven during the tribulation.

He returns to fight and rescue Israel, how does the whole globe earth see a Jesus appearing in the clouds above the earth. Which are just about 6-10 miles high.

“Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven,and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

 

[Yttrium]

Any christian want to explain:

Explain after Jesus leaves heaven and after spending 7 years tabernacling above the earth in the clouds of heaven during the tribulation.

He returns to fight and rescue Israel, how does the whole globe earth see a Jesus appearing in the clouds above the earth. Which are just about 6-10 miles high.

“Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven,and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Television? Watching it on smartphones? We have real time, worldwide video capabilities these days, you know. Just sayin'.

 

[d taylor]

Television? Watching it on smartphones? We have real time, worldwide video capabilities these days, you know. Just sayin'.

When the coming of The Messiah happens, there will be no power. The earth will be enshrouded in darkness, only the light of The Messiah will be able to shine in this darkness. He will have no competing light.

 

[SkyWriting]

Why the obsession with the size of the Earth? There are other things one could worry about.

Nobody is concerned about the size of the earth. You win!

 

[SkyWriting]

What food is Kansas known for?

• Bierocks
• Grebble.
• Lefse.
• Loose meat sandwich.
• Sour cream and raisin pie.

 

[Yttrium]

When the coming of The Messiah happens, there will be no power. The earth will be enshrouded in darkness, only the light of The Messiah will be able to shine in this darkness. He will have no competing light.

Is that a conclusion based on scripture, or just wishful thinking on your part?

 

[d taylor]

Is that a conclusion based on scripture, or just wishful thinking on your part?

God removes the light from the sun, moon and stars.

So i really doubt God will let man made lights to continue to shine.

“Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven,and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.