abortion

[ScottBot]

Is irrelevant in a secular law court

Secular courts of law make rulings people who violate the substantive and procedural merits of established law, typically drawn out through some type of legislative process that tends to affirm "natural law". Additionally, in America, our judicial and legislative does take into consideration the precedent established in divine law. Anyone who argues against these 3 points of the foundation of our legal system really doesn't understand our legal system very well.

 

[Gusoceros]

Well... not if premarital sex is considered a moral activity for the person whom you wish to educate, then no.

Again, when you say "educate people moral value"... I can't see how you mean anything but "teach people MY moral values"...

And I don't think that is appropriate.

Indeed, what I think IS appropriate in school environments (because I get the distinct impression you are labouring under the idea that most abortions occur in unmarried high school age girls)... is that the school has NO place to be teaching any sort of morality... thats the job of parents. The school has a duty to teach information, and opinion about information, as long as it is disseminated as such... but has no place telling people what is right and wrong.

So, am I correct in assuming that you think at some point in a sex education lecture, the teacher should say "if you have sex before you are married, you are commiting an evil act"...or words to that effect through the course of the class?

Im amazed really, at your position that it is MY morality that is unacceptable- because it is SOMEBODY'S morality that is getting taught- and that is OK. A little thought on it, will likely reveal the point is moot- as the moral points to be taught would likely be developed by a group. I believe it is the in the schools arsenal of things to teach basic morality- and I have already covered these points- to include premarital sex as a discouraged thing, and why. I do not believe it is the school's job to do sex education. That is the parents job.

G

 

[ScottBot]

Im amazed really, at your position that it is MY morality that is unacceptable- because it is SOMEBODY'S morality that is getting taught- and that is OK. A little thought on it, will likely reveal the point is moot- as the moral points to be taught would likely be developed by a group. I believe it is the in the schools arsenal of things to teach basic morality- and I have already covered these points- to include premarital sex as a discouraged thing, and why. I do not believe it is the school's job to do sex education. That is the parents job.

G

Well, it's the parents job to ensure of the accuracy and relevance of their children's education in a representative democracy.......Its the government's job in a socialist or communist state.

Education vs indoctrination.

I want my kids educated (i.e. taught HOW to think) vs indoctrinate (WHAT to think). Schools really no long teach kids how to think. They are taught one side of the arguement and are told that it is incontrovertable truth. Just as Al Gore about people who present both sides of an issue.

 

[serephim01]

I think I am a little late on this subject but IMO abortion is just wrong...other than maybe rape or if it will kill the mother it should be IMO illegal...because by what I was taught by reading the bible it says that you shouldn't have premarital sex.....don't really know what it says about abortion but if you are out having sex and then oops your pregnant then oh well he/she is yours now IMO...no flame or hate mail please...PLEASE? edit.....the father should also have to marry that girl because from what i have seen in my neighborhood too many cowards leave the mothers to fend for them selves....you know putting the kid up for adoption is always an option too ya know?

:EDIT: After a long period of thinking on this subject I have come to the conclusion of I don't really know on whether it should be OK to kill a baby if you are raped or are in a life threatening position. I mean if you are in a life threatening position maybe thats where God wanted you to be. On the rape I can only say and I will probaly take a huge amount of flak for this, even though I am only stating my God given right to free speech I am sure someone will get a stick up there butt over this. The fact that you are raped doesnt give you the right IMO to take that hatred for the assailent on the baby...I have no proof or facts or any other thing some thing an annoyed reader is going to demand from me for stating my belief. I am saying this from my heart as I hate the thought that someone can kill a potential child and justify but a full grown person can kill another and get thrown in jail. Dont give me all this "What about ciggarete companies or gun manufactures they kill?" I am basing this on my belief which it is not law because it is my belief, and just because I am a male does not mean I have any less right to an opinion as a female...no offense intended, but I feel that abortion all together is wrong based on my belief that there is a reason that God let it happen. There now any flak towards this comment will be ignored as I do not care to debate my opinion. :EDIT:

 

[saskia1]

It is very wrong to abort a child as the foetus is a living tiny human being.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

Im amazed really, at your position that it is MY morality that is unacceptable-

Excuse me? Where did I say your morality is unacceptible? What I am interested in is how you form the conclusion that your morality, while perfectly acceptible when you intend to apply it to yourself, is necesarily right or proper in application to other people? And before anyone quotes another tired string of tangential Bible verses at me... how does that effect the morality of NON-CHRISTIANS... since I assume we are hoping to reduce the number of abortions amongst them as well?

I do not believe it is the school's job to do sex education. That is the parents job.

In a perfect world... yes. But then, how do you respond regarding the parents who are too embarrassed to do this adequately, who's children end up in all sorts of a mess?

A biology classroom teachs how the digestive tract works, how the circulatory system works... why isn't it appropriate for a science classroom to be the place to learn about how the reproductive system works as well? Its just more biology

 

[ScottBot]

Excuse me? Where did I say your morality is unacceptible? What I am interested in is how you form the conclusion that your morality, while perfectly acceptible when you intend to apply it to yourself, is necesarily right or proper in application to other people? And before anyone quotes another tired string of tangential Bible verses at me... how does that effect the morality of NON-CHRISTIANS... since I assume we are hoping to reduce the number of abortions amongst them as well?

In a perfect world... yes. But then, how do you respond regarding the parents who are too embarrassed to do this adequately, who's children end up in all sorts of a mess?

A biology classroom teachs how the digestive tract works, how the circulatory system works... why isn't it appropriate for a science classroom to be the place to learn about how the reproductive system works as well? Its just more biology

I don't mind the schools talking about the what and how of the reproductive system (a name with grand irony, considering the topic of this thread), but I do have issues with the school teaching my kid when, where, and why. Answering those questions is the parents job.

 

[Nadiine]

It is very wrong to abort a child as the foetus is a living tiny human being.

I agree - I'd like to know when people think God "puts a soul" into them... what age does this happen???

It doesn't matter if the infant isn't even "formed" yet, if it's left alone, it's LIVING and is human. Period. It doesn't stop being human just becuz it's in a certain beginning state.
It's viable and grows...
Is God putting a soul into the "cell" only after it grows 1 finger??? or 1 leg? a head? When it starts to "look" more formed?

The soul is there right at conception; it is who it is immediately in his/her earliest stages. The DNA blueprint is all there to make it male/female, blonde, brunette, tall, short, thin or thick.......
It makes no sense to me why we make it VISUAL as to when life begins.
Even virus cells in a pee tri dish are "alive" to do their work. Fully viable. Living is living no matter what stage it is.

I don't grasp how anyone could view it as "dead" or "inhuman" when that is the "species" it is just in it's pre-formed state!
I can only think that people want to believe the LIE for their own convenience. Justification to alleviate problems in society. If only the first sin wasn't committed of having unwed sex (stats show the majority of abortions are to promiscuous single women).

 

[allhart]

Is irrelevant in a secular law court

Idon't live for the human law.Doesn't mean i don't abide by it.

 

[biblestudy123]

I agree - I'd like to know when people think God "puts a soul" into them... what age does this happen???

It doesn't matter if the infant isn't even "formed" yet, if it's left alone, it's LIVING and is human. Period. It doesn't stop being human just becuz it's in a certain beginning state.
It's viable and grows...
Is God putting a soul into the "cell" only after it grows 1 finger??? or 1 leg? a head? When it starts to "look" more formed?

The soul is there right at conception; it is who it is immediately in his/her earliest stages. The DNA blueprint is all there to make it male/female, blonde, brunette, tall, short, thin or thick.......
It makes no sense to me why we make it VISUAL as to when life begins.
Even virus cells in a pee tri dish are "alive" to do their work. Fully viable. Living is living no matter what stage it is.

I don't grasp how anyone could view it as "dead" or "inhuman" when that is the "species" it is just in it's pre-formed state!
I can only think that people want to believe the LIE for their own convenience. Justification to alleviate problems in society. If only the first sin wasn't committed of having unwed sex (stats show the majority of abortions are to promiscuous single women).

If God puts a soul in these "babies" at conception and 1 in 4 end in miscarriage then do all these "babies" go to heaven?

 

[OneStepCloser39]

I can't begin to tell you how many times I've been yelled at, cussed out and just plain disrespected because I'm a young guy who is a VERY strong advocate against abortion. And some things I say here may be taken offensively but I don't mean to come across that way.

I currently work in a pharmacy and I refuse to dispense the morning after pill, and I have that right to. (However my co-workers don't share my belief and they dispense it because they know my stance on the issue). I know that nothing is "formed" 12 hours after sexual intercourse but I believe that by taking "plan b" you are interfering with God's plan. We live in a world that is constantly making everything faster, easier and more convenient. We now have cans of soup that are microwavable so we don't have to pour it in a bowl before cooking it. And my God how we love our choices! Buying an OTC pain reliever can take 25 minutes when you can choose between the Tylenol gelcaps, coated tabs, disintegrating tablets, extra strength, maximum strength, tablets, capsules, etc. I think we have just become so desensitized to having everything the way we want it that it's carried over into the whole topic of abortion.

We will pray for cures to cancer, but how do we not know that God hasn't answered that prayer by creating a human being that would answer that prayer, only to have it aborted due to convenience? Or due to not yet being married? Or even because she was raped? I understand that when a woman is raped she didn't consent to having sex and may feel that she shouldn't have to live with the consequences for it, but my friend who was hit by a drunk driver and became paralyzed didn't choose to drink that night but he still has to pay the consequences for the rest of his life. I don't see how preventing/taking human life can be justified in anyone mind. But then again I don't understand how many things can be justified in one's mind.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

I currently work in a pharmacy and I refuse to dispense the morning after pill, and I have that right to.

In what jurisdiction do you live that the MAP is dispensed through pharmacy rather than from a doctor's office?

 

[OneStepCloser39]

In what jurisdiction do you live that the MAP is dispensed through pharmacy rather than from a doctor's office?

In the US, the morning after pill became OTC in October 2006, although it took them several months to "re-package" it for OTC sales so I think it was actually AVAILABLE to buy OTC in.. maybe January or so? I don't remember for sure. But even before it was OTC, we still carried it, you just had to have a prescription for it. Under 18 still needs a perscription, but I haven't seen a single person come in with a perscription since it became OTC. I'm sure if you a 17 year old wants Plan B they'll just get an older friend to buy it for them, like they would cigarettes or alcohol.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

RE : see the video link GOOGLE: ayoub mercury

to see what the d-makers are putting in flu and other supposedly "helpful" ampules and giving to people of all ages without their knowledge or consent (people hide from them when they find out !!)

New Surprise: on the tv show <LOST>, just saw it , they said all the
women on the island, when they conceive, their immune system
turns on them......... how about that ? why did they put that in the show ? did somone know already what's been going on worldwide ?

Unconsenting worldwide population control, planned decades ago, published in numerous journals...... foisted on thirdworld people against their will....

Someone in this thread earlier said most conceptions spontaneously end - and said or implied that God did it...... might want to watch the link about "ayoub mercury", and realize abominaable man does it - God gives life, satan the liar came to kill, steal and destroy; and man often goes along with satan instead of going with God, right ?