2 Cor 3:6-11 Affirms the Law of God, and the New Covenant where it is written on the heart

[SabbathBlessings]

The Ox, like humans, is required to refrain from working and observe the Sabbath, as commanded in Deuteronomy 5:14. It should patiently await assistance until the following day, akin to someone trapped in a pit, avoiding actions that might cause others to violate the covenant. Both the Ox and humans who delight in observing the Sabbath should trust in God's promised protection, as stated in Isaiah 58:14 (Jonah did not perish while in the belly of the fish 3days 3nights). Moreover, Ox is included in the Sabbath sacrifices according to Numbers 28:10. One might ponder whether the Ox has its own desires regarding being slaughtered on that day. If they are willing to be sacrificed, then they should also be willing to demonstrate patience.

Anyway, Isaiah 58:13 was followed by Sabbaths as covenant mentioned in Isaiah 56:4, "For this is what the LORD says: 'To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths, who choose what pleases Me and hold fast to My covenant—'" which was referring to the Old that 2 Corinthians 3:13-14 states "reading the old covenant.", which Prophet Ezekiel 20:12 also says, "'I also gave them My Sabbaths as a sign between us, so that they would know that I am the LORD who sanctifies them (those out from Egypt),'"

And Prophet Jeremiah 17:21-22 “This is what the LORD says: Take heed for yourselves; do not carry a load or bring it through the gates of Jerusalem on the Sabbath day. You must not carry a load out of your houses or do any work on the Sabbath day, but you must keep the Sabbath day holy, just as I commanded your forefathers.” - Keeping the Sabbath day as holy involves refraining from carrying any burdens.

You might want to read Isaiah 56 starting with verse 1.

 

[bbbbbbb]

In this instance in Corinthians it most certainly is.

Likewise, that is also the case in the letter to the Hebrews.

 

[Cornelius8L]

You might want to read Isaiah 56 starting with verse 1.

Reading from verse 1 doesn't imply that Sabbath isn't an old covenant in verse 4.

By the way, since animals were sacrificed during the Sabbath, were they all willing participants or did they resist? If they struggled, where is the mercy shown towards them instead of simply slaughtering them?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Reading from verse 1 doesn't imply that Sabbath isn't an old covenant in verse 4.

By the way, since animals were sacrificed during the Sabbath, were they all willing participants or did they resist? If they struggled, where is the mercy shown towards them instead of simply slaughtering them?

Only if you think God's holy mountain is not in heaven, or think His righteousness changes when its everlasting Psa 119:142, or love to Him or serving Him changes. I do not.

I don't think you understand the sacrificial system, or the Sabbath and you seem set in your viewpoint so I will leave it as agree to disagree.

 

[HIM]

Reading from verse 1 doesn't imply that Sabbath isn't an old covenant in verse 4.

By the way, since animals were sacrificed during the Sabbath, were they all willing participants or did they resist? If they struggled, where is the mercy shown towards them instead of simply slaughtering them?

It Seems your issue is with God and what He mandated

 

[Guojing]

In this instance in Corinthians it most certainly is.

Do you want to understand the difference between testament (will) and covenant?

 

[HIM]

Do you want to understand the difference between testament (will) and covenant?

I am pretty sure we spoke quite a bit in the past. And you ask this?
The context to which we speak is 2 Corinthians three. I Can't even imagine you are trying to say that that is not speaking of the covenant.

 

[Guojing]

I am pretty sure we spoke quite a bit in the past. And you ask this?

That is why I asked whether you want to understand, not whether you understand.

The context to which we speak is 2 Corinthians three. I Can't even imagine you are trying to say that that is not speaking of the covenant.

See the KJV of that verse to see the correct translation.

 

[Cornelius8L]

Only if you think God's holy mountain is not in heaven, or think His righteousness changes when its everlasting Psa 119:142, or love to Him or serving Him changes. I do not.

I don't think you understand the sacrificial system, or the Sabbath and you seem set in your viewpoint so I will leave it as agree to disagree.

God's sense of what's right is different from how humans understand morality. So, when you try to explain why it's okay to help the ox in the pit on the Sabbath using human morals, I've shown why your reasoning is flawed.

It Seems your issue is with God and what He mandated

I don't have an issue with the depiction of God as described in the Bible. For instance, passages like Malachi 1:2-4 says God's love can be selective (Romans 9:15, Proverbs 16:4, Romans 9:20), and some living humans are dead in His eyes (Revelation 3:1, Ephesians 2:1) while God is only the God of the living and not of the dead (Mark 12:27). But it would be helpful if you could consider the context of our discussion before offering your comments.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

God's sense of what's right is different from how humans understand morality.

Agreed, so when God reveals to us what is holy Exo 20:8, righteous, how to love and serve Him that was meant to bless and sanctify us. Psa 119:172 Psa 119:142 Isa 56:1-6 Eze 20:12 we should embrace and follow. He reveals His ways to us, but sadly few listen or follow.

So, when you try to explain why it's okay to help the ox in the pit on the Sabbath using human morals, I've shown why your reasoning is flawed.

Not really. It really reveals more that one doesn't understand the sacrificial system and what it meant and pointed to and taking a legalist approach much like the Pharisees that helping someone in need or an animal would be breaking God's Sabbath as if God doesn't have compassion, when its quite the opposite. Jesus and the apostles showed us how to keep the Sabbath, Jesus also showed that if something like an emergency comes up on the Sabbath that doing good is not in violation of the Sabbath, but it's an exception and gave examples of that in scripture, but that's not where ones focus should be looking for exceptions, God's Sabbath is about honoring Him- doing His ways, not ours. Isa 58:13

 

[Cornelius8L]

Agreed, so why argue against what God revealed as holy Exo 20:8, righteous, how to love and serve Him that was meant to bless and sanctify us. Psa 119:172 Psa 119:142 Isa 56:1-6 Eze 20:12 He reveals His ways to us, but sadly few listen or follow.

Before discussing the issue of the ox on the Sabbath, we debated the content of the old covenant, which you misunderstood but still teach.

Not really. It really reveals more that one doesn't understand the sacrificial system and what it meant and pointed to and taking a legalist approach much like the Pharisees that helping someone in need or an animal would be breaking God's Sabbath as if God doesn't have compassion.

It's amusing how, when unable to justify your point, you resort to accusing others of not understanding. I brought up Jesus' example of highlighting human hypocrisy regarding Sabbath observance by mentioning the ox, but you mistakenly interpreted it as an accusation against Jesus. It appears you also need to thoroughly study the context.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

How can something that will be in heaven be "Old Covenant" Jesus in His own Words said breaking and teaching others to break the least of these commandments quoting directly from the Ten Mat 5:19-30 one would be least in heaven Which means lost Mat 5:20 so definitely not Old Covenant. If one wants to believe the one commandment God said to Remember that man teaches to forget that He personally blessed and made holy that no man can reverse Num 23:20 that Jesus and the apostles kept is a least commandment, when Jesus taught not to break even a least commandment -guess its ones free will to test.

 

[Cornelius8L]

How can something that will be in heaven be "Old Covenant" Jesus in His own Words said breaking and teaching others to break the least of these commandments quoting directly from the Ten Mat 5:19-30 one would be least in heaven Which means lost Mat 5:20 so definitely not Old Covenant. If one wants to believe the one commandment God said to Remember that man teaches to forget that He personally blessed and made holy that no man can reverse Num 23:20 that Jesus and the apostles kept is a least commandment, when Jesus taught not to break even a least commandment -guess its ones free will to test.

If Jesus's sacrifice can replace the sacrificial animal, and you believe that God never changes, why do you accuse us of "changing" when the old covenant, which Paul deemed flawed (Hebrews 8:7), is refined?

Malachi 2:2 says God can curse a blessing, "I will curse your blessings." So, you quoted Balaam in Numbers 23:20 in your defense of...?

Jesus refined the flaws of the Ten Commandments, such as the commandment of "honoring parents," "murder," "adultery," so, what was actually there in the tabernacle in heaven after Jesus's refinement (Revelation 15:5)?

So, we don't change what God has used His authority to change, especially the matter of old to new covenant. "If He takes away, who can stop Him?"

 

[SabbathBlessings]

If Jesus's sacrifice can replace the sacrificial animal, and you believe that God never changes, why do you accuse us of "changing" when the old covenant, which Paul deemed flawed (Hebrews 8:7), is refined?

Malachi 2:2 says God can curse a blessing, "I will curse your blessings." So, you quoted Balaam in Numbers 23:20 in your defense of...?

Jesus refined the flaws of the Ten Commandments, such as the commandment of "honoring parents," "murder," "adultery," so, what was actually there in the tabernacle in heaven after Jesus's refinement (Revelation 15:5)?

So, we don't change what God has used His authority to change, especially the matter of old to new covenant. "If He takes away, who can stop Him?"

God's character never changes - and His law reflects His character. Perfect, holy, good and righteousness Psa 19:7 Psa 119:172, which is everlasting Psa 119:142

A covenant is an agreement, changing terms of an agreement is not changing the character of God.

Jesus never changed to not honor our parents, murder or committing adultery or breaking the least of these commandments- He applied it to our thoughts and feelings which is what the New Covenant is about- God's law written in our hearts. Heb 8:10 If He changes us from the inside out, our thoughts of anger towards our neighbor would turn to compassion and thou shalt not murder would automatically be kept. Jesus never taught we can literally murder, or covet, or commit adultery or break the least of His commandments- He wants us changed so those things aren't even a consideration. Sadly many miss this important teaching and apply it to we can break His commandments- literally the opposite of what He taught.

Yes God can curse His blessing- God, not man. Only God can reverse His blessing not man.

Please quote one scripture from the mouth of God where He said we don't have to keep the Sabbath. Not Paul who has a warning that many twist his words to their own destruction 2 Peter 3:16 but God. God personally wrote and spoke the Sabbath commandment, just like the other nine- where does God say we don't have to keep. Most of the scriptures on the Sabbath are direct thus saith the Lords, for us to keep and not profane that He blesses when we keep made for everyone Mark 2:27 Isa 56:1-6, that we are to live by every Word. The argument against God's Sabbath day is not really with man.

 

[Bob S]

Please quote one scripture from the mouth of God where He said we don't have to keep the Sabbath.

Why would God tell us we don't have to "keep" the Sabbath when He never asked us to keep it in the first place? I find your question to be just another false tactic used by SDAs on people that have no prior knowledge of what scripture really is telling us.

Not Paul who has a warning that many twist his words to their own destruction 2 Peter 3:16 but God.

How can anyone "twist" Paul's words in Gal3:19, 2Cor3:6-13, Eph2:8-15 and Col 2:16-17? The fact is that SDAs sure do try, but convince very few.

God personally wrote and spoke the Sabbath commandment, just like the other nine-

Yes, He did, to one small group of slaves who had come out of Egypt, but not one word to all the remainder of His children anyplace else on this Earth.

where does God say we don't have to keep.

The question should be where does He tell us we have to keep it?

Most of the scriptures on the Sabbath are direct thus saith the Lords, for us to keep and not profane that He blesses when we keep made for everyone Mark 2:27 Isa 56:1-6, that we are to live by every Word. The argument against God's Sabbath day is not really with man.

Us???? no, not us, He never told "us" He told "them". How about getting your story straight.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Why would God tell us we don't have to "keep" the Sabbath when He never asked us to keep it in the first place? I find your question to be just another false tactic used by SDAs on people that have no prior knowledge of what scripture really is telling us.

How can anyone "twist" Paul's words in Gal3:19, 2Cor3:6-13, Eph2:8-15 and Col 2:16-17? The fact is that SDAs sure do try, but convince very few.

Yes, He did, to one small group of slaves who had come out of Egypt, but not one word to all the remainder of His children anyplace else on this Earth.

The question should be where does He tell us we have to keep it?

Us???? no, not us, He never told "us" He told "them". How about getting your story straight.

All very good points. Thank you.

 

[Bob S]

You are welcome bb... I have challenged so many SDAs and other Sabbath tryers to tell us when God decided to include Gentiles into the old Torah and make them adhere to the Sabbath requirement that was given to only Israel. No one has ever answered with anything that would resemble a true Biblical answer.

 

[bbbbbbb]

You are welcome bb... I have challenged so many SDAs and other Sabbath tryers to tell us when God decided to include Gentiles into the old Torah and make them adhere to the Sabbath requirement that was given to only Israel. No one has ever answered with anything that would resemble a true Biblical answer.

I agree. I have followed many of these discussions, primarily as an observer, and have yet to read a true Biblical answer. The simple reality, as we know, is that God made a covenant with His people, Israel, beginning on Mount Sinai and that everyone else, called Gentiles, never have been nor ever will be part of that covenant.

 

[Cornelius8L]

God's character never changes - and His law reflects His character. Perfect, holy, good and righteousness Psa 19:7 Psa 119:172, which is everlasting Psa 119:142

A covenant is an agreement, changing terms of an agreement is not changing the character of God.

Yes God can curse His blessing- God, not man. Only God can reverse His blessing not man.

Alright, now you understand that God can change His blessings and not stick to what Balaam said. Plus, you've realized that agreements can change too.

Jesus never changed to not honor our parents, murder or committing adultery or breaking the least of these commandments- He applied it to our thoughts and feelings which is what the New Covenant is about- God's law written in our hearts. Heb 8:10 If He changes us from the inside out, our thoughts of anger towards our neighbor would turn to compassion and thou shalt not murder would automatically be kept. Jesus never taught we can literally murder, or covet, or commit adultery or break the least of His commandments- He wants us changed so those things aren't even a consideration. Sadly many miss this important teaching and apply it to we can break His commandments- literally the opposite of what He taught.

Please quote one scripture from the mouth of God where He said we don't have to keep the Sabbath. Not Paul who has a warning that many twist his words to their own destruction 2 Peter 3:16 but God. God personally wrote and spoke the Sabbath commandment, just like the other nine- where does God say we don't have to keep. Most of the scriptures on the Sabbath are direct thus saith the Lords, for us to keep and not profane that He blesses when we keep made for everyone Mark 2:27 Isa 56:1-6, that we are to live by every Word. The argument against God's Sabbath day is not really with man.

It seems like your resistance to seeing every day as holy, not just the seventh (Romans 14:5), might be because of your church's doctrine or traditions. Maybe you're struggling to align your actions with what the Bible says, like denying yourself, as mentioned in Matthew 16:24. We've discussed how the old Sabbath no longer apply, being replaced by a new covenant, and how Paul referred Sabbath as "today." But it seems like you're more focused on defending what you've said for many years in CF, even if it means distorting the scripture.

Hosea 2:11 "I(God) will put an end to all her exultation מְשׂוֹשָׂ֔הּ (mə·śō·w·śāh): her feasts, New Moons, and Sabbaths—ALL her appointed feasts."​

Here's some advice: Take a moment to calm down and think about whether the beginning of your church aligns with 1 Timothy 2:12, if your doctrines are based on the understanding from 1 Corinthians 13:9-10, and remember that tradition is just human-made rules, as mentioned in Mark 7:7.

 

[HIM]

That is why I asked whether you want to understand, not whether you understand.



See the KJV of that verse to see the correct translation.

If you have something to say, say and prove it. Right now you are not saying anything.