childeye 2 said:

Thanks, that was an interesting read. I still think the positive/negative aspects of determinism are not being fully addressed. I don't see how one can escape the inevitable whether good or bad.

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I don't either.

I can live with the idea that there is no free will. I do consider it now and then if I'm in a bad mood because someone has done something that I don't appreciate. It can be psychologically beneficial in thinking that there was a fixed sequence of events that happened that caused the person to act as they did. So I can view it more as 'an act of God' rather than waste valuable emotional credit in frustration and blame.

But...I most definitely do not like the idea that everything is pre-determined. And I have spent quite a lot of time looking for an escape clause for this. It's why it has taken me very many years to make a decision on free will. It suggests a form of fatalism. Well, it did suggest it. Now...I accept it.

Does that mean I can roll my eyes when I'm up before the judge for sentencing and claim that hey, it was all predetermined and that I can't be blamed? Well, yes and no. Yes, it was all predetermined but no, you're still going to be blamed. You are responsible. Tough luck. But your culpability, in the legal sense - the degree of responsibility to which we will hold you, will be taken into account.

I like it how Jesus answers his question with two words, "water and Spirit", and pretty much nothing else. Nicodemous was a teacher of the law. He should know the definition of those words - meaning, they can be found in the OT. I think most people understand what Spirit means. I think very few understand water.

tdidymas said:

What's your point?

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My point is that a day in genesis is 24 hours, 1,000 years and 8 billion years ALL AT THE SAME TIME depending on your perspective.

The story of the elephant says it best. One is holding the trunk, one is holding the tail and one is holding the. They all compare notes and describe something similar but different. Still they are all talking about the same elephant.

The Bible works off of shadows and types. Children learn the literal Bible in Sunday school. But then when they graduate from Sunday School they enter into the sanctuary and learn the symbolic Bible. 1 Corinthians 15:45 says: So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living being"; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit." What does that mean? This is going to be difficult for a sunday school student to understand how you have a first and a last like that.

• Adam represents humanity’s natural state, created from the dust of the earth.
• Christ, the last Adam, represents a new spiritual reality and redemption.

You see there is a physical literal reality then there is a spiritual reality.
Everything in the universe has to balance itself so one is as true as the other.
Moses himself in Psalms tells us a day is 1,000 years. We call this dispensationalism.
Some people refer to that as the day age theory were a day represents an age or an era,
No reason to go on from here if you do not understand this much.
Or you do not want to understand. That is your choice, that is up to you.

Apple Sky said:

Lol'z

1. It doesn't even show you them sailing around the none existence Antarctica coastline.

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One minute you're posting a reference to someone who visited Antarctica 4 times and saying that visitors can't go very far into the place. The next, you're writing about a non existent Antarctica coastline.
Which is it?

Jeffrey Bowden said:

You are dodging the returns of Jesus. It isn't a total of 2. How many times did He appear in the OT?

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Spiritually Jesus was always here and He has never left us. Matthew 28:20
But what is Prophesied is a physical Return in power and glory, seen by everyone.
He does not need to come in your rapture fable. As you do not know the way....you have to have Him provide a bus service.
Even on His terrible Day of fiery wrath, He will not be seen. Isaiah 66:15-17, Psalms 11:4-6

Jeffrey Bowden said:

The pre-Trib rapture is the next prophesied return of Jesus.

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It was Goebbels who said: If you repeat a lie often enough, people will believe it.
I assure you; it doesn't work that way with me. But the poor saps in dipsy congregations have the rapture rammed down their throats.

Tell us; have you ever heard any alternative to the rapture preached? Would you consider a Biblically supported alternative? If not, why not?

trophy33 said:

Dont change the Bible, it does not say that the lights are under the firmament. It says they are in the firmament

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This is what I've always said, so how am I changing the Bible ?

tonychanyt said:

Matthew 27:


Judas hanged himself and died. His body was left hanging, then Acts 1:


See also Who bought the field of blood?.

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Why can't both of those be true? We can see that the two testimonies written by 2 different people wrote their statement for a different reason, and from a different perspective. Matthew's point was that Judas was unrepentant and committed suicide out of the misery of guilt. Luke wrote that Judas' bowels burst open and the place was called the "field of blood." So then, could Judas have hanged himself in a tree, and some days later his bowels burst open after the body fell? Perhaps the neck rotted enough to sever the head, or perhaps someone cut him down. Maybe he used a thin rope to hang himself. The details aren't written, so we must assume they aren't important. What is important is that the writers of scripture wrote truth, and when people decide it's contradictory, it means they are pleased to accuse the writers of scripture with error, so that they can excuse themselves from believing any of it.

Great-American said:

Yes, I do. It is the only option for America. We do not belong on the Russian border any more than the Soviets belonged in Cuba. There are historical issues there that predate American itself. that none of us really understand.

The only course for American is what Trump said: Sit them down, and get the shooting to stop, but not with military aid.

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My typos really irritate me. LOL.
I wish there was not a time limit on editing posts

trophy33 said:

This absurd picture is not what the world looks like, though. You can send a balloon with a cam and see that its not flat. Also, GPS, satellite internet/TV and other stuff would not work.

Here is a softball question for you - if Antarctica circumferences the earth, how can people sail around it?
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Lol'z

1. It doesn't even show you them sailing around the none existence Antarctica coastline.
2. And yes you maybe able to to track them going around the horn, which is pretty dangerous sailing.
3. And this guy who made the video is probably a paid opposition shill.

Nice try trophy, I'll give you that.

Ceallaigh said:

You know of course that the concern is in the treatment being more harmful than the disorder. As has been the case history with several treatments that were abandoned and or outlawed.

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Because, as everyone knows, the most qualified person to determine whether a medical treatment is harmful or not is a politician.

-- A2SG, that's why everyone trusts politicians to make all their medical decisions for them.....

I want to be charitable here but it is difficult. These Universities have becomes bastions of extremism and Leftism. Any faculty with conservative views were purged long ago. And faculty were some of the participants in the protests!

There were outside influences involved, her is correct there, but he needs to come to grips with the fact that the faculty and most of the student body were on board with it all. It sounds to me like he is trying to shift the blame off of the people he works with.

I'd love to know who he voted for.

You mean Biden actually gave the medal to someone who deserves it? I am shocked. He also gave one to Pelosi and Al Gore.

Good for the priest!

WarriorAngel said:

I pretty much agree with your thoughts...

Ban patrol may now take you.
Buhahahaha

I was just kidding.. maybe
Welcome to OBOB.
Though I believe the same, I vouch for prayers.

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Michie said:

Welcome!

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Wolseley said:

Sounds as if you and I have a great deal in common. I agree with everything you said here.

Welcome. Just remember not to attack anybody; the best way to deal with Our Many Detractors is to counter their drivel with authentic Catholic teachings from authoritative Catholic sources----and to that, I would add the caveat that the best sources are usually pre-Vatican II, LOL.

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chevyontheriver said:

This will offend somebody. You can count on somebody to be offended by almost anything. But nothing you wrote violates the rules of CF. Do watch out in applying any of this to individuals, for example by saying that some leftist who calls himself a Christian is not in reality a Christian. I have seen people get in trouble for saying that. I can think it. I just can't say it.

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Well, thanks to everyone again. I appreciate the kind words.
If you like my video there are more here: Great American Real News Links
and my website: Great American Real News Links, Politics and Elections information
(I don't get a penny from it so I am not selling anything here)

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RileyG said:

Yes. You can hover over my icon and send me a message. If I’m making any sense

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I cannot. Nothing is there. Maybe I am too new for messaging privaleges. No matter, I posted the video anyways. Let the chips fall where they may. LOL

Hazelelponi said:

Welcome to CF.
You'll fit in fine...

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Thank you.

DJWhalen said:

I love it!!!

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I appreciate that. More here: Great American Real News Links
and my website: Great American Real News Links, Politics and Elections information

stevevw said:

I gave this evidence already which shows you don't read the evidence.

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Your following links are all about hierarchy; but your comment was about hierarchy, rigid roles and control. These three things together are not "highly benefficial, healthy and normal."

trophy33 said:

I am a bit confused how both points can be true. If a large majority of Adventists believes in three eternal equal persons, how can a majority not believe that the Holy Spirit is a person?

The definition of the trinity in the parenthesis was not provided in the questionnaires?

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Some people might interpret "person" as "having a body and being humanoid". Which can lead to confusion. English and Latin have no easy equivalent to the actual term the Church Fathers used, hypostasis. Person actually comes from a term used to refer to an actor wearing a mask.

That's not that surprising, considering it is a difficult concept and American culture tends to be pragmatic rather than metaphysical. In surveys, over 40 percent of American Evangelicals deny that Jesus is divine, too.

SavedByGrace3 said:

I think the biggest and most obvious problem is, well, look at the universe. Does this look like the mind and essence of God manifest?

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Sure... why not? That's not far from how many Christians theologians have thought about God's relationship to the world in the past.

SavedByGrace3 said:

At the instant of creation, the universe and everything in it received sovereignty to both exist and interact with other elements of creation. The scripture mentions a "course of nature," which can only be something that is running independently.

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I don't see how one can believe that nature "runs independently" and not come to be a deist or atheist, following its logical course. If God is just an Unmoved Mover, that's far from the God of the Bible, who is intimately involved with, as Jesus says, even the sparrows and the grass of the fields.

Nagomirov said:

У нас в России консерватизм и патриархальные ценности. Вот вы и критикуете нашу Русскую Церковь, но вам лучше бы позаботиться о себе, Байдене, его трансгендерной политике, продвижении ЛГБТ в США. Ваше общество больно, а вы критикуете здоровое общество. Доктор, исцели себя.

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I missed this thread seven years ago. Dunno why.

I can say that a lot of Archer’s expressed concerns have certainly come to pass.

As to the quote, welcome, Nagomirov!
I understand Russian quite well, but this IS an English-language forum. if you have any problems or questions about English, I can help you with that as a professional EFL teacher.

You are right some degree of conservatism and patriarchal values has survived in Russia. And the Russian church rightly stands against the things you yourself criticize. However, when you suggest that Russian society is healthy, I have to challenge that idea. There is certainly a large minority that rejects belief, and rejects conservatism and patriarchal values. Abortion is legal widely practiced in Russia, despite the ostensible influence of the Church that ought to be powerful enough to stop it.

But the number one issue, I think, is that the Russian Church is now serving the secular political interests of the state, which is altogether not the mission of the Church. “Holy things for the Holy”. But the “holy war” approved of in documents of the Patriarchate is anything but holy. It is a political action designed to maintain Russia’s perceived territorial interests. Priests who right think that war is bad, pre-emptive first-strike wars are worse, and killing fellow Orthodox Christians is bad for our souls are punished, fired, demoted, transferred, exiled. even priests, who said nothing publicly have been punished. That is the Church hierarchy punishing priests, not for wrongdoing, but because it questions the narrative of Russia’s secular political actions, not any conflict with the business of the Church. Tell me how the Church is NOT in bed with the government, something no national Church ever ought to be, if it is ever to speak the truth in love to power. We rightly criticize Ukraine for using the new Ukrainian Church Pat. Bartholomew wrongly established to do exactly the same thing in the Ukraine. Why does the Russian Church get a pass to do so?