Why Everyone Needs An AR-15

[HARK!]

I don't usually encounter someone trying to kill me and my loved ones.

Not usually? How often does this happen; and what do you do to escape death?

 

[BNR32FAN]

Is this a problem you deal with frequently? In my day-to-day life I don't usually encounter someone trying to kill me and my loved ones. In fact, if I had to count the number of times this has come up in the last almost 42 years of my life, I'd say it's a big round zero.

-CryptoLutheran

So you’re saying this doesn’t happen? I’ve been shot at by people trying to kill me. Luckily I was able to escape into some tall bushes and run away unharmed. What will you do if the day comes where you’re forced to watch as your loved ones are being raped & murdered, will you wish you had a gun then? Would you hope and pray that someone with a gun would come and save you? There are on average 20,000 homicides committed every year in America. What’s the harm of having a gun and never needing it?

 

[BNR32FAN]

Well, you know, it's not though. It isn't even remotely similar. And it is disturbing that you consider owning an AR-15 the same way you consider mandatory seat belts in motor vehicles.

Why stop at AR-15s? Why not everyone own a nuke? Because it's absurd? Well if it's so absurd, then why did the Cold War never get hot?

Do you think my neighbor is going to risk harming me if they know I can nuke them?

Tell me why my proposition is crazy without defeating whatever argument you might offer for why I need an AR-15.

-CryptoLutheran

Now you’re just making irrational exaggerations that are not even remotely a viable argument. Can we please keep the discussion on an adult level?

 

[HARK!]

Well, you know, it's not though. It isn't even remotely similar.

You're right. I've never needed a seat belt but I need my guns roughly once or twice a year.

 

[Tuur]

Fantasy? Not on my end. Watch the second video for a dose of reality.

I can prove that bigger bullets at higher velocities, do more damage, all day long. If you are still not convinced of reality after watching the second video; let me know; and I'll show you some more.

When an uncle told me he preferred .223 for deer hunting, I was surprised. This was in a time when the .30-06 was still more popular than the .308 and the 30-30 was a popular deer rifle. He said it didn't tear up the meat as bad.

I don't know the particular round he used. Military rounds tend to be full metal jacketed and have less expansion than partially jacketed hunting rounds. Hunting rounds can also have a heavier bullet than military rounds as well as higher powered loads.

At the time I had rifled slugs in case of bear. These in particular had a slight hollow point. Hollow points expand more than regular rounds, and a rifled slug has a diameter a little smaller than the end of the shotgun barrel. That will tear up the meat. Wanting a little more for the table, I used 00 buckshot and a few times hunted with a 30-30. Some areas require rifled slugs for shotguns in deer hunting, but buckshot didn't seem to tear up the meat that badly.

May be wrong, but I don't think the military uses hollow points. They do 00 buckshot, but I have heard (but don't know) that they are full metal jacketed.

The irony is that when hunting, the rounds tend to be more powerful, heavier, and expand more than military rounds.

BTW, don't take my word for it. Check the ballistics. Look at bullet weight and expansion, as well as energy down range. Those are listed in the ballistics. Then compare it to military rounds.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Well, you know, it's not though. It isn't even remotely similar. And it is disturbing that you consider owning an AR-15 the same way you consider mandatory seat belts in motor vehicles.

Why stop at AR-15s? Why not everyone own a nuke? Because it's absurd? Well if it's so absurd, then why did the Cold War never get hot?

Do you think my neighbor is going to risk harming me if they know I can nuke them?

Tell me why my proposition is crazy without defeating whatever argument you might offer for why I need an AR-15.

-CryptoLutheran

Let me explain why I own a gun. Not long after I got married and became the father of two beautiful daughters I had a nightmare one night about people trying to break into my house and I woke up to people chopping thru my bedroom door with a machete. Let me clarify, in my dream I woke up to people trying to chop thru my bedroom door. I didn’t own a gun, all I had was a K Bar knife which is no match for a machete. I woke up literally screaming to my wife to run. At that point I realized how unprotected we are and as a husband and a father it is my responsibility to protect my wife and my children from the evil people in this world who don’t share the same morals that you and I do. So I bought a pistol and I keep it locked up in a safe where only my wife and I can get to it. So what’s the problem here? What is so wrong with me having a pistol hoping that I never actually need it?

 

[ViaCrucis]

Let me explain why I own a gun. Not long after I got married and became the father of two beautiful daughters I had a nightmare one night about people trying to break into my house and I woke up to people chopping thru my bedroom door with a machete. Let me clarify, in my dream I woke up to people trying to chop thru my bedroom door. I didn’t own a gun, all I had was a K Bar knife which is no match for a machete. I woke up literally screaming to my wife to run. At that point I realized how unprotected we are and as a husband and a father it is my responsibility to protect my wife and my children from the evil people in this world who don’t share the same morals that you and I do. So I bought a pistol and I keep it locked up in a safe where only my wife and I can get to it. So what’s the problem here? What is so wrong with me having a pistol hoping that I never actually need it?

I never said there was anything wrong with you, or anyone, owning a gun. At no point have I tried to argue against you having a gun if you want one.

I'm very sorry for your bad dream, but just let me understand you correctly: Nobody actually was trying to chop through your bedroom door with a machete, correct? That only happened in your dream?

I'm asking, because I'm hoping that you aren't trying to argue that you need a gun because you had a scary dream. Because that would be crazy.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[ViaCrucis]

You're right. I've never needed a seat belt but I need my guns roughly once or twice a year.

Elaborate for the class.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[ViaCrucis]

Now you’re just making irrational exaggerations that are not even remotely a viable argument. Can we please keep the discussion on an adult level?

Why is it irrational? I invited you to explain why my proposition is absurd.

The only thing stopping a bad guy with a nuke is a good guy with a nuke. Tell me why I'm wrong.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[BNR32FAN]

I never said there was anything wrong with you, or anyone, owning a gun. At no point have I tried to argue against you having a gun if you want one.

I'm very sorry for your bad dream, but just let me understand you correctly: Nobody actually was trying to chop through your bedroom door with a machete, correct? That only happened in your dream?

I'm asking, because I'm hoping that you aren't trying to argue that you need a gun because you had a scary dream. Because that would be crazy.

-CryptoLutheran

Ok I asked you this question and you didn’t answer before so I’ll ask again and please give me an honest answer this time. Do you deny the fact that innocent people are killed everyday in America?

 

[BNR32FAN]

Why is it irrational? I invited you to explain why my proposition is absurd.

The only thing stopping a bad guy with a nuke is a good guy with a nuke. Tell me why I'm wrong.

-CryptoLutheran

Oh I don’t know maybe it has something to do with the fact that a nuke kills everyone within a 20 mile radius that makes this argument completely stupid.

 

[HARK!]

When an uncle told me he preferred .223 for deer hunting, I was surprised. This was in a time when the .30-06 was still more popular than the .308 and the 30-30 was a popular deer rifle. He said it didn't tear up the meat as bad.

I don't know the particular round he used. Military rounds tend to be full metal jacketed and have less expansion than partially jacketed hunting rounds. Hunting rounds can also have a heavier bullet than military rounds as well as higher powered loads.

At the time I had rifled slugs in case of bear. These in particular had a slight hollow point. Hollow points expand more than regular rounds, and a rifled slug has a diameter a little smaller than the end of the shotgun barrel. That will tear up the meat. Wanting a little more for the table, I used 00 buckshot and a few times hunted with a 30-30. Some areas require rifled slugs for shotguns in deer hunting, but buckshot didn't seem to tear up the meat that badly.

May be wrong, but I don't think the military uses hollow points. They do 00 buckshot, but I have heard (but don't know) that they are full metal jacketed.

The irony is that when hunting, the rounds tend to be more powerful, heavier, and expand more than military rounds.

BTW, don't take my word for it. Check the ballistics. Look at bullet weight and expansion, as well as energy down range. Those are listed in the ballistics. Then compare it to military rounds.

Did you watch that second video that I posted that started this little side discussion? A picture is worth a thousand words.

It's my understanding that the military uses FMJ because that way the bullet will pass through an enemy soldier, and possibly wound one or two more enemies. It takes two to carry a wounded soldier off the field; so for every soldier that is wounded, three are taken off the field.

Here it is:

I LOL when the chair blew apart.

 

[Tuur]

Did you watch that second video that I posted that started this little side discussion? A picture is worth a thousand words.

It's my understanding that the military uses FMJ because that way the bullet will pass through an enemy soldier, and possibly wound one or two more enemies. It takes two to carry a wounded soldier off the field; so for every soldier that is wounded, three are taken off the field.

Here it is:

I LOL when the chair blew apart.

I watched it just now. Not surprising. We're talking a 7mm, presumably a 7mm Remington Magnum. What's fun is comparing it to the 30-06, which was developed for the US military. To the best of my knowledge, the 7mm Remington Magnum was designed for hunting.

I doubt it will change any minds.

 

[HARK!]

I'm very sorry for your bad dream, but just let me understand you correctly: Nobody actually was trying to chop through your bedroom door with a machete, correct? That only happened in your dream?

You are more likely to be murdered with a knife or cutting instrument, than a rifle; let alone an AR-15.

You are more likely to be murdered with hands fists or feet, than a rifle; let alone an AR-15.

You are more likely to be murdered with a weapon other than a firearm, hands fists or feet, or a knife or cutting instrument; than you are likely to be murdered by a rifle; let alone an AR-15.

Fear of being murdered by an AR-15 is a somewhat irrational fear.

Table 20

ucr.fbi.gov

 

[th1bill]

A .223 round isn’t a large caliber, it’s actually smaller than most hunting rifles, and just because someone has a semi automatic doesn’t mean that they’re going to spray their target with lead. The point of having a semi automatic is so that you can get a second shot off quickly if you miss. When your shooting at a target from a long distance and your having to compensate for the target’s movement and wind velocity you have to lead the target and often your first shot is going to miss. With any luck you’ll be able to see where the first shot hit and adjust your aim accordingly. With a single shot you don’t have a chance at reloading fast enough and with a lever action or a bolt action your looking at at least 5 seconds to reload and get your sights back on target. With a semi automatic that time is cut to maybe 1 or 2 seconds which makes a huge difference in a wooded area.

I am sorry but the AR-15 is a sick choice for any purpose other than to kill men with. That tiny round is so unstable that if it hits a Dragon Fly before it contacts the target the projectile begins to tumble. The man I shot at six or seven feet from me had a clean hole through and through. Had I made that headshot with my M-16, same ammo, it is likely a large portion of his rear skull would have been lost with the round. No Deer Hunter wants to destroy any of the meat and the .223 will do that.

Now, I really am sorry but the discussion does not center on Auto nor Semiauto Long Guns but on the Mattel Special, the M-15.

 

[HARK!]

When an uncle told me he preferred .223 for deer hunting, I was surprised. This was in a time when the .30-06 was still more popular than the .308 and the 30-30 was a popular deer rifle. He said it didn't tear up the meat as bad.

I don't know the particular round he used.

Hunting​

Many hunters prefer using AR-15–style rifles because of their versatility, accuracy, wide variety of available features, and wide variety of calibers (see below).[88] Collapsible stocks are convenient for hunters who pack their rifles into remote hunting locations or for length of pull adjustments to fit any sized hunter.[89] Construction with lightweight polymers and corrosion-resistant alloys makes these rifles preferred for hunting in moist environments with less concern about rusting or warping wood stocks. Positioning of the AR-15 safety is an improvement over traditional bolt action hunting rifles. Many states require hunters to use reduced-capacity magazines.[90] If a hunter misses with a first shot, the self-loading feature enables rapid follow-up shots against dangerous animals like feral pigs or rapidly moving animals like jackrabbits.[88] Hunters shooting larger game animals often use upper receivers and barrels adapted for larger cartridges or heavier bullets. Several states prohibit the use of .22 caliber cartridges like the .223 Remington on large game.[91][92][93]

AR-15–style rifle - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Tuur]

I am sorry but the AR-15 is a sick choice for any purpose other than to kill men with. That tiny round is so unstable that if it hits a Dragon Fly before it contacts the target the projectile begins to tumble. The man I shot at six or seven feet from me had a clean hole through and through. Had I made that headshot with my M-16, same ammo, it is likely a large portion of his rear skull would have been lost with the round. No Deer Hunter wants to destroy any of the meat and the .223 will do that.

Now, I really am sorry but the discussion does not center on Auto nor Semiauto Long Guns but on the Mattel Special, the M-15.

So, you're saying my uncle was wrong in his assessment of the .223 for deer hunting? Remember, he said he preferred it because it didn't tear up the meat as bad as the .30 caliber long arms he and my cousins had used for hunting. And yes, the .223 tumbles, which is the round. Granted that I've seen a Civil War era Minnie Ball that keyholed, but the .223 is known to have that characteristic. I don't think it mattered that my uncle most likely used a bolt action.

That there are bolt actions for the .223 says that yes, it can serve as a hunting round. No, wouldn't want to use it for bear or hog, but then again, wouldn't want to use a .22, either.

 

[BNR32FAN]

I am sorry but the AR-15 is a sick choice for any purpose other than to kill men with. That tiny round is so unstable that if it hits a Dragon Fly before it contacts the target the projectile begins to tumble. The man I shot at six or seven feet from me had a clean hole through and through. Had I made that headshot with my M-16, same ammo, it is likely a large portion of his rear skull would have been lost with the round. No Deer Hunter wants to destroy any of the meat and the .223 will do that.

Now, I really am sorry but the discussion does not center on Auto nor Semiauto Long Guns but on the Mattel Special, the M-15.

A 30/30, 308, 270, or a 30/06 are all typical hunting rifles that do more damage to the meat than a 223. And if a round starts tumbling in the air before it hits its target your most likely going to miss because it’s not going to fly straight that why I said I would prefer an AK over an AR because they’re better for shooting thru brush.

 

[th1bill]

So, you're saying my uncle was wrong in his assessment of the .223 for deer hunting? Remember, he said he preferred it because it didn't tear up the meat as bad as the .30 caliber long arms he and my cousins had used for hunting. And yes, the .223 tumbles, which is the round. Granted that I've seen a Civil War era Minnie Ball that keyholed, but the .223 is known to have that characteristic. I don't think it mattered that my uncle most likely used a bolt action.

That there are bolt actions for the .223 says that yes, it can serve as a hunting round. No, wouldn't want to use it for bear or hog, but then again, wouldn't want to use a .22, either.

But the subject is not the round but the AR-15 and it's small form.

 

[Tuur]

But the subject is not the round but the AR-15 and it's small form.

Be that as it may, the discussion included whether or not the .223 is also a hunting round.