The Sabbath – the fourth of the Ten Commandments

[guevaraj]

John 14:6 6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. John 5:39 You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is they that bear witness about me,

“Not everyone who calls out to me, ‘Lord! Lord!’ will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Only those who actually do the will of my Father in heaven will enter. On judgment day many will say to me, ‘Lord! Lord! We prophesied in your name and cast out demons in your name and performed many miracles in your name.’ But I will reply, ‘I never knew you. Get away from me, you who break God’s laws.’ (Matthew 7:21-23 NLT)

 

[Grip Docility]

“Not everyone who calls out to me, ‘Lord! Lord!’ will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Only those who actually do the will of my Father in heaven will enter. On judgment day many will say to me, ‘Lord! Lord! We prophesied in your name and cast out demons in your name and performed many miracles in your name.’ But I will reply, ‘I never knew you. Get away from me, you who break God’s laws.’ (Matthew 7:21-23 NLT)

Lawless: 1 Timothy 1:9 understanding this, that the law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers,

Romans 5:1 Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,

1 John 2:2 He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world.

2 Corinthians 5:20 Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. 21 For our sake He made Him to be sin Who knew no sin, so that in Him we might become the righteousness of God.

 

[guevaraj]

Lawless: 1 Timothy 1:9 understanding this, that the law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers,

Romans 5:1 Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,

1 John 2:2 He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world.

2 Corinthians 5:20 Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. 21 For our sake He made Him to be sin Who knew no sin, so that in Him we might become the righteousness of God.

Yes indeed, it is good when you obey the royal law as found in the Scriptures: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” But if you favor some people over others, you are committing a sin. You are guilty of breaking the law. For the person who keeps all of the laws except one is as guilty as a person who has broken all of God’s laws. For the same God who said, “You must not commit adultery,” also said, “You must not murder.” So if you murder someone but do not commit adultery, you have still broken the law. (James 2:8-11 NLT)

 

[Grip Docility]

Yes indeed, it is good when you obey the royal law as found in the Scriptures: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” But if you favor some people over others, you are committing a sin. You are guilty of breaking the law. For the person who keeps all of the laws except one is as guilty as a person who has broken all of God’s laws. For the same God who said, “You must not commit adultery,” also said, “You must not murder.” So if you murder someone but do not commit adultery, you have still broken the law. (James 2:8-11 NLT)

You don't understand the verses I posted, do you?

 

[guevaraj]

You don't understand the verses I posted, do you?

Brother, forgiveness is not a substitute for obedience to the Fourth Commandment. When you forgive, you give others another chance, and you don't expect others to continue disobeying, because they trust that your forgiveness gives them license to continue disobeying, when your forgiveness is supposed to give them the opportunity to overcome the disobedience to not need more forgiveness than is necessary to grow in obedience to the Fourth Commandment.

“Not everyone who calls out to me, ‘Lord! Lord!’ will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Only those who actually do the will of my Father in heaven will enter. On judgment day many will say to me, ‘Lord! Lord! We prophesied in your name and cast out demons in your name and performed many miracles in your name.’ But I will reply, ‘I never knew you. Get away from me, you who break God’s laws.’ (Matthew 7:21-23 NLT)​

Jesus gives us as much daily forgiveness as we need to grow in obedience. We come out of sin through Jesus' daily forgiveness, like a child who learns to walk by getting up again and again until he no longer falls.

Now there have been many of those priests, since death prevented them from continuing in office; but because Jesus lives forever, he has a permanent priesthood. Therefore he is able to save completely those who come to God through him, because he always lives to intercede for them. Such a high priest truly meets our need—one who is holy, blameless, pure, set apart from sinners, exalted above the heavens. (Hebrews 7:23-26 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[Grip Docility]

Brother, forgiveness is not a substitute for obedience to the Fourth Commandment.

Then, you are you own savior. That is unwise.

 

[guevaraj]

Then, you are you own savior. That is unwise.

Brother, I cannot save myself from sin because I cannot see the way away from sin. Only God can see the path away from sin to save me by guiding me through His law. Judaism sabotaged God's law because they are "blind" guides to write laws, only God can write laws that free us from sin.

“What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you shut the door of the Kingdom of Heaven in people’s faces. You won’t go in yourselves, and you don’t let others enter either. “What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you cross land and sea to make one convert, and then you turn that person into twice the child of hell you yourselves are! “Blind guides! What sorrow awaits you! For you say that it means nothing to swear ‘by God’s Temple,’ but that it is binding to swear ‘by the gold in the Temple.’ Blind fools! Which is more important—the gold or the Temple that makes the gold sacred? And you say that to swear ‘by the altar’ is not binding, but to swear ‘by the gifts on the altar’ is binding. How blind! For which is more important—the gift on the altar or the altar that makes the gift sacred? When you swear ‘by the altar,’ you are swearing by it and by everything on it. And when you swear ‘by the Temple,’ you are swearing by it and by God, who lives in it. And when you swear ‘by heaven,’ you are swearing by the throne of God and by God, who sits on the throne. (Matthew 23:13-22 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[Grip Docility]

Brother, I cannot save myself from sin because I cannot see the way away from sin. Only God can see the path away from sin to save me by guiding me through His law. Judaism sabotaged God's law because they are "blind" guides to write laws, only God can write laws that free us from sin.

“What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you shut the door of the Kingdom of Heaven in people’s faces. You won’t go in yourselves, and you don’t let others enter either. “What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you cross land and sea to make one convert, and then you turn that person into twice the child of hell you yourselves are! “Blind guides! What sorrow awaits you! For you say that it means nothing to swear ‘by God’s Temple,’ but that it is binding to swear ‘by the gold in the Temple.’ Blind fools! Which is more important—the gold or the Temple that makes the gold sacred? And you say that to swear ‘by the altar’ is not binding, but to swear ‘by the gifts on the altar’ is binding. How blind! For which is more important—the gift on the altar or the altar that makes the gift sacred? When you swear ‘by the altar,’ you are swearing by it and by everything on it. And when you swear ‘by the Temple,’ you are swearing by it and by God, who lives in it. And when you swear ‘by heaven,’ you are swearing by the throne of God and by God, who sits on the throne. (Matthew 23:13-22 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Is your Obedience of your flesh required for salvation?
Obedience: compliance with an order, request, or law or submission to another's authority.

You, yourself said that we must OBEY the 4th Commandant. Who is doing the OBEYING? Does having the Holy Spirit within us circumvent our ability to choose?

 

[guevaraj]

Is your Obedience of your flesh required for salvation?

Brother, when I disobey God I am obeying my flesh. I am not obeying my flesh when I obey God. Obedience is required for salvation, as Jesus asserts, correcting their disobedience in the following passage, because Judaism replaced the law of God with their own human law that does not remove the sin that obeying the law of God would have removed from their character.

Jesus replied, “You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you, for he wrote, ‘These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. Their worship is a farce, for they teach man-made ideas as commandments from God.’ For you ignore God’s law/commandment and substitute your own tradition.” Then he said, “You skillfully sidestep God’s law(nomos)/commandment(entolé) in order to hold on to your own tradition. For instance, Moses gave you this law(nomos)/commandment(entolé) from God: ‘Honor your father and mother,’ and ‘Anyone who speaks disrespectfully of father or mother must be put to death.’ But you say it is all right for people to say to their parents, ‘Sorry, I can’t help you. For I have vowed to give to God what I would have given to you.’ In this way, you let them disregard their needy parents. And so you cancel the word of God in order to hand down your own tradition. And this is only one example among many others.” (Mark 7:6-13 NLT fixed)​

Obedience: compliance with an order, request, or law or submission to another's authority.

We need to submit to God's law because we are blind guides to know how to use laws to remove sin from our character.

You, yourself said that we must OBEY the 4th Commandant. Who is doing the OBEYING?

He who has put his trust in the law of God instead of following the desire of his flesh to disobey the law of God. The flesh wants to disobey the law of God because the law of God removes sin from our character.

Does having the Holy Spirit within us circumvent our ability to choose?

The Holy Spirit has given us the word of God through prophets, but He is used as the go-to excuse to do what the flesh wants, which is to disobey the law of God revealed in His word given by the Holy Spirit through prophets.

For a time is coming when people will no longer listen to sound and wholesome teaching. They will follow their own desires and will look for teachers who will tell them whatever their itching ears want to hear. They will reject the truth and chase after myths. (2 Timothy 4:3-4 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[Grip Docility]

Brother, when I disobey God I am obeying my flesh. I am not obeying my flesh when I obey God. Obedience is required for salvation, as Jesus asserts, correcting their disobedience in the following passage, because Judaism replaced the law of God with their own human law that does not remove the sin that obeying the law of God would have removed from their character.

Jesus replied, “You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you, for he wrote, ‘These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. Their worship is a farce, for they teach man-made ideas as commandments from God.’ For you ignore God’s law/commandment and substitute your own tradition.” Then he said, “You skillfully sidestep God’s law(nomos)/commandment(entolé) in order to hold on to your own tradition. For instance, Moses gave you this law(nomos)/commandment(entolé) from God: ‘Honor your father and mother,’ and ‘Anyone who speaks disrespectfully of father or mother must be put to death.’ But you say it is all right for people to say to their parents, ‘Sorry, I can’t help you. For I have vowed to give to God what I would have given to you.’ In this way, you let them disregard their needy parents. And so you cancel the word of God in order to hand down your own tradition. And this is only one example among many others.” (Mark 7:6-13 NLT fixed)​

We need to submit to God's law because we are blind guides to know how to use laws to remove sin from our character.

He who has put his trust in the law of God instead of following the desire of his flesh to disobey the law of God. The flesh wants to disobey the law of God because the law of God removes sin from our character.

The Holy Spirit has given us the word of God through prophets, but He is used as the go-to excuse to do what the flesh wants, which is to disobey the law of God revealed in His word given by the Holy Spirit through prophets.

For a time is coming when people will no longer listen to sound and wholesome teaching. They will follow their own desires and will look for teachers who will tell them whatever their itching ears want to hear. They will reject the truth and chase after myths. (2 Timothy 4:3-4 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Let your yes be yes and your no be no. Anything else is from the evil one. Matthew 5:7

Will you have a simple yes and no discussion with me, without walling up doctrine?

 

[guevaraj]

Let your yes be yes and your no be no. Anything else is from the evil one. Matthew 5:7
Will you have a simple yes and no discussion with me, without walling up doctrine?

Brother, I make no promises. Present the argument you use to "distort" the truth of the need to obey God's law and I will try to find the "error" in your argument.

Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction. Therefore, dear friends, since you have been forewarned, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of the lawless and fall from your secure position. (2 Peter 3:15-17)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[Grip Docility]

Brother, I make no promises. Present the argument you use to "distort" the truth of the need to obey God's law and I will try to find the "error" in your argument.

Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction. Therefore, dear friends, since you have been forewarned, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of the lawless and fall from your secure position. (2 Peter 3:15-17)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Read my question and your answer.

Blessings and prayers

 

[sparow]

Brother, I cannot save myself from sin because I cannot see the way away from sin. Only God can see the path away from sin to save me by guiding me through His law. Judaism sabotaged God's law because they are "blind" guides to write laws, only God can write laws that free us from sin.

“What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you shut the door of the Kingdom of Heaven in people’s faces. You won’t go in yourselves, and you don’t let others enter either. “What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you cross land and sea to make one convert, and then you turn that person into twice the child of hell you yourselves are! “Blind guides! What sorrow awaits you! For you say that it means nothing to swear ‘by God’s Temple,’ but that it is binding to swear ‘by the gold in the Temple.’ Blind fools! Which is more important—the gold or the Temple that makes the gold sacred? And you say that to swear ‘by the altar’ is not binding, but to swear ‘by the gifts on the altar’ is binding. How blind! For which is more important—the gift on the altar or the altar that makes the gift sacred? When you swear ‘by the altar,’ you are swearing by it and by everything on it. And when you swear ‘by the Temple,’ you are swearing by it and by God, who lives in it. And when you swear ‘by heaven,’ you are swearing by the throne of God and by God, who sits on the throne. (Matthew 23:13-22 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Sin is not something you save yourself from, sin is something one refrains from. Salvation from the second death is God's choice, so impress Him, from there, the quality of one's salvation is in according to ones works.

 

[guevaraj]

Salvation from the second death is God's choice, so impress Him, from there, the quality of one's salvation is in according to ones works.

Brother, any scripture to back up what you're trying to clarify? Sin is to disobey God and sin leads to death. To not sin is to obey God's law. Those like Abraham who have put their trust in obeying God are saved. Those who disobey God are lost to sin. For example, Cain was lost to sin because he disobeyed God.

“Why are you so angry?” the LORD asked Cain. “Why do you look so dejected? You will be accepted if you do what is right. But if you refuse to do what is right, then watch out! Sin is crouching at the door, eager to control you. But you must subdue it and be its master.” (Genesis 4:6-7 NLT)​

Sin is to disobey God, and sin leads to death. Those that obey God live and those that disobey God die.

Everyone who sins is breaking God’s law, for all sin is contrary to the law of God. And you know that Jesus came to take away our sins, and there is no sin in him. Anyone who continues to live in him will not sin. But anyone who keeps on sinning does not know him or understand who he is. (1 John 3:4-6 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[sparow]

Brother, any scripture to back up what you're trying to clarify? Sin is to disobey God and sin leads to death. To not sin is to obey God's law. Those like Abraham who have put their trust in obeying God are saved. Those who disobey God are lost to sin. For example, Cain was lost to sin because he disobeyed God.

“Why are you so angry?” the LORD asked Cain. “Why do you look so dejected? You will be accepted if you do what is right. But if you refuse to do what is right, then watch out! Sin is crouching at the door, eager to control you. But you must subdue it and be its master.” (Genesis 4:6-7 NLT)​

Sin is to disobey God, and sin leads to death. Those that obey God live and those that disobey God die.

Everyone who sins is breaking God’s law, for all sin is contrary to the law of God. And you know that Jesus came to take away our sins, and there is no sin in him. Anyone who continues to live in him will not sin. But anyone who keeps on sinning does not know him or understand who he is. (1 John 3:4-6 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

There is no specific list of what to do, such would produce a wrong result, but the blood of Christ for the remission of ones sin is only available through the covenant that most abrogate.

 

[guevaraj]

There is no specific list of what to do, such would produce a wrong result, but the blood of Christ for the remission of ones sin is only available through the covenant that most abrogate.

Brother, the Sabbath is on that list when we are told that if we do not obey the Sabbath we will "fall" like those that died in the desert. God punished those that died in the desert for their disobedience by not allowing them to enter His Sabbath for 40 years, with Manna in the desert being half a day too late to enter the Sabbath near Jerusalem. In the book of Hebrews, the Sabbath kept as the seventh day of the week is corrected from human tradition by telling us that, during the 40 years they kept the Sabbath with Manna, they kept the wrong Sabbath, which does not enter God's rest by being late by half a day when the Sabbath is earlier in Jerusalem than the seventh day of the week. Joshua did not get the Sabbath wrong in Jerusalem, that Jesus kept as our model "Spirit" to do the same as Jesus. Joshua got the days of the week wrong, which makes their human tradition of the Sabbath wrong everywhere beside Jerusalem.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. God announced this through David much later in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now if Joshua had succeeded in giving them this rest, God would not have spoken about another day of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

The days of the week during the 40 years in the desert were from morning to morning, as revealed in the following passage where they are given two portions of Manna on the previous day because there will be no Manna tomorrow. Importantly, the bad news that there will be no quail tomorrow if the next day begins in the "evening" is not mentioned, because they will eat quail in the "evening" before Manna is the first thing they will not have the next day. The quail not mentioned clearly shows the days of the week beginning in the morning.

On the sixth day, they gathered twice as much as usual—four quarts for each person instead of two. Then all the leaders of the community came and asked Moses for an explanation. He told them, “This is what the LORD commanded: Tomorrow will be a day of complete rest, a holy Sabbath day set apart for the LORD. So bake or boil as much as you want today, and set aside what is left for tomorrow.” So they put some aside until morning, just as Moses had commanded. And in the morning the leftover food was wholesome and good, without maggots or odor. Moses said, “Eat this food today, for today is a Sabbath day dedicated to the LORD. There will be no food on the ground today. (Exodus 16:22-25 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[sparow]

Brother, any scripture to back up what you're trying to clarify? Sin is to disobey God and sin leads to death. To not sin is to obey God's law. Those like Abraham who have put their trust in obeying God are saved. Those who disobey God are lost to sin. For example, Cain was lost to sin because he disobeyed God.

“Why are you so angry?” the LORD asked Cain. “Why do you look so dejected? You will be accepted if you do what is right. But if you refuse to do what is right, then watch out! Sin is crouching at the door, eager to control you. But you must subdue it and be its master.” (Genesis 4:6-7 NLT)​

Sin is to disobey God, and sin leads to death. Those that obey God live and those that disobey God die.

Everyone who sins is breaking God’s law, for all sin is contrary to the law of God. And you know that Jesus came to take away our sins, and there is no sin in him. Anyone who continues to live in him will not sin. But anyone who keeps on sinning does not know him or understand who he is. (1 John 3:4-6 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

If we look at the messages to the seven churches, two of the churches have no fault,their salvation is acknowledged, still these are asked to overcome in order to receive greater rewards. Overcome what, sin is not their problem, should they wrestle with angels, Paul is dead and only John is alive.

 

[guevaraj]

If we look at the messages to the seven churches, two of the churches have no fault, their salvation is acknowledged, still these are asked to overcome in order to receive greater rewards. Overcome what, sin is not their problem, should they wrestle with angels, Paul is dead and only John is alive.

Brother, not everyone had problems then, but they still needed to overcome future problems during the long period of time before Jesus returns. Jesus would reward those who would overcome the departure from the "truth" of obeying God as prophesied in the following passage that was to come and now prevails.

In the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who will judge the living and the dead, and in view of his appearing and his kingdom, I give you this charge: Preach the word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. But you, keep your head in all situations, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, discharge all the duties of your ministry. (2 Timothy 4:1-5 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge