VOTE HOW MANY BELIEVE IN A PRE TRIBULATION HOPE/RAPTURE ?

[Douggg]

Neither is a 'rapture to heaven' of the Christian peoples ever actually stated in scripture.

Hebrews 11:
13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

14 For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country.

15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.

16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.

Not Beulah.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Neither is a 'rapture to heaven' of the Christian peoples ever actually stated in scripture.

What Paul guides us with is Prophesies like 2 Thess 2:1-4, where he states that we will see the 'adversary', that is: Satan coming to power and usurping God in the new Temple.
1 Thess 4:15 is quite clear; there will be living Christians on earth, who will meet Jesus when He Returns, then become His priests and co-rulers. Rev 5:9-10
There is no indication they will be fresh converts, as Rev 13:8 precludes that idea.

What Paul wrote in the original 2 Th 2:1-3 is exclusively about making it clear to his Thessalonian flock, who had been deceived by a fraudulent letter (verse 2), that the rapture (the 2nd definition of “apostasia” works beautifully with the context of rapture) will come before the Trib (Day of the Lord) (verses 2 & 3). [I’ve been invited by a very prominent Bible publisher to elaborate on my claim of 2 Th 2:3 being intentionally altered so as to drastically alter the original meaning. This is in-progress.]

1 Th 4:14-15 are prefatory comments on 1 Th 4:16-17, consecutively. V14 is about the dead in Christ being taken from Paradise. V16 is about the raising of the dead in Christ as they transform into their gloried bodies. V15 correlates with V17 concerning those who are alive in Christ at the moment of the pre-Trib rapture. We will not precede the dead in Christ in transforming into our glorified bodies.

1 Cor 15:52 (NIV): in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.

1 Th 4:17 (NIV): After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.

Only 1 Th 4:16-17 align completely and flawlessly align with Acts 1:11. The next return of Jesus Christ will be completely out of the view of unbelievers. We will be raptured straight to Heaven.

“Those” in Rev 3:10 are “those who dwell upon the earth.” They are the unbelievers who will be left behind upon the pre-Trib rapture.

“You” in Rev 3:10 are the dead in Christ raised into their glorified bodies and we who are alive who are also transformed into our glorified bodies. We are not on Earth after the pre-Trib rapture. We are not “those who dwell on the earth” during the Trib.

 

[keras]

16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.

Not Beulah.

Your quote from Hebrews 11<13-16 fails to prove what I asked. It does not say the Lord will take His people to heaven at all. it Promises the new Jerusalem, which we know from Revelation 21:1, will come down from heaven after the Millennium.

Re: the new nation of Beulah, to be established in all of the holy Land: The Prophecy of Isaiah 62:1-5 will come to pass before Jesus Returns.
Jesus said in Matthew 21:43, that the Christian peoples will be the nation that has the Kingdom on earth.

The belief of a 'rapture to heaven', of the Church, is a lie which causes those who believe it to reject and rearrange scripture, to their eternal discredit.

 

[keras]

What Paul wrote in the original 2 Th 2:1-3 is exclusively about making it clear to his Thessalonian flock, who had been deceived by a fraudulent letter (verse 2), that the rapture (the 2nd definition of “apostasia” works beautifully with the context of rapture) will come before the Trib (Day of the Lord) (verses 2 & 3). [I’ve been invited by a very prominent Bible publisher to elaborate on my claim of 2 Th 2:3 being intentionally altered so as to drastically alter the original meaning. This is in-progress.]

1 Th 4:14-15 are prefatory comments on 1 Th 4:16-17, consecutively. V14 is about the dead in Christ being taken from Paradise. V16 is about the raising of the dead in Christ as they transform into their gloried bodies. V15 correlates with V17 concerning those who are alive in Christ at the moment of the pre-Trib rapture. We will not precede the dead in Christ in transforming into our glorified bodies.

1 Cor 15:52 (NIV): in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.

1 Th 4:17 (NIV): After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.

Only 1 Th 4:16-17 align completely and flawlessly align with Acts 1:11. The next return of Jesus Christ will be completely out of the view of unbelievers. We will be raptured straight to Heaven.

“Those” in Rev 3:10 are “those who dwell upon the earth.” They are the unbelievers who will be left behind upon the pre-Trib rapture.

“You” in Rev 3:10 are the dead in Christ raised into their glorified bodies and we who are alive who are also transformed into our glorified bodies. We are not on Earth after the pre-Trib rapture. We are not “those who dwell on the earth” during the Trib.

Just a copy and paste of a diatribe previously posted.
Already shown to be just a lot of your opinion and wishful thinking.

Making 1 Corinthians 15:52 into a rapture verse, shows how you misapply the Prophesies, falsely claiming the raising of all the dead and the gift of immortality before the final Judgment.

We are not “those who dwell on the earth” during the Trib.

This assertion is wrong and is proved wrong by Revelation 13:7, that says how Gods people will be conquered by the beast.
This will happen 42 months before the glorious Return of Jesus, which will be the time of the Great Tribulation.

Also you ignore Revelation 12:14, where we are told that God's faithful peoples will be taken to a place of safety on earth for that time.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Just a copy and paste of a diatribe previously posted.
Already shown to be just a lot of your opinion and wishful thinking.

Making 1 Corinthians 15:52 into a rapture verse, shows how you misapply the Prophesies, falsely claiming the raising of all the dead and the gift of immortality before the final Judgment.

This assertion is wrong and is proved wrong by Revelation 13:7, that says how Gods people will be conquered by the beast.
This will happen 42 months before the glorious Return of Jesus, which will be the time of the Great Tribulation.

Also you ignore Revelation 12:14, where we are told that God's faithful peoples will be taken to a place of safety on earth for that time.

1 Cor 15:52 occurs between 1 Th 4:16-17.

1 Th 4:16–17 are exclusive to the fulfillment of Acts 1:11. “The last trump” is only found in 1 Cor 15:52. Therefore, verse 52 is exclusive in its support of 1 Th 4:16–17. See below.

1 Cor 15:52 occurs between 1 Th 4:16 & 17. Here they are laid out accordingly:

16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.

1 Cor 15:52 (NIV): in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.

17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Just a copy and paste of a diatribe previously posted.
Already shown to be just a lot of your opinion and wishful thinking.

Making 1 Corinthians 15:52 into a rapture verse, shows how you misapply the Prophesies, falsely claiming the raising of all the dead and the gift of immortality before the final Judgment.

This assertion is wrong and is proved wrong by Revelation 13:7, that says how Gods people will be conquered by the beast.
This will happen 42 months before the glorious Return of Jesus, which will be the time of the Great Tribulation.

Also you ignore Revelation 12:14, where we are told that God's faithful peoples will be taken to a place of safety on earth for that time.

The only judgement of believers is the Judgment Seat of Christ. That occurs on the day of the pre-Trib rapture, per 2 Tim 4:8.

Those killed by the beast in the 2nd half are the second group of the GM (Rev 20:4).

 

[keras]

1 Cor 15:52 occurs between 1 Th 4:16-17.

1 Th 4:16–17 are exclusive to the fulfillment of Acts 1:11. Therefore, 1 Cor 15:52 is also exclusive in its support of 1 Th 4:16–17. See below.

1 Cor 15:52 occurs between 1 Th 4:16 & 17. Here they are laid out accordingly:

16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.

1 Cor 15:52 (NIV): in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.

17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.

What fanciful nonsense!
How can people be made immortal before any testing and the Judgment?

Why don't you face the fact of Pauls Prophecy in 1 Cor 15:54-56 must come to pass after the GWT Judgment, Rev 20:11-15.
Only then is Death no more Revelation 21:4

The only judgement of believers is the Judgment Seat of Christ. That occurs on the day of the pre-Trib rapture, per 2 Tim 4:8.

A rapture is never said to happen when King Jesus separates the nations. Matthew 25:31-34

It would be better for you to give up the false doctrines you have been taught by the wolves in the flock, least you become a wolf yourself.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

What fanciful nonsense!
How can people be made immortal before any testing and the Judgment?

Why don't you face the fact of Pauls Prophecy in 1 Cor 15:54-56 must come to pass after the GWT Judgment, Rev 20:11-15.
Only then is Death no more Revelation 21:4

A rapture is never said to happen when King Jesus separates the nations. Matthew 25:31-34

It would be better for you to give up the false doctrines you have been taught by the wolves in the flock, least you become a wolf yourself.

Rev 20:12 is speaking about the dead who died in sin. Only unbelievers appear at the GWTJ.

Believers only appear at the Judgment Seat of Christ. In 2 Tim 4:8, Paul very strongly implies that this occurs on the day of the rapture. Nonetheless, these judgments are not the same, and they do not occur anywhere close together in time.

1 Cor 15:52 says “at the last trump.” The last trump is only in 1 Th 4:16. 1 Th 4:16-17 are exclusive to the fulfillment of Acts 1:11. The key to verse 52 is it serves the dead in Christ and the living in Christ, upon 1 Th 4:16, wherein we only find the last trump. Therefore, it is true that verse 52 only applies to 1 Th 4:16.

There are new converts in the Trib, as in the GM, who are martyred and later resurrected in the last sentence of Rev 20:4. They are then in Heaven in Rev 7:9-17. They, too, have glorified bodies, but there’s simply no “last trump” that is sounded in Rev 20:4.

Verse 52 is exclusively fulfilled in the fulfillment of Acts 1:11, which is exclusively fulfilled by 1 Th 4:16-17.

 

[keras]

Rev 20:12 is speaking about the dead who died in sin. Only unbelievers appear at the GWTJ.

Rev 20:13 The sea gave up its deaad..... . Death and Hades gave up their dead,.......everyone was judged on the record of their deeds.
Your belief is wrong and ALL the dead will stand before God in Judgment.

There are new converts in the Trib,

Maybe just a few, but most of the GT martyrs will come from the group described in Revelation 12:17.

Verse 52 is exclusively fulfilled in the fulfillment of Acts 1:11, which is exclusively fulfilled by 1 Th 4:16-17.

So clearly wrong, it makes your posts a laughing stock.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Rev 20:13 The sea gave up its deaad..... . Death and Hades gave up their dead,.......everyone was judged on the record of their deeds.
Your belief is wrong and ALL the dead will stand before God in Judgment.

Maybe just a few, but most of the GT martyrs will come from the group described in Revelation 12:17.

So clearly wrong, it makes your posts a laughing stock.

“The dead” in your verses are not “the dead in Christ.”

There’s no other verse that contains “the last trump,” than 1 Cor 15:52.

The 4th seal brutally kills 25% of the world’s population, of those who dwell on the earth. The bulk of the GM are then found in the 5th seal.

 

[keras]

The dead” in your verses are not “the dead in Christ.”

Everyone must stand before God in Judgment. It cannot be otherwise.

There’s no other verse that contains “the last trump,” than 1 Cor 15:52.

Which I have proved will happen at the GWT Judgment, after the Millenium. There will still be Death in the Millennium. Isaiah 65:20

The 4th seal brutally kills 25% of the world’s population, of those who dwell on the earth. The bulk of the GM are then found in the 5th seal.

The 4th Seal has happened, the sword, famine, wild beasts and plagues have done this and still ongoing.
The 5th Seal are all the Christian martyrs since Stephe and also still ongoing.
The Great Multitude will be all the faithful Christians who proved their faith thru the Sixth Seal disaster.

Be nice if you really studied these things and made proper rebuttals, [if you did find any errors] instead of opiniated one liners.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Everyone must stand before God in Judgment. It cannot be otherwise.

Which I have proved will happen at the GWT Judgment, after the Millenium. There will still be Death in the Millennium. Isaiah 65:20

The 4th Seal has happened, the sword, famine, wild beasts and plagues have done this and still ongoing.
The 5th Seal are all the Christian martyrs since Stephe and also still ongoing.
The Great Multitude will be all the faithful Christians who proved their faith thru the Sixth Seal disaster.

Be nice if you really studied these things and made proper rebuttals, [if you did find any errors] instead of opiniated one liners.

We can agree on one thing. Everyone will stand in Judgement.

Those who die in sin will include those who surround the camp of the saints just before the end of the MK. They are destroyed by fire from Heaven. They and all others who die IN SIN will appear at the GWTJ.

Every believer will appear before the Judgement Seat of Christ, upon the pre-Trib rapture (2 Tim 4:8).

Matt 24:31’s “elect” will appear before Jesus in Matt 25:34-40.

The living in sin will be judged in Matt 25:41-46.

The first group of the GM is the 5th seal. The second group is in Rev 20:4. You need to see how those verses match. You are making way too much out of the 6th seal. The 4th seal is far more brutal, and it results in the first group of the GM.

Who’s killed in the 6th seal?

 

[keras]

Who’s killed in the 6th seal?

The next Prophesied event that the world will experience will be the Sixth Seal. Revelation 6:12-17
Proved by how the first Five Seals were opened at Jesus’ Ascent to heaven. Revelation 6:1-11 All those things have happened, we have experienced wars, famines, plagues and economic disasters aplenty. Any more of those and humankind would have been wiped out.
The Sixth Seal worldwide disaster, of cosmic and earthly events is graphically prophesied in the Bible over 100 times, will cause the earth to shudder and shake, and move out of her place....Isaiah 13:13, Isaiah 24:19-20, Revelation 6:14

It will be just a one Day event, as the Coronal Mass Ejection explosion of the suns surface, that the Lord will instigate, Isaiah 30:26a, Psalms 50:1-3, will quickly pass; travelling at 3.5 million mph. But the strike onto the earth of a multi billion ton mass, of superheated Hydrogen plasma, will literally cause all the prophesied effects of the virtual depopulation of all the Middle East region, Ezekiel 30:1-5, Isaiah 13:9, Isaiah 66:17, and worldwide devastation.
It won't affect the daily rotation of the earth, ask any scientist to tell you how totally destructive a sudden change to the earths spin would be.

What it will do is speed up the earth’s orbit by pushing the earth as it moves now at 66,000 mph on its orbital track. Just imagine it; a mass approaching a fast moving object, some may initially hit direct, then the main mass; pressing on the trailing side. This will speed up our 365.24 day year to a 360 day year. Isaiah 13:13
Making the time periods as given by Daniel and Revelation fit exactly!

Regarding the darkness on that Day: Amos 5:18-20, Joel 2:31,
The sun will be obscured by the approaching mass, then when it has passed, there will be smoke and ash clouds for possibly months. Isaiah 60:2

The effects of the earthquakes, storms and tsunamis. plus the moon shining bright red and the earths atmosphere temporarily being pushed aside, are what a massive CME can and will cause.

Because this will be a seemingly natural disaster, those who disbelieve in God, will continue in their disbelief and when the Leader of the One World Govt demands worship of him, they will be happy to do so. Revelation 13:8

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

The next Prophesied event that the world will experience will be the Sixth Seal. Revelation 6:12-17
Proved by how the first Five Seals were opened at Jesus’ Ascent to heaven. Revelation 6:1-11 All those things have happened, we have experienced wars, famines, plagues and economic disasters aplenty. Any more of those and humankind would have been wiped out.
The Sixth Seal worldwide disaster, of cosmic and earthly events is graphically prophesied in the Bible over 100 times, will cause the earth to shudder and shake, and move out of her place....Isaiah 13:13, Isaiah 24:19-20, Revelation 6:14

It will be just a one Day event, as the Coronal Mass Ejection explosion of the suns surface, that the Lord will instigate, Isaiah 30:26a, Psalms 50:1-3, will quickly pass; travelling at 3.5 million mph. But the strike onto the earth of a multi billion ton mass, of superheated Hydrogen plasma, will literally cause all the prophesied effects of the virtual depopulation of all the Middle East region, Ezekiel 30:1-5, Isaiah 13:9, Isaiah 66:17, and worldwide devastation.
It won't affect the daily rotation of the earth, ask any scientist to tell you how totally destructive a sudden change to the earths spin would be.

What it will do is speed up the earth’s orbit by pushing the earth as it moves now at 66,000 mph on its orbital track. Just imagine it; a mass approaching a fast moving object, some may initially hit direct, then the main mass; pressing on the trailing side. This will speed up our 365.24 day year to a 360 day year. Isaiah 13:13
Making the time periods as given by Daniel and Revelation fit exactly!

Regarding the darkness on that Day: Amos 5:18-20, Joel 2:31,
The sun will be obscured by the approaching mass, then when it has passed, there will be smoke and ash clouds for possibly months. Isaiah 60:2

The effects of the earthquakes, storms and tsunamis. plus the moon shining bright red and the earths atmosphere temporarily being pushed aside, are what a massive CME can and will cause.

Because this will be a seemingly natural disaster, those who disbelieve in God, will continue in their disbelief and when the Leader of the One World Govt demands worship of him, they will be happy to do so. Revelation 13:8

There is no way the Trib has started.

Who’s the AC (Rev 6:1-2)?

Show me the news clips that there have been wars ALL OVER this world simultaneously (Seal 2).

There would be news of the mark of the beast being applied (Seal 3 is the lifestyle that derives therefrom.)

Show me the news clips on 25% of the world’s population having been killed in short order through God’s wrath to kill by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth (Seal 4).

When you can prove those seals having been opened, you will have credibility.

 

[keras]

There is no way the Trib has started.

I agree, the Great Tribulation will come during the final 3 1/2 years before Jesus Returns.
The 7 Seals are not part of the GT.

Show me the news clips that there have been wars ALL OVER this world simultaneously (Seal 2).

It is considered by scholars that there have been at least 1 war going on somewhere on the earth, over the last 2000 years, Soms tribal conflicts are continuous and generational.

There would be news of the mark of the beast being applied (Seal 3 is the lifestyle that derives therefrom.)

The 'beast' is yet to be revealed. Rev 6:5-6 says nothing about requiring a mark.

Show me the news clips on 25% of the world’s population having been killed in short order through God’s wrath to kill by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth (Seal 4).

Wars, famines, beasts and plagues are estimated to have killed millions of all the people born since 1 AD. A quarter is a conservative estimate.
The Black Death virtually depopulated Europe for example.

When you can prove those seals having been opened, you will have credibility.

The proof of the first Five Seals being open since 1 AD, is the Christian martyrs of the Fifth Seal, All the Christians horribly murdered since Stephen.
Crediblity? Something you totally lack.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

I agree, the Great Tribulation will come during the final 3 1/2 years before Jesus Returns.
The 7 Seals are not part of the GT.

It is considered by scholars that there have been at least 1 war going on somewhere on the earth, over the last 2000 years, Soms tribal conflicts are continuous and generational.

The 'beast' is yet to be revealed. Rev 6:5-6 says nothing about requiring a mark.

Wars, famines, beasts and plagues are estimated to have killed millions of all the people born since 1 AD. A quarter is a conservative estimate.
The Black Death virtually depopulated Europe for example.

The proof of the first Five Seals being open since 1 AD, is the Christian martyrs of the Fifth Seal, All the Christians horribly murdered since Stephen.
Crediblity? Something you totally lack.

The Trib is a 7-year period, not extending from AD1. Daniel’s 70th week has NOT started.

Seal 2 is not about a war occurring somewhere in the world, at all times. It’s about wars happening all over the world at the same time. That hasn’t happened.

Seal 3 is about life after the mark of the beast.

Seal 4 is not about AD1. It’s about 25% of the world’s population being killed in days, weeks or months.

Seal 5 is proof of the worldwide killing. It hasn’t happened.

 

[keras]

The Trib is a 7-year period, not extending from AD1. Daniel’s 70th week has NOT started.

Seal 2 is not about a war occurring somewhere in the world, at all times. It’s about wars happening all over the world at the same time. That hasn’t happened.

Seal 3 is about life after the mark of the beast.

Seal 4 is not about AD1. It’s about 25% of the world’s population being killed in days, weeks or months.

Seal 5 is proof of the worldwide killing. It hasn’t happened.

If you get anyone else to agree with this litany of confused opinion, I would be surprised.

Realize that it is error and brings down a curse, to move around or add to and take away from; the given sequence and Words of Revelation.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

I agree, the Great Tribulation will come during the final 3 1/2 years before Jesus Returns.
The 7 Seals are not part of the GT.

It is considered by scholars that there have been at least 1 war going on somewhere on the earth, over the last 2000 years, Soms tribal conflicts are continuous and generational.

The 'beast' is yet to be revealed. Rev 6:5-6 says nothing about requiring a mark.

Wars, famines, beasts and plagues are estimated to have killed millions of all the people born since 1 AD. A quarter is a conservative estimate.
The Black Death virtually depopulated Europe for example.

The proof of the first Five Seals being open since 1 AD, is the Christian martyrs of the Fifth Seal, All the Christians horribly murdered since Stephen.
Crediblity? Something you totally lack.

Rev 3:10, and from Rev 4:1 and beyond, are all in the future.

Rev 4:1 (NIV): … “Come up here, and I will show you what must take place after this.”

In the “Come up here,” Jesus just showed John the pre-Trib rapture. The Trib occurs after the pre-Trib rapture.

I have a verse that proves “those who dwell on the earth” are only unbelievers because they are killers of the martyrs. The martyrs are identified as such, and their killers are identified as “those who dwell on the earth.” This definitively proves that Jesus was talking about two groups in Rev 3:10. The “you” are believers, and “those who dwell on the earth” are unbelievers. 3:10 (ESV) says, “I will keep YOU from the hour of trial that is coming on the whole world, to try “THOSE who dwell on the earth.’”

Here’s that verse:

Rev 6:10 (ESV): They cried out with a loud voice, “O Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long before you will judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?”

Those that dwell on the earth” are unbelievers, and they are factually killers of the martyrs.

Jesus said in Rev 3:10 that only those who dwell on the earth will be on the earth during the “hour of trial.”

Daniel’s 70th week is seven years long. The “hour of trial” is seven years long.

Jesus proves in Rev 3:10 that we will not be on Earth during Daniel’s 70th week, the 7-year Trib.

 

[keras]

Those that dwell on the earth” are unbelievers, and they are factually killers of the martyrs.

Thos martyrs who they killed were also on the earth.

Your premise has a big hole in it.

Jesus proves in Rev 3:10 that we will not be on Earth during Daniel’s 70th week, the 7-year Trib.

Rev 3:10 says nothing about a rapture removal.
The keeping from.... is; protection through..... Proved by Isaiah 43:2, Isaiah 41:13, Psalms 23, 1 Corinthians 10:13

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Thos martyrs who they killed were also on the earth.

Your premise has a big hole in it.

Rev 3:10 says nothing about a rapture removal.
The keeping from.... is; protection through..... Proved by Isaiah 43:2, Isaiah 41:13, Psalms 23, 1 Corinthians 10:13

Thos martyrs who they killed were also on the earth.

Your premise has a big hole in it.

Rev 3:10 says nothing about a rapture removal.
The keeping from.... is; protection through..... Proved by Isaiah 43:2, Isaiah 41:13, Psalms 23, 1 Corinthians 10:13

The martyrs in the Trib are new converts. They become the GM (Rev 6:9-11 and Rev 20:4). They are resurrected in the last sentence of Rev 20:4. They are next seen in Heaven in Rev 7:9-17.

Your verses are inapplicable to our discussion. They do not relate to the Trib.

In Rev 3:10, “keep from” means “to make something stay out of something.” Source: keep from phrasal verb - Definition, pictures, pronunciation and usage notes | Oxford Advanced American Dictionary at OxfordLearnersDictionaries.com.

We are kept out of the Trib — the hour of trial — wherein God assigned the purpose “to try those who dwell on the earth“ (Rev 3:10). To be kept out of the Trib means we are not on Earth, but in Heaven.

Only unbelievers will be subject to God’s wrath, in the form of 21 judgments.

The next return of Jesus is prophesied to align perfectly with Acts 1:11. Only 1 Th 4:16–17, along with 1 Cor 15:52, do that. All those verses are exclusively related to the pre-Trib rapture.