The law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus, has set us free from the law of sin and death?

[Studyman]

This is like what I wrote about the OT being the picture and the NT being the caption underneath the picture.

And yet, who was the Christ? We see the picture of Him in the New Testament. But must go to the Gospel of Christ to find out who HE was.

Luke 24: 25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken: 26 Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory? 27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.

Surely Paul knew this, and also teaches that the Gospel of the Christ "of the Bible" is the Law and Prophets. Why would I argue with, or ignore the Words, of the very Christ who God sent to save me?

It sounds like you are blaming divisions and sects in the church to the Apostle Paul.

Again, you are sure adding a lot to negative connotations my posts.

2 Pet. 3: 15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;

16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they "do also the other scriptures", (Law and Prophets) unto their own destruction.

17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing "ye know these things before", beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.

When did I suggest or even imply that it is Paul's fault that religious men misrepresent his words? But one thing is absolutely true. It is the "Wresting" of Scriptures by men who "transform themselves onto Apostles of Christ", who call Jesus Lord, Lord, but DO NOT what HE says, that cause all the differing religious businesses and sects in this world God placed us in. Paul never "wrested" the Holy Scriptures. He believed in them. If you need confirmation of this, he tells us as much in Acts 24:14.

There were sects among God's people before Christ came and His apostles wrote things.

No, You have no evidence that there were differing "Religious Sects" among God's People before the Christ Came. There were religious sects who "Professed to know God", who persecuted God's People before the Christ came. But the Church of God was not divided among several different religious sects. Now if you can find evidence of this, please show me. But I have found nothing to support your assertion in this matter.


There were different voices in the garden God placed them in, just as there were for Eve. And like this other voice, the differing "Sects" had "wrested" the Words of the Holy Prophets, and preach from the imagination of their own heart, and not from God. This is not my opinion, as it is spelled out in the Gospel of Christ.

Jer. 23: 16 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, Hearken not unto the words of the prophets that prophesy unto you: they make you vain: they speak a vision of their own heart, and not out of the mouth of the LORD.

17 They say still unto them that despise me, The LORD hath said, Ye shall have peace; and they say unto every one that walketh after the imagination of his own heart, No evil shall come upon you.

There is and was only ONE Church of God and One voice that leads them.

You can't say "We are going to hold Paul responsible for sects among God's people."
Before Paul was even a twinkle in his mother's eye there were twisters and perverters of God's words and sects damaging unity among
God's people. Right?

I never once implied such foolishness about Paul being responsible for men twisting His or God's Words. Paul was not a perverter of God's Word. Many religious men, who call Jesus Lord, Lord, are the perverter of God's Word that we are to beware of. And Jesus warned us not to be deceived by them.

Maybe we can come back to this. But I certainly do not blame the immaturity of many of divisive brothers on Paul.

And neither have I.

I mean that would be like saying Moses is to blame for Judah verses the Northren Kingdom of Israel.

If I had made the case, or even implied that it was Paul's fault that religious men "transformed themselves into Apostles of Christ" in order to deceive people, perhaps a discussion could be had. But I never so much as even implied such a thing.

I have learned that discussions like these can go one and on. The goal post being moved over and over and over. I ask you questions but you refuse to answer them. Where is the edification in that? I think it edifies to establish one truth at a time.

"What was the LAW of the Spirit of Life that was in Christ Jesus? Was it God's Law given by Him to Moses? Or did Jesus walk in another Law?"

"When Paul "delighted in the Law of God after the inward man, but found another law bringing him into captivity to the "doing what he didn't want to do"? Was this before he humbled himself to serve the Law of God in his mind, or after?"

According to Paul, where is the Gospel of Christ found?

These are simple questions, relevant to this discussion. I have answered in detail your every question to me. Should you not answer mine?

 

[Grip Docility]

I have no idea what you’re asking

Jesus taught Peter as a Jew.

Jesus taught Paul from Heaven, revealing the gospel of God.

Paul taught Peter what Jesus had taught Paul.

Matthew 23 is condemnation scripture to the Pharisees and teachers of the Law.

The are similar passages in the Epistles….. and Matthew 23 helps understand their true meaning.

 

[oikonomia]

Good morning and You are welcome. Thank you for being Cordial.

Thankyou for fellowship. Your second answer is clear to me now.
I'd dedicate this post to the first question and response.

If by soul you mean who we are, our life outside of God, yes.

By soul I mean what man has as set of his mind -emotion-will both before and after his living in Christ and God.
Before I lived in God I had a soul. After Christ came into my human spirit I still have a soul.

My spirit was regenerated.
My soul (mind-emotion-will) is being transformed.
My body will be transfigured.

When this completes I will be preserved complete (wholly) in full sanctification - spirit and soul and body.

And the God of peace Himself sanctify you wholly, and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. (1 Thess. 5:23)

I appreciate the Recovery Version's way of distinguishing the soul and the soul-life.
What is replaced is that independent God-less, Christ-less, Holy Spirit-less living.

The natural man (good or bad) loves his soul-life. And we are called to not love the soul-life.
But we are to deny the independent soul-life to follow Christ living in us instead.

The overcomers in Revelation 12 - " . . . they loved not their soul-life even unto death. " (Rev. 12:11b)
Followers of the Lord - He who loves his soul-life loses it; and he who hates his soul-life in this world shall keep it unto eternal life. (John 12:25)
He who finds his soul-life shall lose it, and he who loses his soul-life for My sake shall find it. (Matt. 10:39)

The soul is the personality. The mind, will,and emotion constitute man's soul.
In God's salvation it is to be transformed from its independent expression to one expressing the attributes of God
as human virtues.

The spirit of man is the deeper kernel or nucleus of man from which the Spirit of Christ moves out
into the surrounding soul to transform the soul. I would put it that the soul-life is replaced but the organ or facility
of the human soul we have for eternity. We are headed for soul conformed to Christ's likeness in every way.

For we are dead but live. Yet not us but Christ lives in us. And the life we now live in the flesh we live by the Faith OF the Son of God who gave Himself for us.

That is helpful reference to the Galatians 2:20.

The ego - "I" of Paul is crucified with Christ - dead, buried, lives no longer.
But wait!. The ego - "I" lives. But it now lives a mingled, united, interwoven life with Jesus Christ.

I am crucified with Christ; and it is no longer I who live, but it is Christ who lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live in faith, the faith of the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself up for me. (Gal. 2:20)

He lives a life grafted into the Son of God. He lives a life in the realm of the resurrected Christ who dwells in his
regenerated spirit. He takes Christ by faith to be everything in his soul. The divine attributes of God are embodied
in the human virtues of Jesus Christ. And from his innermost being, his spirit, these Christ attributes are invading and
permeating his soul. The "I" is living a mingled life with Christ.

Paul learned to let the grace of God do its complete work over him and within him. He would not in any way
circumvent the grace of God.
I do not nullify the grace of God; for if righteousness is through law, then Christ has died for nothing. (v. 21)

Where is the origin of this grace? From where does this grace come such that it can infuse his soul with Christ's personality?
It is revealed in the last verse in Galatians and in many other places in the NT. This power of grace is located with his spirit. (small s)

The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit, brothers. Amen. (Gal. 6:18)
Compare:
The Lord be with your spirit. Grace be with you. (2 Tim. 4:22)
Compare:
But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit. (1 Cor. 6:17)

A Christian must learn to discern his or her spirit. It is the spirit that the mind must be set on.
The Spirit [capital S] Who is the Triune God bears witness with our spirit [small s] that we have a life relationship with our Father, our Abba - Divine Daddy.

The Spirit Himself witnesses with our spirit that we are children of God. (Romans 8:16)

A Christian is created when his comatose and deadened human spirit is made alive by the Third Person of the Triune God.

Jesus answered, Truly, truly, I say to you, Unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. (John 3:5,6)

Imagine three concentric circles. The outermost circle is the body. The middle circle is the soul. The innermost circle like a bull's eye
on a target, is the spirit of man. God's salvation implants divine life in the central kernal of man and the moves outward
to permeate and saturate the soul first. And then finally burst out into the body to sanctify us wholly - spirit and soul and body.

So let’s not say, who is to bring Christ down from above or up from the deep. For the word, Christ is in our hearts and in our mouths that we do the things and speak of Him.

Yes. This emphasis on the speaking mouth, the calling mouth is essential to learn to exercise our spirit which is joined to Christ.
Many Christians are weak in their spiritual life because they should use their MOUTH more to call on the Lord.

I say, to get to know our spirit where the Spirit of Jesus is we should use often our MOUTH to call upon Him - call on His
name to contact Him. This is helpful to set the mind and indeed the whole being ON the Spirit in our spirit.

So In Romans 10 faithful Paul speaks much of the need to CALL upon His name to enjoy His availability.

Initially to be regenerated - That if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;

Ongoingly to walk in Him and live in Him - For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord is Lord of all and rich to all who call upon Him; (v.12)

I do not say this is the only way to set the mind on the Spirit in our spirit.
But this is a great way which so effective - Call upon Him "O Lord Jesus. O Lord Jesus. Lord Jesus You love me. Lord Jesus I love You."

If you call on the name of the Lord Jesus for five minutes setting your mind on His living self your spirit will
be on fire. Calling " O Lord JESUS" fans into flame the divine gift within you Christians.

For the Lord Jesus Christ is with our spirit. And there in our innerman is the empowering grace of Christ.

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. (Phil. 4:23) - The empowering grace is with our spirit.

The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. (1 Thess. 3:18) - We Christians all have this empowering energizing divine life - the grace.

The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. (2 Thess. 5:28) - Christ is the grace. And the grace is with our spirit.

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. (Phlm 25) - We must learn to fan into flame the living fire of grace in
our innermost being - our reborn spirit.

That is the Faith in which we are to speak.

Yes, So benefitial to SPEAK out the truth. We are speaking our way into the kingdom.

For We are not, For he that is baptized into Christ has put on Christ. No more Scott nor you. We are all one in Christ, the Temple of the Most high God with His Spirit dwelling in us.

Amen. Yes, it is wonderful. And though we quival on some things - the mutual SPEAKING to one another and writing builds
us up. The using of the mouth Paul also emphasizes in Romans 8 about calling "Abba Father, Abba Father". That calling
is good also to learn to touch the Spirit of our Father in our spirit.

For you have not received a spirit of slavery bringing you into fear again, but you have received a spirit of sonship in which we cry, Abba, Father! The Spirit Himself witnesses with our spirit that we are children of God. (Rom. 8:15,16)

A new creature. old things have passed away.

Praise Him we are a new creation in the Lord Jesus.

ALL is new and of God. Because it was God in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself.

Yes. God in Christ reconciling the world to Himself - and giving us the ministry of reconciliation.
I like to sing this passage.

 

[Studyman]

That is subjective. It is best to go by what the word says rather than say, here it implies it spiritually. In this case the context is established in the mentioning of the cattle and sheep offspring. The fruit of our body is our children and that is what we would teach mainly. That is what would be cursed. The context is offspring .

The Spiritual meaning for the fruit of our body is our Children?

Matt. 3: 8 Bring forth therefore fruits (Children?) meet for repentance:?

Matt. 7: 20 Wherefore by their fruits (Children?) ye shall know them.

Phil. 1: 11 Being filled with the fruits (Children?) of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.

James 3: 17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits (Children?) without partiality, and without hypocrisy.

Wow, I truly thought you knew better.

The LXX translation says it out right. Below is the ABP which is a translation of it.

It COULD BE what we do in the sense of the work of our hands since it is said in relation to the fruit of the land. I considered that also and would not argue it. And would share it. But in that, it isn't specific. As to say Here is the LAW of the Sin which Paul speaks of. That we can't help ourselves and we do what we wouldn't. And if we do what we wouldn't it is no longer we who do it, but the sin the dwells in us.

Deut 28:18 Accursed are the progeny of your belly, and the produce of your land; the herds of your oxen, and the flocks of your sheep.

I could post the Scriptures where Paul says, "does God care for Oxen, or for our sakes is it written"? Or the Jesus "of the Bibles" Words "For out of the heart (Belly) proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies".

But whatever I post, if it doesn't align with your religious philosophy that Paul experienced a curse because of Sin, not known by, or warned of by God or experienced by any other man before him, you call these Scriptures "Irrelevant".

And when I consider the implication of your philosophy here, that God knew and promised to place on sinful man many curses and vexation of spirit, but the One vexation , the ONE curse that Paul experienced was one that had escaped God's knowledge, and in God's definition of the curses that would befall and overtake sinful man by Law, HE failed to sufficiently warn Paul about this specific vexation of spirit, and astonishment of heart, because it somehow didn't exist, or wasn't known of by God, before Paul became a Pharisee.

But the Scriptures show me a different Gospel. Which is why I replied to you.

We know as a Pharisee Paul was blinded by God, as promised.

The LORD shall smite thee with madness, and blindness, and astonishment of heart:

Acts 9: And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost.

And we know as a Pharisee Paul delighted in the Law of God after the inward man.

Rom. 10: 2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.

Is. 58:2 Yet they seek me daily, and delight to know my ways, as a nation that did righteousness, and forsook not the ordinance of their God: they ask of me the ordinances of justice; they take delight in approaching to God.

We know that as a Pharisee, Paul's sinful flesh reigned in his mortal body.

9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died. 10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death. 11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.

We know as a Pharisee Paul yielded his members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin.

Eph. 2: 2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: 3 Among whom also "we all had" our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

Your preaching that God didn't know about these things, or that God didn't address these Curses in the Law and prophets is foolishness. And your stubbornness to consider all that is written, even to the point of actually trying to convince me that the Spiritual meaning of "Fruits of my body" are limited to the children I have, is astonishing to me, given other posts you have written.

Nevertheless, it is good to have these kinds of discussions, so as to separate truth from religious tradition.

 

[oikonomia]

I ask you questions but you refuse to answer them. Where is the edification in that? I think it edifies to establish one truth at a time.

What question did you ask I refuse to reply to ?
I'll do the best I can.

"What was the LAW of the Spirit of Life that was in Christ Jesus? Was it God's Law given by Him to Moses? Or did Jesus walk in another Law?"

No. The law of the Spirit of life is His very life. It is Him Himself. It is the life of Christ dispensed into our innermost being.

Now the Son of God became a man. He was a perfect man. But He did not live by His perfect humanity.
He denied Himself and lived by the Father. And He lived out the Father.

Then He died and became "a life giving Spirit" for His followers to receive Him and live by Him in the same manner.
As the living Father has sent Me and I live because of the Father, so he who eats Me, he also shall live because of Me. (John 6:57)

To eat Him is to absorb Him and allow Him to blend seamlessly into our living in an "organic" way.
Eating Jesus is the way to live.

It is effective to spend time each morning at the beginning of our day - to linger in His presence, be soaked in His Spirit
with reading the word, thanksgiving, praise, confession, loving Him for who He is.
We eat Him by just masticating in Spirit the word with a prayerful spirit.
I learned to begin the day this way. It makes a big difference to the entire day.

Thus we serve in newness of spirit and not in oldness of letter.
But now we have been discharged from the law, having died to that in which we were held, so that we serve in newness of spirit and not in oldness of letter. (Rom. 7:6)

In fact we are discharged from the law and the law of the Spirit of life uplifts us into righteousness.
For sin will not lord it over you, for you are not under the law but under grace. (Rom. 6:14)

When Jesus speaks of His commands or the Apostle John speaks of His commands
these are the minute leanings, inclications of the regularing Spirit leading us.
Such commands are on a "quantum" level in our thought, speech, mind, and the tiniest leadings to live by Him.

This is the sense of we should not be lawless but keep His commandments.

And in this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments.
He who says, I know Him, and does not keep His commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in this one; (1 John 2:2,3)

Of course His word is reflected in the whole Bible. So we are added by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.
It is this honor and unspeakable priviledge that as He lived by the moment to moment instantaneous leading of His Father
we now are on the same path living because of Him.

As the living Father has sent Me and I live because of the Father, so he who eats Me, he also shall live because of Me. (John 6:57)

And in His state of resurrection He promises that because He lives we too will live.
Yet a little while and the world beholds Me no longer, but you behold Me; because I live, you also shall live. (John 14:19)

Now to love one another is His commandment. But His commandments go deep into the minutest movement of
our being. Many are hard to codify. They are commandments lasting a millisecond. His Spirit will command
not to think one thought but think another.

His commandments will be to change to tone of your voice.
His commandment will be not to remember a certain thing.
His commandments may be to smile on a certain occasion and to not smile on another.
This is about abiding in the teaching of the anointing.

The anointing is the moving around and pressing Jesus gently into our personality.
And to not go along with the anointing is the lawlessness John speaks of.

Everyone who practices sin practices lawlessness also, and sin is lawlessness. (1 John 3:4)

Our endevour is to abide in Him. That is to go along with the leading and teaching of the anointing.

And now, little children, abide in Him, so that if He is manifested,
we may have boldness and not be put to shame from Him at His coming. (1 John 2:28)

You see, to abide in Him is to abide in the teaching of the anointing.

And as for you, the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you have no need that anyone teach you; but as His anointing teaches you concerning all things and is true and is not a lie, and even as it has taught you, abide in Him. (1 John 2:27)

When there is a failure to learn to abide in the living anointing legalism comes in to fill the vacuum.
When legalism comes in filling the emptiness everything in the New Testament seems to read like "Go back and keep
the statutes and commandments of the written law."

But this nullifies the indwelling grace which Paul instructed we should not do.
And it is so serious that a Christian can fall from grace being distracted to be a law keeper OT style.

Fallen from grace does not mean unsaved. It means you have fallen from the experience of
Christ living a blended, incorporated life, mingled with your living.

You have been brought to nought, separated from Christ, you who are being justified by law; you have fallen from grace. (Gal. 5:4)

Like John teaches, it is by the indwelling and the anointing of the Spirit righteousness develops into our living.

For we by the Spirit out of faith eagerly await the hope of righteousness. (Gal. 5:6)

"When Paul "delighted in the Law of God after the inward man, but found another law bringing him into captivity to the "doing what he didn't want to do"? Was this before he humbled himself to serve the Law of God in his mind, or after?"

According to Paul, where is the Gospel of Christ found?

These are simple questions, relevant to this discussion. I have answered in detail your every question to me. Should you not answer mine?

Sure. Christ, the living Person of Christ, Paul insists, is with our regenerated spirit.
In our innermost praying organ our spirit, Christ is there and the grace of Christ is there.
The good news is the Person. And the Person has become a life giving Spirit (1 Cor. 15:45) to live in our spirit.

The Lord be with your spirit. Grace be with you. (2 Tim. 4:22)

The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit, brothers. Amen. (Gal. 6:18)

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. (Phil. 4:23)

For God is my witness, whom I serve in my spirit in the gospel of His Son, (Rom. 1:9a)

Jesus Christ is with our innermost praying "organ" our spirit.
We must learn to locate Him in our spirit that His empowering grace may flow into us.

Paul prayed that we would be energized and stengthened into that realm - the place in us deeper than the soul - our spirit.

That He would grant you, according to the riches of His glory, to be strengthened with power through His Spirit into the inner man, (Eph. 3:16)

 

[Studyman]

What question did you ask I refuse to reply to ?

"What was the LAW of the Spirit of Life that was in Christ Jesus? Was it God's Law given by Him to Moses? Or did Jesus walk in another Law?"

You answered this one, you DON'T believe the "LAW of the spirit of Life" that was in Christ Jesus, was God's Law. I disagree with this philosophy, but I know I am outnumbered in my belief.

"When Paul "delighted in the Law of God after the inward man, but found another law bringing him into captivity to the "doing what he didn't want to do"? Was this before he humbled himself to serve the Law of God in his mind, or after?"

You didn't answer this question.

According to Paul, where is the Gospel of Christ found?

You didn't answer this one either.

But if you don't believe the "LAW" of the Spirit of Life that was in the Jesus "of the Bible" was God's Law, what can I say.

Thanks for making your position clear to me. It doesn't really matter about the other two questions now.

Thanks for the discussion.

 

[HIM]

The Spiritual meaning for the fruit of our body is our Children?

You constantly twist things people say. That is not from God.
Nothing else is important until you get a handle on this.

 

[Studyman]

You constantly twist things people say. That is not from God.
Nothing else is important until you get a handle on this.

Your own preaching HIM. Don't get all snooty because I actually read what you post.

"The fruit of our body is our children and that is what we would teach mainly. That is what would be cursed. The context is offspring ."

Perhaps it isn't me, or the Scriptures that are misleading or false here. Maybe the reason why there is so much Biblical evidence against your preaching in this thread, is because it's your preaching which is at fault.

Surely a humble man of God would consider the possibility.

 

[HIM]

Your own preaching HIM. Don't get all snooty because I actually read what you post.

"The fruit of our body is our children and that is what we would teach mainly. That is what would be cursed. The context is offspring ."

Perhaps it isn't me, or the Scriptures that are misleading or false here. Maybe the reason why there is so much Biblical evidence against your preaching in this thread, is because it's your preaching which is at fault.

Surely a humble man of God would consider the possibility.

Like was said nothing else matters until you get a grip on this.
Take care

 

[Studyman]

Like was said nothing else matters until you get a grip on this.
Take care

LOL, You too preacher.

 

[Psalm 27]

Romans 7 is not a record of Paul's struggle against sin

 

[Studyman]

Romans 7 is not a record of Paul's struggle against sin

This is true. Paul is explaining to his Jewish brethren his vexation as a man who professed to know God but walked in or was married to the Flesh.

 

[oikonomia]

You answered this one, you DON'T believe the "LAW of the spirit of Life" that was in Christ Jesus, was God's Law. I disagree with this philosophy, but I know I am outnumbered in my belief.

As I explained before the word "law" in "law of the Spirit" is more like the law of gravity.
And "the law was weak through the flesh" or "I delight in the law" is the code, the written ordinances, statutes, and commandments.

The life in "the law of the Spirit of life" is the Triune God processed and consummated to be dispensed into
the saved as the innate empowering nature of His life.

The law of the Spirit is the law of God's perfectly righteous life. It is the law of His very life.
You have read "In Him [Christ] was life." That is the same life as in Romans 8:2.
You have read "I am the way the truth and the life." - Same life as the law of the Spirit of life.
You have read "I am the resurrection and the life" and "I am the bread of life" and "I came that they might have life"
This is that uncreated divine life who became a man and died, rose, and became "a life giving Spirit"

There is with this life the innate, dependable, uncorruptible, consistent, instrinsic nature that is MORE powerful than
any other kind of law. That law of the Spirit of life is certain the law of Jesus Christ's being and nature.

So Paul can say "For me to live is Christ . . . ".
So we can say with Paul "When Christ our life is manifested . . . "
So that we can say that being born of God we are no longer "alienated from the life of God" (Eph. 4:18)

Let's put it this way. A Cat has a cat law. Its nature is to meow and cats mice.
That is the law of the cat.
A horse has a horse law. Its nature is to gallop. That is the law of the horse.
An eagle, a whale, a dolphin, and any living thing plant or animal has a law of their own.

The uncreated ultimate Person the Triune God also has a law of His life.
That life was manifested in Christ. Vindicated He was in resurrection.
And He is now a High Priest "according to the power of an indestructible life" (Heb. 7:16)

Well this life has a law of its nature which coming into us is our eternal life.
And He can free us from the law of sin and of death over which this divine life has power.
He alone has the love and the power which is stronger than death.

Do not fear; I am the First and the Last and the living One; and I became dead,
and behold, I am living forever and ever; and I have the keys of death and of Hades. (Rev. 1:18)

This law of the life of the Triune God is not the same as the law delivered to Moses on Mt. Sinai.
Having said that I hasten to clarify that the Law delivered to Moses was called also "the Testimony".
It testifies to the nature of God - He is light, love, truth, righeousness, holiness.

There was a period in history's unfolding of God's eternal purpose where Isreal certainly was charged
to obey the statute, ordinances, commandments of this law. There is absolutely no argument about that.
That law was for a long period a school master to lead us to grace - God being for us everything we need.

Now that divine life working in us through faith has come we are no longer under the school master. Nor should we say
living by faith in Christ being all we need is identical with being under that school master of the law of Moses.

We're not talking about ad populum opinion or what lots of people believe as a customery popular notion.
We're talking about what the word of God teaches in Galatians 3:24,25.

So then the law has become our child-conductor unto Christ that we might be justified out of faith.
But since faith has come, we are no longer under a child-conductor.

Christ does not bring us back under the child conductor of the law.
Christ is not identical to the child-conductor of the law received at Sinai.

He is the law of life operating from our regenerated spirit where we must learn to SET. . . our mind.
Jesus living in us performs in us in a mingled way what the child-conductor law was unable to do.

For the law of the Spirit of life has freed me in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and of death.
For that which the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God, sending His own Son in the likeness of the flesh of sin and concerning sin, condemned sin in the flesh, (Rom. 8:2,3)

So He lives in us and to unleash the enabling power of the law of His life we must learn to set the mind on the mingled spirit.

For those who are according to the flesh mind the things of the flesh; but those who are according to the spirit, the things of the Spirit.
For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the spirit is life and peace. (vs. 5,6)

If the law of the Spirit of life was identical with the law given to Moses for Israel verse 3 and 4 would be self contradictory and not make sense.

For that which the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God, sending His own Son in the likeness of the flesh of sin and concerning sin, condemned sin in the flesh,

That the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the spirit.

The law of Moses - Weak through the flesh.
The law of the Spirit of life - Powerful to overcome the sin nature.

So they are contrasted by in Romans 8. They are not made identical in Romans 8.

But if you don't believe the "LAW" of the Spirit of Life that was in the Jesus "of the Bible" was God's Law, what can I say.

You can say that apparently from Romans 8 that has to be true.
But you can take your time to pray on it and think about it.

Now, I trust that you are not eager to misunderstand me on purpose.
The Law of Moses testified of what kind of God Jehovah is.

In that sense one could say "But the Law was God" and I could understand thier feeling.
Moses was told to put the Testimony into the ark. Then the ark became "the ark of the Testimony."
The stone tablets resided there.

And you shall put into the Ark the Testimony which I will give you. (Exo. 25:16)
. . . and into the Ark you shall put the Testimony that I will give you. (v. 21b)
Then he took the Testimony and put it into the Ark, (Exo. 40:20a)

Thanks for making your position clear to me. It doesn't really matter about the other two questions now.

To make it clear to those reading along. In Hebrews we see that the hesitating Jews who wanted to go
back to the old covenant we told they needed the blood of Christ's redemption to cleanse them from "dead works."

Our effort to be law keepers instead of living by Christ "the living God" is to soil our conscience with "dead works."
We need the blood of Jesus to cleanse us from this.

How much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without blemish to God, purify our conscience from dead works to serve the living God? (Heb. 9:14)

Thanks for the discussion.

Likewise - thanks for the discussion.
Unfortunately I do not always keep things in sequence when I respond.

 

[oikonomia]

Romans 7 is not a record of Paul's struggle against sin

Hello Psalm 27. Praise the resurrected and victorious Lord Jesus Christ our God and Savior.

Do I hear you right? You say Romans 7 is NOT a record of Paul's struggle against sin as Pharisee?

Can you tell me why you believe this?
In the mean time I will go and read Psalm 27.

 

[oikonomia]

Psalm 27 read through Psalm 27.
Wait on Jehovah it said at the end.

Yes, wait for Jehovah.

You know my experience is that I have to wait patiently
for Him as Christ to transform my soul. He needs the time.
I need the longsuffering, the endurance to WAIT as He operates to perform this work in me.

That's quite a great Psalm.

Brother Andrew Murrey wrote a great devotional book a study of all the passages in telling us to wait on God.

 

[HIM]

And the God of peace Himself sanctify you wholly, and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. (1 Thess. 5:23)

I appreciate the Recovery Version's way of distinguishing the soul and the soul-life.

I liked your post. But we were not sure about this translation. You are really sold on it I see. I look at the Greek more often than not so this translation of 5:23 troubled me a bit so I looked at it as the TR shares and decided I liked it lol.

The God of Peace sanctifies us perfectly. And completes our Spirit, soul and Body. Preserving us blameless at our Lord Jesus' coming. Amen

The clauses "May sanctify" and "may preserve" use the word may due those words being in the optative mood. Which expresses one's desire. Since it is a prayer that makes sense.

1Thess 5:23 Αὐτὸς δὲ Now Himself
ὁ The
θεὸς God
τῆς εἰρήνης the Of Peace
ἁγιάσαι May Sanctify
ὑμᾶς You
ὁλοτελεῖς PERFECTLY


καὶ And
ὁλόκληρον COMPLETE '
ὑμῶν of you
τὸ πνεῦμα the Spirit
καὶ And
ἡ ψυχὴ the Soul
καὶ And
τὸ σῶμα the Body
ἀμέμπτως Blameless (without fault)
ἐν IN (at)
τῇ The
παρουσίᾳ Coming
τοῦ κυρίου ἡμῶν Of Our Lord
Ἰησοῦ Jesus
Χριστοῦ Christ
τηρηθείη May Be Preserved.

 

[HIM]

Romans 7 is not a record of Paul's struggle against sin

Why you say that?

 

[HIM]

To make it clear to those reading along. In Hebrews we see that the hesitating Jews who wanted to go
back to the old covenant we told they needed the blood of Christ's redemption to cleanse them from "dead works."

Though the sanctuary service is done away with in Christ our conscience being cleansed from Dead works is sin not the sanctuary service.

 

[oikonomia]

I liked your post. But we were not sure about this translation. You are really sold on it I see. I look at the Greek more often than not so this translation of 5:23 troubled me a bit so I looked at it as the TR shares and decided I liked it lol.

The God of Peace sanctifies us perfectly. And completes our Spirit, soul and Body. Preserving us blameless at our Lord Jesus' coming. Amen

The clauses "May sanctify" and "may preserve" use the word may due those words being in the optative mood. Which expresses one's desire. Since it is a prayer that makes sense.

1Thess 5:23 Αὐτὸς δὲ Now Himself
ὁ The
θεὸς God
τῆς εἰρήνης the Of Peace
ἁγιάσαι May Sanctify
ὑμᾶς You
ὁλοτελεῖς PERFECTLY


καὶ And
ὁλόκληρον COMPLETE '
ὑμῶν of you
τὸ πνεῦμα the Spirit
καὶ And
ἡ ψυχὴ the Soul
καὶ And
τὸ σῶμα the Body
ἀμέμπτως Blameless (without fault)
ἐν IN (at)
τῇ The
παρουσίᾳ Coming
τοῦ κυρίου ἡμῶν Of Our Lord
Ἰησοῦ Jesus
Χριστοῦ Christ
τηρηθείη May Be Preserved.

HIM! HIM!! What are you doing to me brother?

I am going to read your reply at least four to six more times to grasp your point.
I will then explain it back to you to be certain that I get what you mean.

Then I hope I can give an answer for the hope within me that First Thess 5:23 kindles.

Hope to be back soon. Unless you've trounced my understanding.
Praise the Lord.

In the mean time. . . please enjoy this song a sister made up that I sing on this verse. Can't hurt.

 

[Studyman]

As I explained before the word "law" in "law of the Spirit" is more like the law of gravity.

I know of your religious philosophy. I have been influenced by it since my youth. I am more interested in what the Scriptures actually teach and there is not one place in the entire Scriptures where God's Law is defined as anything near like the Law of gravity. The implication is that Jesus wasn't obedient because He Humbled Himself to God's Law, as the Scriptures state, but that like the Law of Gravity, obedience was natural for Him because HE was not a man like unto His Brethren and had access to powers HIS Father only gave to Him and no other human ever. And then, even though Jesus never risked anything, because HE couldn't sin, God gave Him a name above all other men anyway.

I reject this philosophy outright as I have explained before. It demeans the Christ and discredits His Father as promoting some kind of show, a deception. The Scrip[tures don't teach it, yet it is widely believed.

And "the law was weak through the flesh" or "I delight in the law" is the code, the written ordinances, statutes, and commandments.

There is a habit among the "many" who come in Christ's Name to only use the parts of Scripture which they can use to justify or promote a certain religious philosophy that could not stand, if all Scriptures was considered.

For instance, here is what Paul actually said.

3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

What could Jesus do that the LAW could not do? Teach us Righteousness? No, the Law can do that. Show us what Sin is? No!, The Law can do that? How about forgive our trespasses, or condemn sin in our flesh? Can the LAW do that? NO! The LAW cannot remove sin, or condemn sin i our flesh. There is no LAW given by God that I can do that will remove by guilt. So how is my sin forgiven? God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:.

Why does God want Sin condemned in my Flesh?

4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, "who walk" not after the flesh, "but after the Spirit".

One might ask, how can I walk after the Spirit? Well, ask yourself the question, did Jesus Walk in the Spirit? And then trust the Scriptures that tell you;

1 John 2: 6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so "to walk", even as he walked.

Don't listen to the other voice in the garden, even if they do "Come in Christ's Name" or "Transform themselves as apostles of Christ", listen to God and walk in His Law, just as Jesus and Paul taught and did.

After all, it is what we are created to do.

Ecc. 12: 13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. 14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.

And again;

Eph 2: 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus "unto good works", which God hath before ordained that we should "walk in them".

This is why it's important to establish undeniable Biblical Truths to build on. Was the "Law of the Spirit of Life" God's Law? Or did Jesus Walk in another? The truth is, when God placed before Jesus "Life and Good, Death and Evil", Jesus Chose Life. I don't care what the Pope says, or Calvin, or Kenneth Copeland, or any other voice in the garden god placed me in might say. The "LAW of the Spirit of Life" that was in Jesus, was God's Law. That is an undeniable Biblical Truth.