Does Romans 14 Refute Sabbath and Kosher-eating?

[LarryP2]

Not until you have wasted 22 years in an utterly dead, counterfeit Sabbatarian cult church can you really appreciate a real live electrifying Christian church.

I am quite entitled to express my opinion on this issue. I have earned that right.

The difference between the miserable, carping depressed Sabbatarian cult church and a real Christian Church is beyond belief. It cannot even be described. The best you can do is describe it as night and day. Miserable Sabbatariansm was my long dark depressed night of the soul.

I have now experienced the Resurrection. I am blinded by the Son.

 

[BobRyan]

The point I was trying to make is that NO modern Sabbatarians are actually keeping the Sabbath. They THINK they are. They CLAIM they are.

.

1. there are MANY post-cross NT Sabbath after Sabbath worship services attended by NT Christian saints. Acts 13, Acts 17, Acts 18 -- and the Apostolic church of Acts 15 actually "relied on this fact" to resolve their church dispute (see Acts 15).

By contrast there are NO week-day-1 after week-day-1 worships services in all of the NT - how sad for those who would make week-day-1 the day of worship for all Christians.

2. In the New Heavens and new earth long AFTER the cross "From Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to Worship" Is 66:23

3. What is more - even the following Sunday sources themselves argue for the continued binding authority of the Sabbath Commandment for all Christians to this very day. (So then just stating the obvious here).

So it is not just Sabbatarian groups trying to honor the 4th commandment - how sad for those who try to imagine that everyone is trying to toss the 4th commandment under a bus except for Seventh-day Adventists.

 

[Steve Petersen]

Several years ago a friend of mine made a connection between Romans 14 and the Mishnah, Tractate Avodah Zarah (Idol Worship). I thought it was rather compelling. He may have picked up on this from Mark Nanos (The Mystery of Romans.)

Basic premise is this: Romans was written to non-Pauline congregations in Rome composed of believing Jews and believing Gentiles. These mixed congregations had problems caused by cultural differences between Jews and Gentiles, specifically in regards to food and days. These stem from Jewish custom and halakah that prohibited eating or drinking things the MAY have been offered to idols. Also part of the problem were Jewish restrictions on doing business with Gentiles at or near pagan holidays. All of these elements can be found in Romans 14 and Avodah Zarah.

Here is a pretty good treatment of the subject.

Here are citations from the Mishnah.

 

[from scratch]

1. there are MANY post-cross NT Sabbath after Sabbath worship services attended by NT Christian saints. Acts 13, Acts 17, Acts 18 -- and the Apostolic church of Acts 15 actually "relied on this fact" to resolve their church dispute (see Acts 15).

By contrast there are NO week-day-1 after week-day-1 worships services in all of the NT - how sad for those who would make week-day-1 the day of worship for all Christians.

2. In the New Heavens and new earth long AFTER the cross "From Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to Worship" Is 66:23

3. What is more - even the following Sunday sources themselves argue for the continued binding authority of the Sabbath Commandment for all Christians to this very day. (So then just stating the obvious here).

So it is not just Sabbatarian groups trying to honor the 4th commandment - how sad for those who try to imagine that everyone is trying to toss the 4th commandment under a bus except for Seventh-day Adventists.

Dude you're calling the assembly of the Jews at the synagogue a meeting of Christians. How exactly is this possible? Haven't you read what Saul was doing to Christians who meet with the Jews at the synagogue? Why didn't the whole city assemble at the synagogue before Paul came? All I see is a smoke screen. A smoke screen is used to hide activity. In this case it isn't hiding the activity of Christians. Paul was preaching something foreign that hadn't ever been heard. He was evangelizing the Jew primarily.

 

[SAAN]

Sabbath:

Rom 14:5
One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

Rom 14:6
He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

Kosher

Rom 14:14
¶
I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.

Rom 14:15
But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ died.


Rom 14:17
For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.

Rom 14:18
For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to God, and approved of men.

Rom 14:19
Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another.

Rom 14:20
For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence

Rom 14:21
It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak.

Rom 14:22
Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.

Rom 14:23
And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.


Any Comments...



BLB - Rom 14: Paul's Epistle - Romans 14 (Blue Letter Bible: KJV - King James Version)

Pretty much it is about vegetarianism. The Sabbath isnt mentioned or talked about in the entire book or Romans and it wouldn't be because Rome was big on Sun God worship. So it is not saying you are free to choose what ever day you want to worship or eat whatever you want.

If it is any days it is referring to, it would be the Feats Days when they normally fasted, so the debate would have been over eating meat vs not eating meat on certain days. But then againt this is Rome we are talking about and they didnt keep feast days in Rome, unless this is being addressed to new believers since they were still keeping these days after the cross.

So if reading the entire chapter 14 in context it seems more about fasting and vegetarianism than about picking any day of worship or if food laws are in debate here, as neither of those 2 topics are being debated in this chapter.