How To Understand : Acts 2:38

ARBITER01 · May 12, 2024

Aviel said:
When John the Baptist said to the Lord Jesus THE Christ......."it is i who should be baptized by YOU"... Jesus said...

Jesus answered and said to him, “Permit it to be so now, for thus it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness.”

So, to "fulfill all RIGHTEOUSNESS", is exactly and specifically related to being """under the LAW"

Jesus was THE Virgin born God-Man , born under the LAW, and that is why he had to be water baptized.

He is fulfilling the law for us all, so that we can be esteemed by God, as if we did it.

= "imputed RIGHTEOUSNESS of Christ".

Am I reading this statement right??

You're actually trying to make the case that water immersion is somehow under the law of Moses, and that He did that for us so we don't have to???

Aviel · May 12, 2024

ARBITER01 said:
Am I reading this statement right??

You're actually trying to make the case that water immersion is somehow under the law of Moses, and that He did that for us so we don't have to???

Jesus made the case to John the Water Baptizer, that by being water baptized he was fulfilling """"ALL Righteousness.""""

"Righteousness" in this case, is what the LAW Requires.

This is why Jesus HAD to fulfill it, by being Water Baptized., as Jesus was "under the Law".

ARBITER01 · May 12, 2024

Aviel said:
Jesus made the case to John the Water Baptizer, that by being water baptized he was fulfilling """"ALL Righteousness.""""

"Righteousness" in this case, is what the LAW Requires.

This is why Jesus HAD to fulfill it, by being Water Baptized., as Jesus was "under the Law".

Oh this is interesting.

Let's see here,...... I think most if not all of the disciples were water immersed prior to the death of Jesus. Jesus Himself water immersed people. There were various folks water immersed after their repentance, Cornelius's household being prominent on this list. The Eunuch over in acts 8 was water immersed after believing,... etc.

It's fairly easy to see that scripture doesn't agree with your assumption.

Aviel · May 12, 2024

ARBITER01 said:
Oh this is interesting.

Let's see here,...... I think most if not all of the disciples were water immersed prior to the death of Jesus.

"you think" is not actually a NT verse, is it?

So, In Acts 2:38, Peter is not water baptized, nor are those in the Upper Room.

Yet they all received Spiritual Gift #9.

Aviel · May 12, 2024

ARBITER01 said:
Jesus Himself water immersed people.

Post that NT Verse.

Aviel · May 12, 2024

ARBITER01 said:
Oh this is interesting.

Let's see here,...... I think most if not all of the disciples were water immersed prior to the death of Jesus. Jesus Himself water immersed people. There were various folks water immersed after their repentance, Cornelius's household being prominent on this list. The Eunuch over in acts 8 was water immersed after believing,... etc.

My Thread does not teach that you are not to be water baptized, after you are born again.

It's teaching that being born again.. has nothing to do with water.

Its teaching that Paul's Gospel, was Given to Paul by Jesus, and Peter didnt have this "Gospel" in Acts 2.

ARBITER01 · May 12, 2024

Aviel said:
Post that NT Verse.

John 3:22

ARBITER01 · May 12, 2024

Aviel said:
My Thread does not teach that you are not to be water baptized, after you are born again.

It's teaching that being born again.. has nothing to do with water.

Its teaching that Paul's Gospel, was Given to Paul by Jesus, and Peter didnt have this "Gospel" in Acts 2.

Well,.... when you don't answer questions from people when they ask you, then you lead people astray. You have a really bad habit of doing that.

Here's what I asked you,...

Am I reading this statement right??

You're actually trying to make the case that water immersion is somehow under the law of Moses, and that He did that for us so we don't have to???

Did you answer it and correct my assumption from your statement? No you didn't.

Guojing · May 12, 2024

LoveofTruth said:
No, it is not incorrect. Paul mentions the other apostles in 1 Cor 15, and he had to show again the gospel he preached. He connects that gospel ( the one gospel) to what they all preached.

Jesus being raised from the dead are facts in both the gospel that Paul preached, and the gospel that the 12 also preached.

But it does not necessarily follow that both gospels are the same.

If I preach my wife has long hair
You preach that your wife has long hair.

It does not follow that my wife is your wife.

Guojing · May 12, 2024

LoveofTruth said:
Curious, do you believe that Jesus Peter and Paul preached different gospels?

Gospel in the Greek means "good news".

There is only ONE good news that saves today, which is the good news found in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4.

But it does not follow that there is only ONE good news at ALL times.

Guojing · May 12, 2024

Aviel said:
Jesus made the case to John the Water Baptizer, that by being water baptized he was fulfilling """"ALL Righteousness.""""

"Righteousness" in this case, is what the LAW Requires.

This is why Jesus HAD to fulfill it, by being Water Baptized., as Jesus was "under the Law".

I agree with you.

Once you understand that Jesus first coming was to the nation of Israel only (Matthew 15:24), once Jesus arrived to preach the gospel of the kingdom to Israel that their promised Davidic kingdom was at hand (2 Samuel 7:12-16, Matthew 1:21, Matthew 10:5-8), then there is no problem understanding that water baptism was then required under the Law of Moses.

If every Jew is to be a priest under that kingdom to reach the entire world (Zechariah 8:23, Matthew 28:18-20, Mark 16:16, Acts 2:38), then every Jew must be water baptized under the Law of Moses (Leviticus 8:5–6).

ARBITER01 · May 12, 2024

LoveofTruth said:
We don;t begin in the Spirit and then seek to add to that by any works of the law to be made perfect.

Do you consider water immersion to be a work of the law of Moses?

Aviel · May 13, 2024

ARBITER01 said:
John 3:22

That verse is vague.

Its one of those verses that can mean, Me and them, or I was there and they were doing it.

So, some scholars say this and some say that....about that verse.

What i do with that verse, is let the Apostle/Disciples do the water baptizing.

ARBITER01 · May 13, 2024

Aviel said:
That verse is vague.

Its one of those verses that can mean, Me and them, or I was there and they were doing it.

So, some scholars say this and some say that....about that verse.

What i do with that verse, is let the Apostle/Disciples do the water baptizing.

Of course you would try to dismiss it, but it does say that Jesus was baptizing. I only care what the text says, not what scholars claim.

You asked for scripture on that section, I gave it.

Aviel · May 13, 2024

ARBITER01 said:
Of course you would try to dismiss it,

Im not trying to dismiss it at all.
The verse is in the NT.
That verse is one of those that is taught as "Them" or "Jesus and them".

I Dont teach my students that Jesus water baptized people. I Teach that just as Jesus "sent them out"... He also had them do the water baptizing.

However, Paul said..>"Christ sent me NOT to Water Baptize"..

And that "not' does not mean....>"dont water baptize"........
= Paul is explaining, ""im not here for that, im here to Preach the Cross because "The Cross is the POWER of GOD, unto Salvation to everyone one who BELIEVES...""......not Water Baptism.

You've noticed this verse....

""All that believe and are WB shall be saved but those that believe not shall be damned"

So, the reason that Damnation is only related to BELIEVING< in that verse, is because the Water is not the SALVATION Part., so it can't be a part of the damnation.

ARBITER01 · May 13, 2024

Aviel said:
Im not trying to dismiss it at all.
The verse is in the NT.
That verse is one of those that is taught as "Them" or "Jesus and them".

I Dont teach my students that Jesus water baptized people. I Teach that just as Jesus "sent them out"... He also had them do the water baptizing.

However, Paul said..>"Christ sent me NOT to Water Baptize"..

And that "not' does not mean....>"dont water baptize"........
= Paul is explaining, ""im not here for that, im here to Preach the Cross because "The Cross is the POWER of GOD, unto Salvation to everyone one who BELIEVES...""......not Water Baptism.

You've noticed this verse....

""All that believe and are WB shall be saved but those that believe not shall be damned"

So, the reason that Damnation is only related to BELIEVING< in that verse, is because the Water is not the SALVATION Part., so it can't be a part of the damnation.

Get out of teach mode, you're preaching to the choir here.

I fully understand how salvation is brought into our lives. I'm not one of those individuals that promotes a false water regeneration.

LoveofTruth · May 13, 2024

ARBITER01 said:
Of course you would try to dismiss it, but it does say that Jesus was baptizing. I only care what the text says, not what scholars claim.

You asked for scripture on that section, I gave it.

"When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John, 2 (Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples,)..." (John 4:1,2 KJV)

LoveofTruth · May 13, 2024

ARBITER01 said:
Do you consider water immersion to be a work of the law of Moses?

Similar, but not exactly. John was called specifically of God to baptize in the Jordan and for specific reasons. His water baptism was different than the Ot washings and diverse baptismos. But connected in the sense of being one of the diverse washings and carnal ordinances imposed on Israel. In the Jordan river fulfills the type when the People of God followed the arc and Joshua through the river Jordan. And God was manifest that day and so was jesus. The comments on the type is a more involved discussion.

ARBITER01 · May 13, 2024

LoveofTruth said:
"When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John, 2 (Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples,)..." (John 4:1,2 KJV)

Good catch, you're right!

ARBITER01 · May 13, 2024

LoveofTruth said:
Similar, but not exactly. John was called specifically of God to baptize in the Jordan and for specific reasons. His water baptism was different than the Ot washings and diverse baptismos. But connected in the sense of being one of the diverse washings and carnal ordinances imposed on Israel. In the Jordan river fulfills the type when the People of God followed the arc and Joshua through the river Jordan. And God was manifest that day and so was jesus. The comments on the type is a more involved discussion.

Why not answer the question better? It seems you are avoiding it.

How To Understand : Acts 2:38

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