Did Yahshua Rise on the 7th Day Shabbat...

Filippus

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No the 14th would have been before the feast day of the 15th hence getting his body into the grave before sunset and breaking the legs of the other 2...
I respect your view and with your placement of the chronology it makes sense.

I do consider that the 14th was the feast from:
Num28:16, ‘The Lord’s Passover shall be on the fourteenth day of the first month of each year.

And again I am considering that the crucifixion only occurred after the 15th, thus if you are prepared to listening closely, it only separates the celebration of the Passover to the crucifixion.

Now lets go with your proposal that Jesus died on Friday and look at an example.

Jesus celebrated the Passover on the 15th see Matt 26: 17-20, Mark 14:12-17, Luk 22:7-13.
John 19:14 places the trail before Pilate on the 16th at noon
The next day Jesus is crucified at 9 am confirmed with John19:31 before a High Sabbath.
Resurrection now falls on the 19th, the first day after the Sabbath, or Firstfruit.

upload_2022-1-23_12-57-51.png
 
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Torah Keeper

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Tuesday - Abib 14 (Sabbath)
=========================
Yeshua buried before evening then the
Jews rest because Passover evening is Sabbath.
=========================
Friday - Abib 17
=========================
Women at Tomb early in the morning. And this is after Sabbath for Passover/Feast of Unleavened Bread.
=========================
Saturday - Abib 18
=========================

If the crucifixion was on Tuesday, the women would have rested Wednesday, and returned to the tomb on Thursday. Yet you have them returning on Friday? This is a flaw in your Tuesday crucifixion theory.

(CLV) Lv 23:14
Not bread or toasted grain or groats of the new crop shall you eat until this very day, until you bring- the approach present of your Elohim. It shall be an eonian statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings.

Compare this with the first Passover in the promised land in Joshua 5. As I said, in order for them to eat the new produce of the land, the barley offering must first have been made. This was made on Sunday. And, they kept Passover the day before. This is only possible if Passover was the day before Firstfruits. This means on that year, in Joshua 5, the Passover was on Shabbat, day 7, and the next day was Sunday, Firstfruits. This proves they were not using a 364 day calendar.
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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I respect your view and with your placement of the chronology it makes sense.

I do consider that the 14th was the feast from:
Num28:16, ‘The Lord’s Passover shall be on the fourteenth day of the first month of each year.

I disagree because on the 15th, Yeshua was dead in the tomb. The feast was on the 15th...Feast of unleavened (Hag haMotzi). "In the first day ye shall have an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein". On the 14th, was Pesakh (Passover), when the lambs were killed.
 
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daq

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How far does your evidence go back in the Second Temple period? Does it go back to before when the Zadokim were exiled? This is an important consideration.

Agreed, and the lunar or lunisolar calendar was most likely introduced in the time of the Maccabees, (when the Tzaddokim were driven out).
 
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HARK!

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I'm going to begin my list of relevant verses from the Apostles. I'll add verses by editing this post; and from time to time I'll bump it. Feel free to copy and paste it with additions.

Matthew


(CLV) Mt 12:40
For even as Jonah was in the bowel of the sea monster three days and three nights, thus will the Son of Mankind be in the heart of the earth three days and three nights.

(CLV) Mt 16:4
"A generation, wicked and an adulteress, for a sign is seeking, and a sign will not be given to it except the sign of Jonah." And leaving them, He came away.

(CLV) Mt 20:18
"Lo! we are going up into Jerusalem, and the Son of Mankind will be given up to the chief priests and scribes, and they will be condemning Him to death.

(CLV) Mt 20:19
And they will be giving Him up to the nations, to scoff at and scourge and crucify. And the third day He will be roused."

(CLV) Mt 26:2
"You are aware that after two days the Passover is coming, and the Son of Mankind is being given up to be crucified."

(CLV) Mt 26:17
Now, on the first day of unleavened bread, the disciples came to Jesus, saying to Him, "Where art Thou wanting we should be making ready for Thee to be eating the passover?"

(CLV) Mt 26:18
Now He said, "Go into the city to so and so, and say to him, `The Teacher is saying, "My appointed time is near. With you am I holding the passover with My disciples."'"

(CLV) Mt 26:19
And the disciples do as Jesus arranges with them, and they make ready the passover.


(CLV) Mt 26:26
Now at their eating, Jesus, taking the bread (Artos, leavened bread), and blessing, breaks it, and, giving to the disciples, said, "Take, eat. This is My body."

(CLV) Mt 26:32
Now after My rousing I shall be preceding you into Galilee."

=====================================
(CLV) Mt 26:42
Again, coming away a second time, He prays, saying, "My Father, if this can not pass by from Me if I should not drink it, let Thy will be done!"

(CLV) Mt 26:43
And, coming again, He found them drowsing, for their eyes were °heavy~.

(CLV) Mt 26:45
Again, then, He is coming to the disciples and is saying to them, "Are you drowsing furthermore and resting? For lo! near is the hour, and the Son of Mankind is being given up into the hands of sinners

(CLV) Mt 26:46
"Rouse! We may be going. Lo! he who is giving Me up is near!"
=======================================

(CLV) Mt 26:61
said, "He averred, 'I am able to demolish the temple of God and, during three days, to rebuild it.'

(CLV) Mt 27:1
Now, morning coming on, all the chief priests and the elders of the people held a consultation against Jesus, so as to put Him to death.

(CLV) Mt 27:45
Now from the sixth hour darkness (night?)came over the entire land till the ninth hour.

(CLV) Mt 27:46
Now about the ninth hour Jesus exclaims with a loud voice, saying, "Eloi! Eloi! Lema sabachthani?" that is, "My God! My God! Why didst Thou forsake Me?"

(CLV) Mt 27:61
Now Miriam Magdalene was there, and the other Mary, sitting in front of the sepulcher.

(CLV) Mt 27:62
Now, on the morrow which is after the preparation, the chief priests and the Pharisees were gathered to Pilate,

(CLV) Mt 27:63
saying, "Lord, we are reminded that that deceiver said while still living, 'After three days shall I be roused.'

(CLV) Mt 27:64
Then order the sepulcher to be secured till the third day, lest at some time his disciples, coming, should be stealing him and may be saying to the people, 'He was roused from the dead,' and the last deception will be worse than the first."

Mark

(CLV) Mk 14:1
Now it was the Passover and the unleavened bread after two days. And the chief priests and the scribes sought how, -laying hold of Him by guile, they should be killing Him.

(CLV) Mk 14:12
And on the first day of unleavened bread, when they sacrificed the passover, His disciples are saying to Him, "Where dost Thou want us to come away that we should be making ready, that Thou mayest eat the passover?"

(CLV) Mk 14:16
And His disciples came out and came into the city, and they found it according as He said to them. And they make ready the passover.

(CLV) Mk 14:17
And, evening coming on, He is coming with the twelve.

(CLV) Mk 14:22
And at their eating, Jesus, taking bread, (αρτον, leavened bread) blessing, breaks it and gives to them, and said, "Take; this is My body."

(CLV) Mk 14:26
And, singing a hymn, they came out to the mount of Olives.

(CLV) Mk 14:27
And Jesus is saying to them that "All of you shall be snared in Me in this night, for it is written, I shall be smiting the shepherd And the sheep shall be scattered.

(CLV) Mk 14:28
But after My rousing I shall be preceding you into Galilee."

(CLV) Mk 14:54
And Peter, from afar, follows Him till within the courtyard of the chief priest, and was sitting together with the deputies, and warming himself at the light (morning?}.

(CLV) Mk 14:58
We hear Him saying that `I shall be demolishing this temple made by hands, and during three days I shall be building another not made by hands.'"

(CLV) Mk 15:25
Now it was the third hour, and they crucify Him.

(CLV) Mk 15:29
And those going by blasphemed Him, wagging their heads and saying, "Aha! You who are demolishing the temple and building it in three days,

(CLV) Mk 15:33
And at the coming of the sixth hour, darkness (Night?) came over the whole land till the ninth hour.

(CLV) Mk 15:34
And at the ninth hour Jesus implores with a loud voice, saying, "Eloi! Eloi! Lema sabachthani?" which is, being construed, "My God! My God! Why didst Thou forsake Me?"

(CLV) Mk 15:42
And, already coming to be evening, since it was the preparation which is before the sabbath,

(CLV) Mk 15:43
Joseph from Arimathea, a respectable counselor, who himself also was anticipating the kingdom of God, coming with daring, entered in to Pilate and requests the body of Jesus

(CLV) Mk 16:1
And, for the elapsing of the sabbath, Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, buy spices, that, coming, they should be rubbing Him.

(CLV) Mk 16:2
And, very early in the morning on one of the sabbaths, they are coming to the tomb at the rising of the sun.
====================================
(CLV) Mk 16:5
And, entering into the tomb, they perceived a youth sitting at the right, clothed with a white robe, and they were overawed.

(CLV) Mk 16:6
Now he is saying to them, "Be not overawed! Jesus are you seeking, the Nazarean, the Crucified. He was roused! He is not here! Perceive the place where they place Him!

(CLV) Mk 16:7
But go, say to His disciples and to Peter, that He is preceding you into Galilee. There you shall see Him, according as He said to you."
==================================
(CLV) Mk 16:9
Now, rising in the morning in the first sabbath, He appeared first to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons.
 
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daq

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The Lunar cycle a very simple indicator of the weekly Sabbath and a reasonable assertion that it would have been used to assist with those not close to Jerusalem.

The lunar cycle, one lunation being approximately 29.53 days, is off by 1.53 days in a mere one lunar month. That's not an indicator of the weekly Shabbat, which would rather be 28 days, or at least close to that number. 29.53/4=7.3825 days. That's basically 7.4 days in a lunar quarter, almost seven and a half days in a lunar quarter if counted as a week. Even if there were 7.25 days in a quarter moon it would still be a lunar month of 29 days, off by a full day. Moreover what would be the lunar sign marking the beginning of the Shabbat, at the end of six days?
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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The lunar cycle, one lunation being approximately 29.53 days, is off by 1.53 days in a mere one lunar month. That's not an indicator of the weekly Shabbat, which would rather be 28 days, or at least close to that number. 29.53/4=7.3825 days. That's basically 7.4 days in a lunar quarter, almost seven and a half days in a lunar quarter if counted as a week. Even if there were 7.25 days in a quarter moon it would still be a lunar month of 29 days, off by a full day. Moreover what would be the lunar sign marking the beginning of the Shabbat, at the end of six days?

The weekly Sabbath is an independent continuous 7 day cycle
 
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Torah Keeper

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The 7 day week is not based on any astronomical sign. It is a memorial of creation. It is not a division of the moon or anything else. As Yesua HaDerekh said. The week is a completely Hebrew unit of time. Other cultures, such as Hawaiians, had no concept of a week at all. Weeks didn't exist to them. They only had days, moons, and years.

Other cultures in trade with the Hebrews adopted a business week due to Hebrew influence. After the diaspora, Jews took the Sabbath with them wherever they went. Jews were often not able to find employment because of Sabbath-keeping, so they were forced to be self employed. This caused many Jews to be business owners, and led to businesses closing on Shabbat, even if the other businesses in the area were not Sabbath-keepers. We see this in countries like the USA, with it's high Jewish population. The "weekend" is 2 days because of the influence of Sabbath-keepers (including Sabbatarian Christians). Saturday (Shabbat), and Sunday. Without Jewish influence, weeks would not exist at all. We would be like the Hawaiians. Just days, moons, and years. Or maybe just days and years, since the Gregorian calendar ignores the moon.
 
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Humble Penny

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If the crucifixion was on Tuesday, the women would have rested Wednesday, and returned to the tomb on Thursday. Yet you have them returning on Friday? This is a flaw in your Tuesday crucifixion theory.
Jesus said He would rise from the dead after 3 Days and 3 Nights...the women came to the tomb the day He rose from the dead...where exactly is the flaw? After all even in the other crucifixion teachings they all teach that the women showed up the day Yeshua rose from the dead...not after...

I don't see how you could miss such a central theme in the Gospels. Also the phrase after the Sabbath could refer to any number of days after the Sabbath. If the text said the day after the Sabbath you'd have a point, but because Yeshua must fulfill the 3 Days and 3 Nights the context if the story tells you they didn't show up the next day after Passover...also...weren't you the one telling me before that the rest day of the Feast if Unleavened Bread wasn't a Sabbath?

Compare this with the first Passover in the promised land in Joshua 5. As I said, in order for them to eat the new produce of the land, the barley offering must first have been made. This was made on Sunday. And, they kept Passover the day before. This is only possible if Passover was the day before Firstfruits. This means on that year, in Joshua 5, the Passover was on Shabbat, day 7, and the next day was Sunday, Firstfruits. This proves they were not using a 364 day calendar.
As I explained to you previously they were at war...the Levitical command is in reference to when they reap their harvest...eating from what the land naturally produces doesn't violate this command. And yes according to Friday burial Doctrines Passover is always on a Friday. Yet somehow you ignore the implications of post #195.

Also Passover falling on a particular day of the week doesn't prove the length of any year on any calendar system.
 
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Humble Penny

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It does not say AFTER in Matthew 12:40
Guess you missed this:
"And He began to teach them that the Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders and the chief priests and the scribes, and be killed, and after three days rise again."
Mark 8:31 NASB1995
 
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HARK!

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It does not say AFTER in Matthew 12:40

It does in Matthew 27:63

(CLV) Mt 27:63
saying, "Lord, we are reminded that that deceiver said while still living, 'After (μετα) three days shall I be roused.'
 
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Humble Penny

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If the crucifixion was on Tuesday, the women would have rested Wednesday, and returned to the tomb on Thursday. Yet you have them returning on Friday? This is a flaw in your Tuesday crucifixion theory.


Compare this with the first Passover in the promised land in Joshua 5. As I said, in order for them to eat the new produce of the land, the barley offering must first have been made. This was made on Sunday. And, they kept Passover the day before. This is only possible if Passover was the day before Firstfruits. This means on that year, in Joshua 5, the Passover was on Shabbat, day 7, and the next day was Sunday, Firstfruits. This proves they were not using a 364 day calendar.

It does not say AFTER in Matthew 12:40
Below gentleman is your Friday theory next to Scripture and the Dead Sea Scrolls. Please explain why it isn't supported?

Friday Burial Doctrines
Calendars which begin Abib 1 on Saturday will logically have Yeshua buried on Friday Abib 14.
  • 1st Month of Abib
  • 01 02 03 04 05 06 07
  • __________________01
  • 02 03 04 05 06 07 08
  • 09 10 11 12 13 14 15
  • 16 17 18 19 20 21 22
  • 23 24 25 26 27 28 29
  • 30__________________

=============================================
Calendar Year Begins with new plant life in the Spring
=============================================
"Then God said, “Let the waters below the heavens be gathered into one place, and let the dry land appear”; and it was so. God called the dry land earth, and the gathering of the waters He called seas; and God saw that it was good. Then God said, “Let the earth sprout vegetation, plants yielding seed, and fruit trees on the earth bearing fruit after their kind with seed in them”; and it was so. The earth brought forth vegetation, plants yielding seed after their kind, and trees bearing fruit with seed in them, after their kind; and God saw that it was good. There was evening and there was morning, a third day."
Genesis 1:9‭-‬13 NASB1995

=============================================
Calendar Year Begins on the 4th Day/Wednesday
=============================================
"Then God said, “Let there be lights in the expanse of the heavens to separate the day from the night, and let them be for signs and for seasons and for days and years; and let them be for lights in the expanse of the heavens to give light on the earth”; and it was so. God made the two great lights, the greater light to govern the day, and the lesser light to govern the night; He made the stars also. God placed them in the expanse of the heavens to give light on the earth, and to govern the day and the night, and to separate the light from the darkness; and God saw that it was good. There was evening and there was morning, a fourth day."
Genesis 1:14‭-‬19 NASB1995
Screenshot_20220104-120909_Adobe Acrobat.jpg
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Guess you missed this:
"And He began to teach them that the Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders and the chief priests and the scribes, and be killed, and after three days rise again."
Mark 8:31 NASB1995

No I didn't miss that...YOU said "AFTER 3 days and 3 nights"...He ALSO said "ON THE 3RD DAY" and "IN 3 DAYS"...
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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I does in Matthew 27:63

(CLV) Mt 27:63
saying, "Lord, we are reminded that that deceiver said while still living, 'After (μετα) three days shall I be roused.'

MY point was that HP said "AFTER 3 days and 3 nights" and it does not say that anywhere...
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Below gentleman is your Friday theory next to Scripture and the Dead Sea Scrolls. Please explain why it isn't supported?

Friday Burial Doctrines
Calendars which begin Abib 1 on Saturday will logically have Yeshua buried on Friday Abib 14.
  • 1st Month of Abib
  • 01 02 03 04 05 06 07
  • __________________01
  • 02 03 04 05 06 07 08
  • 09 10 11 12 13 14 15
  • 16 17 18 19 20 21 22
  • 23 24 25 26 27 28 29
  • 30__________________

I don't need to, your premise is wrong...
 
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daq

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The weekly Sabbath is an independent continuous 7 day cycle

Agreed, there is no need for the cycles of the moon to determine the weekly Shabbat, (that was my point: it doesn't work).
 
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Humble Penny

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No I didn't miss that...YOU said "AFTER 3 days and 3 nights"...He ALSO said "ON THE 3RD DAY" and "IN 3 DAYS"...

MY point was that HP said "AFTER 3 days and 3 nights" and it does not say that anywhere...
Sorry to burst your bubble again pal:
"for just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the sea monster, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth."
Matthew 12:40 NASB1995
 
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Agreed, there is no need for the cycles of the moon to determine the weekly Shabbat, (that was my point: it doesn't work).

yes, I was agreeing with you. Shavua tov!
 
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