SC Senate Passes Bill Banning Affirmative Care For Minors

[Zaha Torte]

Not that i care what Jenner thinks, but with what?? Nothing I said in that post to my knowledge has ever been addressed by them.

Them?

 

[Foamhead]

Them?

How about answering the question, as well as the one where I asked you to tell me which photo is a biological male.

 

[Zaha Torte]

How about answering the question, as well as the one where I asked you to tell me which photo is a biological male.

Sure - I'll get right on that - but this is a more pressing matter.

You realize that Caitlyn Jenner is a single person - right?

 

[ralliann]

Not that i care what Jenner thinks,

Pretty much figured that. You don't care what transgenders think. Just those that agrees with YOU.
Nothin more to discuss..You have obviously never listened to him cuz you don't care.

 

[rjs330]

I'm calling you out. How old is she? A hysterectomy on a child us illegal and would lead to both loss of medical license and prison.

I didn't say she was a juvenile right now. I've walked with my friend through this journey. But her story is one that happens. She transitioned due to her molestation. She went through medicalization, puberty blockers then on to hormones. She first got a mastectomy in San Francisco. She recently got a hysterectomy.

So you aren't really calling me out on anything.

 

[rjs330]

I really don't care about your "research", you are not a medical doctor or a psychotherapist. It is illegal to perform gender surgery on anyone under 18. Show us evidence of these surgeries, not just repeating the same claim over and over. Otherwise you're either grossly (willingly) misinformed or outright deceptive.

The research I have done is simply looking up the research done BY the professionals and what they had to say.
I've already provided the evidence on mastechtomies being done on kids. THAT is being done. See I do back up the information.

 

[rjs330]

I really don't care about arguments from nature/biology. If you really feel that way then you'd oppose corrective glasses, plastic surgery to repair/correct abnormalities I.e. cleft pallet and so on.

Wait are you claiming that being trans is an abnormality?

 

[rjs330]

Jazz was seventeen and a half, which is old enough to give medical consent depending on where you live.

Regardless you people don't say surgery is being performed on 17 and a half year olds, you use the term "children". This is because you're trying to appeal to people's emotions by conjuring up images of 9 year olds.

I have no regard for demeaning baby talk like "wing doodle", or disrespecting people by not addressing them the way they ask. You're hatred is not an argument.

FYI they don't cut off your "wing doodle" during grs, they just rearrange things into a female configuration.

Rearrange? No re-arranging is what males do when their penis is uncomfortable in the position it's in.

What actually happens is serious surgery. Yes the penis IS removed. It's cut off. Here's a brief description.

Converting male anatomy to female anatomy requires removing the penis, reshaping genital tissue to appear more female and constructing a vagina.


An incision is made into the scrotum, and the flap of skin is pulled back. The testes are removed.

A shorter urethra is cut. The penis is removed, and the excess skin is used to create the labia and vagina.

You see, I do know what I'm talking about. Apparently you don't.

But let's not talk about adults. That's a different subject than the OP. We are talking about kids, not adults. Kids ARE having thier breast's removed.

 

[rjs330]

So why add to it? Why demonize another group for no good reason? It only adds to the bullying.

No one is being demonized. If you are going to accuse someone of that you should back it up.

Yeah, but she had a choice, and knew ahead of time that there are employers who hate tats. Nobody told her that her desire to have tats could only be either pretended or the result of mental illness and that she would burn in hell for it.

Well, we have seen people pretend to be trans. And being trans IS a mental illness. That's why people are trying to treat it. And I don't recall saying anyone who is trans is going to burn in he'll cause they are trans. Man you do throw out wild claims don't you.

 

[rjs330]

The bill outlaws nicknames not known to the parents.

Really? I think you have to prove that. You mean if kids call another kid scooter the parents have to be notified?

Any nonconformity to the strict behavior and attitude standards set for men and women. It could be anything; Attitude toward rough/contact sports. Manner of dress. Preferences in leisure activities. Preferences in potential careers. It could be effeminate mannerisms (for a male} or masculine mannerisms (for a female.) Being gay is gender nonconformity. But not all gender nonconformity is trans

Okay so how does this bill outlaw minor accommodations for kids who don't like contact sports or preferences in certain careers? And your going to have to tell us what the strict standards and attitudes are that have been set for men and women. It seems to me that you are the one with tge gender issues here. Where on earth do you get off trying to claim the Standards are so set that a girl who likes football is non-conforming to a woman's standard? Or a guy who prefers to cook instead of hunt doesn't measure up to some manly standard?
And both of these are suspect for being trans?

Your argument establishes nothing.
Let's boil it down.
A girl likes to play hockey so she's non-conforming and may or may not be trans. She likes hockey
1. She might be trans
2. She might not be trans.
You've established exactly nothing.

 

[rjs330]

Actually yes you do see the comparison, you just don't like the comparison. Arguments from nature/biology are non-arguments unless you're prepared to have that stance for all medical procedures that interfere with those things. Since you're not, and most people in your position aren't because that would be insane, it means nature and biology are not really the issues for you.

There is no comparison. Biology can be observed and tested. Male and female sex has many observations and tests to prove if one is male or female. The primary one is the male and female gametes. Those determine if one is male or female.
Eyesight can be tested so can hearing. Cleft pallets can be observed.

You know what can't be observed or tested? Being transgendered. We can't run blood tests, we can't do x-rays, there aren't any defining biological characteristics that we can point to show that one is trans. We have to trust the person. It's a trust based and faith based situation. How do we know one is trans? Cause they say so.

Yes biology is the deciding factor of male or female. Biology matters.

 

[rjs330]

I addressed this in another post. Check it out. Gender Dysphoria IS an illness by defenition

That's not acceptable by transgendered people. That's transphobic. They do NOT want anyone to say they have an illness. Take a look at the trans person on this thread. He would be very upset with you if you claimed he had an mental illness.

 

[rjs330]

I don't need to give you more examples because you know exactly what I'm saying. Playing like you don't means you are very dishonest and I don't waste my time with dishonest people.

Except biology exists in reality. Gender doesn't. Biology determines what you are. Gender doesn't exist outside of biology. You see when you are dead I can run tests and determine if you are male or female.

No it's not... virtually everyone opposed to LGBT rights and transgender medical treatment are religious fundamentalists. This is not my opinion it's born out by the research

The research you posted didn't have anything to do with transgenderism.
But we aren't making a religious argument for the treatment if children. Science is determining that the treatments haven't been proven to be effective and are actually harmful. That's the science. Which has nothing to do with religion.

have never in my life met, seen or heard of a doctor or parent saying to a child "Hey did you ever consider you're a girl in a boy body? Let's getcha on some estrogen stat!".

What nonsense. You obviously don't know what ideology means. Medical conditions and psychiatric disorders are not an ideology.

I think most parents woul rather have a mentally healthy child than a mentally ill one. Although there a parents out there who would transition their kid. A doctor wouldn't explore the transfers of a kid unless someone asked. Then they would affirm them and say they are. They would never challenge the concept. They wouldn't actually treat the illness but instead affirm it and assist them in to further thier illness. That's why it's called Affirmative Care.

Kids are being influenced all the time through media, schools and social media to consider they may be the opposite sex. You never heard of the gender unicorn?

Okay, who? Name any organization qualified in medicine and gender identity disorder who agrees with you that is not religiously affiliated.

Genspect for one. The professionals in Therapy First are more.

 

[KCfromNC]

They may be manipulated into thinking they are the opposite gender when they truly aren’t.

It continues to be instructive how the "reasons" for believing in right wing culture war issues keep shifting as the previous excuses run face-first into reality. This post appears to be part of that pattern.

 

[KCfromNC]

Yes they are. They are being told that transitioning will cure all thier problems. One clinic visit with a doctor and whiz bang here's your drugs now you can transition. Affirmative Care, nedicalization with drugs and you are trans. The next logical step is to have your breast's removed. From the moment a kid hears "yet you are trans", is a manipulation. You've been put on the trans train. Affirmative Care is nothing more than manipulation.

The only thing this post is missing is evidence.

 

[KCfromNC]

Yes they do. WPATH is totally biased. The irfanization is filled with activists and people with conflicts of interest because they are receiving money from being doing affirmative care or medicalization. They know there is no evidence that their guidelines are effective and they know their research is bad. Yet they still claim that it's the only option. Their SOC 8 is junk science.

The funny thing is that there are places that know this ans actually say it, but STILL use their SOC. They refuse to explore the possibility that therapy works in helping kids over come their trans thoughts.

So yes they are totally biased.

Bias, not evidence dominates WPATH transgender standard of care

Review of WPATH transgender standard of care including medical guidelines, conflict of interest and systematic review of evidence.

genderreport.ca

Finding one article isn't evidence that every expert in the field "are 100% biased". And no idea why you're bringing up with WPATH whatever stuff - I never mentioned them. The discussion was about a rhetorical question of whether or not experts in a field could potentially be biased or not.

 

[KCfromNC]

There is NO evidence that it's effective in helping kids and much e idence its harmful.

You've found a few researchers who agrees with you. That doesn't mean that there's no evidence from any other research in the area. Two totally different things.

This seems to be the second area in which your posts have jumped to claims of absolute certainty from a very limited sample size. And other posts have questioned if researchers are immune to bias. Seems like it might be wise to ponder how those points might interact if one were to try to build an internally consistent world view from the various talking points.

Edit - and it is interesting that if the research were as conclusive as is being asserted that there'd be a need for politicians to jump in and resolve the question. Unless the assertion is that everyone who doesn't agree with one particular approach (one which lines up with far-right messaging on the subject) is hopelessly biased and can't see the obvious truth. Which kinda starts to look like a conspiracy theory.

 

[KCfromNC]

First off they are not far right talking points.

Remind me again - which political party was quoted in the OP's article as saying

​

“There are some things in the nature of creation — male and female is one of them — that gets beyond what you believe and I believe,” Republican Sen. Richard Cash said on the Senate floor before debate began Thursday. “It’s rooted in creation; it’s rooted in the creator and those who opposed that are opposing in some sense the nature of creation itself.”​

as support for banning this sort of medical care?

 

[Foamhead]

Sure - I'll get right on that - but this is a more pressing matter.

You realize that Caitlyn Jenner is a single person - right?

Alright enough is enough. Until you show respect, stop playing games and answer what I asked I'm ignoring you.

 

[Foamhead]

Pretty much figured that. You don't care what transgenders think. Just those that agrees with YOU.
Nothin more to discuss..You have obviously never listened to him cuz you don't care.

Okay then if I comb these forums I'm sure in every post you agree with every single Christian here always.

What an absurd comment. Jenner is not the empress of trans people, so why do I care what her opinion is?