Ceallaigh said:

Of course, that's why the law was applied five months before the 2024 election for a crime that took place in 2016.

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Except... It wasn't. Unless you claim that March 30th, 2023 was 5 months before the 2024 election. And that's not taking into account the time spent with the grand jury before that.

Ceallaigh said:

More silly nonsense. This started with you addressing me. Time to put you on ignore again.

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Well, that means that you can ignore the points being made. Some people use the ignore button to save actually putting fingers in the ears.

Ceallaigh said:

Sounds like sour grapes.

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You are avoiding the points being made.

174. In the Light of Christ


In the book of Isaiah we read:
“The Lord called me from birth, from my mother’s womb he gave me my name.” Isaiah, chapter 49, verse 1

God calls all people, without exception, to a unique vocation and mission. Yet not all people respond to the invitation. Many people don’t know it or ignore it or worse yet, refuse to believe it and slow themselves down. Yet it’s when we’re on the move that we discover the potential of faith that we receive from God.

We are called to a vocation and a mission from our conception. However, we have the freedom to answer yes or no:
“I will make you a light to the nations, that my salvation may reach to the ends of the earth.” Isaiah, chapter 49, verse 6

Jesus is the Light of the nations and we need his Light to enlighten our faith and to understand the mission. Let’s ask him his Light constantly to live well the mission in which he wishes to send us.

Let’s walk in the Light of Christ, walk with Christ, walk for Christ, live in Christ and in his Light every day, so that the mission has meaning and fits in God’s will. Not my will, but your will, Jesus. It is you, Jesus, who makes us capable of such a beautiful, exciting and wonderful mission.

The new American Bible, 2011-2014
Book: The Fruit that lasts, Normand Thomas

Carl Emerson said:

This sounds right in theory, but adopting the title of "EcoChurch" in the present Global Political Climate certainly does present a narrow view as it is presented with the obligation to personally consider 'carbon neutrality' and stresses the implied unrighteousness of those who don't take the measure seriously.

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Well, I was commenting on care for the environment more generally. "EcoChurch" isn't a name I'd choose, personally, but I'm disinclined to descend into hyperventilating about it, either.

And yeah, I think there is an obligation to personally, at least consider, these things. I wouldn't be wanting to imply anyone else's unrighteousness on this or most any other grounds, but it's not wrong for a church to put that forward as an ethical ideal.

Now, you might be able to think that cat either alive, or dead, etc, and the only time it exists as neither or both is only when you haven't checked on it yet, etc. But, either way, there was a sequence of events, or causes, going on with you and your thought processes before that and leading up to it that were all caused by whatever was before that, etc. But and/or anyway, there is no way for you to know whether or not you thought the cat either alive or dead or not, but even if you did somehow think the cat something contrary to what it was supposed to be, etc, then that would all be fully known by some other observer who had already made or caused it in you to happen, etc. Because that One was responsible for what led up to it either way, having been the original cause of all of it, etc, including what was happening in or with you before you did that, or were right then able to do that, etc. And if you did do something that was contrary, then it does not mean it wasn't supposed to happen that way, but just that you were not yet able to do anything contrary till up to that very moment, because what needed to happen in or with you, had not been made to happen yet, etc. So if you were somehow able to do something contrary, then it would only be due to your unique make-up that was already meant to happen in or with you, in those very moments, etc, but not before that, etc. All fully known and caused already a long, long time ago already by this "Other", etc, who never not knows it, or never cannot fully know/predict it, because He was actually the original cause of both you and it, which will make you wonder if it is really even ever you doing it, even when it is something contrary to it, etc.

Jesus said it wasn't him actually doing it after all, etc. But that it was this other One who had given him the ability to do it, and was causing/making it happen through him (Jesus) that was the actual one/One doing it, etc. Said that he was doing nothing on his own, or of his own accord, but that it was his Father doing it, etc.

God Bless.

prey

DamianWarS said:

In a matrix there are those who work hard and those who don't work hard and both groups have those with money and those without. By your logic it would be fair to take money away from those who don't work hard and give it to the ones who do work hard so a robinhood version of justice.

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Or some version of communism. But I don't think that you think it's a serious argument, so...I won't take it seriously.

DamianWarS said:

Person X has no money. Person Y has money. Let's assume both work hard and have the same need for money. If the wallet is taken or if the wallet is not in both cases someone goes home empty handed. So either way a poor result. The most pragmatic solution would be to share the money and if we call the most pragmatic the moral best then if the wallet is taken by X or kept by Y then both should be regarded as a moral failure.

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Again, sounds like a version of communism. It's never really worked and it has no direct implication for morals or free will. I'll join in to any thread that wants to discuss it.

DamianWarS said:

I missed that explaintion, since it was brief can you restate it or link to it?

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Post 811. It's brief, but I don't think I really need to expand on it too much.

DamianWarS said:

If we isolate cognitive causes and physical causes in competitive layers that's an option too but we're describing dualism which you've already rejected.

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Yeah. No alternative has been offered.

tampasteve said:

Fair enough, and I am telling you how I read the scriptures and what the physical records seem to show what is. My view harmonizes, yours does not. No fossils that don't make sense? We can see the different layers and strata that the different ages/time periods of certain creatures existed in, we can see the records of when and where dinosaur fossils should be present - and they are. We can see the records of when and where ice age animals should be present - and they are. We can see the records of when and where eocene invertebrate fossils should be - and they are. We can see where mountain ranges moved and flowed over the Earth with the tectonic plates moving, a process happening now and to this day. Why would God create these fossils as mere interesting trinkets for people to dig up at a later date?

Short of for the pleasure of the beauty, no I don't know what a galaxy millions of light years away would have to do with man and life on Earth.

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All fossils were created over the past 6000 years. If you disagree then show the evidence

Diamond7 said:

If you want to read chapter one literal then you should read chapter two literal also. A day yō-wm maybe 24 hours. This word is used 7 times in chapter one but in verse 1:18 the word bay-yō-wm is used for day. "17God set these lights in the expanse of the sky to shine upon the earth, 18to preside over the day and the night, and to separate the light from the darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day. Here we have a classic case of where an age or era bay-yō-wm was made on a literal 24 hour day yō-wm.

In chapter two a day is an age or era. A long period of time. For example: Genesis 2:2 used bay-yō-wm for the word day. "By the seventh day God had finished the work he had been doing; so on the seventh day he rested from all his work." We have six literal 24 hour days but all of a sudden the seventh day is bay-yō-wm.

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Gen 1 and Gen 2 refer to the same event

Akita Suggagaki said:

I wish they would. But Trump is off the chart toxic disaster .

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Trump is? He isn't sitting there ruining the country at every turn like Biden is.

Biden took plenty of credit in his creepy little grin of confirmation that he was behind every second of this trial, so if that's the kind of country the Democrats want - one where we just jail our political opponents for daring to run against the powers that are in office - then I consider them an enemy of the people.

That's just honest. We never sat around trying political enemies on trumped up fake charges when I grew up. This isn't what America was created to be.

Americans have a world view that has given an exceptional model to the world, I will fight against anyone to keep that, I won't see it torn down. I don't care how much people hate seeing it.

I voted for Trump in 2016 and 2020 because here is exactly where the Marxist wing of the Democratic party was promising to go... If people can't see it now they never will. We are at war against an enemy we invited in, and they are against our way of life.

tampasteve said:

certainly it is not. But recall, I am presenting a view of Genesis (and Exodus) that harmonizes the records we can see with what God has provided in scripture.

Yes, well, not death by water necessarily, but covering by water or ash. But that is not really relevant to the fact that they exist and are from animals that existed in certain time periods as noted. Unless you are arguing that the animals all died in The Flood, which does not jive with the observable record of different animal types at different levels or places where we expect to find them and not in other places, nor does it account for animals preserved in permafrost or by natural mummification that are not fossils. *note I am not saying a Flood was not real, I am saying that the vast majority of the fossilized animals did not die in the Flood.

To provide light and for counting by Abraham? You are going to have to be more specific because surely God could accomplish the task in other manners if he chose to. The light is negligible and representing your seed could be accomplished many other ways.

That is not correct, the gravitational pull of other galaxies does not affect ours. Gravitational pull of galaxies does not extend forever.

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The gravitational pull of other galaxies does affect our galaxy.

Ceallaigh said:

You're clearly the one who's out of sorts here. Someone who's into snark would likely call it whining.

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Yet again you address the poster rather than what is posted. Do better.

Ceallaigh said:

This is this is the sort of thing that gets posted when someone and or someone's side of the debate is getting soundly trounced.

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It's not about whether one thinks one is winning or losing. I thought that was crystal clear. It's the standard of rhetoric being used in place of real arguments. At the level it has reached there are no real winners or losers. Because there are no real arguments. It's just point scoring.

quibbler said:

Hello Christians!

I read the Bible often, not only in English but also in Greek and sometimes Hebrew. I've recently finished reading Romans with the assistance of commentaries by Cranfield and Bruce, and I'm now reading Paul R House's commentary on the beautiful book of Daniel. So far I've never got around to learning Aramaic, but I could reasonably be described as an expert on the Bible, in comparison with most people. I'm also aware that one of the things the Bible teaches is that my scholarly knowledge is nothing to be proud of!

I want to be a Christian. I try to live as a Christian. I pray, sometimes for hours and hours...

But the end result is always that I think: none of it is true, is it?

So I'm joining your forum as a sympathetic and knowledgeable atheist. I hope you don't mind.

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Welcome. Why don't you believe?

keras said:

Just another reason for your errors and mistaken beliefs.
To make the KJV inerrant was never the intention of those translators in 1600, they knew there were other manuscripts but not available to them,
We have the modern advantage of far better and understandable Bibles. Why do you rate the KJV over them?

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Why the kjv is better than the rest is a whole debate unto itself.

Many of the modern translations are what is called "though-for-thought" translations. The kjv is a "word for word" translation.

The "thought-for-thought" translations are intended to make reading the bible easier using modern language. The kjv is more difficult to read because it has some old English style to it. such as, the thee's and thou's.

The "thought-for-thought" translations while easier to read are not as accurate as the kjv. I think that the REB 1989 bible has some thought-for-thought elements to it - from what I have read about it. Bibles, like the Living Bible are thought-for-thought translations, which can be good for someone just starting out as a Christian. But can be misleading as a person starts advance attempts at making timelines.

Zaha Torte said:

Cohen admitted to skimming from the top and that Trump did not know.

I don't think Trump is personally involved with every decision made.

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Well, we’ll see how Trump plays this lie*, won’t we?

*golf

Neogaia777 said:

The simplest answer to your question is, because the actions/thoughts/direction/decisions, etc, of the observer themselves, is all always determinate, or has already been determined/predetermined, and that's the simplest answer to your question.

What you are going to think it to be, is all already fully known, or has already all been predetermined already, or is already all fully and totally predictable/knowable/known to some entities, etc. Along with "everything else", etc. Or what was or would be before it, and what would come after it, etc, that is or would be always caused by whatever was or came before it, etc.

God Bless.

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You are never going to be able to say, even if we are somehow determining reality, or what happens next, etc, that the way you did that, or chose that, etc, was not already able to be fully predicted/caused/known, etc. Or that it was "random", etc. And in the case of "caused", etc, this by whatever was happening or was going on before it, etc.

And this going "all the way (way, way, way) back", etc.

God Bless.

Ceallaigh said:

What a load if silly nonsense.

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We're talking here about an ex presidents criminal conviction and how it might affect the upcoming election and you, for heaven knows what reason, bring in contributions to a terrorist organisation as some sort of argument and you accuse me of posting 'silly nonsense'?

Get a grip, please.

Zaha Torte said:

So, you believe that "grooming" and "sexual deviancy" are similar to pledging allegiance to the US flag?

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I brought up another kind of indoctrination, the point being that the indoctrination of children into society is going to involve many differing aspects and facets, I see counselors who are advocates for children who happen to be LGBTQIA+ and others see “groomers”.

Zaha Torte said:

Can you explain why that is?

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Because different (and myriad) indoctrinations take place all of the time in schools, some of it is detrimental, but we will disagree on which is which sometimes.
(No, I’m not championing “sexual deviancy”, either. That would likely be a forum no-no, to boot.)

Pommer said:

It’s 2024, we’ve had nearly eight (yea, LONG) years of vigorous and lively political discourse and everyone is tired, so we’re reduced to bumpersticker back-and-forth for a bit, from time to time.
Like sedentary exercise it keeps the joints limber without taxing the body (or brain) too much.

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It's become a habit. It's devolved to basic instincts. 'Mungo says this bad!' That's what political debate sounds like these days. Can you actually remember a decent political discussion on this forum that actually talked in reasonable terms about a political policy?

This is not normal! I'm trying not to use all caps here. This is not normal!

The political frog has been boiled for so long that anyone under 50 has no idea what reasonable political arguments between two opposing views sounds like. The standard of discussion is at the lowest point that I have ever experienced in my many decades on this planet. And I am so frustrated that I am being dragged down to this level. I'm becoming part of the problem. If you keep having nonsensical arguments thrown at you constantly and, as you say, these bumper sticker level comments used as debating points it's so difficult not to respond in kind, dammit.

Aargh! Rant over...

Douggg said:

midst of the week means in the middle part, not the exact mid-day point.

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Your opinion, not the logical and correct understanding.
The AoD will happen at 1260 days after the treaty is signed and after another 1260 days: Jesus will Return. Any other ideas, are just twisting and shuffling scripture. Not advisable.

Zaha Torte said:

Why do you consider same-sex marriage and actual marriage to be the same?

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Legally there is no difference.
”Separate-but-equal” was repudiated in Brown v Board of Education, (overturning Plessy v Ferguson, btw).