When you die what do you think happens to you?

[Xeno.of.athens]

So you are saying God isn't the All?

A typo. I meant without.

 

[BobRyan]

God exists without evil.

Amen

 

[timothyu]

God can exist without Satan

Then why create the Tempter

 

[prodromos]

Then why create the Tempter

Satan was not created evil.

 

[BobRyan]

Then why create the Tempter

God created the perfect sinless angle Lucifer (See Isaiah 14 and Ezek 28)

He did not create the devil -- Lucifer did that to himself

Lucifer turned himself into "the Adversary" - Satan

 

[Jerry N.]

When you die, you sleep until the judgment. It will seem like no time has passed to most. So, to die is to be with Christ if you are saved. When Jesus told the thief, “Today you will be with me in paradise,” that is how it would seem to him. God has no restrictions of time, but He controls our time. For those living, time passes. Dead people might wake from their sleep for a short while, but they return to sleep. However, we don’t know what happens between death and sleep. I have heard it said that those who have never heard the gospel will learn about it at that time. I don’t know if it is true, but it is a nice idea.

 

[timothyu]

Lucifer turned himself into "the Adversary" - Satan

So did mankind, simply by becoming self-aware.

 

[Jermayn]

Heb 9:27 LSB And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgement,

Paul states that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord (2 Corinthians 5:8).

 

[prodromos]

So did mankind, simply by becoming self-aware.

No. Adam and Eve would have eventually been allowed to eat the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil when they were spiritually mature. It was the disobedience that brought about man's fall.

 

[timothyu]

It was the disobedience that brought about man's fall.

Exactly. They put their will ahead of the Will of God

 

[prodromos]

Exactly. They put their will ahead of the Will of God

They were just as self aware in their obedience to God as they were in their disobedience. Eating the fruit took away their innocence.

 

[timothyu]

They were just as self aware in their obedience to God as they were in their disobedience.

No more than any other animal. Innocence. They did not know they were naked, and probably groomed themselves or whatever without any thought of embarrassment

 

[BobRyan]

So did mankind, simply by becoming self-aware.

No text says that becoming self-aware turns newly created sinless humans into lost people condemned to the lake of fire - second death

 

[BobRyan]

No. Adam and Eve would have eventually been allowed to eat the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil

No text says that

 

[timothyu]

No text says that becoming self-aware turns newly created sinless humans into lost people condemned to the lake of fire - second death

Self awareness was the result of putting their will ahead of the Will of God. Their eyes were opened to the knowledge of the elohim when they disobeyed God's Will and ate of the Tree..

 

[BobRyan]

Paul states that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord (2 Corinthians 5:8).

Not one text in the entire Bible says "TO BE absent from the body IS TO BE present with the Lord". Not even 2 Cor 5:8

In 2 Cor 5 there are THREE states listed
1. At home in this decaying tent body - in this life
2. Unclothed with no body at all
3. Clothed with our immortal eternal body also mentioned in 1 Cor 15 - given to us at Christ's coming

Paul makes it very clear in 2 Cor 5:1-5 that the middle state is very undesirable.

1 Thess 4:13-18 shows what Paul thinks of the state of death - the first death

13 But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. 15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words.

 

[Jermayn]

Not one text in the entire Bible says "TO BE absent from the body IS TO BE present with the Lord". Not even 2 Cor 5:8

In 2 Cor 5 there are THREE states listed
1. At home in this decaying tent body - in this life
2. Unclothed with no body at all
3. Clothed with our immortal eternal body also mentioned in 1 Cor 15 - given to us at Christ's coming

Paul makes it very clear in 2 Cor 5:1-5 that the middle state is very undesirable.

That's very interesting. I was thinking the second state was how we would be present with the Lord until the second coming of Christ. What was undesirable about this state by the way?

 

[timothyu]

Paul makes it very clear in 2 Cor 5:1-5 that the middle state is very undesirable.

An unclothed thought incapable of action.

 

[BobRyan]

That's very interesting. I was thinking the second state was how we would be present with the Lord until the second coming of Christ. What was undesirable about this state by the way?

take a look at 1 Thess 4:13-18 for "with the Lord"

1Thess 4:13 But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. 15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words.

And John 14:1-3 "that WHERE I am there you may be ALSO"
“Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me. 2 In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. 3 If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am, there you may be also.

 

[prodromos]

No text says that

Everything God created was "good".