Question about Re-Marriage/Adultery

[PrettyboyAndy]

I feel that we are not under the law anymore, and i feel that the focus of one living in "perpetual" adultery because one is remarried is legalistic, similarly to circumcision in the OT.

It says you who are trying to be justified by the law, have been alienated from Christ. - We are not justified by the law.

Christ is our redeemer, paying for our entire and total sin debt on the cross. Past, present and future.

In Galatians 5, Paul was refuting those who were preaching one must be circumcised to be a follower of Christ, and without circumcision you cannot be saved.

It's a legalistic issue and to me seems similar to the remarriage issue. We could take the OT law, that a believer must be circumcised, but he goes on to say, it's not the flesh (law keeping) but the heart that was we were circumcised (grace)

For by GRACE you have been saved, a free undeserving gift. You did and do nothing that to add to his finished completed work on the cross.

Galatians 5 below:

It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.
Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law. 4 You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace. 5 For through the Spirit we eagerly await by faith the righteousness for which we hope. 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.

7 You were running a good race. Who cut in on you to keep you from obeying the truth? 8 That kind of persuasion does not come from the one who calls you. 9 “A little yeast works through the whole batch of dough.” 10 I am confident in the Lord that you will take no other view. The one who is throwing you into confusion, whoever that may be, will have to pay the penalty. 11 Brothers and sisters, if I am still preaching circumcision, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the offense of the cross has been abolished. 12 As for those agitators, I wish they would go the whole way and emasculate themselves!

Life by the Spirit​

13 You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh[a]; rather, serve one another humbly in love. 14 For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.”[b] 15 If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

You are very right on this subject


I believe your wrong here concerning " nothing can remove ", it is true no mere man can remove .

On the topic of God removing connections, I don't recall the ancient church having a sacrament for divorce. So this speaks volumes.

What can be removed is the memory of the connection, the memories, the reference to the hidden link between souls.

But the link remains, because it was something established in the creation.

God's faithfulness to the creation covenant cannot be overwritten on a basis of Mercy.

This is why God is presently creating a new heaven and a new earth. It will be revealed after the judgment melts down this heaven and earth.

 

[Reneep]

I feel that we are not under the law anymore, and i feel that the focus of one living in "perpetual" adultery because one is remarried is legalistic, similarly to circumcision in the OT.

It says you who are trying to be justified by the law, have been alienated from Christ. - We are not justified by the law.

Christ is our redeemer, paying for our entire and total sin debt on the cross. Past, present and future.

In Galatians 5, Paul was refuting those who were preaching one must be circumcised to be a follower of Christ, and without circumcision you cannot be saved.

It's a legalistic issue and to me seems similar to the remarriage issue. We could take the OT law, that a believer must be circumcised, but he goes on to say, it's not the flesh (law keeping) but the heart that was we were circumcised (grace)

For by GRACE you have been saved, a free undeserving gift. You did and do nothing that to add to his finished completed work on the cross.

Galatians 5 below:

It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.
Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law. 4 You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace. 5 For through the Spirit we eagerly await by faith the righteousness for which we hope. 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.

7 You were running a good race. Who cut in on you to keep you from obeying the truth? 8 That kind of persuasion does not come from the one who calls you. 9 “A little yeast works through the whole batch of dough.” 10 I am confident in the Lord that you will take no other view. The one who is throwing you into confusion, whoever that may be, will have to pay the penalty. 11 Brothers and sisters, if I am still preaching circumcision, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the offense of the cross has been abolished. 12 As for those agitators, I wish they would go the whole way and emasculate themselves!

Life by the Spirit​

13 You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh[a]; rather, serve one another humbly in love. 14 For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.”[b] 15 If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.

I agree. But the leodicean church thought they were free. Free to do their own things ... and no doubt would be speaking about " gods grace " , but apparently they never stopped long enough to follow Jesus through the processes of purifying and justifying them which is real forgiveness.and cleansing them of the effects of their sins. Pre or post " a conversion?

Is there a conversion where we are not set free..yes it is called religion and it can only offer licenses to sin .. which can not end in salvation.



.

 

[Reneep]

On the topic of God removing connections, I don't recall the ancient church having a sacrament for divorce. So this speaks volumes.

What can be removed is the memory of the connection, the memories, the reference to the hidden link between souls.

But the link remains, because it was something established in the creation.

God's faithfulness to the creation covenant cannot be overwritten on a basis of Mercy.

This is why God is presently creating a new heaven and a new earth. It will be revealed after the judgment melts down this heaven and earth.

Sacraments for sins ? They would not do that anyway. Your missing the spiritual side and why the Christian must be free IN Gods plan . I would have to tell my own story. But when a marriage is unequally yoked, or pre conversion, bonding a sinner and saved.. the umbrella / covering can be a sinful one . The Son may break a marriage and the ties so that the Christian can walk in righteousness. This is about the son doing the Fathers perfect will for Individuals . There is no law for true forgiveness, it is about God grace .
If the mate is male and walkng in sin , the covering OF THE WHOLE FAMILY is under sin and the demonic, and oppression etc, and Jesus has the right by the will of the Father to end that demonic oppression for the sake of the kingdom , or gospel and the child of God. Because Father himself is dragged into those perverted marriages .

Truth is I didn't have a clue all the perversion that had been going on. I was walking in Hope love and IN forgiveness. But IT SEEMS FATHER needed me doing other things, Father has plans and we are getting towards the end and His plans will be done by his children. JESUS CAME TO BRING A SWORD AND I GUESS MY MARRIAGE NEEDED HIS SWORD. BUT I WILL NOT REMARRY IN THIS LIFE.
I'M HEART BROKEN THAT MY MARRIAGE WAS NEVER REALLY HEALED. BUT THAT TAKES TWO. The effects of it in my household to my surprise effected my children in ways I didn't know were possible. But now the time of healing can start. Only Jesus can fix what gets broken by sin. And only Jesus can forgive us and forgive the effects of our sins. And he will in his time.

But legally I am no longer one flesh with ex (who has remarried) not because he remarried but because the Son broke the ties before he remarried. So now I could rebond / marry , but I just don't want to with this old lady body. I will wait to the next age to marry.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Sacraments for sins ? They would not do that anyway. Your missing the spiritual side and why the Christian must be free IN Gods plan . I would have to tell my own story. But when a marriage is unequally yoked, or pre conversion, bonding a sinner and saved.. the umbrella / covering can be a sinful one . The Son may break a marriage and the ties so that the Christian can walk in righteousness. This is about the son doing the Fathers perfect will for Individuals . There is no law for true forgiveness, it is about God grace .
If the mate is male and walkng in sin , the covering OF THE WHOLE FAMILY is under sin and the demonic, and oppression etc, and Jesus has the right by the will of the Father to end that demonic oppression for the sake of the kingdom , or gospel and the child of God. Because Father himself is dragged into those perverted marriages .

Truth is I didn't have a clue all the perversion that had been going on. I was walking in Hope love and IN forgiveness. But IT SEEMS FATHER needed me doing other things, Father has plans and we are getting towards the end and His plans will be done by his children. JESUS CAME TO BRING A SWORD AND I GUESS MY MARRIAGE NEEDED HIS SWORD. BUT I WILL NOT REMARRY IN THIS LIFE.
I'M HEART BROKEN THAT MY MARRIAGE WAS NEVER REALLY HEALED. BUT THAT TAKES TWO. The effects of it in my household to my surprise effected my children in ways I didn't know were possible. But now the time of healing can start. Only Jesus can fix what gets broken by sin. And only Jesus can forgive us and forgive the effects of our sins. And he will in his time.

But legally I am no longer one flesh with ex (who has remarried) not because he remarried but because the Son broke the ties before he remarried. So now I could rebond / marry , but I just don't want to with this old lady body. I will wait to the next age to marry.

Freedom is correct, to not be bound is important. However, spiritual maturity is required to be able to take hold of such a thing.

 

[Reneep]

Freedom is correct, to not be bound is important. However, spiritual maturity is required to be able to take hold of such a thing.

Personally a 10+ year of (the three baptisms ) or Rev 3 process? of buying from him Gold, eye saive, and white clothes. And not sure I am out of the testing yet..IT STARTED10 YEARS AGO WITH A 40 DAY FAST.

So I tell you this not to boast but to share my experiences.


GOLD = PURITY FROM SUCH AUTHORITIES AND POWERS THAT STOOD BETWEEN Jesus and me . PURITY ISNT PERFECTION IT IS DOING FATHERS IMMEDIATE PERFECT WILL . REAPING 100 FOLD CROPS . BECAUSE FATHER DID IT. THERE WAS NO ME IN IT.
In This case a rebellious husband and boat loads of demonic roots , of raccoons and snakes and opossum, yep. And Lies I believed that God doesn't believe . That might lessen the crops to 60 or even 30 fold .

EYE SAIVE = WORKING OUT A VISUAL LANGUAGE using colors , numbers, everything around can be Father talking, communicating with you and giving direction, and proving there is no such thing as coincidences . FATHER RETAINS CONTROL OF EVERYTHING. SO THAT I CAN MOST OF THE TIME OR SOMETIMES ANYWAY, " DO WHAT I SEE FATHER DOING,", I'm not great at it yet but on the road.

WHITE CLOTHES = "righteos deeds of the saints " Jesus preparing your heart , mind soul, understanding OF YOUR PURPOSE IN FATHERS PLAN, and your understanding of the Word etc....for what Father needs you to do in the End of Days senarios, so that you can " overcome " . IT IS Rough stuff. Expect some ptsd as you learn .. oh boy. NEVER WANT TO DO THAT AGAIN.. BUT HE TAUGHT ME IT FOR A REASON...OHHHHHH BUT THAT IS THE OVERCOMING PARTS. WE MUST WALK OUT OUR SALVATION WITH FEAR AND TREMBLING , THEN HOLD ON!

Here is few hints i learned along the way.

Following Jesus and Fathers perfect plans is the difference between the fallen and His Children. the Lord does not give you instructions without using his Word that you have written in your heart. So everyone study and believe it or there isn't much conversation He can have with you. And be willing to obey what he says or there will be little to no conversation.
I hope that helps. See you in the Sukkahs ?

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Personally a 10+ year of (the three baptisms ) or Rev 3 process? of buying from him Gold, eye saive, and white clothes. And not sure I am out of the testing yet..IT STARTED10 YEARS AGO WITH A 40 DAY FAST.

So I tell you this not to boast but to share my experiences.


GOLD = PURITY FROM SUCH AUTHORITIES AND POWERS THAT STOOD BETWEEN Jesus and me . PURITY ISNT PERFECTION IT IS DOING FATHERS IMMEDIATE PERFECT WILL . REAPING 100 FOLD CROPS . BECAUSE FATHER DID IT. THERE WAS NO ME IN IT.
In This case a rebellious husband and boat loads of demonic roots , of raccoons and snakes and opossum, yep. And Lies I believed that God doesn't believe . That might lessen the crops to 60 or even 30 fold .

EYE SAIVE = WORKING OUT A VISUAL LANGUAGE using colors , numbers, everything around can be Father talking, communicating with you and giving direction, and proving there is no such thing as coincidences . FATHER RETAINS CONTROL OF EVERYTHING. SO THAT I CAN MOST OF THE TIME OR SOMETIMES ANYWAY, " DO WHAT I SEE FATHER DOING,", I'm not great at it yet but on the road.

WHITE CLOTHES = "righteos deeds of the saints " Jesus preparing your heart , mind soul, understanding OF YOUR PURPOSE IN FATHERS PLAN, and your understanding of the Word etc....for what Father needs you to do in the End of Days senarios, so that you can " overcome " . IT IS Rough stuff. Expect some ptsd as you learn .. oh boy. NEVER WANT TO DO THAT AGAIN.. BUT HE TAUGHT ME IT FOR A REASON...OHHHHHH BUT THAT IS THE OVERCOMING PARTS. WE MUST WALK OUT OUR SALVATION WITH FEAR AND TREMBLING , THEN HOLD ON!

Here is few hints i learned along the way.

Following Jesus and Fathers perfect plans is the difference between the fallen and His Children. the Lord does not give you instructions without using his Word that you have written in your heart. So everyone study and believe it or there isn't much conversation He can have with you. And be willing to obey what he says or there will be little to no conversation.
I hope that helps. See you in the Sukkahs ?

That's good, usually Revelation is a worthless book that people use to debate how the story will end. It is not common to try and apply the letters to the seven churches and try to overcome.

Blessings.

 

[Reneep]

That's good, usually Revelation is a worthless book that people use to debate how the story will end. It is not common to try and apply the letters to the seven churches and try to overcome.

Blessings.

The lessons I learned about in the time of testing / judgement/ education is about "Christ in me", those trials prove to me..He overcomes , I can do. Nothing but trust.

But I got through it and his Word to me now is 5/ grace, 525, grace to grace, or grace discern grace , or discernment is in his graces , and that it is official I am a child of the Father.. and not many have been introduced to the Father by the Son. It is a kind of reward maybe for going through the process.
. A tough one for sure! But after all that I know Father loves me and has a plan for me and for my good. And all heaven will love and protect me, so that I come through everything that can come, because of " Christ in me" he is the hope and the peace ! I understand that now more than I ever have before. I AM A CHILD OF THE FATHER. GETTING THAT ASSURENCE BEFORE THE END OF THE AGES AND TIMES OF TROUBLE IS REALLY PRICLESS.

 

[Doug Brents]

We have a friend who believes re-marriage would make you an adulterer.

And if you re-marry unless its due to death of your spouse or being cheated on, your living in sin, in a perpetual state of adultery.

I would like to hear other believers view on this.

She has a lot of scripture to backup her point.

I see two different applications of this.
1. If the divorce and remarriage happened before the people came to Christ, then (I believe) that the sin is completely wiped away, and the marriage they are currently in is the marriage they need to stay in, and they are without sin in it.

2. If the divorce and remarriage happened after they were already in Christ, then they are living in sin and need to separate, and seek restoration with their original spouse.

Back to 1 for a minute: I know a couple from many years ago who had both been married to others, each got divorced, and then married each other and had children. Then they both came to the Lord. When they did, they decided that God did NOT condone their remarriage. So they separated. The man purchased another house down the street from the wife's house, and moved into it. But every morning before the children got up he would be at the woman's house to be there for the children (they never knew about this arrangement). He would be their father, and then go off to work. In the evening, he came "home" from work to the woman's house, spent the evening with the children as their father, and then after they went to bed, he went back to his house down the street.

I don't believe that any of this was necessary, but they did, and they did everything they could to live righteously with God and still be proper parents to the children who had nothing to do with the sin they perceived they had been conceived in.

This may or may not be what you were looking for, but I hope it helps.

 

[bling]

We have a friend who believes re-marriage would make you an adulterer.

And if you re-marry unless its due to death of your spouse or being cheated on, your living in sin, in a perpetual state of adultery.

I would like to hear other believers view on this.

She has a lot of scripture to backup her point.

I thought someone would have already given you a good answer by now but found none on this thread. I would give many lessons on this topic to cover it.

Generally, what you need to realize: When good Christians come up with different conclusions it is usually because they are using the same words with different meanings.

Jesus can help us define: marriage, divorce and adultery.



There are several things here that need to be addressed:

1. Christ is talking to Jews while they are still under the Jewish written Law and not the Christian Law written on our hearts.
2. Christ says they are divorced and does not say those that “think they are divorced”.
3. Christ also says they are married even though it causes adultery and means they are adulterous and not, those that “think” they have married.
4. Under the old Law these adulterers should be stoned and from the reaction of the disciples that sounds like what they thought would happen when the Kingdom was established.
5. One problem is with the definition of words, especially: marriage, divorce, and adultery. It seem God in all His wisdom has allowed societies throughout the world and time to define marriage. Divorce seems to be the dissolving of a covenant relationship and an adulterous is anyone involved in the damaging of a covenant relationship.

Before going around telling people they are going to hell if they stay in their existing relationship you might want to study Biblical definitions and you might want to think about what would be the most Godly type Loving reaction. Did David deserve to continue living with Bathsheba or did they both need to be stoned to follow the Law?



What is Marriage:

If they are husband and wife, are they married?

Matt. 1:20, 25...Joseph son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary home as your wife, because what is conceived in her is from the Holy Spirit 25But he did not consummate their marriage until she gave birth to a son…

Luke 1: 34 And Mary said to the angel, “How shall this be, since I have no husband?”

I know from scripture how to treat a woman I am married to and how to treat a woman I am not married to, but is there some in-between way to treat a woman your about to complete the marriage with?

At the time of Jesus is in Israel, did marriage come before sexual intercourse for Israelites?

Does marriage establish a covenant relationship between a man and a woman?

2 Corinthians 6:14 Do not be yoked together with unbelievers….Can you be yoked to an unbeliever, even though it is not permitted?

Do all societies have an understanding of a married couple and an unmarried couple, but what does the Bible say?

What is adultery:

Jer. 3: 8 …Because Israel’s immorality mattered so little to her, she defiled the land and committed adultery with stone and wood.

Jer. 9: 2 Oh, that I had in the desert a lodging place for travelers, so that I might leave my people and go away from them, for they are all adulterers, a crowd of unfaithful people.

Mal. 2: 10… Why do we profane the covenant of our ancestors by being unfaithful to one another? 11 Judah has been unfaithful. A detestable thing has been committed in Israel and in Jerusalem: Judah has desecrated the sanctuary the Lord loves by marrying women who worship a foreign god.

Did everyone in Judah marry foreigners?

Matt. 5: 28 But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

Are all adulterers involved in the damaging or destroying of a covenant relationship?

What is divorce:

Jer. 3: 8 I gave faithless Israel her certificate of divorce and sent her away because of all her adulteries…

Was God married to Israel or did He have a covenant relationship with Israel that was dissolved by God?

Matt. 1: 18… His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be pregnant through the Holy Spirit. 19 Because Joseph her husband was faithful to the law, and yet did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly.

Can you divorce without first being married?

Is divorce the severing of a covenant relationship which releases both parties?

Can a divorced (severed) relationship be restored through the establishment of another covenant relationship?

Matt. 5:32 But I say to you that everyone who divorces his wife, except on the ground of unchastity, makes her an adulteress; and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

Did adultery (the damaging of a covenant relationship) happen with “…everyone who divorces his wife”?

Did Christ forget to say: “everyone who thinks he divorced his wife did not actually commit a divorce, unless it was done because of adultery”?

Did Christ make a distinction between the meanings of “divorce” by giving the exception or just tell us justifiable grounds?

From just the reading, does the divorce itself make the woman an adulteress or does it take her having sex with another man?

Did a divorce take place even if it was because of adultery?

Does just the marrying (which happens prior to having sex) a divorced woman result in adultery?

Is this loose attitude of God’s people about marriage and divorce, (an adulterous generation) result in them all being adulterers (damagers of a covenant relationship)?

The man that marries a divorced woman commits adultery, but from what Jesus said, does this same man also commit marriage?

When does a thief stop being a thief and when does an adulterer stop being an adulterer? When did Saul (Paul) stop being a murder?

 

[Reneep]

I see two different applications of this.
1. If the divorce and remarriage happened before the people came to Christ, then (I believe) that the sin is completely wiped away, and the marriage they are currently in is the marriage they need to stay in, and they are without sin in it.

2. If the divorce and remarriage happened after they were already in Christ, then they are living in sin and need to separate, and seek restoration with their original spouse.

Back to 1 for a minute: I know a couple from many years ago who had both been married to others, each got divorced, and then married each other and had children. Then they both came to the Lord. When they did, they decided that God did NOT condone their remarriage. So they separated. The man purchased another house down the street from the wife's house, and moved into it. But every morning before the children got up he would be at the woman's house to be there for the children (they never knew about this arrangement). He would be their father, and then go off to work. In the evening, he came "home" from work to the woman's house, spent the evening with the children as their father, and then after they went to bed, he went back to his house down the street.

I don't believe that any of this was necessary, but they did, and they did everything they could to live righteously with God and still be proper parents to the children who had nothing to do with the sin they perceived they had been conceived in.

This may or may not be what you were looking for, but I hope it helps.

Yes i think you are right. Wow what a father. And what a man. A little confused but God will get through to him yet. But his sacrifice will be honored no doubt. I WISH HE HAD A BETTER CHURCH THAT WALKED IN THE SPIRIT AND TRUE COUNCIL OF GOD, AND HE WOULD HAVE BEEN FREE AND BEEN WALK8NG IN JESUS ' GRACE BY NOW BECAUSE OF HIS REPENTANCE , BUT TRUTH IS BEFORE JESUS THAT MAN DID WHAT THE LAW OF GOD REQUIRED, BECAUSE BEFORE" CHRIST IN US " / by the holy spirit THERE WAS NO WAY TO BREAK THOSE TIES/ SINS / chains .. SO THANK YOU JESUS YOU ARE OUR CHAIN BREAKER AND RESTORER OF OUR SOULS !

 

[Dan Perez]

I feel that we are not under the law anymore, and i feel that the focus of one living in "perpetual" adultery because one is remarried is legalistic, similarly to circumcision in the OT.

It says you who are trying to be justified by the law, have been alienated from Christ. - We are not justified by the law.

Christ is our redeemer, paying for our entire and total sin debt on the cross. Past, present and future.

In Galatians 5, Paul was refuting those who were preaching one must be circumcised to be a follower of Christ, and without circumcision you cannot be saved.

It's a legalistic issue and to me seems similar to the remarriage issue. We could take the OT law, that a believer must be circumcised, but he goes on to say, it's not the flesh (law keeping) but the heart that was we were circumcised (grace)

For by GRACE you have been saved, a free undeserving gift. You did and do nothing that to add to his finished completed work on the cross.

Galatians 5 below:

It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.
Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law. 4 You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace. 5 For through the Spirit we eagerly await by faith the righteousness for which we hope. 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.

7 You were running a good race. Who cut in on you to keep you from obeying the truth? 8 That kind of persuasion does not come from the one who calls you. 9 “A little yeast works through the whole batch of dough.” 10 I am confident in the Lord that you will take no other view. The one who is throwing you into confusion, whoever that may be, will have to pay the penalty. 11 Brothers and sisters, if I am still preaching circumcision, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the offense of the cross has been abolished. 12 As for those agitators, I wish they would go the whole way and emasculate themselves!

Life by the Spirit​

13 You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh[a]; rather, serve one another humbly in love. 14 For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.”[b] 15 If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.

And read 1 Cor 7:1-40 will help you !!

dan p