Once saved always saved.Bible verses for and against.

[Gold fish]

Once saved always saved.Bible verses for and against. Can you list all the verses that come to mind?

 

[HTacianas]

Once saved always saved.Bible verses for and against. Can you list all the verses that come to mind?

We'd be here a long time listing all the verses against. The ones in favor of that idea are non-existent. Probably thye most stark example of those against is found in Hebrews regarding falling away from the faith:

Heb 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

Heb 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Heb 6:7 For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:

Heb 6:8 But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

There are others as well, including the warning of being cut off:

Rom 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

Jesus himself said "he who endures to the end shall be saved", see Matt 10:22. The meaning is that no one is saved until the end. The end will look like Matthew 25:31-46. It gives example of what is required of us after enter into salvation.

 

[d taylor]

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“For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life”

“Whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will never thirst”

“He who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life”

“He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst”

“He who lives and believes in Me shall never die [spiritually]”

“All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out”

“This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day”

“And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand”

Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?”

 

[Unqualified]

Reacting to your title…. Because I know there are scriptures for and against. But use your noodle man. Maybe the Lord is trying to get us not to judge. Rev 3:5

 

[FreeinChrist]

ADVISOR HAT


This thread has been moved from The Kitchen Sink to Soteriology does not allow theology threads.​

 

[Ivan Hlavanda]

Once saved always saved.Bible verses for and against. Can you list all the verses that come to mind?

The Lord said salvation cannot be lost. John 6 39 'And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day.' The Lord said He will not lose one, therefore we can be assured of our salvation.

John 10 28 confirms this also. 'I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.'

As Paul says in Romans 38 'For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, 39 nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.'
It says here clearly nothing will separate us from His love once we are in Him.

We only have to look on the cross to be assured our salvation cannot be lost. The sacrifice of Lord Jesus on the cross was perfect. He purchased God's elect people on the cross, by paying for their sins with His blood. He atoned for our sins and reconciled us to God. God gave everything for our salvation.

To say that salvation can be lost is saying God has not done enough on the cross, Jesus' sacrifice was not perfect, and He did not fully pay for the sins. In that case no one would be ever saved. Those who say salvation can be lost, I have one message for you; one day you will stand before the Father and tell Him that the sacrifice of His Son was not enough, good luck with that.

 

[tdidymas]

Once saved always saved.Bible verses for and against. Can you list all the verses that come to mind?

This is NOT an exhaustive list (For):
1 Samuel 2:9; 12:22
Psalm 40:11; 66:8-10; 89:30-37; 91:14-16; 94:14-15, 17-19; 97:10; 118:17-18
Isaiah 28:16; 43:4-13
John 5:24; 10:28-29
Romans 8:38-39; 9:14-16
1 Corinthians 3:15; 5:5; 6:19-20
Ephesians 1:13-14; 4:30
Colossians 2:9-14; 3:3-4
2 Timothy 1:9-12; 4:18
Hebrews 7:16, 25
1 Peter 1:3-5
Jude 24
1 John 3:9; 5:18

 

[Maria Billingsley]

The Lord said salvation cannot be lost. John 6 39 'And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day.' The Lord said He will not lose one, therefore we can be assured of our salvation.

John 10 28 confirms this also. 'I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.'

As Paul says in Romans 38 'For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, 39 nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.'
It says here clearly nothing will separate us from His love once we are in Him.

We only have to look on the cross to be assured our salvation cannot be lost. The sacrifice of Lord Jesus on the cross was perfect. He purchased God's elect people on the cross, by paying for their sins with His blood. He atoned for our sins and reconciled us to God. God gave everything for our salvation.

To say that salvation can be lost is saying God has not done enough on the cross, Jesus' sacrifice was not perfect, and He did not fully pay for the sins. In that case no one would be ever saved. Those who say salvation can be lost, I have one message for you; one day you will stand before the Father and tell Him that the sacrifice of His Son was not enough, good luck with that.

Yet....Jesus Christ of Nazareth lost Judas.
Blessings

 

[Ivan Hlavanda]

Yet....Jesus Christ of Nazareth lost Judas.
Blessings

Judas never lost his salvation. He never was a believer in the first place, he was faking it (knowingly or not).

Not everyone who follows Jesus, truly follows Him, only those who are in Him.

If you believe salvation can be lost, you are saying God has not done enough for you on the cross. If he has not done enough to wash away your sin, then your sin remains.

Jesus' sacrifice was perfect, not imperfect or partial, because that would be not enough. Why do people think they can add anything to Jesus' cross? What do you want to add? If salvation could be lost, we would have lost it all already.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Judas never lost his salvation. He never was a believer in the first place, he was faking it (knowingly or not).

Not everyone who follows Jesus, truly follows Him, only those who are in Him.

If you believe salvation can be lost, you are saying God has not done enough for you on the cross. If he has not done enough to wash away your sin, then your sin remains.

Jesus' sacrifice was perfect, not imperfect or partial, because that would be not enough. Why do people think they can add anything to Jesus' cross? What do you want to add? If salvation could be lost, we would have lost it all already.

I respectfully disagree. The Father gave Jesus Christ of Nazareth all 12 and He kept them. He lost one, Judas Iscariot. One can not lose something if one never had it to begin with. Judas made the choice then regretted his choice.
Blessings

John 17:11-13​

11 Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are. 12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. 13 But now I come to You, and these things I speak in the world, that they may have My joy fulfilled in themselves.​

 

[Ivan Hlavanda]

I respectfully disagree. The Father gave Jesus Christ of Nazareth all 12 and He kept them. He lost one, Judas Iscariot. One can not lose something if one never had it to begin with. Judas made the choice then regretted his choice.
Blessings

John 17:11-13​

11 Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are. 12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. 13 But now I come to You, and these things I speak in the world, that they may have My joy fulfilled in themselves.​

I am aware of John 17, but we must not forget John 6:39 'And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day.' As we know, the Word of God cannot contradict itself. So which one is it? We must look at Jesus' work on the cross.

We are all sinners. God is just, therefore, every sin must be punished. We deserve God's eternal wrath for our sins. But God is merciful, and He sent a Saviour, His Son who never sinned, never even desired to sin, to purchase God's people on the cross with His blood, thus satisfying God's just wrath and reconciling us with God. Either Jesus took the punishment for your sins, or you will be punished for them. Either Jesus took the wrath of God, or you will. If Jesus paid the full penalty for your sin, the judgement is no longer on you, because you have been justified by a sinless Saviour.

Jesus did not partially pay for the sin, He paid for them in full. If He paid only partially, then none would be saved. Jesus' sacrifice was perfect. Not imperfect as those who say that salvation can be lost. God's grace cannot be earned either, otherwise it's not grace. The people who think they can be saved by deeds, people who think they can add anything to Jesus' sacrifice, are rejecting the perfect sacrifice of Jesus. Honestly, what do sinners want to add to Jesus' sacrifice? Has God not done enough for you? God gave everything He had for our salvation, but people still say that is not enough? God gave His only Son, but people still want to add deeds to that. Well, let me tell you something if that is the case; one day, you will stand in front of God's judgement throne, and tell Him, He has not done enough for your salvation, that sending His only Son, was not enough. I don't think there is anything worse that you can tell God.

Was God's sacrifice on the cross perfect? Absolutely. Therefore, salvation cannot be lost, otherwise, it would be implying God has not done enough. You also fear for the rest of your life if you are living a good enough life to get to Heaven. But let me tell you this, none of us do. I know the Bible says that we must overcome, but we only overcome because God is holding onto us, and not because we are strong, because frankly speaking, we are all weak.

 

[Lukaris]

The Lord says that salvation involves abiding in Him as we live our lives and according to His commandments. Chapters 14, 15, & 16 in the Gospel of John are crucial for knowing God as Father, Son, & Holy Spirit, His saving grace, that this involves abiding in the Lord. Passages like John 14:15-18, John 15:4-10 focus on this but the chapters should be read completely.

The Apostles are consistent in what they tell us to live by faith. St. Paul gives us probably the best overall definition of our faith & living by it in Colossians 1:1-29. St. Paul also gives an excellent summation of salvation & condemnation on the grand scale of humanity in Romans 11:22-25 ( again, all of Romans 11:1-36 should be read).

This is a very individual matter, people vary. I believe we should pray for the salvation of others ( 1 Timothy 2:1-6) & for evangelism ( Matthew 9:36-38).

 

[Roderick Spode]

I respectfully disagree. The Father gave Jesus Christ of Nazareth all 12 and He kept them. He lost one, Judas Iscariot. One can not lose something if one never had it to begin with. Judas made the choice then regretted his choice.
Blessings

John 17:11-13​

11 Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are. 12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. 13 But now I come to You, and these things I speak in the world, that they may have My joy fulfilled in themselves.​

By saying, "Those whom You gave Me, I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition" (John 17:12), is Jesus saying that He lost someone that He was expected to keep or should have kept?
No, "gave" does not connote the need to 'keep.'

https://www.bibleversestudy.com/johngospel/john17-son-of-perdition.htm
"SON OF PERDITION" - Who Is He And Why Is He Called That?

 

[Maria Billingsley]

I am aware of John 17, but we must not forget John 6:39 'And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day.' As we know, the Word of God cannot contradict itself. So which one is it? We must look at Jesus' work on the cross.

We are all sinners. God is just, therefore, every sin must be punished. We deserve God's eternal wrath for our sins. But God is merciful, and He sent a Saviour, His Son who never sinned, never even desired to sin, to purchase God's people on the cross with His blood, thus satisfying God's just wrath and reconciling us with God. Either Jesus took the punishment for your sins, or you will be punished for them. Either Jesus took the wrath of God, or you will. If Jesus paid the full penalty for your sin, the judgement is no longer on you, because you have been justified by a sinless Saviour.

Jesus did not partially pay for the sin, He paid for them in full. If He paid only partially, then none would be saved. Jesus' sacrifice was perfect. Not imperfect as those who say that salvation can be lost. God's grace cannot be earned either, otherwise it's not grace. The people who think they can be saved by deeds, people who think they can add anything to Jesus' sacrifice, are rejecting the perfect sacrifice of Jesus. Honestly, what do sinners want to add to Jesus' sacrifice? Has God not done enough for you? God gave everything He had for our salvation, but people still say that is not enough? God gave His only Son, but people still want to add deeds to that. Well, let me tell you something if that is the case; one day, you will stand in front of God's judgement throne, and tell Him, He has not done enough for your salvation, that sending His only Son, was not enough. I don't think there is anything worse that you can tell God.

Was God's sacrifice on the cross perfect? Absolutely. Therefore, salvation cannot be lost, otherwise, it would be implying God has not done enough. You also fear for the rest of your life if you are living a good enough life to get to Heaven. But let me tell you this, none of us do. I know the Bible says that we must overcome, but we only overcome because God is holding onto us, and not because we are strong, because frankly speaking, we are all weak.

The Father gives and gives and gives yet there are those who throw what He gives away. This is what Judas Iscariot did. Christ kept him until he fell away. Why do you think he was chosen to be in charge of the money? From John 12:4-6 we learn that Judas was a thief, but also that he was in charge of the money bag. Jesus Christ of Nazareth allowed Judas the opportunity to choose a Master, Him or money. Remember, Satan entered Judas after he ate the bread, not before. He fell into temptation then apostisize.
Blessings.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

By saying, "Those whom You gave Me, I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition" (John 17:12), is Jesus saying that He lost someone that He was expected to keep or should have kept?
No, "gave" does not connote the need to 'keep.'

"SON OF PERDITION" - Who Is He And Why Is He Called That?
"SON OF PERDITION" - Who Is He And Why Is He Called That?

Read post 14

 

[Maria Billingsley]

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[FreeinChrist]

I respectfully disagree. The Father gave Jesus Christ of Nazareth all 12 and He kept them. He lost one, Judas Iscariot. One can not lose something if one never had it to begin with. Judas made the choice then regretted his choice.
Blessings

John 17:11-13​

11 Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are. 12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. 13 But now I come to You, and these things I speak in the world, that they may have My joy fulfilled in themselves.​

Keep in mind that no one was saved until Jesus was crucified and rose again. The Old Testament saints were saved by faith....but that salvation was not realized until the cross. Jesus was the first fruits of the Resurrection. Everything Old Testament pointed to the cross, and everything since points back to the cross.
If I recall the scripture on it, Judas died before the crucifixion, and not in faith.

 

[Roderick Spode]

The Father gives and gives and gives yet there are those who throw what He gives away. This is what Judas Iscariot did. Christ kept him until he fell away. Why do you think he was chosen to be in charge of the money? From John 12:4-6 we learn that Judas was a thief, but also that he was in charge of the money bag. Jesus Christ of Nazareth allowed Judas the opportunity to choose a Master, Him or money. Remember, Satan entered Judas after he ate the bread, not before. He fell into temptation then apostisize.
Blessings.

The Greek word for gave (gavest) in that verse is "didomi" which has a broad meaning including put, receive, and set. The same Greek word is used in 2 Corinthians 12:7 where Paul was given a thorn in the flesh.

In both cases, there was a purpose for being given. For Paul it was to keep him humble. For Jesus it was so that scripture would be fulfilled.

 

[Ivan Hlavanda]

The Father gives and gives and gives yet there are those who throw what He gives away. This is what Judas Iscariot did. Christ kept him until he fell away. Why do you think he was chosen to be in charge of the money? From John 12:4-6 we learn that Judas was a thief, but also that he was in charge of the money bag. Jesus Christ of Nazareth allowed Judas the opportunity to choose a Master, Him or money. Remember, Satan entered Judas after he ate the bread, not before. He fell into temptation then apostisize.
Blessings.

As I said, either Christ has paid the penalty for someone's sin in full or not. If He did, then that person becomes justified when God says 'your sins are forgiven'. It is not upto us, but God alone.

Let me ask you this, was Christ sacrifice perfect or not?

 

[Maria Billingsley]

As I said, either Christ has paid the penalty for someone's sin in full or not. If He did, then that person becomes justified when God says 'your sins are forgiven'. It is not upto us, but God alone.

Let me ask you this, was Christ sacrifice perfect or not?

Yes perfect. I am gathering by your posts that you are a OSAS proponent. I am not. I believe one must repent from unbelief to belief in order to recieve His Holy Spirit. Then one must stay the course in order to remain in Him.
2 Timothy 1:14
"By the Holy Spirit who dwells within us, guard the good deposit entrusted to you."

Blessings.