On the sinfulness of the LGBT path.

[SilverBear]

Ill make it real clear.
Black people cant STOP BEING BLACK.
Gay people CAN.
So when you equate them, it doesnt work.
Understand?

no homosexuals can lie about changing. Sadly some do so after experiencing years of emotional and even physical abuse.

 

[Wisp]

I don't view many issues in black & white. To me, LGBTQ "lifestyles" can be selfish and destructive, or benevolent and purposeful, it all matters what the individual is motivated by, the morals and standards they hold for themselves, and the means by which they attain advancement and fulfillment. The way homosexuality has been presented in the media shows people jumping from bed to bed in an endless quest for sexual satisfaction at the expense of true personal connection, and an obsession with the material and superficial. Those seem like meaningless lives to me. I would feel sorry for someone living like that. However, heterosexuals are just as likely to waste their lives worrying about brand names, fashion and sexual conquests. It strikes me as a purposeless, empty life, and if you consider sin to mean hurting yourself, then it might be sinful, but certainly isn't limited to LGBTQ people.

I do not consider homosexuality wrong in any way. I don't consider any form of sex wrong so long as all participants are consenting adults.

 

[Cis.jd]

There are many Christians who see the LGBT lifestyle as a natural aspect of life, and many who see it as a sin. Do you view it as sinful? Are there any reasons outside of the bible why you would view it as inherently a bad or good (or neutral) thing? Thanks!

Yes and no. I do think it is possible that some people are born that way, however I also think that there are those who were not and just acquired it. I have had long time friends whom i've known since my toddler years who always had this feminine like behavior and tone, and maybe it is due to a much stronger Y chromosome (yes they are currently gay and some of them tried not to be but could not have any form of sexual reaction towards the opposite sex). However that wasn't the case for all the people i've known. There have been some studies that claim that homosexuality usually happens when an area is facing a high population.

I think it is a sin for those on the later. I do have a theory that if there are homosexuals who were really born with it, then it's possible that God created them that way to balance the population count.

Regardless of my views on it, the marriage part is where it goes wrong. If Homosexuals want to have some form of marriage then they should just create their own form of wedlock with a different name. Because the word "marriage" is with in Christian tradition, so we have a right to have problems with it due to it invading the traditions and sacraments we believe in. The fact that they don't and the media has popularized it so much makes it certain that this is some anti-christian propaganda.

 

[loveofourlord]

Yes and no. I do think it is possible that some people are born that way, however I also think that there are those who were not and just acquired it. I have had long time friends whom i've known since my toddler years who always had this feminine like behavior and tone, and maybe it is due to a much stronger Y chromosome (yes they are currently gay and some of them tried not to be but could not have any form of sexual reaction towards the opposite sex). However that wasn't the case for all the people i've known. There have been some studies that claim that homosexuality usually happens when an area is facing a high population.

I think it is a sin for those on the later. I do have a theory that if there are homosexuals who were really born with it, then it's possible that God created them that way to balance the population count.

Regardless of my views on it, the marriage part is where it goes wrong. If Homosexuals want to have some form of marriage then they should just create their own form of wedlock with a different name. Because the word "marriage" is with in Christian tradition, so we have a right to have problems with it due to it invading the traditions and sacraments we believe in. The fact that they don't and the media has popularized it so much makes it certain that this is some anti-christian propaganda.

you mean after Christians stole it from pagans and other groups, and the church one day years after it started decided to stick it';s nose in? Plus marriage isn't something only Christians, so why should one religions concept of marriage be the one chosen.

 

[Cis.jd]

you mean after Christians stole it from pagans and other groups, and the church one day years after it started decided to stick it';s nose in? Plus marriage isn't something only Christians, so why should one religions concept of marriage be the one chosen.

Yes, I know "marriage" isn't exclusive to christians. Please read my post carefully. I am saying the name "marriage" is christian. It is tied to christianity, therefore on the name itself it should be respected.. so the best way for homosexuals to have this legalized unity with out any problems is to give the wedlock their own name.

It's like if i take something traditionally connected to Islam or even other countries with their own cultural traditions (China, Japan) and change it to something so I can be incorporated, that would be invading to them.

 

[loveofourlord]

Yes, I know "marriage" isn't exclusive to christians. Please read my post carefully. I am saying the name "marriage" is christian. It is tied to christianity, therefore on the name itself it should be respected.. so the best way for homosexuals to have this legalized unity with out any problems is to give the wedlock their own name.

It's like if i take something traditionally connected to Islam or even other countries with their own cultural traditions (China, Japan) and change it to something so I can be incorporated, that would be invading to them.

The name marriage predates such things, and not something Christians or even american Christians have exclusive rights to steal from everyone else.

 

[Kylie]

Why come here if you arent a Christian and spread your immoral ideas?
Does it make you feel good attacking peoples faith, trying to destroy it?

You dont put any credence into the bible, yet here you are living in a moral society CHRISTIANS BUILT.
Hate to tell ya, but before Christ, people sacrificed babies, women, men. The world was pure evil.
But the MORAL STANDARD you hate so much ended the grave SINS that plagued this world.
JESUS IS GOD, he set forth a framework tbat you've benefited from.your whole life.
Not that you care.

Do what thou wilst, be the only law. A famous quote by a famous man. Is that what you want?

Oh get off your high horse. The staff here do allow atheists to join and post. If you want a discussion with only Christians there are forums on this site where you can go to avoid having your ideas challenged by non-believers.

And just because people have differing views doesn't make them immoral. You are not the morality police.

And the idea that the USA is built on Christian values is demonstrably false. The Founding Fathers made that abundantly clear. And I'm in Australia anyway - another country that has no state-sanctioned religion.

And your claim that non-Christian civilisations are evil and barbaric is likewise an ignorant one. Without non-christian civilisations, you wouldn't have many of the things you have today. Like numbers or plumbing.

In short, don't get your worldviews from people who only want to give you pro-Christian propaganda. You get a very distorted view of reality.

 

[Kylie]

Ill make it real clear.
Black people cant STOP BEING BLACK.
Gay people CAN.
So when you equate them, it doesnt work.
Understand?

Like I said, you don't actually know any gay people, because what you are saying is complete rubbish. Gay people can't stop being gay any more than you can stop being straight.

 

[rjs330]

There is no LGBT path because it isn't a choice. Sexuality is not a choice.

I used to believe it was a choice, but have since changed my mind. I don't believe it is a choice anymore. But I still believe the homosexual act is sin. And if you actively participate in continual sinful behavior you will not receive salvation and will be judged by God. That goes for any sinfulness we participate in be it thievery or adultery or what have you.

 

[rjs330]

Being minority is not a defect or a sign of disease.





The burden would be on those saying it is harmful and you would have an impossible time proving that.
STDs are not intrinsic to either gays or straights and recall that lesbians have the lowest std transmission rate.
there are many anti-gay groups that tout STD's as a justification for hate and discrimination. For the most part they use misleading statistics or misrepresent information to support their claim. I remember during the ugly fight or proposition 5 in California several groups touted the "epidemic" of syphilis among homosexuals in California. They were eager to point out that the number of syphilis cases among gay men in the state had risen over 200% from the previous year obviously showing how dirty and disgusting gays are. What they didn't say was that the 200% increase amounted to an total increase of 11 cases of syphilis in gay men from one year to the next. They also didn't say that in that same year the number of syphilis cases among heterosexuals had increased over 800%.


no one is saying this.

what is being said is that it is impossible to call homosexuality unnatural, or against natural law when it occurs naturally and occurs in nature.

You are absolutely correct on the sexual disease stuff. The diseases are a direct result of the sinfulness of man. Sexual sin has many consequences and sexual disease is one if them.

 

[SilverBear]

You are absolutely correct on the sexual disease stuff. The diseases are a direct result of the sinfulness of man. Sexual sin has many consequences and sexual disease is one if them.

i meant disease as an origin of orientation such mental illness

 

[Allandavid]

Ill make it real clear.
Black people cant STOP BEING BLACK.
Gay people CAN.

No....Gay people can’t stop being black. They can’t stop being gay either....

If clarity is what you were after...you failed.

 

[fat wee robin]

it's comes off hateful because gays don't see it as being sinful, it comes off as attacking them as they see themselves born gay and that is who they are, it's like saying, "I don't hate you, I just hate that your black." you can argue that they arn't born that way, but that's what it comes off as to those that believe being gay is something your born as. Your hating them for who they are, their sin is who they are. Like I said before, it comes off as hate with a veneer of love, trying to sugar coat something thats hurtful and painful to those that can't help what they are.

What would you say if mass murderers ,pédophiles ,were born that way, and should be allowed to follow their want ?

 

[fat wee robin]

Thats what happens when not everyone in a country is Christian, you can't just make laws based upon religion, you must make laws and things based on things that can be demonstrable to everyone. Sin isn't something the law can decide upon, and people have as much right to live as they want as long as they are harming no one. You must so harm that isn't just, "it's sin." or childish arguments like, "it's not natural." neither is medicine or half the things we do, society should be based upon harm done, and I see the treatment of gays as the real harm, as it causes many to comit suicide and harms more people then good.

What treatment of 'gays' ? Nowadays and for some time they have been a protected group the West ,in spite of their often outrageous behaviours ,or do you prefer to bury your head in the sand there ?

It is true that too many christians are ill educated beyond the bible, and their arguments can be subjective , but there are arguments which show that the purpose of homosexuality is largely the destruction of all sane and decent society . Not all ,but very many .

Yes they should be able to work , live together ,if this pleases them ,but they should not be able to force influence on the young, or force people to put it on the same level as heterosexuality, which is what they want .

 

[fat wee robin]

I cant fathom why an atheist would join a Christian forum, but, welcome anyway.
I recommend reading the bible, praying about it and changing your life for the better with Jesus.
Use that Free Will to help your immortal soul

Atheists don't believe in immortal souls .

 

[Desk trauma]

What would you say if mass murderers ,pédophiles ,were born that way, and should be allowed to follow their want ?

Ah, the blood libel. Never far off in these discussions.

Murder and pedophilia involve violating the rights of a third party, consensual gay sex does not. No matter how often this smear is employed that does not change.

 

[fat wee robin]

it's comes off hateful because gays don't see it as being sinful, it comes off as attacking them as they see themselves born gay and that is who they are, it's like saying, "I don't hate you, I just hate that your black." you can argue that they arn't born that way, but that's what it comes off as to those that believe being gay is something your born as. Your hating them for who they are, their sin is who they are. Like I said before, it comes off as hate with a veneer of love, trying to sugar coat something thats hurtful and painful to those that can't help what they are.

Ah, the blood libel. Never far off in these discussions.

Murder and pedophilia involve violating the rights of a third party, consensual gay sex does not. No matter how often this smear is employed that does not change.

But it defeats " we are born that way" argument , as though all sin is not born that way ,but must be defeated to avoid destruction of the individuals ,and the
insistance of constant public exhibition .

 

[Desk trauma]

But it defeats" we are born that way" argument , as though God may have created them as such .

No, it does not. It does not even address it.

 

[fat wee robin]

No, it does not. It does not even address it.

I changed the second phrase ,as I do not believe I was created at birth ,but already existed .

 

[Desk trauma]

I changed the second phrase ,as I do not believe I was created at birth ,but already existed .

Still irrelevant.