North American Lutheran Church (NALC)

[RileyG]

Hello!

Is this denomination considered confessional or no?

I do know they broke away from the ELCA due to the ELCA ordaining openly gay pastors, and have a conservative view regarding homosexual behavior, but do ordain women.

I only know about them because my advisor in college WAS an ELCA Lutheran and his congregation joined the NALC a number of years ago over LGBT issues.

Are they liturgical? Are they traditional? I know they are small in number.

***I am posting as a guest from an orthodox, traditional Roman Catholic**

Thanks

 

[AlexB23]

Hello!

Is this denomination considered confessional or no?

I do know they broke away from the ELCA due to the ELCA ordaining openly gay pastors, and have a conservative view regarding homosexual behavior, but do ordain women.

I only know about them because my advisor in college WAS an ELCA Lutheran and his congregation joined the NALC a number of years ago over LGBT issues.

Are they liturgical? Are they traditional? I know they are small in number.

***I am posting as a guest from an orthodox, traditional Roman Catholic**

Thanks

Yes, the North American Lutheran Church (NALC) is considered confessional. This means that they hold to the historical doctrinal standards of Lutheranism, as expressed in the ecumenical creeds and the Lutheran Confessions. The NALC's Constitution states that they are "a confessional Lutheran church body" and that "the doctrine of the NALC shall be that set forth in the Holy Scriptures and the Confessions of the Evangelical Lutheran Church."

Regarding liturgical practices, the NALC allows for some flexibility and diversity among its member congregations. While some NALC churches may use traditional liturgical forms, others may have a more contemporary or informal worship style. The NALC's Worship and Liturgy Committee provides resources and guidance on worship and liturgy, but ultimately it is up to each congregation to decide how to implement these resources in their specific context.

In terms of tradition, the NALC is a traditional Lutheran denomination in the sense that it adheres to the teachings of Martin Luther and the Lutheran Confessions. However, like other Lutheran bodies, the NALC also values the importance of living out the faith in the present day and engaging with contemporary issues and challenges. The NALC seeks to be both rooted in the past and relevant to the present, balancing tradition and innovation in its theology and practice.

Source: About Us - North American Lutheran Church

 

[RileyG]

Apparently, no one here is a member of the NALC. It must be very, very small. There is no NALC in my (290,00) city I live in, but there is one congregation in the small town (15,000) I went to college.

Interesting

 

[Shane R]

I was listed on the supply pastor roster for 3 districts of the NALC for most of the last 2 years (still am in 1). During that time I met a lot of clergy and deans and visited several parishes. I had a fairly productive run up to Easter this year.

What I noticed and what kept coming up in conversation with younger deans was that the Church spent it's first decade in defining itself negatively; ie. as not the ELCA. The thought within the church is that it is time to shift to a focus that affirms what the church is rather than what it is not. The denomination is now at a cross roads in where the parishes are coming from as well. They have received about all they are going to from ELCA and now see most of their new affiliations coming from the LCMS or independents.

Now I'm no expert on pre 1970s American Lutheran synods but it seems to me that the mergers that resulted in ELCA were unlikely to have long term success. One of the first things any congregation I was visiting wanted to tell me was what synod they were founded in: ALC, LCA, or some other. This serves to highlight that the church has primarily operated in a maintenance mode, rather than an outreach mode. Neither the NALC nor the ELCA were prolific church planters.

I would hazard to guess that most NALC people would consider themselves confessional Lutherans. Whereas many LCMS and WELS people would not grant them that dignity. My assessment, as an outsider, is that NALC and there Anglican parallel and theoretical partner (ACNA) both think they are more conservative than they really are. But neither group has solidified their identity.

As for the size, look at the church locator. It's really fairly typical of most Lutheran bodies; maybe with a stronger Eastern presence.

 

[JM]

I wouldn't call them confessional.

https://thenalc.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/Affirmation-on-Ordination-of-Women-CTD-07232020.pdf

 

[Shane R]

I wouldn't call them confessional.

https://thenalc.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/Affirmation-on-Ordination-of-Women-CTD-07232020.pdf

Statements like that and the blither that ACNA released in nearly 300 pages highlight my point that both groups think they are more conservative than they really are. However, both groups are young and still developing. In the case of NALC, the ordination of women may die a slow death simply by attrition -most of their female clergy are old- and the lack of candidates in the pipeline; most women seeking Lutheran ordination tend to find their way to the ELCA. If the NALC would stop electing bishops in their late 60s and elect someone with some vision, the direction of the entire church could change.

 

[RileyG]

Statements like that and the blither that ACNA released in nearly 300 pages highlight my point that both groups think they are more conservative than they really are. However, both groups are young and still developing. In the case of NALC, the ordination of women may die a slow death simply by attrition -most of their female clergy are old- and the lack of candidates in the pipeline; most women seeking Lutheran ordination tend to find their way to the ELCA. If the NALC would stop electing bishops in their late 60s and elect someone with some vision, the direction of the entire church could change.

It’s also relatively small. Only about 400,000 communicants iirc.

 

[Shane R]

It’s also relatively small. Only about 400,000 communicants iirc.

The most recent data I've seen was more like 400 congregations and 140,000 members. Frankly, the membership number is usually inaccurate to the point of being meaningless. I prefer to look at Average Sunday Attendance but I don't have a figure for that.

 

[RileyG]

The most recent data I've seen was more like 400 congregations and 140,000 members. Frankly, the membership number is usually inaccurate to the point of being meaningless. I prefer to look at Average Sunday Attendance but I don't have a figure for that.

Ahhhh, I see.

 

[Markie Boy]

I attended one - and it was quite conservative. Seems they just do what they want to, which would leave how they are up to the local congregation more.

In the end, that's how most churches end up anyway.

 

[RileyG]

I attended one - and it was quite conservative. Seems they just do what they want to, which would leave how they are up to the local congregation more.

In the end, that's how most churches end up anyway.

I assume they have weekly communion and it’s not overly high church liturgical? A lot of guitars or praise bands?

I wouldn’t know.

 

[Markie Boy]

I assume they have weekly communion and it’s not overly high church liturgical? A lot of guitars or praise bands?

I wouldn’t know.

Actually more high church than the Catholic parish locally! Only piano music. Weekly communion kneeling at a rail!

 

[RileyG]

Actually more high church than the Catholic parish locally! Only piano music. Weekly communion kneeling at a rail!

Thanks for the input! That sounds nice.

 

[Markie Boy]

I actually really like the pastor - but I am 50 years old, I was 49 when I attended - and I was like a teenager in the congregation.

Just not the community I was looking for.

 

[rturner76]

Hello!

Is this denomination considered confessional or no?

I do know they broke away from the ELCA due to the ELCA ordaining openly gay pastors, and have a conservative view regarding homosexual behavior, but do ordain women.

I only know about them because my advisor in college WAS an ELCA Lutheran and his congregation joined the NALC a number of years ago over LGBT issues.

Are they liturgical? Are they traditional? I know they are small in number.

***I am posting as a guest from an orthodox, traditional Roman Catholic**

Thanks

Not being an expert on "Lutheranism," in with grade, I took Luther's Catechism from a Synod called the WELS (Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod). They were very conservative and had clear views about homosexuality. It was a time before trans issues were talked about openly. As an adult, I worked in a summer school run by the ELCA. I remember the ELCA was very liberal (come one come all), and they were the largest Lutheran group in the country if I remember right. Their biggest competition in numbers was the ELS (Evangelical Lutheran Synod, who were staunchly anti-homosexual and they and the WELS were committed to not allowing women to take up the cloth. So, what I gleaned from my personal experience was the Synods were smaller (like there was a Missouri Synod, an Iowa Synod, and an independent Synod for just about every state in the midwest where there is a very high German and Scandinavian population. The ELCA was the biggest and richest group but the Synods were independent but associated with the others on some level.

I don't know if that helps at all but the Lutheran Church(s) have many differing philosophies, most of them conservative but the biggest, richest, loudest, group is very Liberal so it's hard to put all Lutherans in one camp or the other in general.

 

[Markie Boy]

Not being an expert on "Lutheranism," in with grade, I took Luther's Catechism from a Synod called the WELS (Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod). They were very conservative and had clear views about homosexuality. It was a time before trans issues were talked about openly. As an adult, I worked in a summer school run by the ELCA. I remember the ELCA was very liberal (come one come all), and they were the largest Lutheran group in the country if I remember right. Their biggest competition in numbers was the ELS (Evangelical Lutheran Synod, who were staunchly anti-homosexual and they and the WELS were committed to not allowing women to take up the cloth. So, what I gleaned from my personal experience was the Synods were smaller (like there was a Missouri Synod, an Iowa Synod, and an independent Synod for just about every state in the midwest where there is a very high German and Scandinavian population. The ELCA was the biggest and richest group but the Synods were independent but associated with the others on some level.

I don't know if that helps at all but the Lutheran Church(s) have many differing philosophies, most of them conservative but the biggest, richest, loudest, group is very Liberal so it's hard to put all Lutherans in one camp or the other in general.

In all honesty that is pretty much every denomination today. Methodists, Presbyterians, even Catholic - has huge variations from way left, to solid and conservative/traditional.

It seems the Baptists have this variation less and seem more consistently conservative - but may just be my area too.

 

[RileyG]

Not being an expert on "Lutheranism," in with grade, I took Luther's Catechism from a Synod called the WELS (Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod). They were very conservative and had clear views about homosexuality. It was a time before trans issues were talked about openly. As an adult, I worked in a summer school run by the ELCA. I remember the ELCA was very liberal (come one come all), and they were the largest Lutheran group in the country if I remember right. Their biggest competition in numbers was the ELS (Evangelical Lutheran Synod, who were staunchly anti-homosexual and they and the WELS were committed to not allowing women to take up the cloth. So, what I gleaned from my personal experience was the Synods were smaller (like there was a Missouri Synod, an Iowa Synod, and an independent Synod for just about every state in the midwest where there is a very high German and Scandinavian population. The ELCA was the biggest and richest group but the Synods were independent but associated with the others on some level.

I don't know if that helps at all but the Lutheran Church(s) have many differing philosophies, most of them conservative but the biggest, richest, loudest, group is very Liberal so it's hard to put all Lutherans in one camp or the other in general.

Were you raised WELS?

 

[rturner76]

Were you raised WELS?

In Minneapolis MN. Not a large Synod but very conservative and there are very staunch adherents. I was actually raised AME (African Methodist Episcopalian) which was pretty conservative for a Methodist Church, I went to a WELS school for middle school and took Luther's Catechism. I was thoroughly confused by it so I didn't get confirmed. But I did get baptized there. The Pastor was extremely knowledgeable and spoke fluent Greek, Latin, and Hebrew. I had the utmost respect for him (God rest his soul).

 

[RileyG]

In Minneapolis MN. Not a large Synod but very conservative and there are very staunch adherents. I was actually raised AME (African Methodist Episcopalian) which was pretty conservative for a Methodist Church, I went to a WELS school for middle school and took Luther's Catechism. I was thoroughly confused by it so I didn't get confirmed. But I did get baptized there. The Pastor was extremely knowledgeable and spoke fluent Greek, Latin, and Hebrew. I had the utmost respect for him (God rest his soul).

That’s incredible! Thanks for sharing

 

[rturner76]

That’s incredible! Thanks for sharing

Yes, IMO Lutheranism is one of the closest if not THE closest to Catholicism in doctrine depending on the particular brand of Lutheranism which seems to vary widely.