Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus…..Outside The Church There Is No Salvation !!!!

[civilwarbuff]

I'm not sure, but I think the language issue has led to many misunderstandings in this thread?

I agree....
Gregoire de Nazianze Membe
And if Gregoire might acknowledge his lack of English....most here would be accepting of that..

 

[civilwarbuff]

Sorry, I am probably over stepping my bounds with that one....

 

[mark46]

Ah, you have my prayers.

I have been in very difficult times too, on varying lengths and for different reasons. I do know enough to know it can be spiritually tortuous. God be with you and have mercy on you.

I am reminded of some writings of St. Silhouan, which were a great encouragement to me when I began to read them. I don't know if they can help you. I'll look for a link to an article, and will post if I can find it. As I said, I don't know if you would respond the same though. Edit: here is the article that talks about it. There are several books - especially Remember Your First Love by Archimandrite Zacharias.

It must be that much more difficult, being out of the Church.

Is there an Orthodox priest you could speak with, if you don't want to speak to a Catholic priest? I do not wish to discourage you, but I would not like for you to discover the truth at an inconvenient time - even if the Catholic Church allows you to receive the sacraments in an Orthodox Church, the canons of our Church do not generally permit it. This is a matter for discussion with a priest though.

The research would not take long with a good teacher. There are differences in how we look at things, but it is less than the gulf between Orthodox and some other groups.

If you like, come over to TAW (The Eastern Orthodox forum), though some of our members come here to TT. We have Catholics there as well who chose to post with us, and we welcome them. If you do come, it IS a fasting season for us so ... please be patient if we are not at our best. But you are welcome, if the fellowship can help you.

You do have my prayers. God be with you.

I add my recommendation of TAW to yours, and also add my prayers to yours. I have found that TAW is a safe and welcoming environment to learn about Orthodoxy, and to ask questions.

With regard to the Catholic Church, santiagoamr might also consider visiting an abby or monastery for a weekend. In addition to the obvious benefit, there will be folks there who may be much more able than parish priests to discuss issues that he is experiencing.

 

[mark46]

Thank you so much for you input regarding the Dark Night of the Soul.

You are very welcome. As I indicated to Kylissa, I too will pray for you.

I did have another idea or two. Adoration is a great opportunity if it available to you. I have been blessed to have that availability 24/7 wherever I've lived. Also you might consider a weekend (or an overnight or even a few hours) at an abby or monastery. There should be folks there to speak to, if you wish (but speaking certainly isn't necessary). Over the centuries, many have been helped by both of the above.

 

[steve_bakr]

What was the contexf of when the above declaration was made? Was it directed at lapsed Catholics? Because I have a hard time believing that anyone besides Catholics would be likely to read it at the time it was written.
We Orthodox would certainly not have expressed it that way. We know that salvation is found through being united to Christ's body which is the Orthodox Church (others may disagree with the last bit), but we in no way limit how God may work out the salvation of those who are not members of the Orthodox Church.

I think the right path on this subject is exactly what you suggested. That is, God is omnipotent and infinitely merciful. He can, does, and will save whomever He pleases. No limits can be placed on that.

No one but God can say whether or not an individual is saved or will be saved. That would be to presume to usurp the authority of Almighty God.

This should be remembered in sectarian discussions--whether Catholic, Protestant, or Orthodox--and the tone should be mutual respect for one another and respect for the final authority of God alone.

By the way, I have been away and am not familiar with the new format. What does "Traditional Theology" refer to, exactly? If my post is out of place, please let me know. I am also using my Android so access is more difficult.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Since the Church is the body of the Lord Jesus Christ can anybody be saved apart from being in that body?

 

[Standing Up]

Since the Church is the body of the Lord Jesus Christ can anybody be saved apart from being in that body?

What was the context? How is "Church" being used/defined? As body? How is one a participant in the Body? One faith? What is that?

 

[MoreCoffee]

What was the context? How is "Church" being used/defined? As body? How is one a participant in the Body? One faith? What is that?

Church is being used as it is in holy scripture.