Caffeine, the lesser discussed sin

[Blueforest]

I notice a lot of Christians very quick to point out things as sins (how noble and diligent!) but I rarely see Christians condemn others for their consumption of caffeine-related products. Yet we know that Christians are to abstain from drugs, and caffeine... is a drug. It is a stimulant that creates irritability, unrest and anxiety in individuals. Yet no Christian denominations condemn its usage, let alone, even restricting it in moderation. I see so many Christians addicted to the stuff, stepping over one another after service for their Almighty Caffeine, or them waiting in line for aeons before getting served at the local coffee shop, before Sunday morning service. God forbid these individuals be forced to go a day without their dark idol - the caffeine god. And the issue isn't even addiction, it is consumption. Christians are not to use drugs, period. Right? Yet why do so many abuse their bodies with this horror?

Also, on a semi-related note of things we see in the church that are clearly wrong, yet people do it anyway... what is the deal with obesity and gluttony in the church? I see so many overweight and obese pastors. What a disgrace this is to the body! It is common knowledge that gluttony is a sin, so overindulging in fatty foods is a sin. Yet we see so many Christians, both laypersons and clergy alike, that abuse their temples with unhealthy quantities and types of foods. Why do they do this? Do they not realize they are bringing reproach onto the name of God and Christ? The world doesn't respect laziness, gluttony or people who have no self-control, food addictions or addictions to "harmless" drugs, like the caffeine idol. We're being hypocrites here.

I just do not understand how Christians can be so hypocritical about these things. Clearly, these issues are not okay, yet they are completely overlooked in the church. And don't even get me started on the greed and covetousness I see within many churches! That will have to wait for another time.

 

[Sketcher]

Caffeine does not impair your judgment or cause you to hallucinate or in any way make you a threat to other people. You can't honestly say that about the drugs the church does condemn.

 

[Goodbook]

Alcohol is a far worse drug yet I do find it peculiar to find people addicted to coffee who say they are christians. I think they know this yet dismiss this as something they can't help. They just don't have victory in Christ. The holy spirit keeps convicting them yet they grieve His spirit by ignoring him. And covetousness, as if covetousness is not a sin. Jesus calls us to holiness..100% , not 98%. There is no sin/addiction so great he cannot deliver us.

Mormons and seventh day adventists take a hard line on what food people eat and what they drink including caffeine. They are legalistic in that sense in that some believe you will go to hell for drinking coca-cola. Jesus does say it isn't what goes in the mouth that defiles us but what comes out.
So if coffee drinking causes us to behave badly and gluttonous appetite to offend people then yes..but then I would ask..what kind of church are you going to? I haven't noticed this in my church (it's baptist) Does your church preach a watered down, prosperity gospel? Is it just one of those social-club kind of churches where people just eat and drink whatever they like and sing half-hearted hymns and a sermon that takes one or two verses then somoenes opinion on what it means with quotes from books other than the Bible?

 

[Avniel]

You know I get what the OP is saying, its not about drink soda or a cup of joe it's about the fact that everyone has an issue they are working out. I might drink coca cola everyday(which I don't I'm a sports type of guy lift weights, run, and box a little when I can) and you can watch tv to much.....No matter what it is deal with you, and then I deal with me. A lot of people read the bible to see who they can convict but at the end they are going to be the ones that are judged the person that reads the bible as a mirror is going to be the one that is blessed.

 

[Avniel]

Alcohol is a far worse drug yet I do find it peculiar to find people addicted to coffee who say they are christians. I think they know this yet dismiss this as something they can't help. They just don't have victory in Christ. The holy spirit keeps convicting them yet they grieve His spirit by ignoring him. And covetousness, as if covetousness is not a sin. Jesus calls us to holiness..100% , not 98%. There is no sin/addiction so great he cannot deliver us.

Mormons and seventh day adventists take a hard line on what food people eat and what they drink including caffeine. They are legalistic in that sense in that some believe you will go to hell for drinking coca-cola. Jesus does say it isn't what goes in the mouth that defiles us but what comes out.
So if coffee drinking causes us to behave badly and gluttonous appetite to offend people then yes..but then I would ask..what kind of church are you going to? I haven't noticed this in my church (it's baptist) Does your church preach a watered down, prosperity gospel? Is it just one of those social-club kind of churches where people just eat and drink whatever they like and sing half-hearted hymns and a sermon that takes one or two verses then somoenes opinion on what it means with quotes from books other than the Bible?

There is no lesser drug or worse drug they are all drugs. Coffee becomes apart of the body like any other drug user's body.

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

Common sense would tell you that reasonably speaking coffee is not to be compared with narcotics, it is a natural bean that would appear to be MADE for human consumption. The fact that it contains a minor "drug" per se is really only a technicality, even tea has the same drug...so I guess we should stop drinking Snapple as well? I don't think so.

 

[Blueforest]

Common sense would tell you that reasonably speaking coffee is not to be compared with narcotics, it is a natural bean that would appear to be MADE for human consumption. The fact that it contains a minor "drug" per se is really only a technicality, even tea has the same drug...so I guess we should stop drinking Snapple as well? I don't think so.

Marijuana is a natural plant, so does that make it okay for Christians to use?

Obviously if tea contains caffeine it would be a drug. Why do people not allow their children to drink tea or coffee?

 

[al_man]

Marijuana is a natural plant, so does that make it okay for Christians to use?

Obviously if tea contains caffeine it would be a drug. Why do people not allow their children to drink tea or coffee?

I cans see how caffeine can ruin people's lives through insomnia and stress and causes them fall outs with people and such, but that comes with addiction to the substance.
The majority aren't addicted to caffeine and have no side effects, I believe it would be better to help these people with their addictions rather than just condemning them for being "Sinners" for drinking caffeine. I can see that you are trying to warn them of the dangers of sinning but it's not very productive, and doesn't deal with the underlying cause of the addiction. Every person is an individual some more susceptible to addiction than others.
If you have eaten a chocolate bar or anything listed at this site : Foods highest in Caffeine
Then I'm sorry you've had caffeine, and you are a drug taker.

 

[fuji]

Caffeine is more addictive than weed, yet christians look down on people that use it.

My thought is, read the whole bible and ask the Holy Spirit for guidance. I believe that the American church has this weird belief when it comes to things being a "sin". As an example, you would never go out to the bar after a church service, but in the UK it is normal to go out to the pub after service.

 

[LilLamb219]

The obvious answer to all of this is that we realize that ALL people are in need of a Savior. We, as Christians, still NEED Christ. We cling to Him and the forgiveness won at the cross. We know we have our problems and we won't be perfect while still in these sinful bodies, except that by Christ's blood we have been made perfect. But we still sin...sinner and saint at the same time.

Thanks be to God that a Savior was given to us to save us

 

[Blueforest]

I cans see how caffeine can ruin people's lives through insomnia and stress and causes them fall outs with people and such, but that comes with addiction to the substance.
The majority aren't addicted to caffeine and have no side effects, I believe it would be better to help these people with their addictions rather than just condemning them for being "Sinners" for drinking caffeine. I can see that you are trying to warn them of the dangers of sinning but it's not very productive, and doesn't deal with the underlying cause of the addiction. Every person is an individual some more susceptible to addiction than others.
If you have eaten a chocolate bar or anything listed at this site : Foods highest in Caffeine
Then I'm sorry you've had caffeine, and you are a drug taker.

The issue is that they are hypocrites, being addicted to something and then condemning others in other areas of life.

Most people ARE addicted to caffeine. Deprave some poor coffee addict of his morning latte and watch what manner of beast you unleash! It's sad to see Christians caught up in this same line of thought, while brazenly condemning everyone and everything else. That is the point. It applies equally to gluttony, overeating, being overweight / obese and taking poor care of yourself.

 

[sphsjags]

I agree about the overweight and lazy people, especially leaders in the church. Aside from some medical conditions or medications which can make it more difficult to lose weight, there are many who just overindulge when eating and/or are lazy and do not care for their bodies the way they should. Gluttony is a sin, along with sloth. Whether you're heavy or skinny, being lazy and not doing much physical activity is not right. Seeing church leaders with beer guts; it's not only gross, but the fact that they don't care to do anything about it is sad. I'm not saying that you should never have a drink. I'm also not saying to run marathons every week. But, even a moderate amount of physical exercise could take care of such a problem.

 

[barefeetonholyground]

In relation to caffeine...I think that it's a sin of conscience. Enforcing your belief that it is a sin would be legalism. I mean, if you are mastered by caffeine/addicted to it then the Bible is clear that it is a sin but as far as the occasional cup who cares?

There are worship leaders at my church who smoke. The Bible doesn't say "Thou shall not smoke" but many Christians are convicted against it. I'm not addicted to nicotine, I literally can pick up a cigarette and not smoke again for six months if I choose. I enjoy it. I get irritated when people tell me that I'm in sin when in fact I'm not violating a commandment, I'm not addicted, and I'm simply enjoying myself. Chill out. There's nothing wrong with caffeine unless you are a mormon.

 

[al_man]

I agree about the overweight and lazy people, especially leaders in the church. Aside from some medical conditions or medications which can make it more difficult to lose weight, there are many who just overindulge when eating and/or are lazy and do not care for their bodies the way they should. Gluttony is a sin, along with sloth. Whether you're heavy or skinny, being lazy and not doing much physical activity is not right. Seeing church leaders with beer guts; it's not only gross, but the fact that they don't care to do anything about it is sad. I'm not saying that you should never have a drink. I'm also not saying to run marathons every week. But, even a moderate amount of physical exercise could take care of such a problem.

Or less sugar in their coffee? lol

 

[znr]

This board is too much talk about sin sin sin sin! There is so much fear fear fear fear being spread (even despite the bible says fear not at least several hundred times). Honestly I'm [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]ing tired of this place but for some reason I've been unable to pull myself away. God have mercy. Maybe CF is a drug. Once in a while I see fellowship here. Once in awhile I see humanity as God intended. Sure, it's harder to read tone and tone gets lost in the written word but the underlying spirit comes through loud and clear. And it's fear fear fear fear. And what arrogance here in so many cases. As someone else pointed out in this thread the body of Christ is sick and the cure if love, as Christ intended.

What you really mean to say in your post comes through. Not all people are going to get it but some will. Thanks for sharing what was on your heart.

 

[bsd31]

It's not a drug issue it's a legalism issue. For thousands of years people used what we call illegal drugs today. People smoked pot, chewed coca leaves, and God knows what else. It was simply part of human culture. Christians didn't walk around telling everyone don't do this and don't do that when it came to narcotics. Mainly because those things were recognized for their medicinal properties as well as their more mundane (rope, cloth, etc) uses in a society.

Today Christians are so full of legalism that there or those among the brethren who honestly believe drinking a beer is sinful. Even if the Scriptures warn against being a drunkard and actually encourage drinking alcohol there are still vipers who say it is sin. Knowing this it is no surprise to me that there are people who consider using caffeine to be another sin.

But the question starts to become what exactly can we as Christians consume without running afoul of the legalistic views of some? I take sudafed and I'm toast. I might as well have smoked a joint as far as how it affects me. So is taking sudafed for me sinful? People drink coffee and get hyperactive is it sinful for them to drink it?

 

[Blueforest]

This board is too much talk about sin sin sin sin! There is so much fear fear fear fear being spread (even despite the bible says fear not at least several hundred times). Honestly I'm [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]ing tired of this place but for some reason I've been unable to pull myself away. God have mercy. Maybe CF is a drug. Once in a while I see fellowship here. Once in awhile I see humanity as God intended. Sure, it's harder to read tone and tone gets lost in the written word but the underlying spirit comes through loud and clear. And it's fear fear fear fear. And what arrogance here in so many cases. As someone else pointed out in this thread the body of Christ is sick and the cure if love, as Christ intended.

What you really mean to say in your post comes through. Not all people are going to get it but some will. Thanks for sharing what was on your heart.

My point is, Christians need to stop being so hypocritical. I had someone in another topic arguing with me over something I find very legalistic, unbiblical and frankly, silly. So I am merely pointing out how hypocritical believers can be when it comes to other issues, like drugs, overeating, etc. I could just as easily pull out my own brand of legalism, interpretation or even random bible verses to support my OP. That's not my goal, however. It's more about exposing the hypocrisy I see all around me in the church (BTW, 'the church' includes this board).

And for the record, I am drinking a can of Pepsi as we speak.

 

[znr]

My point is, Christians need to stop being so hypocritical.

I know. Agreed.

I had someone in another topic arguing with me over something I find very legalistic, unbiblical and frankly, silly. So I am merely pointing out how hypocritical believers can be when it comes to other issues, like drugs, overeating, etc. I could just as easily pull out my own brand of legalism, interpretation or even random bible verses to support my OP. That's not my goal, however. It's more about exposing the hypocrisy I see all around me in the church (BTW, 'the church' includes this board).

I liked what Avniel wrote (bible reading > convicting others, rather than reading it as a mirror) and I see his observation playing out here in 70% of the people here, and they seem totally oblivious! They are, as you pointed out, part of the church indeed.

And for the record, I am drinking a can of Pepsi as we speak.

The real sin is ignoring the true message of Christ, which is to love each other believer and unbeliever alike. I suppose the depth of Jesus' message scares the pants off a lot of people.

James 5:16

Confess your faults one to another > and pray one for another, that you may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man avails much.

As Avniel pointed out so many people have it the other way around, looking for any opportunity to convict others. (since when did WE become the Holy Spirit)

Enjoy the Pepsi

 

[znr]

You know I get what the OP is saying, its not about drink soda or a cup of joe it's about the fact that everyone has an issue they are working out. I might drink coca cola everyday(which I don't I'm a sports type of guy lift weights, run, and box a little when I can) and you can watch tv to much.....No matter what it is deal with you, and then I deal with me. A lot of people read the bible to see who they can convict but at the end they are going to be the ones that are judged the person that reads the bible as a mirror is going to be the one that is blessed.

Your PM box is full. Please PM me your email address.

 

[Avniel]

I know. Agreed.



I liked what Avniel wrote (bible reading > convicting others, rather than reading it as a mirror) and I see his observation playing out here in 70% of the people here, and they seem totally oblivious! They are, as you pointed out, part of the church indeed.



The real sin is ignoring the true message of Christ, which is to love each other believer and unbeliever alike. I suppose the depth of Jesus' message scares the pants off a lot of people.

James 5:16

Confess your faults one to another > and pray one for another, that you may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man avails much.

As Avniel pointed out so many people have it the other way around, looking for any opportunity to convict others. (since when did WE become the Holy Spirit)

Enjoy the Pepsi

Exactly when in truth nobody can judge your heart not even you sometimes. How many times on this thread are peoples faith in question, their maturity in Christ questioned........I can't wait for people to realize that they have no heaven or hell to put anyone in.......None, they don't judge me or my heart because they don't know it.

People play God to much, God is a God of order.....Their is a order to doing things and the number one priority is love. That's why the bible says judge not others or you shall be judged, how are you going to pretend to be God.

Nobody can save me or you but Jesus Christ. Not someones made up doctrines, their twisted logic or whatever.

If you feel like eating pork is against God then don't eat it, but don't look at my plate and see a piece of bacon and tell me how I need to grow in Christ. That's you that doesn't eat pork not me I dont have the same conviction as you I don't have the same problems as you God doesn't deal with me the same way he deals with you.