100 Fold Return?

RB4580 · Aug 19, 2005

Is getting a 100 fold return on your money biblical? I listen to Mike Murdock and enjoy his "wisdom" teachings but it just throws me off when he talks about money the way he does. Am I just being to sensitive to this?

akasmom · Aug 19, 2005

No, you aren't being too sensitive, you're being wise. If God leads you to give an amount to a person, church, ministry or whatever, do it with joy and assurance that being willing and obedient has tangible as well as spiritual rewards. But don't get sucked into the "I need a $100 harvest so I'll sow $1 to this guy" school of giving. Don't limit God as to what, when or how He'll bless you, just as He doesn't limit how, when, with whom or where He'll use you!

probinson · Aug 19, 2005

I believe that is correct. If we believe that the principle of sowing and reaping applies to our finances, consider the parable of the sower:

Matthew 13
3And he spake many things unto them in parables, saying, Behold, a sower went forth to sow; 4And when he sowed, some seeds fell by the way side, and the fowls came and devoured them up: 5Some fell upon stony places, where they had not much earth: and forthwith they sprung up, because they had no deepness of earth: 6And when the sun was up, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away. 7And some fell among thorns; and the thorns sprung up, and choked them:8But other fell into good ground, and brought forth fruit, some an hundredfold, some sixtyfold, some thirtyfold.

I believe that if you sow your seed in good ground (i.e., where God tells you to sow) with the right motives, this parable can apply to your finances. But many others here on the forums will tell you I'm wrong, and that you shouldn't expect anything from God. So I guess it's really up to you to decide what you believe.

Cue people telling me "context is key" in 3, 2........

enoch son · Aug 19, 2005

Why live under the law and limit God? Don't that just sound dumb?

RB4580 · Aug 19, 2005

enoch son said:
Why live under the law and limit God? Don't that just sound dumb?

Yes it does. Like I said, I just wanted to know if it's biblical. I'm a non-tither, believe that's under the law, I give what God puts on my heart. But it just never sits right with me when I hear almost every preacher, expecially ones I actually like 90% of the time ruin it with this talk, it just turns me off. I used to tithe and it never felt right. I stopped tithing and now make 150,000$ per year, go figure...LOL. I have more to give now than I ever had and God is blessing the business I run. But it just seems that everybody who falls for this is broke and don't really know better, it seems they are always looking for a "Breakthrough" instead of just loving God. I don't know man... I'm just rambling...

probinson · Aug 19, 2005

I am a tither and I give offerings as God directs me above and beyond my tithe. I don't believe tithing was done away with, but there's a whole other thread to debate that. Just stating it so you know where I stand.

I've seen good times. I've seen bad times. I've been in abundance. I've been in lack. In almost every circumstance where I was in lack, it was because of my own stupidity, because I was not a good steward with my money. That's not something I can blame on God. That's my own fault.

But this is what I remember in those times:

James 1
2Consider it pure joy, my brothers, whenever you face trials of many kinds, 3because you know that the testing of your faith develops perseverance.4Perseverance must finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything.

Despite the fact that I sometimes need that "breakthrough", I never forget to be thankful to God for what He has already done for me. I would agree that many people use tithing and giving as a way to just get that hundredfold return for their own personal gain. Those are wrong motives, and God knows the heart of the giver. I give because I love God and I want to see His kingdom grow. God blesses me because of it, and then I have even more to give. Have I personally seen a hundredfold return? No, but that doesn't mean I can't. I like what the message bible says instead of hundredfold return. It says, "Some fell on good earth, and produced a harvest beyond his wildest dreams."

Andrew · Aug 19, 2005

RB4580 said:
Is getting a 100 fold return on your money biblical? I listen to Mike Murdock and enjoy his "wisdom" teachings but it just throws me off when he talks about money the way he does. Am I just being to sensitive to this?

Of course the principle comes from the Bible.

Matthew 19:29
And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life.

In Luke I think the same verse says "receive now in THIS LIFE" not when you die and go to heaven.

So it is a Godly principle, but the question is how it is applied and for what motives.

Jimmy West · Aug 19, 2005

RB4580 said:
Yes it does. Like I said, I just wanted to know if it's biblical. I'm a non-tither, believe that's under the law, I give what God puts on my heart. But it just never sits right with me when I hear almost every preacher, expecially ones I actually like 90% of the time ruin it with this talk, it just turns me off. I used to tithe and it never felt right. I stopped tithing and now make 150,000$ per year, go figure...LOL. I have more to give now than I ever had and God is blessing the business I run. But it just seems that everybody who falls for this is broke and don't really know better, it seems they are always looking for a "Breakthrough" instead of just loving God. I don't know man... I'm just rambling...

You are a non-tither? Who supports that church you attend? I guess you let everyone else take care of that. Think about that.

RB4580 · Aug 19, 2005

Jimmy West said:
You are a non-tither? Who supports that church you attend? I guess you let everyone else take care of that. Think about that.

You don't have to tithe for a church to be taken care of. That's just sad. If people gave what God put ont their heart like it says in the new testament it wouldn't be such a debate or problem. I believe the last stats were something like 3% of Christians actually tithe, and... The churches are still runnin' and gunnin' aren't they? These Pastors are still flying in their private jets to make sure they are at the next "conference" right? Tithing isn't the problem and it's not the solution. 95% of money issues are how we as a people educate ourselves about it, use it, etc. To many people use God as a copout with their finances. It's just plain lazy what I hear sometimes... "Well I'm waiting on God". "God blessed me with a new car".... REALLY? God blessed you with a new car with car PAYMENTS!!! God never used debt to bless people. It's just funny to me I guess....

Andrew · Aug 19, 2005

Tithing isn't the problem and it's not the solution. 95% of money issues are how we as a people educate ourselves about it, use it, etc.

If Christians would learn to tithe , they would have less money and financial problems. Tithing means God comes first where money is concerned. It means getting your priorities right. It helps mature the Christian in terms of how he manages and uses money.

Tithing also sanctifies your 90%. It's the principle of the firstfruits in the Bible. If the 10% is holy (set apart to the Lord) , God makes the rest 90% holy.

RB4580 · Aug 19, 2005

Andrew said:
If Christians would learn to tithe , they would have less money and financial problems. Tithing means God comes first where money is concerned. It means getting your priorities right. It helps mature the Christian in terms of how he manages and uses money.

Tithing also sanctifies your 90%. It's the principle of the firstfruits in the Bible. If the 10% is holy (set apart to the Lord) , God makes the rest 90% holy.

I respect your opinion but it makes no sense. I know people who have been tithing for YEARS and yet they still have debt, not much in the bank, etc. Hmmm, santified huh?

Think about your statement, you said tithing helps you in the way you manage and use your money, no it does not. Has nothing to do with it, there are alot of ignorant tithers when it comes to handling money. God isn't going to wave a magic wand and BOOM your better with money because you are giving me 10 percent. Cmon now...

Andrew · Aug 20, 2005

Works for me and many others.

So i guess we can't use testimonies. Boils down to the Word again. Boils down to your 'right' interpretaion vs my 'right' interpretation doesnt it.

holo · Aug 20, 2005

I don't "tithe" but I share. I give, not in order to recieve anything from God, but because He gives me more than I need. It's pretty simple. We give because He gave us first. Only a lot of us think that He gives us because we offered Him something. They're just missing the rhythm with half a beat IMO.

New_Wineskin · Aug 20, 2005

Jimmy West said:
You are a non-tither? Who supports that church you attend? I guess you let everyone else take care of that. Think about that.

Do you think a "church" *needs* to be "supported" financially ? If so , how did they get into that position ? Why do people allow their groups to be money-pits that avert funds that could be given to those in need ? Those are things that one may think about , as well .

Strong in Him · Aug 20, 2005

Jimmy West said:
You are a non-tither? Who supports that church you attend? I guess you let everyone else take care of that. Think about that.

This poster said that they didn't tithe - not that they didn't give. Big difference.

I don't know what I think about tithing. I must admit that I give away about 1/10 of the money I get in benefits, because I've always been taught that that's the amount Christians "should" give. But even if that amount dropped, there are other things I do which I also consider to be part of my tithing. For example, when I designed a prayer card for our local hospital, I paid to have it printed, and if they require more copies, I will do so again. I do spend a lot of money on craft materials, but with most of them I make greetings cards which I give to charities so that they can sell them and make money. I don't make any money from them myself. I think it was Jennifer Rees-Larcombe who said that she used some of her tithing money to feed and offer hospitality to others. Or buy flowers to say that she cared.

R.T Kendall says that he considers that the whole of a person's tithe should be given to the church, and a Christian should give what they can, over and above that amount, to other causes. He did quote a verse in support of that, but I don't know which one. If this is a definition of tithing; giving 1/10 of your income to the church, then I don't do it.

Strong in Him · Aug 20, 2005

PS With regards to the OP: if this is how God blesses, then this is how God blesses. But I wouldn't say "well I need £1000, and so I need to give £10 to God to make sure that I get that." I think that if God knows one of his children is desperate for £1000, he is well able to meet that need. If he blesses above that need, then we should ask him what he wants us to do with the rest.

(Just thought - I've changed my outfit, I should now be writing in red. )

IAmTheClay · Aug 20, 2005

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the tithe "origianlly" was meant to care for the priests and the Levites who did not sow or reap, and used as a storehouse for the "whole" congregation during lean times. As such, the modern idea of tithing is so far removed from the original concept it is so sad. I have yet to see a "church" take care of the needy in it's own congregation on the tithes it takes in, let alone the needy within it's own neighborhood. As such, I feel it's best if one is going to give, give to those in true need within your reach.

JimB · Aug 20, 2005

Andrew said:
If Christians would learn to tithe , they would have less money and financial problems. Tithing means God comes first where money is concerned. It means getting your priorities right. It helps mature the Christian in terms of how he manages and uses money.
*****

Not true, Andrew. This is an, um, unrealistic benefit of tithing. Some of the best financial managers I know do not tithe and some of the worst financial managers I know tithe.

In fact, some of the wealthiest people I know do not tithe and some of the poorest tithe.

IMO, we should never give to get. Thats self-centered and greedy. Giving to the work of God should come from a generous heart brimming with the love of God and compassionate of the needs of others. Giving should not be looked at as a some sort of personal financial investment from which we expect personal gain. Thats what Wall Street is for; not the Kingdom of God. The Kingdom of God is not a corporation and the offering plate is not where you buy stock.

We give because we love (see John 3.16) not because we want some sort of personal benefit from our gift. IMO, thats works-based/formula-driven Christianity that seeks only my own benefit and not others. Love is always outward-directed, never inward.

Love does not seek its own (1 Cor. 13.5).

I also try to please all people in all things, not seeking my own profit, but the profit of many, (1 Cor. 10.33).

~Jim

ForgivenToo · Aug 20, 2005

Tithing isn't for the church, the offering that the church takes goes to the church and the expenses of the church. Tithing is for your pastor, the one that provides a service for you. The one that answers the phone at 2 am when you have a problem, the one that listens to you and offers guidance like a couselor, but without the $80 an hour fee. Tithing is to support your pastor, who has no other job besides this.

Is it fair to let your pastor go thru life unpaid for the multitude of services they perform?

What if you went to work everyday and when payday came around they decided that they didnt' want to pay you for your services?

mortsmune · Aug 20, 2005

Here is what Jesus said is necessary for the hundredfold blessing:

Mat 19:29-30: And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life. But many that are first shall be last; and the last shall be first.

Mar 10:29-30: And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's, But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.

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