Sabbath keeping

EJ M said:

Hello,
Do you believe all scripture is inspired by God and is profitable for doctrine………….?
To include Paul’s writings?
see my post above for an answer to your question, do I follow the commandments.

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yes, and I am glad you follow the commandment.

Blessings

SabbathBlessings said:

Strange- you open to say you are not arguing against Sabbath-keeping but then go on with human arguments against Sabbath-keeping.

Then try to make the argument if you turn on a light switch that's breaking the Sabbath which is a legalistic approach to Sabbath keeping, we can't compare turning on a light switch to kindling a fire which takes hours and a lot of work. The Sabbath is about honoring God and having communion with God on the day God set aside sanctified and blessed for holy use. When keeping it shows God is our Authority Eze 20:20 and its a remembrance of how we got here and where we came from as it takes us back to Creation Exo 20:8-11 Gen 2:1-3

I don't think one can reason with this type of thinking, I have tried in the past, so will leave it as agree to disagree and all will get sorted out soon enough.

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Hi again
Point out what isn’t true in my reply. If insisting on keeping the Sabbath is not legalism but insisting it be kept according to God’s word is. Is this not a double standard?
James writes a double minded man is unstable in all his ways, let not that man think he shall obtain anything from the Lord. Remember, I do not argue against Sabbath keeping, I only point out the hypocrisy of judging and condemning others for not keeping the Sabbath and then not keeping it either. And judging and condemning others (the Pope among others) for changing the laws of God and doing the same. If you feel it’s important to keep the Sabbath, by all means keep it, however I worry changing the commandment to suit yourself (kindling a fire in a lightbulb or in a car) and call others legalists who believe keeping the Sabbath as God commanded is hypocrisy. God will not condemn any for keeping His commandments. If to keep it excactly as God commanded, to do otherwise isn’t keeping the Sabbath. And I worry about the fruit of judgment on others and doing the same.

JesusFollowerForever said:

Jesus did not change the Sabbath or set a different time for it. Instead, He clarified and magnified the commandments, explaining their true meaning. The Pharisees and Sadducees had added many rules and made the law burdensome, but Jesus taught that the commandments are fundamentally based on love—first and foremost for God, and then for our neighbors.

Jesus came to guide us onto the proper path, and He emphasized that He did not abolish the law. The proof is found in the scriptures. We see that Jesus observed the Sabbath both before and after His resurrection, as did the apostles. There is no text indicating that the commandments or the Sabbath are no longer applicable.

Blessings

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Hi JesusFollowerForever, nice to meet you

Regarding the time of the Sabbath,
does the Sabbath in the USA start before or after the one in Jerusalem?
The Sabbath in the Philippines? Before or after Jerusalem?

Do those who observe a Seventh-Day Sabbath have an answer that comes from the scriptures? The International date line is a man-made thing, I hope we can all agree

Blessings!

EJ M said:

Hi again
Point out what isn’t true in my reply. If insisting on keeping the Sabbath is not legalism but insisting it be kept according to God’s word is. Is this not a double standard?

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Obedience to God is not legalism its love.

showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments. Exodus 20:6

For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments 1 John 5:3

If you love Me, keep My commandments John 14:15

If you are a parent, do you not have rules for your children out of love because you know what's best for them? So does God. He is a God of love but He is also a King and a King has rules, God gave us His rules written by His own finger Exo 31:18 Exo 32:16, they are not meant to be burdensome 1 John 5:3, but meant because He knows what is best for us. If one thinks having communion with God by keeping His Sabbath by resting in Him is legalisms may need to re-think their relationship with God.

HIM said:

God is not unclear as some purport. We are called to cease by the very word Sabbath. And the rest of the commandment tell us what we are to cease from. We are to cease from all our occupation, and unbeknownst to some, that includes religious. That is why Jesus said that ministers were breaking the Sabbath but were guiltless. Some of us have things that the Lord has directed us to do also on the Sabbath. But some of us sadly are doing ministerial work also on the Sabbath because we want to and or think it is right. We will not judge that; it is an issue though.

There are things that are needful. But Most things unless directed from the Lord can be done the other six days. By doing things that can be put off we are not resting as we should on the 7th day. The day that He sanctified, set apart for such.

Sin is an issue every day. But the most important part of the command is to keep it Holy. Do not defile it. This we do by not bringing sin into the day by our actions. The only way to do that is through God and His Spirit. So it helps to do religious activities that keep us centered. Pray and praise in fellowship with likeminded people through Him is seen throughout Scripture. The fact we are to not work also helps in this. Because sometimes somethings come up while we are working that bring out our fleshly nature and sin comes knocking. This also happens in ministerial work. So we need to be careful.

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Don’t purchase electricity either. Throw your power main off. Most Sabbath Keepers purchase electricity and use it on Sabbath causing others to work on that day to provide it. I hope you do not.

Leaf473 said:

Hi JesusFollowerForever, nice to meet you

Regarding the time of the Sabbath,
does the Sabbath in the USA start before or after the one in Jerusalem?
The Sabbath in the Philippines? Before or after Jerusalem?

Do those who observe a Seventh-Day Sabbath have an answer that comes from the scriptures? The International date line is a man-made thing, I hope we can all agree

Blessings!

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No, the international dateline was put where it is by man for good reasons but what necessitates its existence is God’s work in creating the earth, sun and time. If we did not account for the gaining or losing of hours in global travel we’d all be on different days.

JesusFollowerForever said:

Sabbaths in plural! Many other sabbaths were part of the mosaic law. The sabbath command number 4 in the 10 Commandment sis different. Please do not confuse them.

Sabbath Year (Shemittah) - Every seventh year, the land rests.
Year of Jubilee (Yovel) - Every fiftieth year, land returns to its original owner and servants are freed.
Sabbath of Weeks (Shavuot) - A one-day festival, 50 days after Passover.
Sabbath of Trumpets (Rosh Hashanah) - The first day of the seventh month, marked by trumpet blasts.
Day of Atonement (Yom Kippur) - A solemn day of fasting and atonement, on the tenth day of the seventh month.
Feast of Tabernacles (Sukkot) - A seven-day festival starting on the fifteenth day of the seventh month, with an additional eighth day.

Each of these observances reflects various aspects of religious life, land management, and communal restoration in ancient Israel.

Blessings

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And I believe that Col 2:16 is a good answer as the Paul says in 2 Cor 3:13- 14 that the Law of Moses has been set aside .

Acts 28:25-28 , why Israel and its LAW was set aside , and Isa 6:1-18 and more than these >

Unless you believe that the Law of Moses is still in operation ?

dan p

Mercy Shown said:

No, the international dateline was put where it is by man for good reasons but what necessitates its existence is God’s work in creating the earth, sun and time. If we did not account for the gaining or losing of hours in global travel we’d all be on different days.

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That's what I was getting at, I think

If one wishes to observe a seventh day Sabbath, using just the scriptures and nothing man-made,
there isn't a way to say if
the Sabbath in the USA starts before or after the one in Jerusalem.

Good to hear from you

Leaf473 said:

Hi JesusFollowerForever, nice to meet you

Regarding the time of the Sabbath,
does the Sabbath in the USA start before or after the one in Jerusalem?
The Sabbath in the Philippines? Before or after Jerusalem?

Do those who observe a Seventh-Day Sabbath have an answer that comes from the scriptures? The International date line is a man-made thing, I hope we can all agree

Blessings!

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Nice to meet you too leaf, to answer your question, In the Bible, the Sabbath is observed from sunset on the sixth day (Friday) to sunset on the seventh day (Saturday). This timing is based on the creation account and Jewish tradition, where a day begins and ends at sunset rather than at midnight.
Here are some verses related to the Sabbath:

Genesis 1:5 (KJV): "And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day." This verse establishes the pattern of a day beginning in the evening.

Exodus 20:8-10 (KJV): "Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:" This commandment emphasizes the Sabbath as a day of rest, starting on the seventh day of the week.

Leviticus 23:32 (KJV): "It shall be unto you a sabbath of rest, and ye shall afflict your souls: in the ninth day of the month at even, from even unto even, shall ye celebrate your sabbath." This verse specifies that the Sabbath begins at sundown and ends at the next sundown.

Regarding people living in different hemispheres or time zones, the Bible does not address modern concepts of time zones or hemispheres. The biblical Sabbath observance is rooted in the tradition of sunset to sunset, which was practical for the cultures of the time. In a global context, individuals generally adapt the timing of Sabbath observance to their local sunset times, aiming to honor the principle of rest and worship on the designated day according to their geographic location.

Peace.

Dan Perez said:

And I believe that Col 2:16 is a good answer as the Paul says in 2 Cor 3:13- 14 that the Law of Moses has been set aside .

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In the context of the Old Testament, the Law of Moses is different from the 10 commandments written by the hand (Finger) of GOD! they were placed inside the ark of the covenant, the 10 Commandments also refered to as the Moral Law IS IN EFFECT THE COVENANT! The rest of the Law written by Moses was Placed outside the Ark of the Covenant can be understood through several passages and explanations:
Placement of the Law:
Deuteronomy 31:26 (KJV): "Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee."
This verse indicates that the Law, written in a book, was placed beside the Ark of the Covenant rather than inside it. The Ark itself contained the two stone tablets with the Ten Commandments.

Purpose of the Law Outside the Ark:
The Law placed beside the Ark served as a witness against the Israelites. The Ark housed the tablets as a sign of the covenant between God and Israel, while the written Law was a detailed guide and testimony of their responsibilities.

Significance of the Ark’s Contents:
Exodus 25:21 (KJV): "And thou shalt put the mercy seat above upon the ark; and in the ark thou shalt put the testimony that I shall give thee."
This verse describes that the Ark was to contain the "testimony" or the tablets of the Ten Commandments. The tablets were considered the core expression of the covenant, reflecting God's moral law.


The placement of the Law outside the Ark symbolized the fact that while the Ten Commandments were central to the covenant, the written law also had an important, though distinct, role. The Law beside the Ark served as a continual reminder and witness to the covenant’s requirements. Many of these requirements can no longer be applied today.

Dan Perez said:

Acts 28:25-28 , why Israel and its LAW was set aside , and Isa 6:1-18 and more than these >

Unless you believe that the Law of Moses is still in operation ?

dan p

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No, the Law of Moses most of it anyways cannot be in operation today for many reasons. But the covenant defined by the 10 Commandments or Moral laws is still Binding and will never change;

Rev 11:19 Then God's temple in heaven was opened, and the ark of his covenant was seen within his temple. There were flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder, an earthquake, and heavy hail.

Blessings.

JesusFollowerForever said:

Claire, The sabbath is not only about work here is what the word of God given to us says;

Exodus 31:12-17, Exodus 31:12-17 (KJV): 12. And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, 13. Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the Lord that doth sanctify you. 14. Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. 15. Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death. 16. Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant. 17. It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.​

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Ex 35:2-3 - "For six days, work is to be done, but the seventh day shall be your holy ("set apart," from work) day, a Sabbath of rest to the Lord. Whoever does any work on it must be put to death." (See Nu 15:32-36.)

Dt 5:14 - ". . .the seventh day is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter nor your manservant or maidservant, nor your ox, your donkey or any of your animals, nor the alien within your gates. so that your manservant and maidservant may rest as you do."

Jer 17:21-22 - ". . .be careful not to carry a load on the Sabbath day or bring it into the gates of Jerusalem. Do not bring a load out of your houses or do any work on the Sabbath, but keep the Sabbath day holy (set apart, from work), as I commanded your forefathers."

Jer 17:27 - If you do not obey me to keep the Sabbath day holy (set apart, from work) by not carrying any load as you come through the gates of Jerusalem on the Sabbath day, then I will kindle an unquenchable fire in the gates of Jerusalem that will consume her fortresses.

I enter God's own full-time NT Sabbath rest in Jesus Christ (of which the OT Sabbath rest was a pre-figure) where I rest full-time from my own work to save and in his work which saves.

This:

Clare73 said:

I enter God's full-time NT Sabbath rest in Jesus Christ (of which he OT Sabbath rest was a pre-figure) where I rest full-time from my own work to save and in his work which saves.

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Does not match what these scriptures say

Clare73 said:

Ex 35:2-3 - "For six days, work is to be done, but the seventh day shall be your holy ("set apart," from work) day, a Sabbath of rest to the Lord. Whoever does any work on it must be put to death." (See Nu 15:32-36.)

Dt 5:14 - ". . .the seventh day is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter nor your manservant or maidservant, nor your ox, your donkey or any of your animals, nor the alien within your gates. so that your manservant and maidservant may rest as you do."

Jer 17:21-22 - ". . .be careful not to carry a load on the Sabbath day or bring it into the gates of Jerusalem. Do not bring a load out of your houses or do any work on the Sabbath, but keep the Sabbath day holy (set apart, from work), as I commanded your forefathers."

Jer 17:27 - If you do not obey me to keep the Sabbath day holy (set apart, from work) by not carrying any load as you come through the gates of Jerusalem on the Sabbath day, then I will kindle an unquenchable fire in the gates of Jerusalem that will consume her fortresses.

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God defined when is the Sabbath

Exo 20:10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord.

The Sabbath is not everyday, but the seventh day as God stated- written and spoken so clearly. Best to allow God to be God and for us to be His humble servant living by His every Word, not changing even a stoke of a pen, because we are not God.

Jesus indicated the Sabbath would be kept long after His death Mat 24:20 not once mentioning that He became the Sabbath or the Sabbath is daily, which makes NT scripture on the Sabbath not make any sense, why we are told not to make changes to God’s Word.. Always best not to add what’s not there especially when it’s something God personally wrote and personally spoke and is kept under His mercy seat that is revealed in heaven. Rev 11:19 as our ways are not His ways. There is no greater Authority than God. It’s why the Sabbath in the NT is still according to the commandment for God’s faithful Luke 23:56

SabbathBlessings said:

This:

Does not match what these scriptures say

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As your practice does not match what Lev 1:3-5 say. . .

Clare73 said:

As your practice does not match what Lev 1:3-5 say. . .

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Sure it does, I follow Hebrews 10:1-22. There would be no need for animal sacrifices, when Jesus became our Sacrificial Lamb for sin 1 Cor 5:7 Sin is still breaking God’s law, even in the NT 1 John 3:4 Rom 7:7 Mat 5:19-30 James 2:10-12 but instead of bringing an animal sacrifice to a human priest Jesus us our High Priest and we can go directly to Him when we sin (break God’s law) and His blood will cleanse of all sin and unrighteousness when we repent and confess 1 John 1:9 , which means a change of heart and direction. Pro 28:13 John 8:11

SabbathBlessings said:

Sure it does, I follow Hebrews 10:1-22.

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As I follow Heb 4:8-11.

Clare73 said:

As I follow Heb 4:8-11.

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But there is no scripture that says the Sabbath is daily in Heb 4:8-11.

The author of Hebrews has no authority to change God’s commandments, nor would they.

I hope and pray one day you will consider who really has the authority in the scriptures, the apostles were servants of Jesus and God- Jesus has all Authority Mat 28:18-20 and He said not a jot or tittle can pass from His law Mat 5:18-19, because we are not God and our ways are not His ways. There is no thus saith the Lord, that we can profane the seventh day Sabbath in lieu of some other idea. We have been through this before, so will leave it as agree to disagree and all will get sorted out soon enough.

Speaking of the Sabbath- Happy Sabbath @HIM @JesusFollowerForever @Freth @eleos1954 @BobRyan and to all- Hope you all have a very blessed Sabbath!

JesusFollowerForever said:

In the context of the Old Testament, the Law of Moses is different from the 10 commandments written by the hand of GOD! they were place inside the ark of the covenant, the 10 Commandments also referes to as the Moral Law IS IN EFFECT THE COVENANT! The rest of the Law written by Moses was Placed outside the Ark of the Covenant can be understood through several passages and explanations:
Placement of the Law:
Deuteronomy 31:26 (KJV): "Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee."
This verse indicates that the Law, written in a book, was placed beside the Ark of the Covenant rather than inside it. The Ark itself contained the two stone tablets with the Ten Commandments.

Purpose of the Law Outside the Ark:
The Law placed beside the Ark served as a witness against the Israelites. The Ark housed the tablets as a sign of the covenant between God and Israel, while the written Law was a detailed guide and testimony of their responsibilities.

Significance of the Ark’s Contents:
Exodus 25:21 (KJV): "And thou shalt put the mercy seat above upon the ark; and in the ark thou shalt put the testimony that I shall give thee."
This verse describes that the Ark was to contain the "testimony" or the tablets of the Ten Commandments. The tablets were considered the core expression of the covenant, reflecting God's moral law.


The placement of the Law outside the Ark symbolized the fact that while the Ten Commandments were central to the covenant, the written law also had an important, though distinct, role. The Law beside the Ark served as a continual reminder and witness to the covenant’s requirements. Many of these requirements can no longer be applied today.



No, the Law of Moses most of it anyways cannot be in operation today for many reasons. But the covenant defined by the 10 Commandments or Moral laws is still Binding and will never change;

Rev 11:19 Then God's temple in heaven was opened, and the ark of his covenant was seen within his temple. There were flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder, an earthquake, and heavy hail.

Blessings.

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Do you see any difference between the OLD COVENANT and the NEW COVENANT ??

dan p

Clare73 said:

As your practice does not match what Lev 1:3-5 say. . .

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1. There is no animal sacrifice in the Sabbath commandment - Ex 20:8-11
2. There is no animal sacrifice in Gen 2:2-3 when the Sabbath was made a holy day - according to the Sabbath commandment Ex 20:11
3. There will be no animal sacrifice for all eternity in the New Earth when "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall all mankind come before Me to worship" Is 66:23
(and no animal sacrifice mentioned even in Lev 23:3-4 for the weekly Sabbath)

JesusFollowerForever said:

In the context of the Old Testament, the Law of Moses is different from the 10 commandments written by the hand of GOD! they were place inside the ark of the covenant, the 10 Commandments also referes to as the Moral Law IS IN EFFECT THE COVENANT! The rest of the Law written by Moses was Placed outside the Ark of the Covenant can be understood through several passages and explanations:
Placement of the Law:
Deuteronomy 31:26 (KJV): "Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee."
This verse indicates that the Law, written in a book, was placed beside the Ark of the Covenant rather than inside it. The Ark itself contained the two stone tablets with the Ten Commandments.

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And of course Deut 5:22 says God spoke the TEN -- and "added no more".

Both Moses in Deut 5:22 and Paul in Eph 6:1-2 make the case that the TEN as a unit are of special interest for mankind.

No wonder almost every Christian denomination on Earth affirms the continued *"unit of TEN" for Christians today

[*]The Baptist Confession of Faith section 19
[*]The Westminster Confession of Faith section 19
[*]Voddie Baucham
[*]C.H. Spurgeon
[*]D.L. Moody
[*]Dies Domini by Pope John Paul II
[*]D. James Kennedy
[*]R.C. Sproul
[*]many others as well..