Only Three Are Tormented Eternally

[Mr. M]

Revelation Twenty:

10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire

and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are.

And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

[note: not second death]

Revelation Twenty-One:

7 He who overcomes shall inherit all things,

and I will be his God and he shall be My son.

8 But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers,

sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars

shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire

and brimstone, which is the second death.

The Second Death is Death not torment Duh!

ECT for the unsaved is a cruel lie against the Lord,

and such who hold this belief are anathema, deceived

by a vain attempt to "scare sinners straight" by telling

them they will spend an eternity in fiery torment.

Salvation is received one way, in Love. You can drop the

scare tactics, show them the Love of the Father.

 

[Hoping2]

Revelation Twenty:

10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire

and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are.

And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

[note: not second death]

Revelation Twenty-One:

7 He who overcomes shall inherit all things,

and I will be his God and he shall be My son.

8 But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers,

sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars

shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire

and brimstone, which is the second death.

The Second Death is Death not torment Duh!

ECT for the unsaved is a cruel lie against the Lord,

and such who hold this belief are anathema, deceived

by a vain attempt to "scare sinners straight" by telling

them they will spend an eternity in fiery torment.

Salvation is received one way, in Love. You can drop the

scare tactics, show them the Love of the Father.

I'll stick with Jesus' POV on this one.
It is written..."Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal." (Matt 25:45-46)

 

[Mr. M]

everlasting punishment

POV is yours. Everlasting punishment is NOT eternal torment. It is a judgment that is final and without recourse.
This is made clear in the OP. Why not respond to the post, rather than change the subject.

shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire

and brimstone, which is the second death.

Their part in the lake of fire is death, not torment. Finito.
You are changing the wording in Revelation 21 to meet a false doctrine.
If you want to go out and try to scare sinners with those threats, good luck.
The Gospel is about Love, Not fear of torment.

The Second Death is Death not torment Duh!

ECT for the unsaved is a cruel lie against the Lord,

and such who hold this belief are anathema, deceived

by a vain attempt to "scare sinners straight" by telling

them they will spend an eternity in fiery torment.

Salvation is received one way, in Love. You can drop the

scare tactics, show them the Love of the Father.

 

[Hoping2]

POV is yours. Everlasting punishment is NOT eternal torment. It is a judgment that is final and without recourse.
This is made clear in the OP. Why not respond to the post, rather than change the subject.

Their part in the lake of fire is death, not torment. Finito.
You are changing the wording in Revelation 21 to meet a false doctrine.
If you want to go out and try to scare sinners with those threats, good luck.
The Gospel is about Love, Not fear of torment.

I do not agree with your minimalization of sin's repercussions.

 

[Mr. M]

I do not agree with your minimalization of sin's repercussions.

Last I read, Jesus died for the sin of the whole world. Nothing needs to be minimized.
The second death is not torment. Nowhere is this stated. Only 3 are tormented forever.
"they have their portion in the lake of fire"=second death, not torment.
I do not agree with your interpretation of the Divine Attributes.

Psalm 116:5 Gracious is the LORD, and righteous; yea, our God is merciful.

 

[Mr. M]

I do not agree with your minimalization of sin's repercussions.

It is important for everyone to understand the error of this statement.
John 3:18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Those not found in the Lamb's Book of Life suffer the second death not because of sin, but unbelief.

 

[Ivan Hlavanda]

The universal punishment for all who reject Jesus Christ as Savior is to be “thrown into the lake of fire” Revelation 20:15.

The Bible speaks of hell as a place of “outer darkness” where there will be “weeping and gnashing of teeth”

Sinners suffering in hell for eternity is just. God is love and therefore must punish all evil. Those who reject Christ will pay for their sins for eternity.

This is not some scare tactic. This is reality. There is no good news without the bad news. The bad news is we are in debt to God for our sins and deserve His wrarh. The good news is that God provided a Saviour.

How many in Bible started their speech with 'God loves you'? The word 'wrath' in the Bible is mentioned much much more than the word 'love'. I wonder why....

Btw, no one talked more about hell than Jesus. When you see a shark approaching swimmers you do not shout 'please, come out of water' but you shout 'shark'. It's not to scare people, it's to warn them of the impending doom.

 

[trophy33]

Sinners suffering in hell for eternity is just. God is love and therefore must punish all evil.

Are you able to explain why torturing is just and why God who is love must torture living beings (not some hypothetical "evil", but real beings you meet in the shopping mall or in a work place), even for eternity?

 

[Mr. M]

Sinners suffering in hell for eternity is just. God is love and therefore must punish all evil. Those who reject Christ will pay for their sins for eternity.

The second death is not torment. Nowhere is this stated. Only 3 are tormented forever.
"they have their portion in the lake of fire"=second death, not torment.
I do not agree with your interpretation of the Divine Attributes.

Psalm 116:5 Gracious is the LORD, and righteous; yea, our God is merciful.

Only 3 are clearly stated to endure eternal torment.
"Eternal punishment" means there is no sentencing.
No 30 years with chance for parole.
The eternal punishment of the unsaved is clearly defined as "the second death". Not torment.
They get death. The Saints will receive life eternal.
You may want to study how God the Father feels about the oppressed, the persecuted, the widow the orphan. He has promised them justice. Subsistence farmers across Asia, Africa, and S. America etc...are just trying to survive in this world and have no place among the wicked. This is a grave error to not understand that the calling of the Savior's Elect are to serve the Gospel, not get a golden ticket.

The universal punishment for all who reject Jesus Christ as Savior is to be “thrown into the lake of fire” Revelation 20:15.

The Bible speaks of hell as a place of “outer darkness” where there will be “weeping and gnashing of teeth”

Are you saying that these two are the same thing, or are you just throwing a few quotes out there. No offense intended, just wondering how to get from your point #1 to point #2.

 

[Burbank Rob]

Revelation Twenty:

10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire

and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are.

And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

[note: not second death]

Revelation Twenty-One:

7 He who overcomes shall inherit all things,

and I will be his God and he shall be My son.

8 But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers,

sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars

shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire

and brimstone, which is the second death.

The Second Death is Death not torment Duh!

ECT for the unsaved is a cruel lie against the Lord,

and such who hold this belief are anathema, deceived

by a vain attempt to "scare sinners straight" by telling

them they will spend an eternity in fiery torment.

Salvation is received one way, in Love. You can drop the

scare tactics, show them the Love of the Father.

I agree. God is merciful, and He will give eternal life to those who trust in Jesus for salvation. If a person rejects the free gift, they will be brought to and end. God will not perform some kind of gruesome miracle to keep people writhing in torment forever. He is the Lord of Life. "Say to them: ‘As I live,’ says the Lord God, ‘I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live. Turn, turn from your evil ways! For why should you die, O house of Israel?’"

 

[Hoping2]

Last I read, Jesus died for the sin of the whole world.

And still, so many reject His offering on their behalf.

Nothing needs to be minimized.
The second death is not torment. Nowhere is this stated.

Neither is it stated that the haters of God will just go "poof", and be gone.

Only 3 are tormented forever.
"they have their portion in the lake of fire"=second death, not torment.
I do not agree with your interpretation of the Divine Attributes.
Psalm 116:5 Gracious is the LORD, and righteous; yea, our God is merciful.

I don't think that Jesus was citing an untruth when He made up the parable of Lazarus and the rich man, in Luke 16.

 

[Jeff Saunders]

I'll stick with Jesus' POV on this one.
It is written..."Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal." (Matt 25:45-46)

Look into the actual Greek words here kolasin aionion ( in English everlasting punishment ) the work kolasin is a punishment unto correction, not timoreo which is vengeance or vindictive , kolasin was a term used for pruning a vine to make it produce more fruit, cutting away that which does not produce fruit.
Aionios is " pertaining to the age or age enduring"
The true meaning is the punishment to cut away the dross and it lasts till the age or unto the age, it has a beginning and an end.
Life eternal in Greek is zoen aionios , which means life of the age or pertaining to the age.
Because that life is only in Jesus and he is eternal so will be the life of all who follow Jesus, life throughout all the ages, it has no end.

 

[Hoping2]

It is important for everyone to understand the error of this statement.
John 3:18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Those not found in the Lamb's Book of Life suffer the second death not because of sin, but unbelief.

Unbelief fosters sin.
Unbelief genders sin.
Unbelief gives birth to sin.

 

[Hoping2]

Look into the actual Greek words here kolasin aionion ( in English everlasting punishment ) the work kolasin is a punishment unto correction, not timoreo which is vengeance or vindictive , kolasin was a term used for pruning a vine to make it produce more fruit, cutting away that which does not produce fruit.
Aionios is " pertaining to the age or age enduring"
The true meaning is the punishment to cut away the dross and it lasts till the age or unto the age, it has a beginning and an end.
Life eternal in Greek is zoen aionios , which means life of the age or pertaining to the age.
Because that life is only in Jesus and he is eternal so will be the life of all who follow Jesus, life throughout all the ages, it has no end.

Everlasting, means eternal to me.

 

[Jeff Saunders]

The universal punishment for all who reject Jesus Christ as Savior is to be “thrown into the lake of fire” Revelation 20:15.

The Bible speaks of hell as a place of “outer darkness” where there will be “weeping and gnashing of teeth”

Sinners suffering in hell for eternity is just. God is love and therefore must punish all evil. Those who reject Christ will pay for their sins for eternity.

This is not some scare tactic. This is reality. There is no good news without the bad news. The bad news is we are in debt to God for our sins and deserve His wrarh. The good news is that God provided a Saviour.

How many in Bible started their speech with 'God loves you'? The word 'wrath' in the Bible is mentioned much much more than the word 'love'. I wonder why....

Btw, no one talked more about hell than Jesus. When you see a shark approaching swimmers you do not shout 'please, come out of water' but you shout 'shark'. It's not to scare people, it's to warn them of the impending doom.

How is " sinners suffering in hell for eternity just" not just one more lie from satan to make God out to be a monster and not the loving God that he is? God hates unjust measurements, one of the very things he said he specifically hates, and yet you say that to punish eternally for a mortal finite sin is justified? No, Gods judgments are fair and loving and he correct by removing all that is not of him, some have more some have less, but no person deserves or will get eternal punishment, that's just not Gods character or nature. Lamentations 3:31-33 For the Lord will not reject us forever, though he causes grief, he then has compassion on us according to the abundance of his loyal kindness, for hi is not predisposed to afflict or to grieve people.

 

[Jeff Saunders]

Everlasting, means eternal to me.

That's fine but it didn't to the Greek speakers when the books were written. That was from the bad translation into Latin which Augustine enforced with the possibility of banishment or death, and that's why its been propagated till this very day in most but not all English translations of scripture.

 

[Hoping2]

That's fine but it didn't to the Greek speakers when the books were written. That was from the bad translation into Latin which Augustine enforced with the possibility of banishment or death, and that's why its been propagated till this very day in most but not all English translations of scripture.

All that POV accomplishes, is to give hope to the wicked.

 

[Jeff Saunders]

All that POV accomplishes, is to give hope to the wicked.

Why should they not have hope Jesus died so that they can be reconciled back to God. Is this not what the Gospel is about our hope in Jesus, unless you think he failed in his mission of being the savior of the world. do these verses give false hope tp the wicked? Phil 2:10-11 Every knee will bow and every tongue will confess( the Greek word Exomologeo means to acknowledge, openly and joyfully, to celebrate, to give praise without reservations,) The very thing all must do to get to the Father.
1 Tim 4:9-11 Because we trust in the living God, who is the savior of all men, especially of those who believe.
Do you think that these and many more like them give hope to those who you deem whicked? I hope so because God is the God of hope and love and in him there is no darkness.

 

[lismore]

Revelation 14:9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,

10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

God Bless

 

[Mr. M]

11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

Thank you lismore for citing this passage. I would note that this pertains to the tribulation and the mark of the beast and should not be applied to all who will be judged. I am also hesitant to think that this torment is eternal, as the verse states that "the smoke from the torment continues to rise. It is hard to imagine this lasting beyond the end of the age, but it does seem to be a memorial of judgment specific to accepting the mark of the beast. Definitely worthy of deep consideration of the matter. Great response!