I don't know which "one".....

[2PhiloVoid]

I wouldn't mind finding a new church, but being that I'm naturally so skeptical and inclined toward the philosophical appraisal of darn near everything, I don't really see any churches in my area that would allow me "to be me" and put up with my questions and evaluations of their specific Church Dogma and the presentation of further historical, hermeneutical, and sometimes scientific, research ...

I prefer a church denomination that doesn't assume the Bible comes in a hermetically sealed box from that church's own self-accredited packaging plant, especially not for the specific support of politics.

Does anyone know of a Christian Church like that? I don't, but if anyone here does, please let me know.

 

[BobRyan]

I wouldn't mind finding a new church, but being that I'm naturally so skeptical and inclined toward the philosophical appraisal of darn near everything, I don't really see any churches in my area that would allow me "to be me" and put up with my questions and evaluations of their specific Church Dogma and the presentation of further historical, hermeneutical, and sometimes scientific, research ...

Well first of all -
1. This forum is a good place to try out a lot of your questions, observations etc.
2. Be sure that your understanding of the Bible is solid before claiming that all other views are in error unless they line up with what you are thinking today. Recall how in your life you have changed views over time. If someone came along with one of your old views - you would say "ah ha - that view is in error I should know , I used to believe that". Might you say the same thing about your view today - 10 years from today? Be sure your measure is accurate.

I prefer a church denomination that doesn't assume the Bible comes in a hermetically sealed box from that church's own self-accredited packaging plant, especially not for the specific support of politics.

good idea.
The Bible comes from God - not from the church.

Does anyone know of a Christian Church like that? I don't, but if anyone here does, please let me know.

mine.
The one I go to.

 

[PloverWing]

One of the things that most drew me to the Episcopal Church was its willingness to put up with my questions and doubts and disbeliefs. Because our unity as Episcopalians is found in our form of worship rather than in uniformity of belief, there's more freedom to explore and research and question beliefs than is found in some other churches. If you can cope with liturgical worship, you might find a good home in the Episcopal Church.

Individual parishes will vary in how interested they are in the scholarly stuff, but my first Episcopal parish was near a university, and we had some great intellectual discussions there.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

I wouldn't mind finding a new church, but being that I'm naturally so skeptical and inclined toward the philosophical appraisal of darn near everything, I don't really see any churches in my area that would allow me "to be me" and put up with my questions and evaluations of their specific Church Dogma and the presentation of further historical, hermeneutical, and sometimes scientific, research ...

I prefer a church denomination that doesn't assume the Bible comes in a hermetically sealed box from that church's own self-accredited packaging plant, especially not for the specific support of politics.

Does anyone know of a Christian Church like that? I don't, but if anyone here does, please let me know.

Well you're off to a rough start by seeking a " denomination ". Man made doctrines are top order in all of them. Then there are the " non- denominational" institutions which are actually worse. They are the mega/start-up churches who typically practice unholy behavior. I know I sound cynical but what can one do when the gathering of Christians has turned away from God's will? Paul began a correction with the Church in Corinth but alas it did not stick. LMK if you find a group of Christians who are actually in the Body of Christ.( Note: Within every denomination there ARE those who are in Him.)
Be blessed.

 

[seeking.IAM]

I was also going to recommend you give us a look to see how we fit for you. The Episcopal Church is more about common worship than common belief. The oft told joke is wherever you'll find 3 Episcopalians, you'll find 5 opinions.

 

[CoreyD]

I wouldn't mind finding a new church, but being that I'm naturally so skeptical and inclined toward the philosophical appraisal of darn near everything, I don't really see any churches in my area that would allow me "to be me" and put up with my questions and evaluations of their specific Church Dogma and the presentation of further historical, hermeneutical, and sometimes scientific, research ...

I prefer a church denomination that doesn't assume the Bible comes in a hermetically sealed box from that church's own self-accredited packaging plant, especially not for the specific support of politics.

Does anyone know of a Christian Church like that? I don't, but if anyone here does, please let me know.

When I want to find a place that I would like to go to, and I don't know how to get there, or where it's located, I pull up Google Maps. Type in what I am searching for, and there it is.
Then I check the route to get there.

It sounds like you are looking for a place to worship, where persons are rational, and reasonable.
To find that, you need to use the Bible. That's your map.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Well first of all -
1. This forum is a good place to try out a lot of your questions, observations etc.
2. Be sure that your understanding of the Bible is solid before claiming that all other views are in error unless they line up with what you are thinking today. Recall how in your life you have changed views over time. If someone came along with one of your old views - you would say "ah ha - that view is in error I should know , I used to believe that". Might you say the same thing about your view today - 10 years from today? Be sure your measure is accurate.

good idea.
The Bible comes from God - not from the church.

mine.
The one I go to.

Oh, I'm quite sure that my understanding of the Bible is solid, Bob. Or rather, I'm quite sure that the understanding of the Bible which countless scholars have, and from whom I draw my own education, is quite solid.

As for my own views, when I say that I think all other views are questionable, I don't mean this in the same way that a very ardent Calvinist would mean this. Rather, what I mean is that whatever the denomination, I can usually spot chinks in the armor of that denomination. This isn't the same as saying, "I think they're utterly wrong, through and through." No, if I thought that, I'd never be the ecumenical Trinitarian that I attempt to be.

But whatever the case, thanks for your input.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Well you're off to a rough start by seeking a " denomination ". Man made doctrines are top order in all of them. Then there are the " non- denominational" institutions which are actually worse. They are the mega/start-up churches who typically practice unholy behavior. I know I sound cynical but what can one do when the gathering of Christians has turned away from God's will? Paul began a correction with the Church in Corinth but alas it did not stick. LMK if you find a group of Christians who are actually in the Body of Christ.( Note: Within every denomination there ARE those who are in Him.)
Be blessed.

Honestly, Maria, I'm not really "seeking" a denomination. I'm more or less wishing there was a church in my area that could be more philosophically open to theological exploration where the Bible is concerned rather than focusing so much on reading it in a dogmatic fashion. But I think I get what you're saying. Some of what you're saying here partly reflects my own feeling about being caught in a sort of American Catch-22, where churches here these days tend to be either politically charged on either the left or the right and are more interested in the outcomes of their own political outlooks than they are with merely 'being Christian.'

OR something like that. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

One of the things that most drew me to the Episcopal Church was its willingness to put up with my questions and doubts and disbeliefs. Because our unity as Episcopalians is found in our form of worship rather than in uniformity of belief, there's more freedom to explore and research and question beliefs than is found in some other churches. If you can cope with liturgical worship, you might find a good home in the Episcopal Church.

Individual parishes will vary in how interested they are in the scholarly stuff, but my first Episcopal parish was near a university, and we had some great intellectual discussions there.

I won't hide the fact that I've thought about the Episcopal Church more than once as an option. However, in a similar way as to the Emergent (Progressive?) Churches, I have a difficult time with a polity that brings the politics of the Left into the church in a way that I don't quite feel is....................................[how do I say this in an academic fashion without sounding like a conservative bigot????]...............................morally copacetic.

I think what I'm looking for, essentially, is a church that is more latitudinarian and academically minded where epistemological and scientific issues are at stake, but without the same latitudinarian viewpoint in its view on Ethics and Morality.

Does this make sense? ... the truth is, where I live, the churches are EITHER/OR. Either totally Left, or totally Right, and exclusive of views that don't politically comport with those Left or Right commitments. And because of this either/or demand, I find the whole act of considering and seeking an institutional church to be a rather frustrating endeavor on the whole.

Anyway, none of that is your fault, I know, sister PloverWing. It's just I'm too expansively educated and sophisticated in my own outlook that I'm going to have a difficult time finding a fit. I'll have to keep thinking on this.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

 

[seeking.IAM]

I won't hide the fact that I've thought about the Episcopal Church more than once as an option. However, in a similar way as to the Emergent (Progressive?) Churches, I have a difficult time with a polity that brings the politics of the Left into the church in a way that I don't quite feel is...

For me, that is just the thing about the TEC. While the stance of the national church is undeniably progressive, the stances of local congregations will have variance, while the stances of those in the pew have even greater variance. I have been a member of two Episcopal churches. Both were heavily populated by political conservatives, likely reflecting the demographics of the red state in which I Iive. In neither have I heard politics of the left from the pulpit. I hear Jesus and Bible-based sermons. Given the variance of those in the pew and congregations, I thought TEC might be a consideration for one who wants to be able to question and even disagree at some times. In any case, best wishes for your journey. I know we all have things that are "stoppers" for us, and one must respect those in discerning where to attend. May you find what you are looking for.

 

[bèlla]

Everything is black or white and that's the problem. There's extremes on both sides and little room for gray. You may find a place that ticks the philosophical side but morality is a hot potato and that's what I've noticed. I even contemplated quakers and mennonites and found similar things in those circles.

One day I realized it doesn't exist and I'd have to create it. I'm not referencing buildings in that statement but pools in its place. Because fellowship isn't one-size fits all. You can build multiple networks for every interest in the body. We keep forgetting that.

I have a group of entrepreneurs who love the Lord and another with a passion for investments. I found another for writers and one for aspiring speakers and so on. The common denominator is God and our shared passion for the subject. How we approach it through faith is incredible and informative too. And I learn a lot! There's never a dearth of conversation because I'm dealing with kindred spirits. I don't have to convince them of its worthiness. They already agree.

We're trying to find our people in a building but they're really spread out. You have a smattering here and there and places you've never gone. Find them and enjoy the experiences. Don't try to convert the others. They're on a different page and that's okay.

Most things have a mate in the body. Look at your hands, feet, eyes, arms, etc. They come in pairs. ;-)

~bella

 

[HTacianas]

I wouldn't mind finding a new church, but being that I'm naturally so skeptical and inclined toward the philosophical appraisal of darn near everything, I don't really see any churches in my area that would allow me "to be me" and put up with my questions and evaluations of their specific Church Dogma and the presentation of further historical, hermeneutical, and sometimes scientific, research ...

I prefer a church denomination that doesn't assume the Bible comes in a hermetically sealed box from that church's own self-accredited packaging plant, especially not for the specific support of politics.

Does anyone know of a Christian Church like that? I don't, but if anyone here does, please let me know.

At the risk of evangelizing, I can honestly tell you that you will find what you are looking for in the Orthodox Church. You will find all of the answers to all of your questions there. I spent years looking for the same thing. But I was motivated by looking for the truth. You can spend years doing the same or you can take my advice and use the short cut I'm offering.

 

[PloverWing]

I won't hide the fact that I've thought about the Episcopal Church more than once as an option. However, in a similar way as to the Emergent (Progressive?) Churches, I have a difficult time with a polity that brings the politics of the Left into the church in a way that I don't quite feel is....................................[how do I say this in an academic fashion without sounding like a conservative bigot????]...............................morally copacetic.

I appreciate the difficulty of finding a good church home. I wish you all the best in your search, and I hope you find a community that will allow you to flourish.

 

[eleos1954]

I wouldn't mind finding a new church, but being that I'm naturally so skeptical and inclined toward the philosophical appraisal of darn near everything, I don't really see any churches in my area that would allow me "to be me" and put up with my questions and evaluations of their specific Church Dogma and the presentation of further historical, hermeneutical, and sometimes scientific, research ...

I prefer a church denomination that doesn't assume the Bible comes in a hermetically sealed box from that church's own self-accredited packaging plant, especially not for the specific support of politics.

Does anyone know of a Christian Church like that? I don't, but if anyone here does, please let me know.

Need to be Christ centered and bible only church ... I find this is SDA teachings although I do not attend any church .. I have and do study for myself and check all teachings with it no matter where the teachings comes from.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

For me, that is just the thing about the TEC. While the stance of the national church is undeniably progressive, the stances of local congregations will have variance, while the stances of those in the pew have even greater variance. I have been a member of two Episcopal churches. Both were heavily populated by political conservatives, likely reflecting the demographics of the red state in which I Iive. In neither have I heard politics of the left from the pulpit. I hear Jesus and Bible-based sermons. Given the variance of those in the pew and congregations, I thought TEC might be a consideration for one who wants to be able to question and even disagree at some times. In any case, best wishes for your journey. I know we all have things that are "stoppers" for us, and one must respect those in discerning where to attend. May you find what you are looking for.

If this could be the case, then I'll have to check further into the make-up of the congregations in whatever Episcopalian churches may be in my area. I also know there are a few Anglican churches here as well, so I'll try to keep in mind that some of these congregations may have a mixture of political views rather than adhering solely to one. I already know that these churches won't mind so much that I lean toward evolutionary thought where science is concerned and that my epistemology regarding how I engage the Bible is anything but fundamentalistic in tone.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

At the risk of evangelizing, I can honestly tell you that you will find what you are looking for in the Orthodox Church. You will find all of the answers to all of your questions there. I spent years looking for the same thing. But I was motivated by looking for the truth. You can spend years doing the same or you can take my advice and use the short cut I'm offering.

Oh, I'm not looking to have questions answered so much as a place that won't challenge me too much and demand that I let go of what I already know. But, I'll keep the Orthodox church in mind as well. It's always an option.

 

[HTacianas]

Oh, I'm not looking to have questions answered so much as a place that won't challenge me too much to let go of what I already know. But, I'll keep the Orthodox church in mind as well. It's always an option.

I'm not sure what you mean by challenging you on what you already know. Can you give us an example?

 

[eleos1954]

Needs to be Christ centered and bible only church ... I find this in SDA teachings although I do not attend any church .. I have and do study for myself and check all teachings with it no matter where the teachings comes from.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

I'm not sure what you mean by challenging you on what you already know. Can you give us an example?

Sure. If I come into the church and I let them know that I'm not big on seeing the sacraments as "definitive" in nature for the faith and that I aver more or less for a philosophically primitive form of Christian faith due to a sophisticated epistemological viewpoint, I want to know that I'm not going to be roundly rejected for it.

See what I'm saying? If not, let me put it this way: I don't go to church to proselytize or convert others to my way of thinking. Rather, I go to connect with other Christians in our common Trinitarian faith, but I will firmly defend my more ecumenical, existentially laden point of view against all challengers. The churches that I used to attend in the past wouldn't put up with me now (e.g. Southern Baptist, or Christian Church/Church of Christ, etc.)

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Need to be Christ centered and bible only church ... I find this is SDA teachings although I do not attend any church .. I have and do study for myself and check all teachings with it no matter where the teachings comes from.

Well, I definitely can agree that a church needs to be Christ-centered, but the part of it where it's "Bible Only" is going to be a big stretch to accept for someone like myself.