What are the earlier references to Mary?

[Lord'sWarrior]

What are the earlier references in history to Mary as a person with some importance? If you could quote catholic and non catholic references that would be great, emphasis on non catholic.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

There are none that suggest the veneration given her by certain religions. Jesus was actually rude to her on one occasion and dismissive on another.

 

[prodromos]

There are none that suggest the veneration given her by certain religions. Jesus was actually rude to her on one occasion and dismissive on another.

That's a terrible misinterpretation of Scripture which would have our Lord breaking the 5th commandment.

 

[GreekOrthodox]

Some of the early references compare Mary as a second Eve,

Irenaeus wrote, "As Eve was seduced by the speech of an angel, so as to flee God in transgressing his word, so also Mary received the good tidings by means of the angel's speech, so as to be God within her, being obedient to this word. And though the one had disobeyed God, yet the other was drawn to obey him; that of the virgin Eve, the virgin Mary might become the advocate and as by a virgin the human race had been bound to death, by a virgin it is saved, the balance being preserved- a virgin's disobedience by a virgin's obedience." (Against Heresies, 3, 19 130 A.D.)

Justin Martyr, in a Dialogue with Trypho, wrote around 150AD that "For whereas Eve, yet a virgin and undefiled, through conceiving the word that came from the serpent, brought forth disobedience and death; the Virgin Mary, taking faith and joy, when the Angel told her the good tidings that the Spirit of the Lord should come upon her, and the power of the Most High overshadow her, and therefore the Holy One to be born of her should be the Son of God, answered, Be it done to me according to thy word."

So it is early on that Mary was recognized as unique.

 

[dzheremi]

The earliest hymn to reference to St. Mary as Theotokos (i.e., with that specific Christological title, which means "Birth-giver to God", and was affirmed at the Council of Ephesus in 431) dates to approximately 250 AD, where it is found in a Coptic (Egyptian) Nativity liturgy. It is the hymn "Beneath Thy Protection" (in some translations, "Compassion"), which is to this day sung in the Coptic Orthodox, Eastern Orthodox, Roman Catholic, and other churches, as part of our common heritage.

So that's pretty early, in terms of hymns. Whenever something reaches the level of being a hymn that is sung in the liturgy, you can be very confident that the theology it affirms has been present for a very, very long time. We don't compose hymns, nor integrate them into the liturgy, on a whim. They must reflect the faith of the Church.

 

[concretecamper]

The earliest reference to Mary was at the beginning of humanity.

Gen 3:15 I will put enmities between thee and the woman, and thy seed and her seed: she shall crush thy head, and thou shalt lie in wait for her heel.

Notice that Jesus called Mary Woman at Cana which defines her as the New Eve. This is something the old wise guy misses.

 

[HardHead]

The earliest reference to Mary was at the beginning of humanity.

Gen 3:15 I will put enmities between thee and the woman, and thy seed and her seed: she shall crush thy head, and thou shalt lie in wait for her heel.

Notice that Jesus called Mary Woman at Cana which defines her as the New Eve. This is something the old wise guy misses.

This early reference does indeed seem to be about Mary in what I have read in the past from people of various denominations.

The part you may take a bit of care with is the translation using the he or she pronouns. How you choose to look at the translations may depend on what denomination you are following or are a part of.

Whatever the case, the point is that the verse seems to be about Mary and Jesus.

Most translations I have seen read something like the following in that they do not imply that the woman is doing the battling but her offspring (Jesus) is. Here the offspring is the focus it seems.

Genesis 3:15
(NRSV) I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; he will strike your head, and you will strike his heel."

(ESV) I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and her offspring; he shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise his heel.”

(NET) And I will put hostility between you and the woman and between your offspring and her offspring; her offspring will attack your head, and you will attack her offspring’s heel.”

Note that the DRB (more Catholic friendly from what I know) translation reads like this.

Genesis 3:15
(DRB) I will put enmities between thee and the woman, and thy seed and her seed: she shall crush thy head, and thou shalt lie in wait for her heel.

Here its somewhat ambiguous whether or not the focus is on her or her offspring. Note that she doing the crushing may (or may not) mean that her offspring (i.e her lineage) is being discussed, not her specifically. This is similar to referring to Israel as a nation since they are followers or the lineage of Israel the person. Here it is also implied that a lineage of people who follow a being that is not God will or do exist. These offspring are an enemy it seems.

Also consider that the wording in all cases is referring to her seed (i.e not the seed of a male human she had children with). This seems to imply that she is the only human source of the lineage. Therefore, from a Christian point of view, the passage is likely about Mary and Jesus and the virgin birth in all of these translations.