Was the ‘mystery’ of the Body of Christ known before Acts 28?

[agenes]

By the way Paul, I was once a Mid Acts ( Acts 9-13) Dispensationalist. Since around four years ago, due mostly to my Calvinism, became consistent in my theology, and became a Covenantalist.

 

[@@Paul@@]

By the way Paul, I was once a Mid Acts ( Acts 9-13) Dispensationalist. Since around four years ago, due mostly to my Calvinism, became consistent in my theology, and became a Covenantalist.

Hi agenes,

My history goes a little like this... Acts 2 > MID > Acts 28.

 

[@@Paul@@]

Seriously though, you should read it. The entire work, that I referenced to from my site, took me six months to complete.

I read the first post.. working on the second...

I have also written a lot (80 + pages) on the first TWO chapters of Ephesians, AND i'm still working on chapter 3.... But it looks like another 40.

I appreciate your posts,, thank you.

 

[agenes]

Hi agenes,

My history goes a little like this... Acts 2 > MID > Acts 28.

Only two theological steps away from the full and complete truthfulness of it all.

 

[agenes]

I appreciate your posts, thank you.

You are welcome.

 

[@@Paul@@]

Only two theological steps away from the full and complete truthfulness of it all.

OK,, that's taking it a bit too far...

That's your opinion.

 

[agenes]

Did you notice the wink? I was laughing when I typed it. I always poke at my Dispensational brothers and sisters who are almost Covenantalists.

 

[@@Paul@@]

Did you notice the wink? I was laughing when I typed it. I always poke at my Dispensational brothers and sisters who are almost Covenantalists.

LOL, yes,,, i was returning it. Didn't you see mine?

..........anyway, thanks again for the posts.

 

[Terral]

Hi Av1611 and Paul:

The Mystery in Scripture appears as a shining jewel that has many facets. When we look at the Mystery from varying perspectives, then we are looking at the same Mystery process, but through one particular face or side. Please allow me to present to you a new way at looking at the Mystery. By using one very simple diagram, I will show you how all the mysteries of the NT can be visualized.

Take a blank piece of paper and draw two circles; one to the left, and on to the right; but, make the two circles overlap in the center of the page so that the diagram has three equal parts. Inside the left half moon shaped orb, write the word ‘Spirit.’ Inside the right half moon orb, write the word “Water,” and inside the newly created central section, write the word “Blood.” What you are looking at, gentlemen are the Three Witnesses of 1John 5:8, and the “three are into the One.” Inside the Spirit Section, write the word “Creator: John 1:1.” In the Water Section, write the word “Creation: John 1:3”, and inside the central Blood (begotten) Section, write the word “Word/Son: John 1:2.”

Right here we are looking at ‘The Mystery.” Every time Paul talks about a ‘mystery,’ he is talking about something, someone or a group being baptized into something or Someone else to become a member of that body. Prophecy describes how all things are derived from the One. The mystery describes how those things (heavens and earth) are to be summed up. Once you become skilled at using this simple diagram, then even God’s deepest mysteries shall become very easy to understand. For example:

Place the Father in the Spirit position, and the Holy Spirit in the Water position, and the Son in the blood position. Here we see the Three Witnesses of the “Invisible God” that dwells beyond the veil of time and space. Let us agree that the fingertip of God Almighty cannot fit inside this temporal Creation. As David says,

"But will God indeed dwell on the earth? Behold, heaven and the highest heaven cannot contain You, how much less this house which I have built!” 1Kings 8:27.

Almighty God currently expresses Himself through His Three Witnesses of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Thus, it is written of Christ,

“He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.” Col. 1:15.

What does this mean, that Christ is “the image of the invisible God?” What does Christ say of the Father?

"I and the Father are one." John 10:30.

Now go back and look at your diagram, and let’s go three dimensional. The Father and the Son make up one perfect sphere. It is also true that the Son and the Holy Spirit make up one perfect sphere. If you turn your diagram over 90 degrees, so that the spirit part is on top, you are looking at the ‘image of a man,’ which is the image of the Almighty God (three into the One: 1John 5:8). And that, my friends, is why Christ is the ‘image’ of the invisible God.


Consider that Creation is a fishbowl compared to the Almighty, and He is outside of this creation looking in. Also acknowledge that every single event that transpires inside this fishbowl happened before Him in the flash of a single moment. It is just like God Almighty had His picture taken by the ‘flash’ of this creation; beginning to very end. So, if we could see beyond the veil of time and space, and look upon His face, then all we would see throughout the entire lifetime of this creation would be “His stare.” The Almighty literally has no time to change His mind about anything. The miraculous part of understanding these things comes when we realize, that through His eternal power and divine nature, He is able to actually dwell within Jesus Christ our Lord. Thus, it is written,

“Now all {these} things are from God, who reconciled us to Himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation, namely, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation.” 2Cor. 5:18+19.

Doesn’t that bring a tear to your eye; acknowledging that the Almighty was In Him, suffering for us too? And all the time He has the power to shake every atom of this creation, and to make all of this simply disappear. Our Creator is truly worthy of our worship and praise. Here are some examples on how to use this diagram to understand other things in Scripture:

Place heavens in the spirit position, and earth in the water position (Gen. 1:1), then heaven in the ‘begotten: (Gen. 1:8) central position. Now you can visualize why the ‘kingdom of heaven’ is so very important to the overall plan of God. The ultimate goal for each of these three witnesses is for the central ‘begotten’ aspect to enlarge, until The Three Are Again One (See Eccl. 1:9-11). That is what creation groans for in Romans 8:22.

Place Adam in the spirit position, Eve into the water position, and seed into the ‘begotten’ blood position. The family is a microcosm of the relationship that our Creator has with Creation through His Son. Place the Holy of Holies in the Spirit position, the Court in the water (laver or water) position and the Holy Place in the blood position. Clearly the laver of water belongs inside the Tabernacle of Moses (10x30 cubits). However, the laver of water has been moved outside into the court, because the Holy Spirit is now among men in the world.


Place your own spirit into the spirit position, and your body in the water position, and your soul in the central “blood/begotten” position (Gen. 2:7). The family and man himself have been created in the image of our Triune God. Even Bread works with this diagram: Oil/spirit, water/water, broken grain/blood. So Christ is the ‘bread of life,’ because all three witnesses were ‘in’ Him (Father: John 10:38 and Holy Spirit: Luke 4:1). Now, when you look at the diagram, it makes more sense to read,

“But if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father." John 10:38.

Even the Word of God (Holy Scriptures) itself is depicted by this simple illustration of two spheres overlapping to become One. This truth is difficult to swallow for many; at first. The OT is the Spirit part (Prophecy Unclothed), the Hebrew Epistles is the Water part (Prophecy Clothed), and the Pauline Epistles is the Blood part (Mystery). And thus: the three primary dispensations of Scripture (Israel: Moses: Mosaic Law / Gentile dominant body: Paul: Grace Doctrine / Jewish dominant bride: Peter: Kingdom Doctrine).

The last point to be made is over Paul’s (our poster) comments that pertain to the Apostle Paul’s words in Ephesians 3. Yes, the Apostle Paul is describing ‘a mystery,’ but NOT ‘the mystery of Christ.’ Even the mystery of Christ is a microcosm of ‘the Mystery.’ Remember the Apostle Paul’s words to the Colossians,

“. . . that their hearts may be encouraged, having been knit together in love, and {attaining} to all the wealth that comes from the full assurance of understanding, {resulting} in a true knowledge of God's mystery, {that is,} Christ {Himself}.” Col. 2:2.

God’s Mystery is Christ Himself, because of the relationship of the Creator (spirit), His Word/Son (blood; begotten) and Creation (water). After all, Christ is the “Word of God” from 1John 1:1+2. And that is why Paul uses this phrase as a qualifier to his words about the ‘mystery of the administration’ (Eph. 3:9).

“ . . . that by revelation there was made known to me the mystery, as I wrote before in brief. By referring to this, when you read you can understand my insight into the mystery of Christ.” Eph. 3:1-4.

So by referring to ‘this,’ (what he is talking about now) we can understand the bigger picture. Also, when Paul mentions, “as I wrote before in brief,” he is not talking about another letter. He pointing to words he wrote in this same letter, saying,

“He made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His kind intention which He purposed in Him with a view to an administration suitable to the fullness of the times, {that is,} the summing up of all things in Christ, things in the heavens and things on the earth. In Him also we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will.” Eph. 1:9+10.

This gets kind of complicated: So, from here Paul begins to paint a picture of the ‘administration’ through which God is going to sum up all things in Christ. Paul is talking about our mother; New Jerusalem. Gal. 4:26. That is the central administration building (if you will) of “Heaven.” Once again, pull out your trusty ‘three into the One’ diagram and plug in the right values.


This Adminstration has the same triune nature that is typical of all these examples. Members from the heavens go into the spirit position (Type is Elijah on Mt. of Transfiguration; never saw death), and Members from the earth (Jewish Bride; Kingdom Dispensation; 'before the throne' Rev. 7:15: Type Moses) go into the Water position. Members from the body of Christ ('center of the throne' (Rev. 7:17: Lamb includes all those baptized into His body on the cross) go into the ‘begotten’ central aspect of the newly created administration through which all things shall be judged and reconciled/summed up in Christ. This Administration shall continue to enlarge throughout eternity, and we have seats there even now.


Remember that our role in New Jerusalem is the judge the world (Earth) and the angels (Heaven). 1Cor. 6:2+3. Throughout eternity things of the heavens and earth shall be continuously summed up ‘in Christ,’ through this ‘administration’ of Eph. 3. In the end, the heavens and earth shall be totally engulfed by this central growing section, until “God is all in all.” 1Cor. 15:28.

While I see just one Mystery process, all of the smaller facets follow that exact pattern. So, for me, the Mystery is more of a reconciliation/summing up process, than anything else. The most important aspect to realize, again, is that all of the smaller micro-versions of ‘The Mystery’ are based upon the same Triune relationship that exists between the Creator, His Word and Creation.

In Christ,


Terral

 

[Terral]

Hi Agenes:

Agenes wrote >> Before it is objected that we Covenantalists do not see any particularity in the Apostleship of Paul unto the Gentiles: let it be made clear once for all time, that we affirm and teach that Paul was called to take the Gospel to the Gentiles, that this is a distinct calling. But let it also be made clear, we are not saying that he had any monopoly on what Dispensationalists call the “mystery”;

First off, please allow me to say that I have debated the word for years with many Dispensationalists. We simply agree to disagree on many points. On this topic of Eph. 3:1-12, let us allow the facts to speak for themselves on these issues of Paul and his stewardship from God (Eph. 3:2). Paul states,

“But I am speaking to you who are Gentiles. Inasmuch then as I am an apostle of Gentiles, I magnify my ministry.” Rom. 11:13.

I challenge you to find Peter, John or James speaking to Gentiles in the first person, even once, in any of their Hebrew Epistles.



The word “musterion” (mystery) is rarely used in the New Testament, when compared to “charis” (grace) or “pistis” (faith). Let’s try to guess how many times Paul uses “musterion,” and compare that to how many times all of the Kingdom writers use it combined. Paul uses the term six times to the Ephesians and four times to the Colossians for a total of twenty times in all of his Gentile Epistles. Peter, John and James use the term exactly zero times. Let us consider Paul’s words in his first letter to the Corinthians.

“Yet we do speak wisdom among those who are mature; a wisdom, however, not of this age nor of the rulers of this age, who are passing away; but we speak God's wisdom in a mystery, the hidden {wisdom} which God predestined before the ages to our glory; 1 Cor 2:8 {the wisdom} which none of the rulers of this age has understood; for if they had understood it they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.” 1Cor. 2:6-8.

Then, let’s look at Peter’s own words about this same wisdom, about seventeen years after the meeting in Jerusalem.

“Therefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless and blameless, and regard the patience of our Lord {as} salvation; just as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you, as also in all {his} letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort, as {they do} also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.” 2Pet. 3:14-16.

Peter verifies the fact that this ‘wisdom’ was given to Paul. As stated above, Paul spoke God’s wisdom in a mystery, the HIDDEN, which God predestined . . .” As AV1611 has pointed out, Paul’s gospel is “according to the revelation of the mystery.” Rom. 16:25. Again, Peter verifies that people are distorting this wisdom to their own destruction. Paul also presents the same message in his second letter to the Corinthians, saying,

“2 Cor 4:3 And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, in whose case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving so that they might not see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.” 2Cor. 4:3+4.

People are perishing, because they are distorting this 'wisdom given him.' These are big red flashing warning signs in Scripture. Paul's gospel is definitely unique and has its own set of precepts. The facts in this case indicate that Paul certainly has a monopoly on the topic of the Mystery in our New Testament. The reason is that Paul continued to have ‘visions and revelations of the Lord.” 2Cor. 12:1.

Agenes continues >> . . . neither are we saying that he took a wholly distinct Gospel to the Gentiles, one that would be wholly divergent from what was preached unto the world before the conversion of Saul of Tarsus. This issue will be developed and addressed more in the subsequent commentary.

“For I would have you know, brethren, that the gospel which was preached by me is not according to man. For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but {I received it} through a revelation of Jesus Christ.” Gal. 1:11+12.



In all of the Hebrew Epistles of Peter, John and James, only Peter uses the word ‘revelation’ (3 times), and each is in reference to the second coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. 1Pet. 1:7, 13, 4:13. The Apostle Paul is the only NT Apostle who continued to experience these visions and revelations of the Lord, according to the Scriptural evidence. That is why Christ sent Paul down to Jerusalem to submit our gospel to Peter, John and James (Gal. 2:2) in the first place. If Peter, John and James were privy to this hidden wisdom, and our gospel according to the revelation of the mystery, then what is the reasoning behind Christ sending Paul to this meeting in Jerusalem?



Peter and the other Kingdom Disciples continued to preach the ‘gospel of the kingdom’ (Matt. 4:17 (23), 9:35, 24:14, Acts 8:12) all of their lives. They looked for the ‘times of refreshing’ of Acts 3:19 and the ‘presence of the Lord.’ The Kingdom Disciples were still looking for the restoration of the kingdom to Israel (Acts 1:6). The main precepts of the gospel of the kingdom were ‘repentance’ and ‘water baptism’ for the forgiveness of sins (Mark 1:4, Acts 2:38).

Paul’s gospel (Rom. 2:16, 16:25, 2Tim. 2:8) is one aspect of ‘God’s Hidden Wisdom,’ that nobody was allowed to see before the crucifixion. As far as Satan and his unholy angels of darkness knew, they were crucifying the King/Messiah of the Kingdom of Israel. God tricked Satan into carrying out the crucifixion, so that we could later be justified by faith in His finished work. That is the whole point of Paul’s words to the Corinthians in 1Cor. 2:6-8. “which none of the rulers of this age has understood; for if they had understood it they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.” 1Cor. 2:8. Satan knew everything that every man knew on this planet. Therefore, God kept His plan of redemption hidden from all men, so that Satan could be fooled. Then, Paul was raised up and given all of this information, as it is contained in his Gentile Epistles.


Peter’s gospel to the circumcised (Gal. 2:7) is the ‘gospel of the kingdom.’ Paul’s gospel to the uncircumcised (Gal. 2:7) is the ‘gospel of the grace of God.’ Acts 20:24. Peter’s gospel is based upon ‘water’ for forgiveness (Acts 2:38). Paul’s gospel is based upon Christ’s blood for forgiveness (Eph. 1:7, Col. 1:20). Thus, John writes,

“This is the One who came by water and blood, Jesus Christ; not with the water only, but with the water and with the blood.” John 5:6.

There were two gospel messages being heralded in Paul's day; not just one. Paul's gospel came after the crucifixion.

God bless,



Terral