The power of God when a preacher admits he was wrong.

brodav9@thicket

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It takes a real man to admit he was wrong. We are only human. the true power of God will return. I'm speaking of Benny Hinn who has a video showing his repenting of using gimmicks to receive prosperity. One especially was giving a 1,000 dollars and God will give back. He said he has been preaching that for many years and apologizes. He also says God hates it and it is a abomination. Hopefully other preachers will see this and repent to. God's looking for faith for all to do his will, and restore( true) apostolic power.
 

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Money, money, money.

About 10 years back I did an extensive amount of research on the new translations of the Bible that were coming out, specifically in the New Testament. I did this because I received a lot of questions from people about the credibility of said Bibles. Knowing that in order to obtain a new copyright a book must be altered by 20% from any previously published version of the same book of course brought alarm. Where is all this leading, just hang on a moment and you will find out.

In my research of the New Testaments found within these new versions of the Bible there was a common theme of two topics that had been altered the most. The first topic was reference to Jesus as the Son of Man and the Son of God, and references to his deity. The second topic which was altered dramatically was the topic of greed, that spiritual leaders should not, and could not, be people who were greedy for money, this topic was pretty much all but eliminated. I think that speaks volumes about the modern Church and it's view of money.


Love of money, money, money, whether Christian or not seems to be one of the greatest downfalls of all time.
 
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hislegacy

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It takes a real man to admit he was wrong. We are only human. the true power of God will return. I'm speaking of Benny Hinn who has a video showing his repenting of using gimmicks to receive prosperity. One especially was giving a 1,000 dollars and God will give back. He said he has been preaching that for many years and apologizes. He also says God hates it and it is a abomination. Hopefully other preachers will see this and repent to. God's looking for faith for all to do his will, and restore( true) apostolic power.
It was refreshing to hear him make the correction five years ago. Makes me wonder how long it will be before the modern prophets will do the same on their numerous errors regarding the former president.

Curiosity question: What do you mean by "Apostolic Power"?
 
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Blade

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Not directed at anyone :) just sharing.... Its something Pastor Hinn never had to do publicly. As its written against thee and only thee have I sinned and do this evil in your sight. Its just there are busy bodies in the church that have to know everything and if you don't walk talk act the way they expect you to ooh watch out that love and forgiveness Christ always shows goes out the window very fast. Again as its written we don't answer to man. We are not over any pastors, prophets, teachers, Apostles. We really need to think about that. Its not what others are doing its what are we doing.

If I expect Pastor Hinn to repent do right as in live by faith walk right as in walk by faith not make mistakes with the ministry or family.. ooh in GODS eyes I best be walking in it first. Its a really good way of getting ..to put it simple a target on your back with God. He won't be looking at anyone else but you. As one pastor asked God about some preachers that he believed should be judged and fire and brimstone yet Christs answer was "ooh but do you know the good they do for me?" Yeah I have yet to find one "exposed" video and the like that makes sure to point out the good they do then where they get it wrong "then" the reason for the video was go get us to come together and "pray" for them. To help to uplift to encourage.

So never expected Pastor Hinn to say anything.. I am not his God he does not ever have to answer to me being out in the open or not. Now there is someone over him he does talk to. I don't mean God.

As for other preachers, prophets, Apostles... I don't the heart and I will not touch speculation. See they have a "Dad" a "Abba Father" a "GOD" that made them and I wonder sometimes well when people tried to tell me about my kids.. I don't care if it was the bother or sister. God? there is no one better at taking care of His own. He does not need us to tell Him what His kids are doing. What He started in them He not me He will finish. I don't ever remembering reading about Paul, James, John, Peter ever writing about all the sins they did and repenting. I am only guessing they were human like everyone else.
 
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lismore

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It takes a real man to admit he was wrong. We are only human. the true power of God will return. I'm speaking of Benny Hinn who has a video showing his repenting of using gimmicks to receive prosperity. One especially was giving a 1,000 dollars and God will give back. He said he has been preaching that for many years and apologizes. He also says God hates it and it is a abomination. Hopefully other preachers will see this and repent to. God's looking for faith for all to do his will, and restore( true) apostolic power.

In the gospel, Luke 19:8, when Zacchaeus repented he returned the money he had swindled.

When Benny Hinn repented of cheating people did he return the money? And has he changed his practices in line with his profession of repentance?

God Bless :)
 
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Pioneer3mm

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The focus/emphasis on..'money & assets/property' has been..
- one of main problems/issues..
- in the Church & Ministry (Charismatic & Non Charismatic).
---
I have been observing/involved in ministries/missions..
- since 1970s.
 
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brodav9@thicket

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It was refreshing to hear him make the correction five years ago. Makes me wonder how long it will be before the modern prophets will do the same on their numerous errors regarding the former president.

Curiosity question: What do you mean by "Apostolic Power"?

It was refreshing to hear him make the correction five years ago. Makes me wonder how long it will be before the modern prophets will do the same on their numerous errors regarding the former president.

Curiosity question: What do you mean by "Apostolic Power"?
Can a man preach things that make people sick, and manifest falling under (apostolic) power at the same time? He has also repented of some heresies. One is the God head is 9 and not 3.
 
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hislegacy

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Can a man preach things that make people sick, and manifest falling under (apostolic) power at the same time? He has also repented of some heresies. One is the God head is 9 and not 3.
I am asking you to define Apostolic Power -

What is it - what does it look like - where is it in scripture?
 
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hislegacy

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As for falling:

You can look at John Wesley (Wesley Methodist founder)

Those who had received this new living faith through the Holy Spirit continued to meet together. About sixty of us were holding a love feast on New Year’s Eve on Fetter Lane. At about three in the morning, as we were continuing in prayer, the power of God came mightily upon us. Many cried out in complete joy. Others were knocked to the ground. As soon as we recovered a little from that awe and amazement at God’s presence, we broke out in praise. “We praise you, O God; we acknowledge you to be the Lord.”5​
From this time forward, Wesley spoke periodically of people who would sink, or fall to the ground under the power of the Holy Spirit while he was preaching. Sometimes he used the word “thunderstruck” to describe people who fell as their physical strength succumbed to God’s power. He also described many crying out for mercy as they came under the conviction of the Holy Spirit.
As far as I know - he was not an Apostle.
 
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I's2C

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Money, money, money.

About 10 years back I did an extensive amount of research on the new translations of the Bible that were coming out, specifically in the New Testament. I did this because I received a lot of questions from people about the credibility of said Bibles. Knowing that in order to obtain a new copyright a book must be altered by 20% from any previously published version of the same book of course brought alarm. Where is all this leading, just hang on a moment and you will find out.

In my research of the New Testaments found within these new versions of the Bible there was a common theme of two topics that had been altered the most. The first topic was reference to Jesus as the Son of Man and the Son of God, and references to his deity. The second topic which was altered dramatically was the topic of greed, that spiritual leaders should not, and could not, be people who were greedy for money, this topic was pretty much all but eliminated. I think that speaks volumes about the modern Church and it's view of money.


Love of money, money, money, whether Christian or not seems to be one of the greatest downfalls of all time.
This brings to my mind of: Eze 13:20 Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly.
The NIV had changed souls in this verse to birds flying where it totally changes the whole meaning. Just for a buck and to confuse GODS children.
Eze 13:19 And will ye pollute me among my people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to my people that hear your lies?
People: most are good Christians trying to understand GOD by buying so called easier translations; preachers see a cash cow and rather than teach the WORD of GOD, they change proven scripture to fit their life style. Thing is no other books can fit like a glove the WORDS of GOD if not from GOD. They are cursed and no matter what they do/say, they cant change their curse; when they do it for hand full of barley, instead of trying to lead GODS children to salvation. CHRIST will release them from their bondage, GOD will rip them from their hold on them; GOD is Great!.
 
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It takes a real man to admit he was wrong. We are only human. the true power of God will return. I'm speaking of Benny Hinn who has a video showing his repenting of using gimmicks to receive prosperity. One especially was giving a 1,000 dollars and God will give back. He said he has been preaching that for many years and apologizes. He also says God hates it and it is a abomination. Hopefully other preachers will see this and repent to. God's looking for faith for all to do his will, and restore( true) apostolic power.
That man's ministry is all talk. There is no power there at all. He doesn't even try to minister to the worst disabled and sick people who come to his services because he knows that he can't heal them. True apostolic power is the preaching of the Gospel of Christ and Him crucified, leading to souls saved and become long-term disciples for Christ. All this other talk about apostolic power being signs and wonders is nonsense, mainly because apart from the speech making and vain promises, there is little to no evidence of real signs and wonders at all.
 
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The focus/emphasis on..'money & assets/property' has been..
- one of main problems/issues..
- in the Church & Ministry (Charismatic & Non Charismatic).
---
I have been observing/involved in ministries/missions..
- since 1970s.
I have been involved in and observed the work of "healing ministries" since 1970, and I have to see or hear of anyone who has been healed of heart failure, heart disease, cancer, cerebal palsy, or any other disability that has had a person wheelchair bound, and the healing totally validated by medical evidence.

Alternatively, I have heard many motivational speech making about healing, and many promises of healing which have turned out, IN EVERY CASE, to be vain. I have heard of many deaths of people who believed the healing evangelist and not gone back to the doctor and stopped taking their medication.

So I conclude that the current talk about "apostolic power" is fantasy, often with the intention of making money to support the evangelist's lavish lifestyle. This is the fulfillment of Paul's teaching to Timothy, that they have turned away from sound doctrine (the true Gospel of Christ) to cunningly devised fables.
 
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I am asking you to define Apostolic Power -

What is it - what does it look like - where is it in scripture?
Paul said it. "I am not ashamed of the Gospel of Christ because it is the power of God (ie: apostolic power) until salvation for everyone who believes it." Saying that it is the signs and wonders is deception and nowhere in Scripture.
 
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jiminpa

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That man's ministry is all talk. There is no power there at all. He doesn't even try to minister to the worst disabled and sick people who come to his services because he knows that he can't heal them. True apostolic power is the preaching of the Gospel of Christ and Him crucified, leading to souls saved and become long-term disciples for Christ. All this other talk about apostolic power being signs and wonders is nonsense, mainly because apart from the speech making and vain promises, there is little to no evidence of real signs and wonders at all.
Are you discussing Benny Hinn, or the Church as a whole?
 
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God's looking for faith for all to do his will, and restore( true) apostolic power.
I wouldn't really use that term.

Jesus ministered in the power of The Holy Spirit. Jesus also promised the disciples that they would receive the same power at the arrival of The Holy Spirit upon them (Acts 2). If anything just call it the power of The Holy Spirit.

This same power is available to any born again Christian, if they will follow the steps that Jesus took. Most don't understand it and have never experienced it.
 
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Are you discussing Benny Hinn, or the Church as a whole?
It is true that in the church as a whole there is a lot of speech making about signs and wonders along with the gifts, but in most cases that's as far as it goes. Benny Hinn is very entertaining and gets whole sections of his congregation to fall down when he waves his jacket at them. The problem is that if there is enough power to cause a whole group to fall to the floor, how come there is not enough power to heal a wheelchair bound disabled person? He prays for a sick person who subsequently falls to the floor supposed under the power of God, but ends up going home as sick as he or she was when they first arrived. How can that be? How come the power that caused the person to fall to the floor didn't heal the person? The only conclusion is that what caused the person to fall to the floor was not the power of God at all otherwise the sick person would have been healed. This problem is observed with all the big name Word of Faith healing and prosperity preachers.

When Jesus and the Apostles healed sick people, no one seemed to fall to the floor, but they were immediately healed when they were ministered to. But today the scenario is like the fable of the Emperor's New Clothes. He and everyone around were convinced that he was wearing a fine new suit of clothes, but in reality he was in his underwear because the tailor was a crook. But everyone was convinced that the Emperor was wearing the new clothes, because they had blinded themselves to the fact that the new clothes didn't exist. This is the state of many in our churches. They are convinced that God heals people on demand, and are blind to the fact that very few people actually get healed, and that all the promises of healing from the healing evangelists are empty, and most sick and disabled people go home from their healing conferences not healed at all. Yet many convince themselves that they are healed when they are not, and cease taking their medication and going back to the doctor. As a result many become critically ill and death often results.

As it took a little child to cry out, "The Emperor has no clothes on!" to jolt people out of their self-deception, in the same way, we need to acknowledge that no one is getting healed as the result of the promises of the healing evangelists. After examining all the big name healing evangelists from the 1950s, 60s and 70s and up to this day, there is no evidence of any healing that has been documentally validated by medical professionals. Most of the supposed healings have been nothing more than hearsay, and requests for medical reports validating the healings have not materialised.

So, are people really getting healed through the speeches of Benny Hinn and others like him? NO, they are not! That's why I believe that they are all talk and nothing else.
 
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jiminpa

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It is true that in the church as a whole there is a lot of speech making about signs and wonders along with the gifts, but in most cases that's as far as it goes. Benny Hinn is very entertaining and gets whole sections of his congregation to fall down when he waves his jacket at them. The problem is that if there is enough power to cause a whole group to fall to the floor, how come there is not enough power to heal a wheelchair bound disabled person? He prays for a sick person who subsequently falls to the floor supposed under the power of God, but ends up going home as sick as he or she was when they first arrived. How can that be? How come the power that caused the person to fall to the floor didn't heal the person? The only conclusion is that what caused the person to fall to the floor was not the power of God at all otherwise the sick person would have been healed. This problem is observed with all the big name Word of Faith healing and prosperity preachers.

When Jesus and the Apostles healed sick people, no one seemed to fall to the floor, but they were immediately healed when they were ministered to. But today the scenario is like the fable of the Emperor's New Clothes. He and everyone around were convinced that he was wearing a fine new suit of clothes, but in reality he was in his underwear because the tailor was a crook. But everyone was convinced that the Emperor was wearing the new clothes, because they had blinded themselves to the fact that the new clothes didn't exist. This is the state of many in our churches. They are convinced that God heals people on demand, and are blind to the fact that very few people actually get healed, and that all the promises of healing from the healing evangelists are empty, and most sick and disabled people go home from their healing conferences not healed at all. Yet many convince themselves that they are healed when they are not, and cease taking their medication and going back to the doctor. As a result many become critically ill and death often results.

As it took a little child to cry out, "The Emperor has no clothes on!" to jolt people out of their self-deception, in the same way, we need to acknowledge that no one is getting healed as the result of the promises of the healing evangelists. After examining all the big name healing evangelists from the 1950s, 60s and 70s and up to this day, there is no evidence of any healing that has been documentally validated by medical professionals. Most of the supposed healings have been nothing more than hearsay, and requests for medical reports validating the healings have not materialised.

So, are people really getting healed through the speeches of Benny Hinn and others like him? NO, they are not! That's why I believe that they are all talk and nothing else.
Are you saying that no one is getting healed today?
 
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Are you saying that no one is getting healed today?
There are testimonies of people who have been healed, but there seems to be a real lack of actual before and after medical reports to validate most of the claims. Most of the healings I have heard about are for headaches, backaches and issues of that kind. But healing of heart conditions and cancer seems to be almost non existent, or hard to prove that it was the medication that achieved the result.

One of the nastiest form of deception has been the healing evangelist who would get a word of knowledge about a person having cancer, being prayed for, and when the patient went back to the doctor, no cancer was found. The truth is that there was no cancer in the first place, and the word of knowledge was fake.

I reckon that if there were any significant healing of terminal cancer or heart disease that was or is validated by before and after xrays and blood tests, those healings would be front page news. Researchers who went and interviewed people who were claimed to be healed, discovered that these people were not healed after all, and some had actually died because after being told they were healed stopped taking their medication and did not go back for further medical checkups.

I was with a particular Charismatic church in Palmerston North NZ over 7 years during the 1970s. During that time we had most of the prominent healing evangelists come holding meetings in our local high school hall, and during the several "transdenominational" conventions held at the local racecourse. All sorts of promises and claims were made about healing. One evangelist was described as being like Kathryn Kuhlman who could tell that someone was healed through a word of knowledge. The problem was that there were no notable reports of anyone actually being healed. In some of those meetings, there was the leg lengthening which looked convincing, but now has been exposed as a fraudulent trick as shown during Todd White's manipulation of a subject's foot to make it appear that the leg had been lengthened but he actually moved the other foot which observers didn't look at. When the process was speeded up, the fraud was clearly seen.

Fraudulent words of knowledge resulting from using social media through an iphone or ipad, or pre-meeting interviews, and even in the case of one evangelist who had a hidden earpiece and his wife transmitting details to it to make it appear that he was getting a word of knowledge, has brought that side of the healing ministry into disrepute. Yet, some of these fraudsters are still doing it!

I have carefully studied all the healing ministries, from Jack Coe, Oral Roberts, A.A. Allen T.L. Osborn, Benny Hinn, Curry Blake, John Wimber, plus all the lesser known ones who visited Palmerston North during the 1970s, and I can't locate any actual verified before and after medical reports that show that cancers, heart conditions, cerebral palsy, spinal injuries, brain injuries, or blindness have actually been healed through these ministries. I have listened to 130 testimonies on a DVD of healings through Bill Subritzky, but these are hearsay, and I don't see any validation through actual medical documents.

When Jesus healed the lame, blind, disabled and palsied people, it was done in the presence of many witnesses who saw without a doubt that the person was instantly and perfectly healed. No doubt about it. Even the Jewish Pharisees who were vehemently opposed to Jesus acknowledged the authenticity of the healing miracles. No hearsay there. So, either Jesus doesn't heal everyone on demand today, or the way the healing evangelists are going about it is fake and just a means to increase their wealth through the offerings of people who believe their empty promises.
 
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jiminpa

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There are testimonies of people who have been healed, but there seems to be a real lack of actual before and after medical reports to validate most of the claims. Most of the healings I have heard about are for headaches, backaches and issues of that kind. But healing of heart conditions and cancer seems to be almost non existent, or hard to prove that it was the medication that achieved the result.

One of the nastiest form of deception has been the healing evangelist who would get a word of knowledge about a person having cancer, being prayed for, and when the patient went back to the doctor, no cancer was found. The truth is that there was no cancer in the first place, and the word of knowledge was fake.

I reckon that if there were any significant healing of terminal cancer or heart disease that was or is validated by before and after xrays and blood tests, those healings would be front page news. Researchers who went and interviewed people who were claimed to be healed, discovered that these people were not healed after all, and some had actually died because after being told they were healed stopped taking their medication and did not go back for further medical checkups.

I was with a particular Charismatic church in Palmerston North NZ over 7 years during the 1970s. During that time we had most of the prominent healing evangelists come holding meetings in our local high school hall, and during the several "transdenominational" conventions held at the local racecourse. All sorts of promises and claims were made about healing. One evangelist was described as being like Kathryn Kuhlman who could tell that someone was healed through a word of knowledge. The problem was that there were no notable reports of anyone actually being healed. In some of those meetings, there was the leg lengthening which looked convincing, but now has been exposed as a fraudulent trick as shown during Todd White's manipulation of a subject's foot to make it appear that the leg had been lengthened but he actually moved the other foot which observers didn't look at. When the process was speeded up, the fraud was clearly seen.

Fraudulent words of knowledge resulting from using social media through an iphone or ipad, or pre-meeting interviews, and even in the case of one evangelist who had a hidden earpiece and his wife transmitting details to it to make it appear that he was getting a word of knowledge, has brought that side of the healing ministry into disrepute. Yet, some of these fraudsters are still doing it!

I have carefully studied all the healing ministries, from Jack Coe, Oral Roberts, A.A. Allen T.L. Osborn, Benny Hinn, Curry Blake, John Wimber, plus all the lesser known ones who visited Palmerston North during the 1970s, and I can't locate any actual verified before and after medical reports that show that cancers, heart conditions, cerebral palsy, spinal injuries, brain injuries, or blindness have actually been healed through these ministries. I have listened to 130 testimonies on a DVD of healings through Bill Subritzky, but these are hearsay, and I don't see any validation through actual medical documents.

When Jesus healed the lame, blind, disabled and palsied people, it was done in the presence of many witnesses who saw without a doubt that the person was instantly and perfectly healed. No doubt about it. Even the Jewish Pharisees who were vehemently opposed to Jesus acknowledged the authenticity of the healing miracles. No hearsay there. So, either Jesus doesn't heal everyone on demand today, or the way the healing evangelists are going about it is fake and just a means to increase their wealth through the offerings of people who believe their empty promises.
Are you saying that no one is called into healing ministry?
 
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Are you saying that no one is called into healing ministry?
There is no such thing as a healing ministry mentioned in the New Testament. This is why most if not all those who purport to have a healing ministry are unable to do more than talk about healing, and cannot produce actual evidence of any significant healing. A prominent healing "ministry" was asked to produce just five medical reports validating his claims of healing of significant medical issues. He couldn't do it. So, if God chooses not to answer their prayers for healing, it is a foregone conclusion that I choose not to put any confidence in their prayers if I at any time needed healing.
 
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