Discussion spirit of Christ and Holy Spirit differences

[enoob57]

The teaching of baptismal regeneration is error:
God specifically says about Himself-
Romans 2:11 (KJV)
[11] For there is no respect of persons with God.

This means the thief on the cross could not have been saved for he was not baptized *yet* Jesus said he was-
Luke 23:42 (KJV)
[42] And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
[43] And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

The course set is God would have to have respect of person to save this man if baptism was a necessary element in salvation!

 

[ARBITER01]

I've never thought of it like that. If I understand, then, you're viewing the term spirit of Christ more poetically, as a way to express the new creature we become and not as Jesus's Spirit, different from the Holy Spirit.

I view our regenerated human spirit as the spirit of Christ inside us. We are adopted into his family by that blood regeneration.

The Holy Spirit comes after our water immersion, just like it did for Jesus, and once we receive Him inside we are sealed unto the day of redemption.

Originally I thought the Holy Spirit was partially given at our rebirth, but I've since then recanted from that position.

 

[Aussie Pete]

Yes, we need so badly to be filled with the HS. I always wanted to make a thread about this, but i don't feel like an 'example', but not having this as a christian or not seeking it, because of wrong theology is so bad.

I resisted the baptism of the Holy Spirit for about 3 years. Partly this was because of some unhelpful experiences with hard line Pentecostals. It was also because I was bound up emotionally and I saw a lot of emotion in Pentecostal circles. The Christian life is a marathon. We all start off in different places and with different problems. Being baptised in the Holy Spirit is no guarantee of being spiritual. Paul rebuked the Corinthians. They come across as a Pentecostal church, yet they were full of problems.

Yes, we need to be baptised in the Holy Spirit. But even more we need a firm foundation in Christ. Too often, the power of the Spirit leads to pride, which then leads to a fall. I've seen this happen all too often. The Rock is to hear the words of Christ and obey them. It is not in speaking in tongues and prophesying.

 

[Aussie Pete]

I view our regenerated human spirit as the spirit of Christ inside us. We are adopted into his family by that blood regeneration.

The Holy Spirit comes after our water immersion, just like it did for Jesus, and once we receive Him inside we are sealed unto the day of redemption.

Originally I thought the Holy Spirit was partially given at our rebirth, but I've since then recanted from that position.

A mentor of mine put it like this: The Holy Spirit puts us into Christ when we are born again. Christ immerses us in the Holy Spirit when we receive the Holy Spirit after we are born again. If we are born again, we have the indwelling Christ in the Person of the Holy Spirit. What we lack is the power of the Holy Spirit.

You are right in that the Spirit of Christ is not the same as the Holy Spirit. The Spirit of Christ is His human side, so to speak. It's not that we partially receive the Holy Spirit. How can you have a part of God? However, the baptism of the Holy Spirit is a separate experience. Maybe not the best analogy, but we can drink a glass of water and so have the water inside of us. Then we can jump in the pool and be immersed in the water. The water is the same substance but the experience is different.

 

[NBB]

I resisted the baptism of the Holy Spirit for about 3 years. Partly this was because of some unhelpful experiences with hard line Pentecostals. It was also because I was bound up emotionally and I saw a lot of emotion in Pentecostal circles. The Christian life is a marathon. We all start off in different places and with different problems. Being baptised in the Holy Spirit is no guarantee of being spiritual. Paul rebuked the Corinthians. They come across as a Pentecostal church, yet they were full of problems.

Yes, we need to be baptised in the Holy Spirit. But even more we need a firm foundation in Christ. Too often, the power of the Spirit leads to pride, which then leads to a fall. I've seen this happen all too often. The Rock is to hear the words of Christ and obey them. It is not in speaking in tongues and prophesying.

Yes, but being filled with the HS, is so much more than tongues and all that, is the person of Him, in you in a great way, someone who is going to treat with you, and protect you, and more, accompanying you always, and he is so kind and loving.

 

[NBB]

A mentor of mine put it like this: The Holy Spirit puts us into Christ when we are born again. Christ immerses us in the Holy Spirit when we receive the Holy Spirit after we are born again. If we are born again, we have the indwelling Christ in the Person of the Holy Spirit. What we lack is the power of the Holy Spirit.

You are right in that the Spirit of Christ is not the same as the Holy Spirit. The Spirit of Christ is His human side, so to speak. It's not that we partially receive the Holy Spirit. How can you have a part of God? However, the baptism of the Holy Spirit is a separate experience. Maybe not the best analogy, but we can drink a glass of water and so have the water inside of us. Then we can jump in the pool and be immersed in the water. The water is the same substance but the experience is different.

I disagree a bit, being filled with the Holy spirit is not just power, is the person himself in you, filling you, tongues and prophesying and all that is just a minor thing compared to having this person in this way in you.

 

[NBB]

Yes, but being filled with the HS, is so much more than tongues and all that, is the person of Him, in you in a great way, someone who is going to treat with you, and protect you, and more, accompanying you always, and he is so kind and loving.

Yes, the analogy of the person being like a vessel, and there can be varying degrees, of this 'filling' you could be filled a bit or full, etc.
And we need to congregate where the presence of God is, to maintain the spirit of God lit up.
I believe a christian can't survive spiritually if they don't congregate.
God promised to show up where there are 2 or 3 congregated, not 1 alone.

 

[ARBITER01]

If we are born again, we have the indwelling Christ in the Person of the Holy Spirit. What we lack is the power of the Holy Spirit.

Scripturally, it would be this,...

- Regenerated human spirit (spirit of Christ)

- Water immersed

- Filled with The Holy Spirit (gifts/fruits given to us)

- Holy Spirit resting upon us in power (because of the anointing upon our heads)

The last step is the hardest to receive because satan fights against us to keep us from receiving the anointing.

 

[Aussie Pete]

Scripturally, it would be this,...

- Regenerated human spirit (spirit of Christ)

- Water immersed

- Filled with The Holy Spirit (gifts given to us)

- Holy Spirit resting upon us in power (because of the anointing upon our heads)

The last step is the hardest to receive because satan fights against us to keep us from receiving the anointing.

The last step is also hardest because the anointing easily lost by carelessness and sin.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

Christ in the Father, the Father in Him, you in Christ, Christ in you. The Spirit in Christ, Christ in the Spirit, the Spirit in me, me in Him. The Spirit of Christ in those long before Peter was pointing them to the coming of Christ and the surrounding events.

We are to receive the Holy Spirit as a seal and the fruit of the Spirit is written in Galatians 5:22, love...

This is like a unit of special nature a unit of Christ and the Spirit, that weld into the centre of our hearts, hearts like thrones and comes to king to sit and rule as we allow Him. We surrender to Him and He gives us love... self control. On His shoulders.

We can go on to receive the Father's love.

Leading to the strength necessary to receive Christ, can be a drink of living water and a cover over for a moment in living water.

Jesus' sacred blood may open our hearts to receive Him or the Spirit.

Jesus' blood can be again and again, also the living water. We need receive Christ once.

An anointing can be given in one measure and unlike salvation is much about service to others. Isaiah 11:2 and Luke 4.

We should receive more and more of the Holy Spirit or Jesus' blood to remain functional. Such as each morning.

The Father is Spirit and the Son and the Holy Spirit. The Son proceeds from the Father and the Spirit from the Son.

From Jesus' throne comes living water, but is that Christ's Holy Spirit or the Holy Spirit? Jesus' sacred blood is an endless resource. Glorious and powerful.

I suppose the Holy Spirit sends forth the portions of the anointing. And His fire, gold. Jesus sends forth bread and blood.

The scriptures say the Spirit has a mind and also a will and emotions.

 

[I's2C]

1st off wherever the FATHER, SON are, the HOLY SPIRIT is also.

Holy SPIRIT was not sent to strive with man until 50 days after Crucifixion (Pentecost). Act 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.

Act 2:4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

CHRIST had told them HE would send the HOLY SPIRIT and give them power on this day as a help meat when this happens 50 days after Passover, CHRIST who became our sacrificial Lamb.

CHRIST said this is when HE would send the COMFORTER and not until then. the Disciples had had GOD in the flesh with them and no need for the comforter for GOD was with them comforting them always.

Act 19:2 He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.

They did not receive the HOLY SPIRIT because they did not even know of CHRIST teaching only what JB preached who was the forerunner who indeed baptized of repentance. but after CHRIST who baptized with the HOLY SPIRIT all who believe that CHRIST was the only begotten SON of GOD the FATHER.

If you do not know or believe in CHRIST you will not receive the HOLY SPIRIT!!

Act 19:5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

Publicly accepted CHRIST, and believed and not until then were they able to receive the HOLY SPIRIT. When we who were baptized in a church or wherever we publicly accepted CHRIST and all HIS teachings and all who witness. When we publicly acknowledge CHRIST, HE acknowledges you to the FATHER and when we fully accept 100%, the HOLY SPIRIT will dwell with us. If this did not happen to you then you were not fully believing, GOD is a heart knower and knows your motives. Did you get baptized to please man or GOD..

The thief on the right side of CHRIST, on the cross believed in all that CHRIST was preaching on the cross and was saved because he believed on the SON of GOD that he was the SON of GOD.

Not even Moses the deliver had the HOLY SPIRIT with him; all his inspiration came from GODS own mouth. Abraham perhaps the most faithful of all did not have the HOLY SPIRIT either; everything he did he did on faith, loving GOD and by his devout faith good works were done. Same with Job arguably as righteous as Abraham did not have the HOLY SPIRIT but by his love and faithfulness to GOD overcame Satan.

Joh 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

Those who do not believe in CHRIST with 100% of his heart will not know the HOLY SPIRIT; there may be certain instances that one gets a sudden jolt of the Comforter but only those GOD knows and love GOD. You can’t say I believe a little bit or I believe mostly, you either 100% believe or you don’t there is no in between with GOD.

No one received the HOLY SPIRIT until then

Joh 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

This is because where ever the FATHER, SON are the HOLY SPIRIT is too.
In order for the HOLY SPIRIT to comfort man, JESUS had to not be there, for the SPIRIT is always in HIM, around HIM and all by faith who believe in HIM can be cured, saved.

Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

When we are consumed by the HOLY SPIRIT we will have remembrance of things past and future for we for that instance have 100% brain use. Things we have long forgotten about now become abundantly clear. I am sure many when studying have felt all of a sudden a warm peaceable feeling and all of a sudden a passage, you may have read a hundred times, becomes so clear and full understanding.

 

[Aussie Pete]

I disagree a bit, being filled with the Holy spirit is not just power, is the person himself in you, filling you, tongues and prophesying and all that is just a minor thing compared to having this person in this way in you.

The baptism of the Holy Spirit is not the same as the filling with the Spirit. Being filled is ongoing and requires something from us. The Baptism of the Holy Spirit is once and for all. The exhortation to "Be filled with the Spirit...." is literally, "Be being filled with the Spirit". We do this by praying and fellowship with Lord Jesus. It's a fine distinction and it is not especially important to make. It is more important to maintain fellowship by confessing sin and walking in the Spirit.

I agree that fruit is more important than gifts. Both are important, but God looks for fruit. The gifts are free, fruit is costly. We cannot live for ourselves and bear fruit at the same time. Yet the sin tolerant Corinthians were not lacking in gifts. Fruit? Not so much.

 

[AbbaLove]

I agree that fruit is more important than gifts. Both are important, but God looks for fruit. The gifts are free, fruit is costly. We cannot live for ourselves and bear fruit at the same time. Yet the sin tolerant Corinthians were not lacking in gifts. Fruit? Not so much.

Are not the true "Fruits of the Spirit" (Galatians 5:22-23) dependant on the indwelling/infilling of His Holy Spirit? Otherwise one could take some credit if these "Fruits" of the Spirit were also possible by mankind's own good works (secular humanism). For example the parable of the good-hearted "Good Samartan" (Luke 10:29–37) ...

Would not this seem to suggest that the Baptism of the Holy Spirit isn't always necessary before one can carry/display some of the "Fruits of the Holy Spirit" ? OR must the one time initial Baptism of the Holy spirit always precede an infilling/anointing of one or more "Fruits" the Holy Spirit ?

Does the "Baptism of the Holy Spirit" always precede the "Anointing/Infilling of the Holy Spirit" ?

Bible Verses on Anointing/Infilling of the Holy Spirit ...​

1. Luke 1:67 – Zacharias prophesied​

2. Acts 2 – Disciples were filled, former coward Peter boldly preached and 3000 were converted.​

3. Acts 4:8-14 Peter filled with the Holy Spirit spoke to Caiaphas and Alexander with boldness. Priests observed the confidence of Peter and John and understood that they were uneducated and untrained men, they were amazed.​

4. Acts 4:24-32 Read this prayer that was prayed. They asked the Lord to help them speak with confidence, asked Lord to extend Your hand to heal, and signs and wonders. It then says the place where they had gathered together was shaken, and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and they spoke Word of God with boldness. This sounds like a revival to me. This is evidence that the disciples were filled with Holy Spirit more than once.​

5. Acts 6:3 Disciples asked that 7 men be selected to help serve meals. One of the requirements was to be filled with the Spirit. How many people would we have to chose from today to serve tables if this was a requirement?​

6. Acts 7:55 Stephen was filled with the Spirit when he was being stoned.​

7. Acts 13:52 (NKJV) The disciples were filled with joy and with the Holy Spirit.​

8. Galatians 5:16 (NKJV) Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh.​

9. Acts 1:8 (NKJV) But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.” Where is the churches power today?​

10. Ephesians 5:18-21 (NKJV) And do not be drunk with wine, in which is dissipation; but be filled with the Spirit, speaking to one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord, giving thanks always for all things to God the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, submitting to one another in the fear of God.​

Are not the Infilling and Anointing of the Holy Spirit one and the same ? ​

 

[Aussie Pete]

Are not the true "Fruits of the Spirit" (Galatians 5:22-23) dependant on the indwelling/infilling of His Holy Spirit? Otherwise one could take some credit if these "Fruits" of the Spirit were also possible by mankind's own good works (secular humanism). For example the parable of the good-hearted "Good Samartan" (Luke 10:29–37) ...

View attachment 341849​

Would not this seem to suggest that the Baptism of the Holy Spirit isn't always necessary before one can carry/display some of the "Fruits of the Holy Spirit" ? OR must the one time initial Baptism of the Holy spirit always precede an infilling/anointing of one or more "Fruits" the Holy Spirit ?

Does the "Baptism of the Holy Spirit" always precede the "Anointing/Infilling of the Holy Spirit" ?

Bible Verses on Anointing/Infilling of the Holy Spirit ...​

1. Luke 1:67 – Zacharias prophesied​

2. Acts 2 – Disciples were filled, former coward Peter boldly preached and 3000 were converted.​

3. Acts 4:8-14 Peter filled with the Holy Spirit spoke to Caiaphas and Alexander with boldness. Priests observed the confidence of Peter and John and understood that they were uneducated and untrained men, they were amazed.​

4. Acts 4:24-32 Read this prayer that was prayed. They asked the Lord to help them speak with confidence, asked Lord to extend Your hand to heal, and signs and wonders. It then says the place where they had gathered together was shaken, and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and they spoke Word of God with boldness. This sounds like a revival to me. This is evidence that the disciples were filled with Holy Spirit more than once.​

5. Acts 6:3 Disciples asked that 7 men be selected to help serve meals. One of the requirements was to be filled with the Spirit. How many people would we have to chose from today to serve tables if this was a requirement?​

6. Acts 7:55 Stephen was filled with the Spirit when he was being stoned.​

7. Acts 13:52 (NKJV) The disciples were filled with joy and with the Holy Spirit.​

8. Galatians 5:16 (NKJV) Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh.​

9. Acts 1:8 (NKJV) But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.” Where is the churches power today?​

10. Ephesians 5:18-21 (NKJV) And do not be drunk with wine, in which is dissipation; but be filled with the Spirit, speaking to one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord, giving thanks always for all things to God the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, submitting to one another in the fear of God.​

Are not the Infilling and Anointing of the Holy Spirit one and the same ? ​

Fruit and gifts are not the same. The fruit of the Spirit is only possible for those who are born again. The Lord Jesus dwells in the believer in the Person of the Holy Spirit. That is eternal. The Baptism in the Holy Spirit is a separate experience. I've met plenty of hard and harsh Pentecostals who have gifts but little fruit. Derek Prince said, "I've been Pentecostal long enough to know what legalism is!"

The Baptism of the Holy Spirit is a one time experience. I've been in trouble spiritually and yet God has still given me a word of wisdom for someone. Being filled with the Spirit should be our normal condition, but we can grieve or quench the Holy Spirit quite easily. Christians worry about what we do to God when we sin. God is concerned about what happens to us when we sin. Jesus is the life of the born again believer. Sinning is like cutting the air supply for a deep sea diver. That is why it is so important to confess our sins.

This leads me to declare the root of the Church's problems. Christians seem unable to grasp the truth that Jesus really is the new life of the believer. We accept that Jesus is the only way to God. We accept that everything Jesus says is the Truth. But Jesus is now our very life? Very few know this. If Christians did, many problems would evaporate immediately. So many are full of doubt and unbelief because they seek an answer in themselves. They worry that they are not doing the right thing. If they knew that Jesus was living in them to be all that God requires them to be, they would suffer much less. There is a further stage though. It is vital to relinquish all hope in self and depend on Lord Jesus to live out His life in us, through us and in place of what was there before. This is not automatic. We must choose.

I spent decades struggling, OK for a while, failing at something and sinking into hopelessness. I remember the day I saw the truth as clearly as the day I was born again. When I was born again, the burden of sin lifted. When I saw Jesus as my Life, the burden of self lifted. I knew the scriptures and studied them for years. But I still did not get it. Finally God opened my eyes. I imagine that He was fed up with my yo-yo experience!

Does this work in experience? If not, it is just another doctrine. Yes, it works. A bit over 3 years ago, I had a bout of pancreatitis. It is a miserable and painful illness with a 30% death rate for people my age. In spite of the trial, I was at peace. It was 6 of the worst days of my life. Yet Jesus was with me every moment. I was able to witness to one of the doctors. Another doctor told me I was not taking the illness seriously. My now wife visited as often as she could (it was COVID time) and prayed for me, aloud. The doctor I'd witnessed to was there. She told me later that my wife's prayer had been answered to the word. I was playing Christian songs on my mobile phone. A couple of Christian nurses told me that they were encouraged by the songs.

There are two anointings. The first is what we receive from the Holy One when we are born again. It is for the work that God calls us to as individuals. There is also an anointing for specific occasions and needs. I received a gift of faith for a man with an abscessed tooth. He was in agony, it was a Sunday and he had to ride a motor bike 100 km or so. I was saying in my heart that God does not heal teeth. The Lord said to me, "yes I do". I then had faith instead of doubt and prayed for the man. He was healed instantly. That was 40 years ago and I've had nothing like it since.

 

[ARBITER01]

Are not the Infilling and Anointing of the Holy Spirit one and the same ?

No.

Pay attention to what Jesus said,...

Luk 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, Because he anointed me to preach good tidings to the poor: He hath sent me to proclaim release to the captives, And recovering of sight to the blind, To set at liberty them that are bruised,
Luk 4:19 To proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord.

The Holy Spirit was at rest upon Jesus because of the anointing He received after the wilderness. The filling and the anointing are different and separate things. You can be filled with The Spirit but not have the anointing upon your head.

 

[AbbaLove]

There are two anointings. The first is what we receive from the Holy One when we are born again. It is for the work that God calls us to as individuals. There is also an anointing for specific occasions and needs. I received a gift of faith for a man with an abscessed tooth. He was in agony, it was a Sunday and he had to ride a motor bike 100 km or so. I was saying in my heart that God does not heal teeth. The Lord said to me, "yes I do". I then had faith instead of doubt and prayed for the man. He was healed instantly. That was 40 years ago and I've had nothing like it since.

Thank you for your detailed reply and testimony of supernatural faith, Appreciate if you could further clarify the following portion of your above reply ...

"The first (anointing) is what we receive from the Holy One when we are born again. It is for the work that God calls us to as individuals. There is also an anointing for specific occasions and needs."​

​

Is a believer only "born again" (Titus 3:5) by the "anointing" of the Holy One and not by an "infilling" of the Holy One ... OR ... *both (anointing and infilling) can take place at the instant when one is "born again" ... only possible with New Covenant.​

​

OT Hebraic Covenant ...​

1. Luke 1:67 – Zacharias prophesied (anointing) ... Aren't all Hebrew Bible (OT) referenes to the supernatural power in a chosen man of GOD ... even Mary's prophetic words (Luke 1:46-55) an anointing and not an infilling.​

​

NT Jewish/Gentile Covenant ...​

5. Acts 6:3 Disciples asked that seven men be selected to help serve meals. One of the requirements was to be filled with the Spirit. (infilling)​

6. Acts 7:55 Stephen was filled with the Spirit when he was being stoned. (infilling)​

7. Acts 13:52 (NKJV) The disciples were filled with joy and with the Holy Spirit. (infilling)​

10. Ephesians 5:18-21 (NKJV) And do not be drunk with wine, in which is dissipation; but be filled with the Spirit, speaking to one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord, giving thanks always for all things to God the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, submitting to one another in the fear of God. (infilling)​

 

[Aussie Pete]

Thank you for your detailed reply and testimony of supernatural faith, Appreciate if you could further clarify the following portion of your above reply ...

"The first (anointing) is what we receive from the Holy One when we are born again. It is for the work that God calls us to as individuals. There is also an anointing for specific occasions and needs."​

​

Is a believer only "born again" (Titus 3:5) by the "anointing" of the Holy One and not by an "infilling" of the Holy One ... OR ... *both (anointing and infilling) can take place at the instant when one is "born again" ... only possible with New Covenant.​

​

OT Hebraic Covenant ...​

1. Luke 1:67 – Zacharias prophesied (anointing) ... Aren't all Hebrew Bible (OT) referenes to the supernatural power in a chosen man of GOD ... even Mary's prophetic words (Luke 1:46-55) an anointing and not an infilling.​

​

NT Jewish/Gentile Covenant ...​

5. Acts 6:3 Disciples asked that seven men be selected to help serve meals. One of the requirements was to be filled with the Spirit. (infilling)​

6. Acts 7:55 Stephen was filled with the Spirit when he was being stoned. (infilling)​

7. Acts 13:52 (NKJV) The disciples were filled with joy and with the Holy Spirit. (infilling)​

10. Ephesians 5:18-21 (NKJV) And do not be drunk with wine, in which is dissipation; but be filled with the Spirit, speaking to one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord, giving thanks always for all things to God the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, submitting to one another in the fear of God. (infilling)​

I don't use the word "supernatural" when referring to the things of God. God is Spirit. You won't find "supernatural" in the Bible.

Being born again is the work of the Holy Spirit working through the gospel. The Holy Spirit convicts of sin and reveals Jesus as Saviour. The part of us that is born again is the spirit. Our spirit man, which is the real "us", died to God when Adam rebelled in Eden. In creation, God spoke His word and the Holy Spirit carried it out. Likewise, the Word is spoken (faith comes by hearing) and the Holy Spirit causes the person to be born again. Exactly how this happens, I do not know.

You are correct in your understanding of the Holy Spirit in the OT. David could pray "do not take your Holy Spirit away from me." He was born again (I believe that of all the OT saints) but the Spirit did not indwell him. So yes, he was anointed as were the true and faithful prophets, priests and kings that trusted God.

Those who are born again can grieve or quench the Holy Spirit but they cannot lose Him.

The question is, what does it mean to be filled with the Spirit? This is how I see it. Two objects cannot occupy the same place. And two life sources likewise cannot be in control at the same time. Either we are controlled by self or we are controlled by the Spirit. "Self" is the life that Adam had in Eden. It is in the soul. The self of the soul was corrupted by Satan's nature when Adam put himself into subjection to Satan. So it is with every human being since. Only Jesus was born without the sin nature.

Once born again, Christians have a choice, something like Adam faced in Eden. We can try to retain the self of the soul, trying to force it to comply with what we perceived to be godly behaviour. Too many on this forum follow that pattern. Alternatively, we can submit entirely to the Lordship of Christ, relying solely on Him to live in place of the self of the soul. The former produces a form of godliness but has no power. The latter leads to a fruitful, joyful life that glorifies Jesus and blesses us personally.

Many Christians (I used to be a prime example) vacillate between self and Christ. There is a cost to being full of the Holy Spirit. Self must be put off before Jesus can become Lord in more than just words. To be born again costs nothing. To be full of the Holy Spirit costs everything. Every Christian, I believe, has something precious in their hearts that is not wrong, but is a hindrance to full surrender. I had more than one, but my son was one of them. I was separated shortly before my son's 6th birthday. I fully intended to go to his party. God said, "Don't go". I cried over my son. God said, "My Son died for you..............." Ah. Yes. Well. OK. I discovered 20 years later that it would have been a disaster if I'd gone.

There is the anointing that abides (1 John 2:27). Then there is the anointing that comes at various times. I've preached with the anointing and without it. With the anointing, people were edified and blessed. Without the anointing, some got some knowledge but that was all. With the anointing, I don't need notes. I speak from the deposit of truth that is already in my heart. If I don't have the anointing, it's better to say nothing.

 

[AbbaLove]

Having read the replies it seems that the title of this thread could have read the following in order to minimize any possible misinterpretation (confusion?) of what the OP was desiring to discuss ...

Discussion: spirit of Jesus and Spirit of Christ differences ...

The OP may believe the "spirit of Jesus" was without the infilling and anointing; whereas not so with the "Spirit of Christ" (therefore differences). Otherwise why would he spell "spirit" uncapitalized and the other "Spirit" capitalized?

It would have been helpful if the OP would conclude by defining "spirit of Jesus" in comparison to "Spirit of Christ". Does the OP believe the "spirit" of Jesus was somehow influenced by the the fallen nature of the "spirit" of mankind?

I don't believve Jesus was ever influenced by the corrupt nature of fallen man; although He was well aware of the condition of mankind. .

​

 

[ARBITER01]

Having read the replies it seems that the title of this thread could have read the following in order to minimize any possible misinterpretation (confusion?) of what the OP was desiring to discuss ...

Discussion: spirit of Jesus and Spirit of Christ differences ...

The OP may believe the "spirit of Jesus" was without the infilling and anointing; whereas not so with the "Spirit of Christ" (therefore differences). Otherwise why would he spell "spirit" uncapitalized and the other "Spirit" capitalized?

It would have been helpful if the OP would conclude by defining "spirit of Jesus" in comparison to "Spirit of Christ". Does the OP believe the "spirit" of Jesus was somehow influenced by the the fallen nature of the "spirit" of mankind?

I don't believve Jesus was ever influenced by the corrupt nature of fallen man; although He was well aware of the condition of mankind. .

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The title and discussion is perfectly fine.

 

[AbbaLove]

Matthew 2:21-23 ... The famiy (Jesus is atill a child) goes back to Israel and resides in Nazareth. Twenty plus years pass from the end of Matthew 2 to the beginning of Matthew 3.

Matthew 3 ... begins with Jesus being water baptized by John and Anointed by the Holy Spirit for His Ministry. Jesus as a child and through His 20s was not yet Anointed by the Holy Spirit for His Ministry. (Matthew 3:16-17).

This discussion may be whether or not the "spirit" of Jesus should still be capitalized as He was conceived by the Holy Spirit. There is no evidence and no reason for a born again Believer to consider that Jesus ever "sinned" as a child and young man before Baptized by John and Anointed by the Holy Spirit. Therefore "spirit" of Jesus is a misnomer if comparing to the "spirit" of fallen manknd.

To conclude one might assume the reason the OP didn't capitalize "spirit" of Jesus is because he may believe Jesus wasn't sinless until His Anointing. Jesus being the only begotten Son of Almighty GOD and the "Word" (John 1:1-3, 14) existed with Father GOD in the beginning and never unduly influenced (although tempted) by sin'/inquity (Matthew 4:1-11)

Even though Jesus wasn't Anointed until 30 the "spirit" of Jesus should still be capitalized ("Spirit"). To believe otherwise (theology) is in so many words implying that the "spirit" of Jesus as a child and young man was unduly influenced like the fallen nature of sinful mankind. Yet Jesus never sinned so the "Spirit" of Jesus is not be compared to the "spirit" of fallen mankind.

Today's enlightened modern Christian theology suggests that the Biblical account of Adam and Eve is an allegory. Todays' modern Christian theology calls into question whether there is a literal Hell. Postmodernism reminds the Christian theologian that theology is not complete, but a developing and maturing science. Postmoderism by many Israelis believes trading land for peace is the best humane solution. Postmoderism theology has its grip on re-interpreting our American Constitution, abortion, gay rights, transgenderism, legalizing marijuana, Physician-Assisted Dying, etc, etc, etc.

Just another indication of some of today's misplaced theology like referring to the "spirit" of Jesus when Jesus was a child and young man prior to being Anointed by the Holy Spirit (Matthew 3:16-17).