I Always Lose Debates With Non- Believers

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Not necessarily a good thing to lose a debate as it can further harden unbeliever's hearts against God by feeding their egos. I've learned at times to not debate or try to convince people who are already hostile towards God.

The last "debate" or "dialogue" I got into was online. I don't know how I got into that; it was a Facebook convo with some friends from high school, one of which is a hardcore atheist, another a liberal Christian. Rather than treat it as a win/lose debate, I treated it more as an AMA and honestly answered their questions. I don't think I changed any minds, but they did give me props for not being a complete jerk.
 
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Bobber

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If this way of doing things doesn't work for you, then maybe try something else. I have not found debate, or trying to prove points, to be fruitful ways of witnessing, in general. But being a living example of the good news, being willing to share and teach as you can, being willing to respond to the needs of those around you with loving service, being willing to challenge injustice and pursue peace, all of these might be much more fruitful ways to live out your calling.
Words of great wisdom.
 
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stevevw

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Dear Brothers and Sisters; I have been called, but I'm not very smart. Whenever I try to witness, I eventually get run over by the intellectual non-believers and then I feel and look foolish. They are very, very, intelligent. They tell me things about the Bible being false etc. They hurt me so much when they say that my Lord does not exist. So, I then do as Christ Jesus instructed and turn the other cheek and walk away from the discussion with my tail between my legs and head down. I do not like to debate. Poor example of a good witness I am! I will never be a good pastor or Scripture lawyer, I'm too stupid. I have no clue why I was called to spread seeds of The Living Word, but I still try.
I don't think you can be in a position to know what effect your words may have when you interact with others. As they say God works in mysterious ways. Romans 1:20 says 'For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse'.

So despite the other person winning the intellectual argument it may be a shallow victory because its not the truth. I think someone can think they have won the debate but still feel at a loss. Romans 1:21-23 says
'For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and crawling creatures'.

Sometimes I think people may be trying to convince themselves more than anyone they are debating with. Otherwise why bother. I think we all know God through the His creation that people intellectualize over. If this is the case then deep down people know that their arguments don't answer the important questions in life.

That is the beauty of Gods grace, you don't have to be an Einstein to know it. Like Jesus said we have to have that childlike faith because we cannot ever intellectualize ourselves into Gods kingdom but only through faith. As the Bible also says in Hebrews 11:1 'Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see'.

So no amount of evidence is going to cause someone to believe. If you had the answers that still won't make a difference. So maybe you are doing exactly what you should be doing and God will do the rest. That doesn't mean you can learn and as you grow so will your interactions with others. You may learn how to debate but more important is wisedom which can only come with time.
 
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The Liturgist

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Dear Brothers and Sisters; I have been called, but I'm not very smart. Whenever I try to witness, I eventually get run over by the intellectual non-believers and then I feel and look foolish. They are very, very, intelligent. They tell me things about the Bible being false etc. They hurt me so much when they say that my Lord does not exist. So, I then do as Christ Jesus instructed and turn the other cheek and walk away from the discussion with my tail between my legs and head down. I do not like to debate. Poor example of a good witness I am! I will never be a good pastor or Scripture lawyer, I'm too stupid. I have no clue why I was called to spread seeds of The Living Word, but I still try.
You know, here is food for thought: Christians need pastors, and so do atheists, but the difference is atheists are trying to prevent themselves from that need, like how a smoker needs to stop smoking but finds quitting too difficult (but through the grace of God, some people can be delivered, and also, we all have our vices and peccadillos; I use smoking as an example because of its known unhealthiness).

To have any chance of bringing over atheists, it helps to have a congregation of Christians, and to be visible in the community.

If you feel called to be a pastor, you should focus on being a servant to a group of Christians, perhaps in a denomination or existing church - there can be benefits to being a part of an existing church because the unity of the Body of Christ is stressed as important in 1 Corinthians and elsewhere in Scripture, and there are facilities to develop your vocation and train and so on, and from there you focus on serving the community.

And that is how atheists often get converted: A good friend of mine in his stride was proudly atheistic and reconciled with our Lord on his deathbed thanks to the comforting ministry provided by the wife of a Methodist elder.

So basically, to be a pastor, you just have to understand how the church works, and it is extremely simple: people worship God, baptizing new members of the community, perhaps infants, perhaps converts, in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost, reverently, and celebrate Holy Communion, perhaps spiritually in the manner of the Quakers or Salvation Army, but usually with bread and wine after the manner of the Last Supper as described in 1 Corinthians 11, doing all things decently and in order as the Holy Apostle Paul instructed, reading the scriptures and preaching the Gospel, and singing psalms, hymns and spiritual songs. From this group some people will be able to assist in serving the community, in many different capacities: food banks, various forms of health related services, collecting and distributing clothing, basically, acts of mercy: clothing the naked, feeding the hungry, sheltering the homeless, caring for the sick, visiting the imprisoned, comforting the bereaved, caring for widows and orphans and one’s own neighbors, and these acts will draw people to the church.

The main use for arguments against atheism is defensive, so as to strengthen the flock against the temptations of the world that would cause them to give up. Arguing with atheists is I think potentially counterproductive, because it encourages them in their false idolatry, for atheism is just another false religion, despite its pretentious claims to the contrary; indeed it is an ancient superstition which has been debunked probably millions of times by millions of intellectuals over the many thousand years of human civilization, just like sun worship, numerology, astrology and other really silly superstitions which are contrary to all piety. So don’t despair if you lost an argument to an atheist, because they thrive on getting into such arguments. Also, if one develops a novel argument against atheism, employing it against atheists exposes them to it; it is best that such wisdom be disseminated to the pious Christian youth to defend them from being bullied out of their faith.

I believe sincerely @glenninindy that you have good intentions and feel a real calling, and I find myself wanting to cheer you on and support you if you really want to be a pastor. Because a good pastor will help people.
 
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rockytopva

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In the same boat... Mate! When we had a plating department in our facility I worked myself up to Lab Technician and worked under a chemist. This chemist was very smart and very good at math. When he laid out equations he did so in very neat handwriting and there would be much activity as he turned the results of an analysis into an addition. I would take his calculations and put them in the form of visual basic functions and sub procedures.

Of all the years I worked with this man I had one opportunity to witness to him. I made my presentation while he was analyzing adhesion under a microscope in which you could hear the sounds... Scratch, scratch, scratch! Scratch scratch, scratch! After my presentation he just continued to look under the microscope as if he ignored everything I said so I just continued in my work. Then... The scratch scratch, scratching stopped! And he speaks!

"You know what I think it is?" He says while continuing to look under the microscope... "I think it is arrogance!"

And then, without taking his eyes off the microscope, he continues his work... Scratch, scratch, scratch! Scratch scratch, scratch! I did not reply but went about my work. Inside I feared he was right. In many cases religion can inhabit too much personal ego. And I too end up losing the challenge.
 

timewerx

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They hurt me so much when they say that my Lord does not exist.

That's because many Christians themselves behave like the Lord does not exist. Non-believers see nothing miraculous about Christians. The miraculous healings are really not the most convincing proof. But your/our own personal transformation that non-believers will see. Most Christians have nothing to show. They simply turn from one kind of habitual sinner into a different kind of habitual sinner. For example, they changed from drug addict criminal to a self-righteous person of greed spreading false teachings and that's even worse, way worse!

Although Christians say often and with conviction God exists, etc. Their actions betray them.

What's more, the Bible says something but many Christians believe the opposite of what it says. In some instances, Some Christians are even colder and more hateful than non-believers.

There's more to 'belief' than what you say or what's in your mind. Belief means you will go all the way to hell just to know the truth, to find the Lord. And to be honest, there's only few Christians in the world who has such convictions. I'm not one of them.

You're not alone in your problem. Many Christians are worse in debates. They present ridiculous arguments probably not even supported by sound Biblical doctrine. So they try to win by using 'circular reasoning'. They sometimes win but more likely, the non-believing side simply gave up because sound reasoning has left floor and they're just debating like drunkards.

My recommendation if you can't win debates. Don't try harder. Go a different path and continue seeking the Truth, the Lord, you have no idea what you may be missing.

You know the greatest miracle of all is your own salvation, not in winning other people to Christ because the truth of the matter is, only few can be saved, not many. Many are deceived. It takes far more effort to seeking the truth in this world built upon many foundations of lies than trying to win others to Christ.
 
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rturner76

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Dear Brothers and Sisters; I have been called, but I'm not very smart. Whenever I try to witness, I eventually get run over by the intellectual non-believers and then I feel and look foolish. They are very, very, intelligent. They tell me things about the Bible being false etc. They hurt me so much when they say that my Lord does not exist. So, I then do as Christ Jesus instructed and turn the other cheek and walk away from the discussion with my tail between my legs and head down. I do not like to debate. Poor example of a good witness I am! I will never be a good pastor or Scripture lawyer, I'm too stupid. I have no clue why I was called to spread seeds of The Living Word, but I still try.
Knock the dust off your feet and let them sit in their quagmire of spiritual life. These people are lost. You can't go too far into the wilderness to seek them out. This can knock you off of your path as they sew seeds of doubt. I just look at them as if they were robots. Unable to compute spiritual matters. It's not in their programming.
 
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IoanC

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Such debates don't work. Religion works in the heart and disbelief is rational. Unbelievers will always have all the weapons,while a religious person will always be peaceful. God is transcendent and mysterious, while atheism is realistic and normal.
 
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Sawsar

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Dear Brothers and Sisters; I have been called, but I'm not very smart. Whenever I try to witness, I eventually get run over by the intellectual non-believers and then I feel and look foolish. They are very, very, intelligent. They tell me things about the Bible being false etc. They hurt me so much when they say that my Lord does not exist. So, I then do as Christ Jesus instructed and turn the other cheek and walk away from the discussion with my tail between my legs and head down. I do not like to debate. Poor example of a good witness I am! I will never be a good pastor or Scripture lawyer, I'm too stupid. I have no clue why I was called to spread seeds of The Living Word, but I still try.
I am referring you to member AGTG. He has the gift of teaching. I recommend, you beginning reading his messages.
God Bless you
 
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ViaCrucis

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A quote I heard a long time ago comes from Philip Yancey, and I'm probably paraphrasing it here, "No one ever came to faith because they lost the argument."

That is, regardless of whether in a debate someone "wins" or "loses" it's not going to change whether or not a person believes. Faith in Christ can't come by having the best argument. Faith is, in a sense, a profoundly non-rational (or, perhaps, trans-rational) thing. For one, faith comes from God as a gift, not from ourselves (Ephesians 2:8-9). The Holy Spirit gives, works, and creates faith by the Gospel, as Paul says, "faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ" (Romans 10:17). After all, "we preach Christ crucified ... which is foolishness to the Greeks"--that is, to the philosopher, the student of rational inquiry, the Gospel is complete nonsense. The Gospel is not true because it is perfectly rational to say, "A Jewish carpenter is actually God in the flesh who suffered and died for the sins of the world, then rose again from the dead, and now He reigns in heaven as Lord over all", that is a patently absurd statement. So it is total nonsense to the one who doesn't have faith, but, as the Apostle also says, for us who believe Jesus Christ is "from God for us, wisdom, righteousness, sanctification, and redemption" (1 Corinthians 1:30).

So it's not about having the best argument, it's not about debate at all. Apologetics are good, not because we can make people believe by presenting an argument, but because the purpose of apologetics is to make clear what we believe against misunderstanding and confusion. The very word apologetic comes from the Greek apologia, meaning something like "a response with words"--a written or verbal response in order to clarify or defend.

Apologetics serve to make clear what we believe, to address certain charges which are false or confused, and to be completely transparent. But they aren't a means to make others believe. Only the grace of God in the Gospel--which Paul says is the power of God to save all who believe--can do that, for faith comes from Him, only God can take the sinful, broken, and stoney heart of man and rescusitate it and transform it into a muscle that pumps blood and new life, "For you were dead in your trespasses", but "because of His great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in our trespasses."

Others here have said a lot of very great things about being a witness through word and action, by living our faith, by speaking peace and justice and love, by giving answer, as St. Peter says, to the hope that is in us with gentleness and respect.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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Chaleb

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Dear Brothers and Sisters; I have been called, but I'm not very smart. Whenever I try to witness, I eventually get run over by the intellectual non-believers and then I feel and look foolish.

The Love of God is not a debate.
Its a fact of the Cross of Christ.
Dont debate with unbelievers, if you are trying to lead them to Jesus.

Here is the thing, glenninindy..

You are not the savior... you are the presenter of the Good news, that Christ has made it possible for all our sin to be forgiven and for us all to go to heaven.
That's it.
God is responsible for their Salvation......not you. You are just there to share the Love of God that is Jesus.


Something you might try..
Let say they are not wanting to listen.
Then, that is fine......but before you let them go......and if its a good place and time, then just say....>"would you mind if i prayed for you?
They'll probably say "Ok".
Then say....>"is there anything you need, a problem we can pray about".

"well.......you know....""" "i am having a problem"....

And then.... PRAY = God and JESUS into that problem for them........and thank them for taking care of that problem for them".

See that?
You are now showing them a FATHER and a SAVIOR , instead of a JUDGE and someone they are to fear.

That is a SEED that will grow in them.

Just plant the seed and God will watar it.
 
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anetazo

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Titus chapter 3. Don't debate or strive about God's word. Don't cast perils before swine. These Christian formats are best ways to plant seeds, produce fruit for God. Just share God's truth and move on. Don't look back, and argue with the person if they disagree with you. Don't even read their reply. Just plant seeds and move on, don't look back. Its unprofitable to debate or strive about the law. Read Titus chapter 3.. Peace.
 
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SavedByGrace3

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Dear Brothers and Sisters; I have been called, but I'm not very smart. Whenever I try to witness, I eventually get run over by the intellectual non-believers and then I feel and look foolish. They are very, very, intelligent. They tell me things about the Bible being false etc. They hurt me so much when they say that my Lord does not exist. So, I then do as Christ Jesus instructed and turn the other cheek and walk away from the discussion with my tail between my legs and head down. I do not like to debate. Poor example of a good witness I am! I will never be a good pastor or Scripture lawyer, I'm too stupid. I have no clue why I was called to spread seeds of The Living Word, but I still try.
Think about it.
What we have is a faith. It is the belief in things not seen. We are called to witness to something that is essentially invisible. Also the message we preach is about something that science and the world at large says cannot happen, namely the resurrection of a person 3 days dead. How does one debate about things that are invisible and impossible? Not a good topic if you are given to debates. This is why we are called to preach things, not debate them Just present the word. Don't try to talk people into it on an intellectual level. Debating is a good platform to present the word. Just present the word without trying to explain it. The word and the Holy Spirit do the work anyway. You are just a billboard.
Jesus died for our sins. He was buried, and rose from the dead on day 3. Push that. Trust the Spirit and the Word to do their jobs.
 
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