An Emergency Exposition of Revelation 11

[Jerryhuerta]

The Lord was crucified in Jerusalem. Jerusalem being called Sodom and Egypt is nothing new, read Ezekiel.

According to the NT, Christ was crucified outside of Jerusalem to signify he died for the world, not just for the descendants of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate. Let us go forth therefore unto him without the camp, bearing his reproach. For here have we no continuing city, but we seek one to come. (Hebrews 13:-8-9)​

Christ’s mediation commenced with presenting himself before the heavenly sanctuary. His mediation ended the Old Covenant, according to Hebews,

And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance… For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us. (Hebrews 9:15, 24)​

Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second. (Hebrews 10:9)​

Under Christ’s mediation, Jerusalem is interpreted as the city of the New Covenant, not the city under the Old.

Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid. (Matthew 5:14)​

For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all. (Galatians 4:25-26)​

According to the New Testament, the “Church” is the great city throughout Revelation, and it becomes the place where Christ is crucified again when it apostatizes,

For it is impossible for those who… were made partakers of the Holy Ghost… If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. (Hebrews 6:4, 6)​

Revelation is Christ’s mediation over the New Covenant, and the great city is not ancient Jerusalem.

The merchants of the earth were not made rich by Ancient Jerusalem, which is written about the great city of Babylon in Revelation.

Ancient Jerusalem did not make “all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication,” which is written about the great city of Babylon in Revelation.

Ancient Jerusalem did not reign “over the kings of the earth,” which is written about the great city of Babylon in Revelation.

And the kings and rich merchants of the earth certainly did not wail and weep over the destruction of Ancient Jerusalem, which is written about the great city of Babylon in Revelation.

The futurist and preterist beliefs about Revelation are entirely exposed by the historicist paradigm when it is wielded by those who know the true history of the Church.

 

[Fisherking]

The scarlet coloured beast represents the third, final, and most depraved phase of Daniel 7’s fourth beast system; the first of those three phases was the Great Red Dragon of Rev 12 (Pagan Roman Empire), the second was the Beast from the Sea of Revelation 13 (European civilisation with an apostate Christian veneer), and the third "that was, is not and yet is" being the West as a bloc under final-phase Marxist (aka Globalist) control.

You are conflating the Beasts. They are SELF IDENTIFIED in each chapter by the Crowns.

Rev. 12 is Satan, the Red Dragon chases Israel (Woman/Gen. 37:9 code) and he has CROWNS on every Head because of course as he told Jesus in Luke 4, all the kingdoms of the world have been given unto him. The 7 Headed Beast is only about one region, the Mediterranean Sea Region and the Beasts over her, as in Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece, Rome and the coming Man of Sin/Little Horn/A.C.

Rev. 13 is the A.C. only, notice he has CROWNS only on the 10 horns which mean Revived Rome (E.U.) and the number 10 signifies "Completion" thus the 10 horns/kings = the E.U. in Completion, whether it be 8 Nations to begin with or 27 to end or whatever number, the 10 means the Complete E.U. Thus the 10 CROWNS are on the 10 Horns ONLY, because the Anti-Christ is only over the E.U. as the human President.

The Scarlet Colored Beast of Rev. 17 is Apollyon, that is why is WAS.........IS NOT.......YET IS, he gets locked up in the bottomless pit by God during the Church Age, thus he was placed over the Mediterranean Sea Region by Satan, thus he was over Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece and Rome (he WAS) and then after Rome fell he WAS NOT (he was placed in the pit) but he YET IS (he will be released). The Scarlet Colored Beast will be released, be placed over the A.C. and thus he will have been OF THE SEVEN....and he us an 8th king (of the Bottomless Pit thus he has NO CROWNS in Rev. 17 because Rev. 17 is about the earth and the Mediterranean Sea Region, not the Bottomless Pit.

 

[Douggg]

The futurist and preterist beliefs about Revelation are entirely exposed by the historicist paradigm when it is welded by those who know the true history of the Church.

Jerry, Ezekiel 39 provides the framework for end time events. All of the end time event timeframes fit within the 7 years following the Gog/Magog event.

Gog/Magog event is latter days, latter years, Ezekiel 38:8 and Ezekiel 38:16, and is close at hand.

btw, did you mean "wielded" not welded ?

 

[Puritan_Jay]

You are conflating the Beasts. They are SELF IDENTIFIED in each chapter by the Crowns.

Rev. 12 is Satan, the Red Dragon chases Israel (Woman/Gen. 37:9 code) and he has CROWNS on every Head because of course as he told Jesus in Luke 4, all the kingdoms of the world have been given unto him. The 7 Headed Beast is only about one region, the Mediterranean Sea Region and the Beasts over her, as in Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece, Rome and the coming Man of Sin/Little Horn/A.C.

Rev. 13 is the A.C. only, notice he has CROWNS only on the 10 horns which mean Revived Rome (E.U.) and the number 10 signifies "Completion" thus the 10 horns/kings = the E.U. in Completion, whether it be 8 Nations to begin with or 27 to end or whatever number, the 10 means the Complete E.U. Thus the 10 CROWNS are on the 10 Horns ONLY, because the Anti-Christ is only over the E.U. as the human President.

The Scarlet Colored Beast of Rev. 17 is Apollyon, that is why is WAS.........IS NOT.......YET IS, he gets locked up in the bottomless pit by God during the Church Age, thus he was placed over the Mediterranean Sea Region by Satan, thus he was over Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece and Rome (he WAS) and then after Rome fell he WAS NOT (he was placed in the pit) but he YET IS (he will be released). The Scarlet Colored Beast will be released, be placed over the A.C. and thus he will have been OF THE SEVEN....and he us an 8th king (of the Bottomless Pit thus he has NO CROWNS in Rev. 17 because Rev. 17 is about the earth and the Mediterranean Sea Region, not the Bottomless Pit.

I'm not conflating anything; rather, you are.

The evil beasts in Apocalyptic prophecy are empires or blocs acting as proxies of Satan, but are not Satan himself. The Great Red Dragon of Rev 12 is not the same as merely "the dragon" of Rev 12. John Gill, for example, explained this superbly in his commentary.

Rev 13's Beast from the Sea is a continuation of the same thing that first manifested as the Great Red Dragon, and Rev 17's Scarlet Beast from the Bottomless Pit is it in its final phase. All 3 phases collectively are unified under Daniel 7's fourth beast system.

The AC is only the Little Horn of the Beast from the Sea, not the entire thing.

The symbolism is thus:

1. Evil beasts = power blocs or empires, as confirmed by Daniel 7.
2. Heads = forms / types of government (e.g. kings, emperors, dictators, etc.)
3. Horns = individual kingdoms or governments within the broader bloc or empire.
4. Crowns = sovereignty or autonomy of rulership within the bloc.

This is why the beast system in its final phase lacks crowns... the western governments have surrendered all their sovereignty to the supranational scarlet entity "that was, is not (a thing of the past, or so we thought) and yet is", i.e., communism. We are facing a communist attack and next year, it will be that very agency, communism, calling itself globalism or democracy (as it laughably often did during the Cold War) or whatever, that kills the Lord's public witness in every western country through its hate speech laws.

 

[Puritan_Jay]

Apparently, you’re coming from a postmillennial form of historicism with your notion that the fifth kingdom is the rock cut out without hands. The rock strikes the period of the feet, not the iron legs (Daniel 2:34, 44). Daniel 7 affirms that the little horn is a beast that comes out of the Roman empire, the legs, and contends with Christ at his return, making it the fifth kingdom. At the same time, Revelation reveals two more kingdoms, the beast from the earth and the image, before the scarlet beast rises from the abyss to kill the two witnesses. That's seven, nay eight kings (Revelation 17:9-11).

The fifth kingdom is the papacy. The rise of Protestantism wounded it, and history affirms that it had the merchants subdued while it held power over the Western world. As I said, no argument prevails against this truth. We live in a time of rich merchants, and Protestantism promoted our secular society to the kings and princes of the earth, which enriched the merchants. It was Protestantism that held intercourse with the kings of the earth, and “the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.”

Furthermore, the influence of the Protestants also led to the merchandise of religion, which historians of our day affirm. I have documented this in my work. You might want to read Odo W. Middelmann's The Market-Driven Church. I cite several contemporary authors in my work who substantiate that we live in the Laodicean era. The Philadelphian era can be affirmed as the end of the 2300 days/years in 1844, which is no coincidence when the merchants made their greatest strides in laissez-faire.

And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed. (Daniel 8:14)​

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For our God is a consuming fire. (Hebrews 12:29).​

My work scares and upsets most "Christians."

It's a "notion" that hopefully you will live to see begin later this decade.

Daniel 7 does not make the Little Horn (which is the Papacy) a beast of its own, but rather a principal operator within the fourth beast system. It cannot be part of the fourth beast system and then, at the same time, a beast system all of its own. That would be straining the symbolism beyond credulity. The fifth monarchy of Daniel 7 is the kingdom that the saints of the most High will begin to possess when the Little Horn's toxic influence and position of esteem in the sight of even the irreligious in the West finally comes to an end, laer this very decade, as the ENglish Puritans et al correctly understood.

You can invoke the entirety of modern Protestant Reformed theological output to support the view that we are in the Laodicean era, but it does not alter the fact that it is not the case.

Where was the judgment on Sardis of Rev 3v3?

Why is the command to Sardis repeated in Rev 16v15, on the eve of Armageddon?

Where was the Philadelphian church era, with the conversion of the Jews to Christ and the nations falling into the hands of godly rulers? Not the age of the missionaries in the 1800s, as that was polluted with Arminianism and more harm done to the Regulative Principle of worship.

Sadly, modern theologians just will not read the old writers. They think they're too smart for that or they can't be bothered looking at old texts with mile long paragraphs.

Through the terrifying new hate speech laws currently in motion, the church will be gagged next year, in 2025, with a "like a thief" visitation for turning away from the advances of Sardis' "morning star" which was the Reformation and for having a name that it lives, but is actually dead. You don't have long to wait to see if my interpretation is correct, and after that happens, then will come the 7 last plagues as we run up to global war.

However, as I have said before, the church cannot receive this message now (bar a tiny number).

 

[Douggg]

Jesus is not coming back any time soon, and certainly not right after the Gog-Magog war (which is the opening act of , or trigger for, Armageddon).

The parable of the fig tree generation will see Jesus's return.

The fig tree represents Jerusalem. Matthew 21:18-20.

1967 the Jews back in control of Jerusalem + 70 years/generation Psalms 90:10 = 2037. Jesus will return not later than the end of 2037.

minus 7 years for the 70th week of Daniel 9:27, which is the 7 years following Gog/Magog event in Ezekiel 39.

So 2037 minus 7 years = 2030. The Gog/Magog event will take place not later than the end of 2030. We are really close.

In Ezekiel 39:21-29 is Jesus Himself speaking in the text having returned to this earth, His Second Coming.

 

[contratodo]

I think the two witnesses are actual men.
Actual fire will come out of their mouths, only the beast and false prophet will be able to contend with them.

The beast is cyborg man, fierce countenance seeming to have been saved from death by technology.
The anti-Christ is super man, flying around and sending fire down on a seeming anti-Christ.

The two witnesses will testify right before the beast and false prophet come on the scene.

Before that, thunders will sound.
Things will fall from heaven.

There will be a change, a shift, then the two prophets actually arrive.
They will likely give a true account of the scriptures and the teachings of Christ.
They will cause plagues like turning waters to blood.
They will get killed by cyborg man and their dead bodies lie in the open,
people rejoicing that they were able to be killed,
but after three days and a half they rise back to life and ascend up beyond the sky.

The beast then speaks blaspheme against God and those beyond the sky.

 

[Jerryhuerta]

Jerry, Ezekiel 39 provides the framework for end time events. All of the end time event timeframes fit within the 7 years following the Gog/Magog event.

Gog/Magog event is latter days, latter years, Ezekiel 38:8 and Ezekiel 38:16, and is close at hand.

btw, did you mean "wielded" not welded ?

And look, the "seven years" of famine in Genesis 41:27 also provides the framework for end-time events! How absurd.

Have you not eyes to read the narrative of Gog and Magog in Ezekiel, which runs parallel to the expiration of the thousand years,

And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. (Revelation 20:7-8)​

You have the narrative come before Christ returns for the second time.

Furthermore, you have Christ returning under the Old Covenant to judge Daniel’s people. But in Christ, there “is neither Jew nor Greek.” The Old Covenant, in which Daniel’s people were judged, ended when Christ anointed the most holy sanctuary at his ascension, fulfilling Daniel 7:24.

 

[Jerryhuerta]

It's a "notion" that hopefully you will live to see begin later this decade.

Daniel 7 does not make the Little Horn (which is the Papacy) a beast of its own, but rather a principal operator within the fourth beast system. It cannot be part of the fourth beast system and then, at the same time, a beast system all of its own. That would be straining the symbolism beyond credulity.

Really, concerning the little horn Daneil prophecies, “I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame. As concerning the rest of the beasts, they had their dominion taken away: yet their lives were prolonged for a season and time.” (Daniel 7:11-12)

The term “beast” is defined in the context, and historicists hold it as a kingdom, like Rome, which vindicates the papacy as the fifth kingdom. Concerning the other beasts, including Rome, their dominions were taken away. You do know the Roman empire had its dominion taken away by the German kings in the year 476 AD, don’t you? The German kings are illustrated by the ten horns, feet, and toes in Nebuchadnezzar’s image.

The fifth monarchy of Daniel 7 is the kingdom that the saints of the most High will begin to possess when the Little Horn's toxic influence and position of esteem in the sight of even the irreligious in the West finally comes to an end, laer this very decade, as the ENglish Puritans et al correctly understood.

You failed to perceive my point concerning Daniel 2:34, 44. The rock strikes the feet, not the legs, which means Christ's kingdom commences during the period of the feet, not the legs. Postmillennialists fallaciously hold that the rock strikes the legs to have Christ’s kingdom commence with his first advent.

As for the saints’ possession of their kingdom, Christ says that happens when he returns,

And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father. (Revelation 2:26-27)​

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To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne. (Revelation 3:21)​

At Christ’s return, he rewards the overcomers of this age with authority in his millennial reign,

Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. (Revelation 20:6)​

I need you to explain to us how we are reigning over the nation as priests with Christ in a secular society, one in which the Protestants fostered by their intercourse with the princes and kings of the earth.

You can invoke the entirety of modern Protestant Reformed theological output to support the view that we are in the Laodicean era, but it does not alter the fact that it is not the case.

Where was the judgment on Sardis of Rev 3v3?

Why is the command to Sardis repeated in Rev 16v15, on the eve of Armageddon?

Where was the Philadelphian church era, with the conversion of the Jews to Christ and the nations falling into the hands of godly rulers? Not the age of the missionaries in the 1800s, as that was polluted with Arminianism and more harm done to the Regulative Principle of worship.

Sadly, modern theologians just will not read the old writers. They think they're too smart for that or they can't be bothered looking at old texts with mile long paragraphs.

Through the terrifying new hate speech laws currently in motion, the church will be gagged next year, in 2025, with a "like a thief" visitation for turning away from the advances of Sardis' "morning star" which was the Reformation and for having a name that it lives, but is actually dead. You don't have long to wait to see if my interpretation is correct, and after that happens, then will come the 7 last plagues as we run up to global war.

However, as I have said before, the church cannot receive this message now (bar a tiny number).

What is not altered is the fact that we live in a market-driven society in which even the Church is caught up in acquisitiveness and covetousness. Gaslighting doesn’t alter this fact, and anecdotal and historical evidence substantiates it.

As for judgment, we’ve been plucked off the land to work as wage earners at the mercy of the banks and corporations, while our children are wasted in foreign wars to enrich the military-industrial complex, to name a few chastisements. And postmillennialist try and gaslight us were in the kingdom of Christ! How absurd. There is nothing new under the sun; the people under the Old Covenant didn’t know when God was judging them, and neither does the Church,

Yea, the stork in the heaven knoweth her appointed times; and the turtle and the crane and the swallow observe the time of their coming; but my people know not the judgment of the LORD. (Jeremiah 8:7)​

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Who gave Jacob for a spoil, and Israel to the robbers? did not the LORD, he against whom we have sinned? for they would not walk in his ways, neither were they obedient unto his law. Therefore he hath poured upon him the fury of his anger, and the strength of battle: and it hath set him on fire round about, yet he knew not; and it burned him, yet he laid it not to heart. (Isaiah 42: 24-25)​

The four horsemen in Revelation illustrate the judgment on the Church, and if we love God with all our heart, mind, and soul, he reveals they rode forth in our modern time.

 

[Douggg]

And look, the "seven years" of famine in Genesis 41:27 also provides the framework for end-time events! How absurd.

Jerry, Jesus Himself is not speaking in Genesis 41, having returned to this earth, like Ezekiel 39:21-29.

That it is Jesus Himself speaking in the text of Ezekiel 39:21-29 is the end of the 7years, completing all of the end times prophesies.

Ezekiel 39:28 is Matthew 24:31.

Ezekiel 39:17-20 is the Armageddon event.

The 7 years following the Gog/Magog event in Ezekiel 39:9-10 are the 7 years of Daniel 9:27.

The confirmation of the covenant for 7 years in Daniel 9:27 will be by the little horn person, as the prince who shall come, who the Jews following Gog/Magog will initially think that he is their long awaited messiah. As such, the person will be anointed the King of Israel, becoming the Antichrist.

During the first 7 months following the Gog/Magog event, the Jews will built their next temple and the daily sacrifice begun again.

Later, their thought to be messiah, the Antichrist, will stop the daily sacrifice, and expose himself as the man of sin.

Have you not eyes to read the narrative of Gog and Magog in Ezekiel, which runs parallel to the expiration of the thousand years,

The referral to Gog and Magog at the expiration of the thousand years is that it will be the same nations that made up the Gog/Magog event nations of Ezekiel 38-39 a thousand years earlier.

You have the narrative come before Christ returns for the second time.

Ezekiel 39:21-29 is Jesus's Second Coming. Jesus's first coming was 2000 years ago, when He died on the cross for atonement of our sins.

Furthermore, you have Christ returning under the Old Covenant to judge Daniel’s people. But in Christ, there “is neither Jew nor Greek.” The Old Covenant, in which Daniel’s people were judged, ended when Christ anointed the most holy sanctuary at his ascension, fulfilling Daniel 7:24.

No, I do not.

During the 7 years following the Gog/Magog event, the Jews will turn to Jesus and the gospel of salvation. Revelation 12:10.

Jesus does not return to judge Daniel's people the Jews, but to rescue them from the time of Great Tribulation, that will take place the last 1335 days of the 7 years following the Gog/Magog event.

 

[Jerryhuerta]

Jerry, Jesus Himself is not speaking in Genesis 41, having returned to this earth, like Ezekiel 39:21-29.

That it is Jesus Himself speaking in the text of Ezekiel 39:21-29 is the end of the 7years, completing all of the end times prophesies.

Ezekiel 39:28 is Matthew 24:31.

Ezekiel 39:17-20 is the Armageddon event.

The 7 years following the Gog/Magog event in Ezekiel 39:9-10 are the 7 years of Daniel 9:27.

The confirmation of the covenant for 7 years in Daniel 9:27 will be by the little horn person, as the prince who shall come, who the Jews following Gog/Magog will initially think that he is their long awaited messiah. As such, the person will be anointed the King of Israel, becoming the Antichrist.

During the first 7 months following the Gog/Magog event, the Jews will built their next temple and the daily sacrifice begun again.

Later, their thought to be messiah, the Antichrist, will stop the daily sacrifice, and expose himself as the man of sin.



The referral to Gog and Magog at the expiration of the thousand years is that it will be the same nations that made up the Gog/Magog event nations of Ezekiel 38-39 a thousand years earlier.


Ezekiel 39:21-29 is Jesus's Second Coming. Jesus's first coming was 2000 years ago, when He died on the cross for atonement of our sins.


No, I do not.

During the 7 years following the Gog/Magog event, the Jews will turn to Jesus and the gospel of salvation. Revelation 12:10.

Jesus does not return to judge Daniel's people the Jews, but to rescue them from the time of Great Tribulation, that will take place the last 1335 days of the 7 years following the Gog/Magog event.



View attachment 344779

I figured you would double down on your misrepresentations. John draws from Ezekiel 38-39 in Revelation 20 for those with eyes that see. There are not two Gog and Magog events, as in your misrepresentation. You're hyper about finding seven years anywhere in the Bible to shore up your fallacies. Your misrepresentation confuses the testimony of Christ because we can’t look to the OT to interpret Revelation rightly.

And yes, you do have Christ return to the Old Covenant, insomuch as the Old Covenant dealt with Daniel’s people, while Christ’s mediation pertains to Jews and Greeks. The gifts and calling to the Jews never ceased (Romans 11:29); it just broadened to include the Gentiles in Christ. Christ doesn't return to save the Church and then leaves again to return to save just Daniel's people. Christ returns once to save the Church despite your silly charts.

 

[Douggg]

I figured you would double down on your misrepresentations. For those with eyes that see, John draws from Ezekiel 38-39 in Revelation 20. There are not two Gog and Magog events, as in your misrepresentation. You are hyper about finding seven years anywhere in the Bible to shore up your fallacies. Your misrepresentation confuses the testimony of Christ because we can’t look to the OT to interpret Revelation rightly.

And yes, you do have Christ return to the Old Covenant, insomuch as the Old Covenant dealt with Daniel’s people, while Christ’s mediation pertains to Jews and Greeks. The gifts and calling to the Jews never ceased (Romans 11:29); it just broadened to include the Gentiles in Christ. He doesn't return to save the Church and then leaves again to return to save just Daniel's people. Christ returns once to save the Church despite your silly charts.

Jerry, in Revelation 20:8-11, following Satan's last deception of the nations, including the former Gog and Magog nations, Satan is cast into the lake of fire. And then the second resurrection relevant to millennium, that of the rest of the dead (Revelation 20:5) takes place (Revelation 20:12-14). And this present earth and heaven are destroyed (Revelation 20:11).

No 7 months to bury the dead of Gog's army, no 7 years of burning the weapons. No return of Jesus's to Mt. Olives, His Second Coming. No final gathering of the Jews back to land of Israel. All, like in Ezekiel 39.

Those things will have taken place a 1000 years earlier.

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Jerry, Jesus is not "returning to the Old Covenant" in Ezekiel 39. His Second Coming in Ezekiel 39:21-29. The Jews will have received the New Covenant in Christ in the middle part of the 7 years following the Gog/Magog event. Revelation 12:10.

 

[Jerryhuerta]

Jerry, in Revelation 20:8-11, following Satan's last deception of the nations, including the former Gog and Magog nations, Satan is cast into the lake of fire. And then the second resurrection relevant to millennium, that of the rest of the dead (Revelation 20:5) takes place (Revelation 20:12-14). And this present earth and heaven are destroyed (Revelation 20:11).

No 7 months to bury the dead of Gog's army, no 7 years of burning the weapons. No return of Jesus's to Mt. Olives, His Second Coming. No final gathering of the Jews back to land of Israel. All, like in Ezekiel 39.

Those things will have taken place a 1000 years earlier.

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Jerry, Jesus is not "returning to the Old Covenant" in Ezekiel 39. His Second Coming in Ezekiel 39:21-29. The Jews will have received the New Covenant in Christ in the middle part of the 7 years following the Gog/Magog event. Revelation 12:10.

The prophets aren’t given the complete picture, but only part. That is why we must study all the prophets to get the full picture. Ezekiel is given part of what happens after the 1000 years, and John is given more. Otherwise, we get the foolish notion that there are two Gog and Magog events.

The gifts and calling to the Jews never ceased (Romans 11:29); it just broadened to include the Gentiles in Christ. Christ doesn't return to save the Church and then leaves again to return to save just Daniel's people. Christ returns once to save the Church despite your silly charts. You haven't surmounted what I wrote.

 

[Douggg]

The prophets aren’t given the complete picture, but only part. That is why we must study all the prophets to get the full picture. Ezekiel is given part of what happens after the 1000 years, and John is given more. Otherwise, we get the foolish notion that there are two Gog and Magog events.

Jerry, there are not two Ezekiel 38-39 events. There are two events in the bible involving the Gog and Magog nations.

event 1 - the end times Ezekiel 38-39 Gog/Magog event, and the 7 years that follow, concluding with Jesus's Second Coming to this present earth. Before the millennium begins.

event 2 - After the millennium, Satan's last deception of the nations, which will include the former Gog and Magog nations, concluding with the destruction of this present earth and heaven.

The gifts and calling to the Jews never ceased (Romans 11:29); it just broadened to include the Gentiles in Christ. Christ doesn't return to save the Church and then leaves again to return to save just Daniel's people. Christ returns once to save the Church despite your silly charts. You haven't surmounted what I wrote.

Jesus will come for the church, i.e. the corporate believers in Jesus, in the rapture/resurrection event.... before His Second Coming.

Jesus, at His Second Coming, will return with the raptured/resurrected saints, at the end of the Great Tribulation, to rescue the Jews in Jerusalem, and to end the beast-king's rule, and execute judgment on the wicked who will have martyred the Great Tribulation saints, and to destroy those armies which will have gathered to make war on Him.

 

[Jerryhuerta]

Jerry, there are not two Ezekiel 38-39 events. There are two events in the bible involving the Gog and Magog nations.

event 1 - the end times Ezekiel 38-39 Gog/Magog event, and the 7 years that follow, concluding with Jesus's Second Coming to this present earth. Before the millennium begins.

event 2 - After the millennium, Satan's last deception of the nations, which will include the former Gog and Magog nations, concluding with the destruction of this present earth and heaven.


Jesus will come for the church, i.e. the corporate believers in Jesus, in the rapture/resurrection event.... before His Second Coming.

Jesus, at His Second Coming, will return with the raptured/resurrected saints, at the end of the Great Tribulation, to rescue the Jews in Jerusalem, and to end the beast-king's rule, and execute judgment on the wicked who will have martyred the Great Tribulation saints, and to destroy those armies which will have gathered to make war on Him.

Like I said, you might want to stop focusing on any seven year reference and joining it with the seventieth week of Daniel, suppressing the context. God tells Ezekiel to prophesy to Gog and say,

Thus saith the Lord God; In that day when my people of Israel dwelleth safely, shalt thou not know it? And thou shalt come from thy place out of the north parts, thou, and many people with thee, all of them riding upon horses, a great company, and a mighty army: And thou shalt come up against my people of Israel, as a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes. (Ezekiel 38:14-16)​

The context fits perfectly with Revelation 20.

Israel had previously come to the land that was "brought back from the sword" and "gathered out of the nations" and dwelling safely "without walls, and having neither bars nor gates." (verses 8-12)

And, if you had bothered, the context follows chapter 37, which illustrates the resurrection.

You're taking the event out of context, as usual.

And Christ returns for the Church because this age is under his New Covenant mediation, which is unveiled in Revelation. In Christ's mediation, there is neither Jew or Greek. Your interpretation returns to the Old Covenant that was mediated over Daniel's people. Revelation depicts the judgment upon the Church, not the Old Covenant people.

 

[Douggg]

Like I said, you might want to stop focusing on any seven year reference and joining it with the seventieth week of Daniel, suppressing the context. God tells Ezekiel to prophesy to Gog and say,

Jerry, I showed you that in Ezekiel 39 there are 7 years of burning the weapons and 7 months of burying the dead of God's army. While in Revelation 20:8-13, there are no such 7 months, nor 7 years.

They are not the same event.

Admit you are wrong.

----------------------------------------------------

The 7 years of Daniel 9:27 are still unfulfilled. Do you agree with that ? Perhaps you are wrong about Daniel 9:27 as well.

----------------------------------------------------

Israel had previously come to the land that was "brought back from the sword" and "gathered out of the nations" and dwelling safely "without walls, and having neither bars nor gates." (verses 8-12)

That verse in Ezekiel 38 is referring to 1948, the Jews return to the land of Israel to become a nation again - after being taken captive to the nations in Luke 21:24 during which the past 2000 years have fallen by the sword. The biggest of which was the holocaust of WWII.

Luke 21:24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

And Christ returns for the Church because this age is under his New Covenant mediation, which is unveiled in Revelation. In Christ's mediation, there is neither Jew or Greek. Your interpretation returns to the Old Covenant that was mediated over Daniel's people. Revelation depicts the judgment upon the Church, not the Old Covenant people.

Jerry, Jesus returns with his church. Jesus returns to Jerusalem to rescue the Jews. You are not located in Jerusalem, as most of us Christians are not.

Revelation is not about judgement on the church. Nor against the Jews. Revelation is about the 7 years that precede Jesus coming in power and great glory. And the end of Satan and his angels mystical kingdom of Babylon the Great.

 

[Jerryhuerta]

Jerry, I showed you that in Ezekiel 39 there are 7 years of burning the weapons and 7 months of burying the dead of God's army. While in Revelation 20:8-13, there are no such 7 months, nor 7 years.

They are not the same event.

Admit you are wrong.

----------------------------------------------------

The 7 years of Daniel 9:27 are still unfulfilled. Do you agree with that ? Perhaps you are wrong about Daniel 9:27 as well.

----------------------------------------------------


That verse in Ezekiel 38 is referring to 1948, the Jews return to the land of Israel to become a nation again - after being taken captive to the nations in Luke 21:24 during which the past 2000 years have fallen by the sword. The biggest of which was the holocaust of WWII.

Luke 21:24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.



Jerry, Jesus returns with his church. Jesus returns to Jerusalem to rescue the Jews. You are not located in Jerusalem, as most of us Christians are not.

Revelation is not about judgement on the church. Nor against the Jews. Revelation is about the 7 years that precede Jesus coming in power and great glory. And the end of Satan and his angels mystical kingdom of Babylon the Great.

I admit, Doug, that I can’t change a hardened mind like those entrenched in the folly of futurism; only God can do that. Dispensational futurists believe that God rewards those whom he has hardened. I read the opposite in the scripture; God rewards those he justifies.

The notion that God sanctioned or endorsed the UN’s return of the land to those whom he has hardened as the fulfillment of God’s gathering Israel back to their land is saying that God rewards those whom he hardened. I read that God gathers back the Israel that he justifies, which makes Ezekiel 37-39 parallel Revelation 20.

As revealed in Ezekiel, Israel dwells safely, without bars and gates, after being brought back from the sword and, in essence, living without “fear.” That’s certainly not the circumstances for the unbelieving Jews in Israel today.

All scripture points to a time when God fulfills the time of the Gentiles and rewards the Israel whom he has justified by bringing them back to their land, accompanied by all the Gentiles that have joined to them, and that happens when he judges the nations, depicted in passages like Isaiah 11,

And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse… with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked… in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious. And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea. (Isaiah 11:1, 4, 10-11)​

Isaiah prophesied that Israel is gathered back a second time when God judges the nations, which can’t be what happened in 1948, insomuch as the Jews have “never” dwelt safely since. The nations, indeed, haven’t been judged.

As to your fallacious notion that “Revelation is not about judgment on the church,” the judgments illustrated by the seven churches quash such folly, as does Peter’s epistle,

For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear? (1 Peter 4:17-18)​

 

[Douggg]

I admit, Doug, that I can’t change a hardened mind like those entrenched in the folly of futurism; only God can do that. Dispensational futurists believe that God rewards those whom he has hardened. I read the opposite in the scripture; God rewards those he justifies.

Jerry, I am not a dispensationalist. Some futurists are dispensationalists, but not all.

The notion that God sanctioned or endorsed the UN’s return of the land to those whom he has hardened as the fulfillment of God’s gathering Israel back to their land is saying that God rewards those whom he hardened. I read that God gathers back the Israel that he justifies, which makes Ezekiel 37-39 parallel Revelation 20.

Jerry, Israel, a nation back in the land in 1948, is fulfillment of the reuniting of the northern and southern kingdoms back into one kingdom, one nation again.

Ezekiel 39:21-29, is Jesus Himself speaking in the text having returned to this earth, 7 years after the Gog/Magog event. Ezekiel 39:28 is the final completed gathering of the house of Israel back to the land of Israel - which is the gathering of the elect in Matthew 24:31, from one end of heaven to the other - a saying taken from Deuteronomy 30:4, regarding gathering of the children of Israel.

There is no time following the Revelation 20:9 destruction of them who will attack the camp of the saints, i.e. saved persons, which the Jews will be during the thousand years. No time, Jerry, for the 7 years and 7 months of Ezekiel 39 to take place. Ezekiel 39 is the 7 years before Jesus returns, His Second Coming.

Jerry, you are attacking futurism for the sake of the historist view. But you are doing it without consideration of what it says in Ezekiel 39 versus what it says in Revelation 20.

As to your fallacious notion that “Revelation is not about judgment on the church,” the judgments illustrated by the seven churches quash such folly, as does Peter’s epistle,

Jerry, who is cast into the lake of fire in Revelation 19:19-20 ? The church? Who's armies are destroyed by Jesus in Revelation 19:21 ? Those of the church ?

 

[Oseas]

Scriptures interpret Scriptures

Scripture interprets Scripture

Facebook - Textus Receptus Academy https://m.facebook.com/groups/christian.apologetics.page/permalink/1625897814484486/? Ron Braswell https://www.facebook.com/ron.braswell.52 Mark 16:9-20 is the autographic text. I...

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Revelation 12:3 and 7-12

3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great RED DRAGON, having seven heads(Revelation 13:1) and ten horns(Revelation 17:12-14), and seven crowns upon his (7) heads.

7 And there was WAR in heaven(Ephesians 1:3-8): Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven(Ephesians 1:3-8).

9 And the great dragon was cast out (of the heaven-Ephesians 1:3-8), that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth(was cast out of the heaven-Ephesians 1:3-8), and his angels were cast out with him.

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our GOD(Revelation 11:15-18. Take a look), and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens(Ephesians 1:3-8), and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth(inhabiters of the current rebellious Israel) and of the sea!(all Gentile NATIONS) for the Devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

Revelation 16:13-15

12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.

13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs (a satanic trinity, why frogs?) come out of the MOUTH of the dragon(Revelation 13:11), and out of the MOUTH of the Beast(Revelation 13:1), and out of the MOUTH of the false prophet (John 5:43-47 combined with 2Thess. 2:3-12). THREE UNCLEAN SPIRITS LIKE FROGS - WHY FROGS?

14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles(Revelation 13:13-14. Take a look), which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that Great Day of GOD Almighty.

15 Behold, I come as a thief.
Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.

DANIEL 12:12 -
12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

In fact we are living I would say in the last decade of this current world of Devil-2020-2030. DETAIL: the last week, week 70th- Daniel 9:24-27 - is within this current decade, but it must happen only after the election of the next Pope, the last, and manifestation of the false Messiah as was prophesied by our Lord JESUS Christ- John 5:43-47 combined with 2Thessalonians 2:1-2, and Revelation 13:11. I think that you know that we are living in the period of sorrows- our Lord JESUS listed several events which have been fulfilled and still remain happening for now-Matt. 24:3-8. That said, according the Word of GOD-the Word is GOD, self-executing, in my vision JESUS will come in the day 1335 -Daniel 12:12. No man knows when the day 1335 will happen, it's a mystery for now. But as it's written, "Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days"

Jewish Calendar - How to explain the difference of exactly 240 years in the Jewish calendar?

The Jewish calendar is the type of calendar that the Jewish people use for counting time and commemorating birthdays, festivities, weddings, deaths, religious celebrations and other solemnities. According to the Hebrews, the years are counted from what they believe to be the creation of Adam...

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[Oseas]

Similarity between passing by the Red Sea and by the Red Dragon

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ - PUT THIS IN YOUR MIND ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ - THE RED SEA AND THE RED DRAGON ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I believe you know that the Hebrews had to cross the Red Sea, and walk through a desert, walk until they got to the Promised Land after 40 years of...

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