"Reformed" "Reform" in name of church always mean the Pastor is Calvinistic in doctrine?

[pkeck]

When a church name includes the word "reformed" or "reform" does that always mean (or to a very high degree) that the Pastor will be Calvinistic in doctrine?

 

[HTacianas]

When a church name includes the word "reformed" or "reform" does that always mean (or to a very high degree) that the Pastor will be Calvinistic in doctrine?

Honestly, at this point, it could mean anything. If you said the definition is "not Catholic" you'd be close. Lutherans I believe consider themselves reformed, but they are not Calvinists. Then there are the "Free Will Baptists" who are reformed but not entirely Calvinist. But the Orthodox Churches are not Catholic (capital C), not reformed, and not Calvinists.

 

[The Liturgist]

Honestly, at this point, it could mean anything. If you said the definition is "not Catholic" you'd be close. Lutherans I believe consider themselves reformed, but they are not Calvinists. Then there are the "Free Will Baptists" who are reformed but not entirely Calvinist. But the Orthodox Churches are not Catholic (capital C), not reformed, and not Calvinists.

Indeed, the Orthodox are not reformed because unlike those who chose to estrange themselves from us we retain the original form, which anyone can verify with a simple study of the Apostolic Fathers like St. Ignatius.

 

[JSRG]

When a church name includes the word "reformed" or "reform" does that always mean (or to a very high degree) that the Pastor will be Calvinistic in doctrine?

Yes. Not always, but to a very high degree. "Reformed" is generally synonymous with "Calvinist".

 

[pkeck]

Yes. Not always, but to a very high degree. "Reformed" is generally synonymous with "Calvinist".

Thanks for simplifying this!

 

[Ain't Zwinglian]

Lutherans I believe consider themselves reformed, but they are not Calvinists.

Lutherans are not Calvinists and they try very hard to distance themselves away from the term "Reformed." Having said that, there are a few compatibles between Reformed thought and Lutheranism. On the 5 point TULIP scale, Lutherans are 1.5 out of 5.

• You will rarely hear a Lutheran pastor use the term "Sovereignty of God."
• Never use the phrase "Once saved, Always saved."
• Never use the term "Eternal Security."
• Never use the concept of "Covenant Theology" as referring to the NT.
• Don't use the terms "sign" or "seal" exclusively to describe the Sacraments.
• Will use the term "Election" three or four times a year, rather than 300 to 400 times a year.
• Lutherans will never practice the Regula Principle of Worship.

Lutherans are the only Protestant group that was never overly influence by John Calvin (As Lutheranism is a generation before Calvin). Luther dies in 1546 and Calvin's Institutes was published in 1560.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Simply because a church, or denomination, has an identification in its name hardly means that its clergy are allied with that identification. In this instance, I can cite a clear example. Norman Vincent Peale, the late pastor of the Marble Collegiate Church in New York City, which is identified with the Reformed Church in America, was about as far from Calvinism as one could imagine.

Likewise, not all "Catholic" churches have clergy which adhere to the Catechism of the Catholic Church. For example, there is the Apostolic Catholic Church (aka Irvingites) in Great Britain who probably can be described as highly liturgical, pentecostal, millenialists. There is also the Polish National Catholic Church, which is much closer to the RCC, differing from it primarily over the dogma of Papal infallibility.

 

[Hazelelponi]

When a church name includes the word "reformed" or "reform" does that always mean (or to a very high degree) that the Pastor will be Calvinistic in doctrine?

Used IN the name of the church itself then yes, your likely to see anything from 3-5 point Calvinists.

I'm actually either all 5 points or 4.5 point and when I say reformed I am definitely referring to reformed doctrine that will uphold at least most of TULIP.

The Lutherans are generally viewed as not getting far enough away from Roman Catholicism and though leaders in the reformation aren't always included in the category these days.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Used IN the name of the church itself then yes, your likely to see anything from 3-5 point Calvinists.

I'm actually either all 5 points or 4.5 point and when I say reformed I am definitely referring to reformed doctrine that will uphold at least most of TULIP.

This is mostly true for most Reformed denominations. The one exception that I have come across is the Reformed Church in America which is Reformed in tradition only.

 

[Ain't Zwinglian]

The Lutherans are generally viewed as not getting far enough away from Roman Catholicism and though leaders in the reformation aren't always included in the category these days.

Got that one right.

One of my pet'tists of all pet peeves are when Baptists accuse all three branches of the Reformation of 'NOT GOING FAR ENOUGH.' This is in specific reference to the Sacraments.

The Reformation era goes from 1517 to 1648 (the end of the Thirty Years War). All branches of the Reformation went as far as history allowed them to go.

There are many Baptists today who don't catagorize themselves as Protestants due to Sacramental issues.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Got that one right.

One of my pet'tists of all pet peeves are when Baptists accuse all three branches of the Reformation of 'NOT GOING FAR ENOUGH.' This is in specific reference to the Sacraments.

The Reformation era goes from 1517 to 1648 (the end of the Thirty Years War). All branches of the Reformation went as far as history allowed them to go.

There are many Baptists today who don't catagorize themselves as Protestants due to Sacramental issues.

The Baptists always seem to have been quite a motley crew. The Anabaptists of the Reformation don't bear close comparison with contemporary American Baptist denominations. In fact, the descendants of the Anabaptists (Mennonites, Amish, Dunkard Brethren, Evangelical Brethren, etc.) are probably closer to groups such as the Friends (pacifists) or the various Campbellites (Churches of Christ, etc.) than they are to Baptists.

 

[Hazelelponi]

those who loudly proclaim transsubtantiation and insist that the bread becomes the real body and flesh of Jesus Christ and the wine becomes the real blood of Jesus Christ, actually do not believe that they are eating human flesh and drinking human blood

Well and I am quite certain of that, lol... No one could do it otherwise.

But the language defies the attitude, and I can't do that, not before man and God.

It's the one thing I am, I will not do anything unless I truly believe in it. I have to be honest about my faith because this is eternity, and there's a lot of weight upon us here to remain true to God, and be real with it.

I do thank God He gave me a husband with the patience of Job, who gives me just enough room to learn how I need to learn.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Well and I am quite certain of that, lol... No one could do it otherwise.

But the language defies the attitude, and I can't do that, not before man and God.

It's the one thing I am, I will not do anything unless I truly believe in it. I have to be honest about my faith because this is eternity, and there's a lot of weight upon us here to remain true to God, and be real with it.

I do thank God He gave me a husband with the patience of Job, who gives me just enough room to learn how I need to learn.

I have found it curious to determine the nature and meaning of various Christian words and phrases. If taken literally, some things become really quite absurd. Thus, without understanding the nature of metaphor and allegory, one could come to crazy ideas. For example, Jesus Christ could be taken to have been a complete lunatic when He informed folks that he was a piece of woodwork with metal fittings (I am the door) or that He was not at all a human being, but a lamb.

Other absurdities - I once encountered a church where they were seated in a square formation around a communion table. I was informed that I was prohibited from sitting in the circle because I was not a member of their denomination. When I asked the gentleman where the circle was to which he was referring, he became quite heated an insisted that their square was, in reality, a circle.

Then there is the standard question - Are you saved? Saved from what? or Are you born again? Even Nicodemus struggled with that one.

In the RCC there is a lot of reference to "the religious". "Religious" is an adjective and not a noun. Thus, one can be a religious person, but one can never be a "religious". Nevertheless, the refer to folks who have undertaken religious vocations in their denomination as being "the religious".

Have you "walked the aisle" or "hit the sawdust trail"? Do you go to school on Sunday? What kinds of sacrifices are slain on your altar? Are you covered in "the blood"? Is your "all on the altar"?

 

[Hazelelponi]

I have found it curious to determine the nature and meaning of various Christian words and phrases. If taken literally, some things become really quite absurd. Thus, without understanding the nature of metaphor and allegory, one could come to crazy ideas. For example, Jesus Christ could be taken to have been a complete lunatic when He informed folks that he was a piece of woodwork with metal fittings (I am the door) or that He was not at all a human being, but a lamb.

Other absurdities - I once encountered a church where they were seated in a square formation around a communion table. I was informed that I was prohibited from sitting in the circle because I was not a member of their denomination. When I asked the gentleman where the circle was to which he was referring, he became quite heated an insisted that their square was, in reality, a circle.

Then there is the standard question - Are you saved? Saved from what? or Are you born again? Even Nicodemus struggled with that one.

In the RCC there is a lot of reference to "the religious". "Religious" is an adjective and not a noun. Thus, one can be a religious person, but one can never be a "religious". Nevertheless, the refer to folks who have undertaken religious vocations in their denomination as being "the religious".

Have you "walked the aisle" or "hit the sawdust trail"? Do you go to school on Sunday? What kinds of sacrifices are slain on your altar? Are you covered in "the blood"? Is your "all on the altar"?

I absolutely love folk sayings because they can convey so much meaning so simply. And of course sometimes they make you giggle even as they convey an idea.

It's why I like Biblical language so much, but there's a lot I don't take literally. And there's always cues, sometimes in the things you don't think about...

Some conclusions people reach would be like me calling an ambulance because my husband said "I'm finer than frog hair split 3 ways" so I jumped to the conclusion that most of him might have disappeared... Lol

(And by the way, that's actually how my husband answers the question "how are you?", every time he's asked unless he's sick.. lol..)

But as to something you said, how do you know what some of this even means? Some of it I really did just have to experience to understand, or just wait upon God to reveal the meaning.

Light bulb moments are awesome... I love them, don't you?

 

[bbbbbbb]

I absolutely love folk sayings because they can convey so much meaning so simply. And of course sometimes they make you giggle even as they convey an idea.

It's why I like Biblical language so much, but there's a lot I don't take literally. And there's always cues, sometimes in the things you don't think about...

Some conclusions people reach would be like me calling an ambulance because my husband said "I'm finer than frog hair split 3 ways" so I jumped to the conclusion that most of him might have disappeared... Lol

(And by the way, that's actually how my husband answers the question "how are you?", every time he's asked unless he's sick.. lol..)

But as to something you said, how do you know what some of this even means? Some of it I really did just have to experience to understand, or just wait upon God to reveal the meaning.

Light bulb moments are awesome... I love them, don't you?

Thank you. I had not heard the phrase "finer than frog hair split 3 ways" and may use it for some of the multitude of telemarketers who routinely ask me how I am. Lately I have been telling them that I am "dead as a doorknob". They usually respond with "That's good" before launching into their spiel.

I do love light bulb moments, having had more than my fair share of them. They are wonderful, not to mention enlightening.

 

[Hazelelponi]

Lately I have been telling them that I am "dead as a doorknob". They usually respond with "That's good" before launching into their spiel.

Wow... Well that proves they don't even listen to you.... Lol.

I'd respond to that with at least a modicum of wit...

 

[bbbbbbb]

Wow... Well that proves they don't even listen to you.... Lol.

I'd respond to that with at least a modicum of wit...

Unfortunately, these telemarketers are usually offshore, generally in India, so their knowledge of American idioms is limited, at best.

 

[Valletta]

In the RCC there is a lot of reference to "the religious". "Religious" is an adjective and not a noun. Thus, one can be a religious person, but one can never be a "religious". Nevertheless, the refer to folks who have undertaken religious vocations in their denomination as being "the religious".

"Religious" can be used either as an adjective or noun.

 

[MarkRohfrietsch]

<Snip>

The Lutherans are generally viewed as not getting far enough away from Roman Catholicism and though leaders in the reformation aren't always included in the category these days.

And we see the reformed as going way to far; cutting off their noses to spite their face.

 

[MarkRohfrietsch]

Real presence freaks me out. It really does. It's my absolute never.

I have oddly wondered privately, what if I'm wrong?

I think it's a camp I can't be in though... I'm comfy here with the motley crew.. haha haha (just making a joke).

Since you asked the question; Scripture is clear and sternly admonishes us regarding no discerning Christ's body and blood.